From nobody Tue Sep 1 22:47:03 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 162E53A0CA8; Tue, 1 Sep 2020 22:46:55 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Barry Leiba via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Barry Leiba Message-ID: <159902561466.27239.11154649696524664213@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2020 22:46:55 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 05:46:55 -0000 Barry Leiba has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Just a couple of very minor comments: “RPL” should be expanded on first use. We should probably ask the RFC Editor to mark “DAG” and “DODAG” as “well known”, but they are not yet so marked, so “DODAG” should be expanded on first use. — Section 5.3 — It is RECOMMENDED to only deploy nodes that support [RFC8138] in a network where the compression is turned on. I think I misread this the first time; it’s ambiguous, so please reword it to make this clear. What is it that’s recommended?: 1. In a network where compression is turned on, only deploy nodes that support 8138? 2. Don’t deploy nodes that support 8138 unless compression is turned on? — Section 7 — An attacker in the middle of the network may reset the "T" flag Thank you for this phrasing; I like it. 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Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 178F83A0DA5; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 07:05:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.402 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.402 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id u-ftAxcqputb; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 07:05:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io1-f54.google.com (mail-io1-f54.google.com [209.85.166.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 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2002:a5d:80d2:: with SMTP id h18mr3648925ior.61.1599055535215; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 07:05:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Barry Leiba Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:05:24 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 14:05:44 -0000 > Please let me know if we need more work here : ) No more work, in my opinion. And thanks for the quick response to my comments! Barry From nobody Wed Sep 2 07:10:01 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 043C63A0744; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 07:09:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <159905579897.24450.6889359247281097422@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 07:09:59 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 14:09:59 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2020-09-02 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and reset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:14:55 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Barry Leiba CC: The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" Thread-Topic: Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AdaBK0HYglnWN9zRQee1z/liskFRLAABtg8AAAA36HA= Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:14:31 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:13:39 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: computer.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;computer.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:e4b9:2f2f:4d58:8d08] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: c07f790a-cee5-4fc6-ed92-08d84f4a9176 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB4158: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:9508; 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Wed, 2 Sep 2020 09:25:20 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Martin Duke via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Martin Duke Message-ID: <159906391966.364.6288639877267418145@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 09:25:20 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 16:25:20 -0000 Martin Duke has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Sec 3. “Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.“ Is “This specification” referring to 6550 or roll-turn on-rfc8138? I have a feeling you mean RFC6550. But that document only defines MOPs 0-3! On a similar note, it might be useful to establish an IANA registry for MOP code points so that change control for these bits is clearer. 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Wed, 2 Sep 2020 16:35:19 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Martin Duke CC: The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , "mariainesrobles@googlemail.com" Thread-Topic: Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWgUWz7Pi4lyr1JUyoyVlWwdwxXKlVi4vM Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 16:35:19 +0000 Message-ID: <55B5F8AC-7965-4A56-A541-AD64CC2D103B@cisco.com> References: <159906391966.364.6288639877267418145@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <159906391966.364.6288639877267418145@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:c4cd:5f22:77fe:1f3] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 474b3e8f-2789-409a-eb27-08d84f5e2e37 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3758: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882; 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boundary="_000_55B5F8AC79654A56A541AD64CC2D103Bciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 474b3e8f-2789-409a-eb27-08d84f5e2e37 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 02 Sep 2020 16:35:19.2712 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: 2QgVTH54wrK7yHS0Kx3348iBYU4jX+fTRRZyxZ31x4OnAEHcqGycO2Gh2mVwiQvJq6EcBCFNiJ8vQ+mFl0Qq+A== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3758 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.13, xch-rcd-003.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-8.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 16:36:23 -0000 --_000_55B5F8AC79654A56A541AD64CC2D103Bciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; 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Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:28:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC01B389AA; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:28:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 239671FB; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:49:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Barry Leiba , roll@ietf.org, aretana.ietf@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <159902561466.27239.11154649696524664213@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <159902561466.27239.11154649696524664213@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 16:49:22 -0000 Barry Leiba via Datatracker wrote: > =E2=80=9CRPL=E2=80=9D should be expanded on first use. > We should probably ask the RFC Editor to mark =E2=80=9CDAG=E2=80=9D a= nd =E2=80=9CDODAG=E2=80=9D as =E2=80=9Cwell > known=E2=80=9D, but they are not yet so marked, so =E2=80=9CDODAG=E2= =80=9D should be expanded on first > use. Do we just send them a request? I guess we ask them to point at RFC6550. -- ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh network= s [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | IoT architect = [ ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails = [ From nobody Wed Sep 2 10:18:18 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B063A084A for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:18:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.401 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.401 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SRWYu5sZfTUl for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:18:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io1-f53.google.com (mail-io1-f53.google.com [209.85.166.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A84B93A0846 for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:18:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io1-f53.google.com with SMTP id j2so6591139ioj.7 for ; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 10:18:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HOEb6P9N2r1XHEBQeKQ9F5nIEvEhDVfyTgk9wqVnVRg=; b=TEugqq9EeEy/wJxTiqYFomVYB1LBteu7/IPTsjOa16PA9Rz8dFWxN72dAen1rJ1kzm 0GGd8QwuV3EbnUvcgfNrTrGJWiQ47kz9GP1tRpXUfa9qH7Yyd5bJNZxwtTg4yGHM5q5N atODs8V6Y4cyZEJvC9/lDVKjrM2gfsr6YDrD+SZB5tv9EtslTVVTNqeWZ+L0rcjk+wpA u6FT+cZjExhwtPsWnqvf2gdPwj31hD/U99pWBvzq9ss7EztBCe5p//uZqmFQIol9msc7 GYMwPEahmjbPae8t1vRT5Jddz28XdB8xSy8KOWw1ra3yyCGjrSsXfbxwZaOwT8WbI1PI bp5Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532hnjvdR7gyB8uhpmO8hx2FstFUPZ+BdgJcztVH6LlW6FMFKhnw /Cdzgpt3qLGuI8UwgInCtSb4oY5k/ilxTobdDTM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx87Zde0Kb2Aqwk0Wq5t8JhcLiS3hZenMJeS2LLe/PF1Q5O+Sxs/FhWpkj+29U2cVCZpUmDiyBn3et0XMdh5po= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6638:13c7:: with SMTP id i7mr4332472jaj.52.1599067094784; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 10:18:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159902561466.27239.11154649696524664213@ietfa.amsl.com> <9695.1599065358@localhost> In-Reply-To: <9695.1599065358@localhost> From: Barry Leiba Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 13:18:03 -0400 Message-ID: To: Michael Richardson Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , =?UTF-8?Q?=C3=81lvaro_Retana?= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 17:18:17 -0000 > > =E2=80=9CRPL=E2=80=9D should be expanded on first use. > > We should probably ask the RFC Editor to mark =E2=80=9CDAG=E2=80=9D= and =E2=80=9CDODAG=E2=80=9D as =E2=80=9Cwell > > known=E2=80=9D, but they are not yet so marked, so =E2=80=9CDODAG= =E2=80=9D should be expanded on first > > use. > > Do we just send them a request? > I guess we ask them to point at RFC6550. Their abbreviation list doesn't include references, and just flags certain abbreviations with an asterisk, meaning that they don't always expect them to be expanded. It's clear that in routing documents, everyone knows what DAG and DODAG are, and insisting that they be expanded doesn't accomplish much. Also, not expanding them doesn't eliminate the need for a reference when it's appropriate; it's the difference between "blah blah DODAG [RFC6550]" and "blah blah Destination-Oriented Directed Acyclic Graph (DODAG) [RFC6550]". I think it should be =C3=81lvaro who makes the request, but, yes, it's just a matter of sending a note to the RFC Editor. Barry From nobody Wed Sep 2 10:23:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 006923A0BE9; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:23:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EVjByiT2xzlt; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io1-xd35.google.com (mail-io1-xd35.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 805E13A0BE6; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io1-xd35.google.com with SMTP id m23so6633443iol.8; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 10:23:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=JrJA4nWJiK6l7WCs56keg9glqq8fnpb4Puz3kdP31s0=; b=jnYpF/2Qyz3Jw7YeqbiIqsXagreiHRtl+SEeapeVqVQTz7T36xyiAjvaPMOyGI0VFp jerse1x5je995jLqJaVK4C41Jy8h+qHStH8uKXgvwsPtQZvDrWqMbybbrk17JOJnEHIw LyQQw+x2hlhchjm+PJzfgurufu/DfYTvtnukFTMDxuo7SOPXOCtzdgzwIBzZRH3qhKFr KGWQOG6/k51Au8fFzojwEzdnwZLURkxZADG7w5pnXE7pOsSnBSoLsPfoDSNsm+sq8WcZ ksa49eAqNdQFtKgr2LyeSWBF66xIHtV8hVtguf5MUgrNjhJwn4pMrJ3uxHX5pBIblFWm 0EwQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=JrJA4nWJiK6l7WCs56keg9glqq8fnpb4Puz3kdP31s0=; b=lnJTnRqHx/HYeNXYQtWZnWBI0iSLDNw35U7OqmqoA/7LdS7EAUCpRvOeXVipKaEspQ H47Dmdk+jiC0s/AzPvgdDhHARgu3p7L0vi0S+gawCoWoBD27zuKNBJoYvskcsPwuVES/ IolY+bwhug60i5wy0t8hd8W9hNFlaHE7MeprYu7ojNyBRIv1lpviCoCh+XzgG5aD31iq sYlTi2o0H3k0XM/ugyauJp2EOSjXbmgL/hZyERdNQxD7GCpiEOWmR7Ygw7t54g4gI00c T29IE+kMIe23ss3y+2ALQoKN+KzlHZcmESWgbW1Pe7FfBpirI/foV+alNAYmstXxoA23 XbSA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532nvIqlwAUBpdWiINOuc/FmGATQ03bj+b0vp30dP6bZWVyZPB6X eqD9lr4hCyB0FI9AZKDSLOXcV5UDbm9Px0XLAW8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxfKExqmwj/PgToQqlGjv8II/NCPxF/SK/qkVQaAqTH9SPKgIX+F0BUplncu1z+1o2lVQOyLPxxwlSNn1r9/j4= X-Received: by 2002:a02:a047:: with SMTP id f7mr4184977jah.31.1599067408722; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 10:23:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159906391966.364.6288639877267418145@ietfa.amsl.com> <55B5F8AC-7965-4A56-A541-AD64CC2D103B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <55B5F8AC-7965-4A56-A541-AD64CC2D103B@cisco.com> From: Martin Duke Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:23:19 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , "mariainesrobles@googlemail.com" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000de6d1105ae57e4fb" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 17:23:31 -0000 --000000000000de6d1105ae57e4fb Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ah, OK, I understand what is happening now though I would not have gotten that from the text. 1. It is critical that IANA considerations then add instructions to add MOP codepoint 7 to the registry. 2. May I suggest new text for this paragraph: OLD =E2=80=9CSection 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP)= in the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.=E2=80=9C NEW "Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in the DIO Base Object. This specification adds codepoint 7 to the registry for this field. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.=E2=80=9C Martin On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 9:35 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Martin > > Many thanks for your time and review! > > Let=E2=80=99s see below : > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Sec 3. =E2=80=9CSection 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operat= ion (MOP) > in > the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For > a MOP > value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the > setting > of the "T" flag.=E2=80=9C > > Is =E2=80=9CThis specification=E2=80=9D referring to 6550 or roll-turn on= -rfc8138? I have a > feeling you mean RFC6550. But that document only defines MOPs 0-3! > > > This specification means this draft not RPL. > Not sure how to improve this text. Curiously it went through a lot of > massaging already. > > On a similar note, it might be useful to establish an IANA registry for M= OP > code points so that change control for these bits is clearer. > > Good point, and we actually did it. > > Please see https://www.iana.org/assignments/rpl/rpl.xhtml#mop > > Did you find anything else we could clarify ? > > Take care, > > Pascal > --000000000000de6d1105ae57e4fb Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ah, OK, I understand what is happening=C2=A0now though I w= ould not have gotten that from the text.

1. It is critic= al that IANA considerations then add instructions to add MOP codepoint 7 to= the registry.

2. May I suggest new text for this = paragraph:
OLD
=E2=80=9CSection 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines= a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in
the DIO Base Object. This specificat= ion applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For a MOP
value of 7, the compression = MUST be used by default regardless of the setting
of the "T" f= lag.=E2=80=9C

NEW
"Section 6= .3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in
the DIO B= ase Object. This specification adds codepoint 7 to the registry for this fi= eld.=C2=A0=C2=A0 For a MOP
value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless= of the setting
of the "T" flag.=E2=80=9C

M= artin=C2=A0=C2=A0

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 9:35 AM Pascal Thubert (pthub= ert) <pthubert@cisco.com> w= rote:
Hello Martin=C2=A0

Many thanks for your time and review!

Let=E2=80=99s see below :

-------------------------------------------------= ---------------------
COMMENT:
---------------------------------------------------------------------= -

Sec 3. =E2=80=9CSection 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Op= eration (MOP) in
the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6.= For a MOP
value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the= setting
of the "T" flag.=E2=80=9C

Is =E2=80=9CThis specification=E2=80=9D referring to 6550 or roll-tur= n on-rfc8138? I have a
feeling you mean RFC6550. But that document only defines MOPs 0-3!


This specification means this draft not RPL.
Not sure how to improve this text. Curiously it went through a lot of = massaging already.

On a similar note, it might be useful to establish a= n IANA registry for MOP
code points so that change control for these bits is clearer.<= br>
Good point, and we actually did it.


Did you find anything else we could clarify ?

Take care,

Pascal=C2=A0
--000000000000de6d1105ae57e4fb-- From nobody Wed Sep 2 10:27:55 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2AAC3A0C0B; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 10:27:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Martin Duke via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Martin Duke Message-ID: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 10:27:50 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 17:27:51 -0000 Martin Duke has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Now that I know that an IANA registry exists for MOP, codepoint 7 should be included in the IANA considerations for the "Mode of Operation" Registry. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I found last paragraph of Section 3 confusing. I suggest the following change: OLD: Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. NEW: "Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in the DIO Base Object. This specification adds codepoint 7 to the registry for this field. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.“ From nobody Wed Sep 2 12:51:52 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE9433A0D9D; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:51:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id h4ijQkMxz06X; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:51:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 142653A0D9B; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 12:51:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0C343899C; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:30:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id J7e6RCM4CSz3; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:30:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30D638992; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:30:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76B1FB0F; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:51:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Martin Duke cc: "The IESG" , draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com In-Reply-To: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 19:51:51 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Martin Duke via Datatracker wrote: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > DISCUSS: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Now that I know that an IANA registry exists for MOP, codepoint 7 should be > included in the IANA considerations for the "Mode of Operation" Registry. Okay, but we don't know what MOP #7 is yet. We have another WG document (draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01) that, for MOP#7 extends the bit space. That document will register MOD#7. This document avoids keeping the reservation of the scarce bits in the header for future versions of the protocol. We can define it always on in the future. (Or not. It's the future) The WG has spent a lot of time in the last year getting this right. So having this document allocate MOP#7 is just wrong. -- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -= IPv6 IoT consulting =- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9P99IACgkQgItw+93Q 3WULawf/f3InLvUCUd88jqgnYBugR/IC6aM5SRnQk0tTUY2yQdvHhqGT5EKQ75Mt ksVTVMzYsx3Eg0ygMJBua8lgYKJUeguEZJavWCt09PwFIQxgYiPUwhpu6ArnyzvQ hApSwnESHEfQtNMzEif+TJUtPVCOOycZg45fXC4M/a0aNswTrB9uTZCR84N/U8Ac HhDZLdjX6z3tOGG6LSv4n/1sCZ4o+k1lx3kRjfx5Z2RychqydMQoWSckwWJE/DBH mib1RbY/RvN1t3rjCOTQgTOYZjHqi2k3xhq9erXCpGBusfci4qIWlksbNS76lY9V Xb6h1Z2yt4VKID9CLNEqpCKN19Zc+A== =+VDu -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Sep 2 13:34:56 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81A3A3A0EA8; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 13:34:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com 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15.20.3348.015; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 20:39:22 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Martin Duke CC: The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , "mariainesrobles@googlemail.com" Thread-Topic: Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWgUWz7Pi4lyr1JUyoyVlWwdwxXKlVi4vMgAANaYCAADbHbQ== Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 20:39:22 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159906391966.364.6288639877267418145@ietfa.amsl.com> <55B5F8AC-7965-4A56-A541-AD64CC2D103B@cisco.com>, In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:e466:c5b6:b979:a747] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 41547217-6745-429a-0ad9-08d84f804667 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 41547217-6745-429a-0ad9-08d84f804667 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 02 Sep 2020 20:39:22.5872 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: mJ9JgPvorqpwpzXq0Cut93B0ZMnUooKi7jHFw4asZ7zt6Dr35r3HOvVCMDR+g6evrjoWFvdTiqtbutHy2S8RWw== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3758 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.13, xch-rcd-003.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-12.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 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"draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 21:27:06 -0000 Hi! Regardless of any future work, this document doesn=E2=80=99t define a new M= OP. Maybe what needs to be slightly clarified is this text from =C2=A73: =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (= MOP) in =C2=A0 =C2=A0the DIO Base Object. =C2=A0This specification applies to MOP v= alues 0 to =C2=A0 =C2=A06. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by= default =C2=A0 =C2=A0regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. The specification does apply to all MOPs in that it is specifying what to d= o. NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (= MOP) in the =C2=A0 =C2=A0DIO Base Object. =C2=A0This behavior specified in this documen= t applies to MOP =C2=A0 =C2=A0values 0 to 6. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUS= T be used by =C2=A0 =C2=A0default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. Alvaro. On September 2, 2020 at 4:34:40 PM, Pascal Thubert wrote: > Hello Martin > > Code point 7 is not defined and =C3=A9thique doc does not define it. The > intention and WIP draft is that the value 7 will signal RPLv2, and that t= he > support of RFC 8138 will be mandated at that point. The mop itself will b= e > signaled in an extension, more in > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-cap. The text here is t= o > prepare the current implementation so that it behaves correctly in the > presence of RPLv2. > > Does that answer the discuss? > > Pascal > > > Le 2 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 21:52, Michael Richardson a =C3=A9crit : > > > > =EF=BB=BFMartin Duke via Datatracker wrote: > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------= - > > > DISCUSS: > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------= - > > > > > Now that I know that an IANA registry exists for MOP, codepoint 7 > > > should be included in the IANA considerations for the "Mode of > > > Operation" Registry. From nobody Wed Sep 2 14:31:19 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 603A93A1032 for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:31:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.096 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y72ScQ5f7KWK for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:31:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x529.google.com (mail-ed1-x529.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::529]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D80573A1031 for ; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:31:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x529.google.com with SMTP id c8so494306edv.5 for ; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 14:31:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=JZ++7+nnzGfDZS+osc0w8Kb7GP++C5+AQ+s2ajWUPPk=; b=WGmgk8SJFzuVRdWzixmWY6VFME9qGyHsWlWuJJXX8zmiLoCOR8pirQryhlFvWUML6A bdJUKmr2qmq8SHdwprT0eXzC0cWHiCEYgzYr4+r8F35vZ03NbFcsM0ynqQiR+LLYBffx pOd+zHRtuZ8BCHoD/3HrOWR6tMZPZnRG7hI5q8nKjE4pXlsXMdjdWwQe76UnmPsoTWKt 46vTI/OK/MSEVWlB3y228Hvwe7B+Mc8O8qbMXY4dTKtoYgEQHyUYu9DuGIaYSg4K/l0q 3MVFDt/P2TSaruXBFGJ5o16d12WC2YyrHqfMjXychwDEjziM0mEKqR4N/mcnhLvD6wCc Spag== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=JZ++7+nnzGfDZS+osc0w8Kb7GP++C5+AQ+s2ajWUPPk=; b=mkRt1+bXy1wiGkrYTFqQktZGbtTD8pEPNpt/o0XG+SkNhiIb80QmMI9kCU3RYxoWn4 YiV1e0JNsq/p23K0gqyjqeDnr7PS9Yh0Fplm5ev7Qn2sZ2SrCzngNFM/ZAfyV5Gmvp+O PGFTEhaVD/90MPfdMK0k7hwb98lEXpaOPYYV++KNzlP3M2HaeS4Wyfq0e8UFg0U9rL65 QbP3kOQ2GLTuCVqMf3mrm0DOKXT0Yh2Ry0+QAv92B6qZ2oNdb/eDKIP37Vlwmc8Of4qA 0wE8iVNv7wNmg2qXlSO/NPn2YcIRxTRV5Q45XWHjA8sIFZ1nu/kGaeS1cKAYX+Uu3Ttq IrBQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Kp2wZI9aKzPJr5Iyp26thE2Ty7QuRl+eSQ5kDlKFwVm7EjOTv qZXoDP/wozJdA2/ckIISa3259S2RFybfmzxqFW4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyOk1vLp3fXhpzb+YULSwcNwv3vWRes+hXpNON4o3oil3Xx7IobJHxvkWGfOk2umUMSaomEpm03mC+OWmQIJzY= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1212:: with SMTP id c18mr2080847edw.344.1599082275436; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 14:31:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:31:14 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: References: <159902561466.27239.11154649696524664213@ietfa.amsl.com> <9695.1599065358@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:31:14 -0700 Message-ID: To: Barry Leiba , Michael Richardson Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fe7d3e05ae5b5a5e" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Barry Leiba's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 21:31:18 -0000 --000000000000fe7d3e05ae5b5a5e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yup. I will. Alvaro. On September 2, 2020 at 1:18:15 PM, Barry Leiba (barryleiba@computer.org) wrote: I think it should be =C3=81lvaro who makes the request, but, yes, it's just= a matter of sending a note to the RFC Editor. --000000000000fe7d3e05ae5b5a5e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =
Yup.=C2=A0 I will.


Alvaro.

On September = 2, 2020 at 1:18:15 PM, Barry Leiba (barryleiba@computer.org) wrote:

I think it should be =C3=81lvaro who makes the req= uest, but, yes, it's just =20 a matter of sending a note to the RFC Editor.
--000000000000fe7d3e05ae5b5a5e-- From nobody Wed Sep 2 14:32:10 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FC073A1036; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:32:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kAmOQFcEoa0g; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:32:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0AA53A1032; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 14:32:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A86F389AB; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 17:11:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id NDQqvfIz8nQ8; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 17:10:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FCAF389AA; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 17:10:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8C6FB0F; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 17:32:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Alvaro Retana , "roll\@ietf.org" , Martin Duke , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138\@ietf.org" In-Reply-To: References: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> <23816.1599076306@localhost> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 21:32:08 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alvaro Retana wrote: > Maybe what needs to be slightly clarified is this text from =C2=A73: > =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Opera= tion (MOP) in > =C2=A0 =C2=A0the DIO Base Object. =C2=A0This specification applies to= MOP values 0 to > =C2=A0 =C2=A06. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be u= sed by default > =C2=A0 =C2=A0regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > The specification does apply to all MOPs in that it is specifying wha= t to do. NEW> > =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Opera= tion (MOP) in the > =C2=A0 =C2=A0DIO Base Object. =C2=A0This behavior specified in this d= ocument applies to MOP > =C2=A0 =C2=A0values 0 to 6. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the compressi= on MUST be used by > =C2=A0 =C2=A0default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. That doesn't really work better. For a MOP value of 7, there is no T flag. =2D- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9QD1MACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUmTwf/ffXb4dgWHhAq3b9HW7rikGUbY5TMb5VFsyEoA/AtjgSVOXfC7VTNk2wt ZpsozaFZZBmyu4Tnn3HF6/WR3jyBuw4TH9JpvBTyVLa/SJAyzBJYAbhQCIp3jKhV DlH3dRQhW6Xav5Nd/1bqYo33nfh2m+S5Kq9+pMNKYXzb170quDHby7ZO4ACwePW4 7PUYpcFmtWdC+GwR5iy738ISecLnoltcAWcnjWLSUzG2AbvlWHAHyCBXEo5F2HWc /uMFU1BN/mqanE5DiJkyAe2AhHatDwkUU83xL0Iee1FmoeJhsFS8dZyt19A+DEen N91e2VFqfs8Nlak3EK3aETubdpHNfQ== =AVfp -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Wed Sep 2 15:23:23 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 963FD3A1111; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:23:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VaEZ0G9cM_fT; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io1-xd2d.google.com (mail-io1-xd2d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 423123A110A; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io1-xd2d.google.com with SMTP id m17so650079ioo.1; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 15:23:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=lmCOCJ9n7EzD+ogClnhtlcWAdwD+3NZb60q5oKbubZk=; b=Oto6qZgOLuoJNrnrg8VhyASJjOb4zZ/79aqiXhNR7s8vFjs2ywccvNOKzMWr5oO6YD EdabtFHfgxxRAoc2+hvjAjeuuzLxlHUcSxnp/v1xTCeSvkNa9D2b9NB3xgOd2Cbsno9H PR36BxzV3To7KIWQCHOkp83Qdh8sRp/gslbS8WLqfAg0uyF3Xq0YO4zzk+vw6XETq4cI Dw/PoBBMSZ8yPwimqqbCqJoHlCMHu5XQjHQt2ykteGPJ7ZWiHWcuOZqKR8foZ4vQ8Mwv uhfUeWhxt2jcHSk+PTlNFTrm5xxmXQR9l4B+Vf2/07eLdQ8qkKttX1NQGl7wrmE2szEF bPKA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lmCOCJ9n7EzD+ogClnhtlcWAdwD+3NZb60q5oKbubZk=; b=oVWjZa2dyONF9imrso6LZAGDpwWg8autnSVmfG7TztwuNqH81AQyI2s/xfz7E05i0w cHY+h2kZv3Qltr0YGhUzxoQx8C3dMM1EsKWLmoN/yhvglEAWZWP4mLO3eH9mIUxNyVyO kA++upHUJ43nvuMhsH+gUxnpwdtG44B4ed3ziCCkYes9d3sQZ8mNh8MojZrYl3yY5+Xb sdqrekzt2NR6Bi6WCiO26ryJwjnWtTy+/dLc+ifMge32tRLzvfyOkQ/5O0BA+l6i7cIx eoccym0serT0VcVbsuF4YhEUBMTn6FeftXW9siTpQV//DuHEhBiboZg+gdhByD6DcWst 9cvQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530jG3Bfj/7/NMsdRvNsbARCuRAtdxzZryNxUnPsNDLX53yfVpq/ 6idAsEbDxw6LFpeQUHbUUlB70TcAn/crdVnBnR0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwBJ+XtzidY/2Q8RT9g32M5S4J+ib0HPB5WjS2JYNmxZ81oOY+p5QyJnvkYmTAXSKmmXmRm+vpZmngiYwUJOi8= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:9d10:: with SMTP id j16mr392623ioj.97.1599085394291; Wed, 02 Sep 2020 15:23:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> <23816.1599076306@localhost> <14761.1599082323@localhost> In-Reply-To: <14761.1599082323@localhost> From: Martin Duke Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2020 15:23:03 -0700 Message-ID: To: Michael Richardson Cc: Alvaro Retana , "roll@ietf.org" , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e470f305ae5c1449" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2020 22:23:17 -0000 --000000000000e470f305ae5c1449 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I find this all very odd, which maybe is a sign we should simply DISCUSS in the telechat. As far as I can understand: - codepoints 5, 6, and 7 are currently unassigned, though draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01 (still in the WG) allocates 7 as a field extender (though this is not listed as a dependency) - The intent of this document is to define a compression behavior of MOP 7 independently of the eventual outcome of roll-mopex, or indeed what the extended MOP codepoints might want to do - MOP 7 might indicate there is no T flag, although the current draft says there would be and quick scan of draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01 doesn't reveal why that might be true.. It is entirely possible I missed something critical, but as described this seems unsatisfactory to me. On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 2:32 PM Michael Richardson wrote: > > Alvaro Retana wrote: > > Maybe what needs to be slightly clarified is this text from =C2=A73= : > > > Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation > (MOP) in > > the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 > to > > 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by defaul= t > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > The specification does apply to all MOPs in that it is specifying > what to do. > > NEW> > > Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation > (MOP) in the > > DIO Base Object. This behavior specified in this document > applies to MOP > > values 0 to 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be > used by > > default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > That doesn't really work better. > For a MOP value of 7, there is no T flag. > > -- > Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works > -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- > > > > --000000000000e470f305ae5c1449 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I find this all very odd, which maybe is a sign we should = simply DISCUSS in the telechat. As far as I can understand:
- codepoint= s 5, 6,=C2=A0 and 7 are currently unassigned, though draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01 (still in the WG) allocates 7 as a field extender = (though this is not listed as a dependency)
- The intent of this = document is to define a compression behavior of MOP 7 independently of the = eventual outcome of roll-mopex, or indeed what the extended MOP codepoints = might want to do
- MOP 7 might indicate there is no T flag, altho= ugh the current draft says there would be and quick scan of=C2=A0draft-ietf= -roll-mopex-01 doesn't reveal why that might be true..

It is entirely possible I missed something critical, but as descri= bed=C2=A0this seems unsatisfactory to me.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 2:32 = PM Michael Richardson <mcr+ie= tf@sandelman.ca> wrote:

Alvaro Retana <aretana.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > Maybe what needs to be slightly clarified is this text f= rom =C2=A73:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit = Mode of Operation (MOP) in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0the DIO Base Object.=C2=A0 This specificati= on applies to MOP values 0 to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A06.=C2=A0 For a MOP value of 7, the compress= ion MUST be used by default
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0regardless of the setting of the "T&qu= ot; flag.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > The specification does apply to all MOPs in that it is s= pecifying what to do.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 NEW>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit = Mode of Operation (MOP) in the
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0DIO Base Object.=C2=A0 This behavior specif= ied in this document applies to MOP
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0values 0 to 6.=C2=A0 For a MOP value of 7, = the compression MUST be used by
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > =C2=A0 =C2=A0default regardless of the setting of the &q= uot;T" flag.

That doesn't really work better.
For a MOP value of 7, there is no T flag.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>, Sandelman Software Works
=C2=A0-=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D-



--000000000000e470f305ae5c1449-- From nobody Wed Sep 2 18:32:55 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 419633A0C46; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 18:32:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4xIL4E8pEQ1Q; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 18:32:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2AE603A0CDD; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 18:32:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06726389AB; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 21:11:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id rP7Ij2KtOJsy; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 21:11:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB8B7389AA; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 21:11:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B47DB3E; Wed, 2 Sep 2020 21:32:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Martin Duke cc: Alvaro Retana , "roll\@ietf.org" , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138\@ietf.org" In-Reply-To: References: <159906767077.10518.17525113825721227844@ietfa.amsl.com> <23816.1599076306@localhost> <14761.1599082323@localhost> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Martin Duke's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2020 01:32:50 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Martin Duke wrote: > I find this all very odd, which maybe is a sign we should simply DISCUSS in > the telechat. As far as I can understand: > - codepoints 5, 6, and 7 are currently unassigned, though > draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01 (still in the WG) allocates 7 as a field extender > (though this is not listed as a dependency) Right, we aren't sure what will be codepoints 5 and 6, but we suspect that we might need them before we have an RPLv2. Maybe. > - The intent of this document is to define a compression behavior of MOP 7 > independently of the eventual outcome of roll-mopex, or indeed what the > extended MOP codepoints might want to do No, that's not the goal. The intent of this document is to define a compression behaviour for MOP 0..6 only. We are signaling that before looking at the T flag, you need to know the MOP number. > - MOP 7 might indicate there is no T flag, although the current draft says > there would be and quick scan of draft-ietf-roll-mopex-01 doesn't reveal > why that might be true.. Because mopex doesn't define RPLv2. mopex gives us enough more bits in order that we can eventually define things. Nodes that do not not understand the MOP value join a leaves rather than routers (and we have several documents that clarify this behaviour). So, the MOP value is the highest order determination of behaviour. > It is entirely possible I missed something critical, but as described this > seems unsatisfactory to me. I think that the first step is to make get you to understand our goals, and then you can tell us where our text led you astray. -- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -= IPv6 IoT consulting =- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9QR7kACgkQgItw+93Q 3WXfaQf+L03MNpvu3C8Sm0o8NoFcu0iyzNbzzeyYGBPerpyPPJwH24/ZfyfdMLzS /FvPdTHVlNKHYwJqZxeqGuYnbxEf90xZ7co2JiZZJWALZwPHXzt2R6yqYt9TCNmb EsImKRBU2BEkYfaJGsHKA6o9/gaGygQB1J67n+pwawuutchxzPdB/cXh8Bh+HQok CXwNgSkv5OOZQn8kbMvQNVxNM2TEc7/3tlVKSkT3aJ7cAFT1m57TeLVHAtoMcCe/ VNgyhrGhoT8GNRdjmIQHBQ4iHcQRJOfvvUHoe5Zj05ejm2023hk0404PyB5mW37F +tsFWuozzOyt4gs6lqQMxNC1VmPvfA== =vQdv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Sep 4 05:55:22 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AE313A0BC2; Fri, 4 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 3591ccd5-4f93-42e4-f416-08d850d1bc96 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Sep 2020 12:55:01.3842 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: nF3T5Uod40uy3ka5OpWs+vHtq8ajzJdZseNdvSNuQTihzDNGQFb/1nk4hmdvpsOAWqvOwVRFfVGIk4gcNsKMnQ== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BYAPR11MB2838 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.36.7.12, xch-aln-002.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-1.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2020 12:55:09 -0000 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aWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9yb2xsDQo= From nobody Fri Sep 4 05:59:04 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D5973A0BC2; Fri, 4 Sep 2020 05:58:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wWr16qSB6k1D; Fri, 4 Sep 2020 05:58:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.83]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 575973A09E8; Fri, 4 Sep 2020 05:58:52 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.76,359,1592863200"; d="scan'208";a="466104331" Received: from wifi-pro-83-247.paris.inria.fr ([128.93.83.247]) by mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 04 Sep 2020 14:58:50 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) From: =?utf-8?B?TWFsacWhYSBWdcSNaW5pxIc=?= In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2020 14:58:49 +0200 Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "iot-directorate@ietf.org" , "last-call@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo.all@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <159602896040.32219.18351168129491497436@ietfa.amsl.com> To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2020 12:58:56 -0000 Hello Pascal, Sounds good, thanks for checking this. Mali=C5=A1a > On 4 Sep 2020, at 14:54, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) = wrote: >=20 > Hello Malisa >=20 > I rechecked RFC 6553. It is contradicting itself somehow. Section 2 = has a lowercase must for the RPI.=20 > Later RFC 6553 says =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent between RPL routers MUST = include a RPL Option or RPL Source Route Header ([RFC6554]) and MAY = include both.=E2=80=9C RFC 8138 requires the RPI at all times for = compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all cases, it appears simpler to be = able to count on it to apply QoS. >=20 > Take care, >=20 > Pascal >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Roll On Behalf Of Pascal Thubert = (pthubert) >> Sent: jeudi 30 juillet 2020 11:08 >> To: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 ; = iot-directorate@ietf.org >> Cc: last-call@ietf.org; roll@ietf.org; = draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo.all@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of = draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 >>=20 >> Hello Mali=C5=A1a >>=20 >> Many thanks for your review! >>=20 >> I'm not the editor but I'd like to refine some points here >>=20 >>>=20 >>> Section 1: >>>=20 >>>> Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 >> encapsulation. >>> It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the >>> RFC6040 [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion >>> notification (ECN) field of the IP header should be constructed on >>> entry to and exit from any >>> IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether >>> it is appropriate to have a normative MUST here. >>=20 >> That's a good point, but then all the best practice of encaps also = applies, not >> sure we need/want to list them all. >> I'm afraid that if we start listing some we miss others and get in an = endless >> discussion at IESG, e.g., fragmentation. >>=20 >> The reverse angle could be the MTU discussion. >> If we use RFC 8138 then the IP in IP does not really steal from the = 6LoWPAN >> MTU of 1280. >> If not it does. So on paper the IP in IP encapsulator should fragment = at the IP >> layer. This might happen in particular in non-storing mode with a = routing >> header that causes a larger encapsulation. >> But as it goes, even though the MTU is 1280, the fragmentation allows = more >> (2048 with RFC 4944, no explicit limit with = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft- >> ietf-6lo-fragment-recovery-21). >>=20 >> So it could be good to add text that says: >> - best practice IPv6 encapsulation applies >> - mention RFC6040 >> - there are exception >> - no IP layer MTU discovery (because MTU is 1280) >> - though MTU is 1280, no IP layer fragmentation when the >> encapsulated packet is over that (because fragmentation copes with it = above >> 1280) >> - The recomposition buffer SHOULD be large enough. We could >> RECOMMEND 2048 bytes. >>=20 >>=20 >>> Section 4.2: >>>> The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from = 0x63 >>>> to 0x23, >>> as the root can always create the right packet. The type change = does >>> not adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what = RPI >>> option type should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the >>> discussion in Section 4.3 would be useful. >>>=20 >>=20 >> Note that adding/removing an RPI on the way (e.g., at the root) = always >> involves en/decapsulations (ask 6MAN!). >> I'm not clear what difference you make there? >>=20 >> The problem is for packets from the LLN node to the internet. This is = the same >> for storing and non-storing. >> 0x23 allows us to not remove The RPI thus to not encapsulate at the = LLN node. >> Maybe that can be clarified. >>=20 >> We deprecate 0x63 globally and want it replaced by 0x23 in all cases. = Maybe >> that can be clarified too. >>=20 >>=20 >>> Section 4.4: >>>=20 >>>> A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the >>>> RPI Option >>> Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) >>> and 0x63 (old). The node will know which to use based upon the >>> presence of the flag in the DODAG Configuration option defined in >>> Section 4.3. E.g. If the network is in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), >>> then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - If my understanding is >>> correct, this means that in order to decompress data plane packets, = a >>> node first needs to remember the option type mode the network is >>> operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not = possible >> before at least one DIO is received. >>=20 >> True. At that point the node does not even know it is in a RPL = network. >> Note that the decompression generally happens at the destination of = the outer >> header which removes the RPI if it is a router and ignores it if it = is the final >> destination. So it does not really matter. >> But just in case we can mention that the default is 0x23. >>=20 >>=20 >>> Section 6: >>>=20 >>>> The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet. >>> - How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this >>> not redundant with RFC6553? >>=20 >> Agreed to lowercase it, and as you point out all the uppercase which = echo an >> existing RFC >>=20 >>> Section 8: >>>=20 >>>> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down >>> - It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on = the >>> way down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, = IPv6-in-IPv6 >>> is marked as =E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify. >>=20 >> Need to clarify that this is for routed traffic not self-generated = traffic >>=20 >>> Section 8.2.1: >>>=20 >>> - A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is >>> destined for the Internet would be useful. >>=20 >> Note that that it does not need to. With this spec, the RAL may do = the same >> thing whether the destination is a RAL, a RUL, or the Internet. >> But yes I agree; we could say that if the RAL knows what the RPL = domain is, it >> may encapsulate to the root when the destination is not in that = domain. >>=20 >>=20 >> Many thanks again! >>=20 >> Take care >>=20 >> Pascal >> _______________________________________________ >> Roll mailing list >> Roll@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll From nobody Sat Sep 5 03:43:56 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27B793A0A40 for ; Sat, 5 Sep 2020 03:43:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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auth=pass smtp.auth=CUSA40A35 smtp.mailfrom=tirumaleswarreddy_konda@mcafee.com X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0.002 X-Mimecast-Originator: mcafee.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_MWHPR16MB15352A9604389BC647A87A5FEA2A0MWHPR16MB1535namp_" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Secdir last call review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2020 10:43:55 -0000 --_000_MWHPR16MB15352A9604389BC647A87A5FEA2A0MWHPR16MB1535namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Reviewer: Tirumaleswar Reddy Review result: Ready with nits I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's ongoing= effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the IESG. These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the security area = directors. Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments just= like any other last call comments. Summary: Ready with nits [1] You may want to clarify how the attacker manages to modify a protected = configuration including the "T" flag introduced in this spec. [2] Is it possible to identify the attacker (or compromised router) who set= the "T" flag to remediation measures ? [3] If due to an human error one or more of the on-path routers are not upg= raded or if the router sees both settings, I presume an alert could be sent= to the network management for troubleshooting. You may want to add text to= discuss the same. [4] What do you mean by "subDAG" (I don't see any definition in this spec a= nd RFC8138) ? Cheers, -Tiru --_000_MWHPR16MB15352A9604389BC647A87A5FEA2A0MWHPR16MB1535namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Reviewer: Tirumaleswar Reddy

Review result: Ready with nits

 

I have reviewed this document as part of the securit= y directorate's ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed= by the IESG.

These comments were written primarily for the benefi= t of the security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs shou= ld treat these comments just like any other last call comments.<= /p>

 

Summary: Ready with nits

 

[1] You may want to clarify how the attacker manages= to modify a protected configuration including the “T” flag int= roduced in this spec.

[2] Is it possible to identify the attacker (or comp= romised router) who set the “T” flag to remediation measures ?<= o:p>

[3] If due to an human error one or more of the on-p= ath routers are not upgraded or if the router sees both settings, I presume= an alert could be sent to the network management for troubleshooting. You = may want to add text to discuss the same.

[4] What do you mean by “subDAG” (I don&= #8217;t see any definition in this spec and RFC8138) ?

 

Cheers,

-Tiru

 

 

 

--_000_MWHPR16MB15352A9604389BC647A87A5FEA2A0MWHPR16MB1535namp_-- From nobody Sat Sep 5 15:38:50 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 973AD3A1340; Sat, 5 Sep 2020 15:38:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.087 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.087 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sTzxHvsAjU4D; Sat, 5 Sep 2020 15:38:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vk1-xa36.google.com (mail-vk1-xa36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a36]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D69E13A133F; Sat, 5 Sep 2020 15:38:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vk1-xa36.google.com with SMTP id t189so2499427vka.10; Sat, 05 Sep 2020 15:38:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=+zo2Ga6HZSHHssrCF+coOHHxGc4FdqXatriHLr7IQgE=; b=u25KqlGRs8bsFlOzf2QLVrxDWM/rOrLvphLPFubwW9QDgs/goaG+Fl+n45gCzh/biJ 7Rqr3rcVjDfWhdAUzSQuYt8bPASUzZ0M9iUkUHh7sRcLb1g4RiGiR8xv6SdWkYUfm8js akpijGHcMSRQA5Qg/NqgZCmF072cRc/99KdNm3gjTI3/oftMYykhZZSnxMu7FTUkl9by ln0nlyqPIk5LkJJgmCvDhSxJkX4B7SulFK/2xquLmQYxrfYz4zUKW25PV3ptVhFjhjug kuc5EjGO2eJwVyXmUbXEiaLkvpbYMZ/1TQf8d7aacEo7x1RJiRXAEEpK0kNtfRBmExnX dD3A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=+zo2Ga6HZSHHssrCF+coOHHxGc4FdqXatriHLr7IQgE=; b=Eamz4ppJp4SjoNbHRL2h/sNNb5ZTUgnGeS5xSBtmuFotxfWfEf8ytqVzdJMB/rdhxG SDMPsl1DnvSlF2V/KeLa/gvaMbwR0cSxh3BFBGAtpPB6Hn/9xZgDFQwBZBq+sgs6Yi0j JeIWsj+B+izJyJDVL7qaKbMWx7IxP8dW3yl0T67t8C5WakwabKy3rTMq9LgpkTSPOFLm nH7EsuRZAPG24VZ/SWeTX0BEB65KSzTKTY8RAq3iDunaKzuAeH39KDexWIM7ioDxIaIR wJFnyrBvXB+a5JKGHMmnFQvmWtz9qQ7SUFgbhFXfQRfS/3Nom712TaGVYTeHft4MFmqN zSCQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530zqNrtjAo5jo84hurDNiT1XZjsEj7aec6ePr+aN7LJnicbT/yw uKfBNE6ZHyQg4UxgrS61nh33AOg3t2pFlZg8VvY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxlKbUpIHQY7nD25kduAN1UI31AYqWAR62iVF8Vt1vWJKB4DphxoR0aigRbc3ZvqrgEENp6xVON0i6To08496w= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:5c56:: with SMTP id q83mr9509598vkb.40.1599345516717; Sat, 05 Sep 2020 15:38:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159602896040.32219.18351168129491497436@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <159602896040.32219.18351168129491497436@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Ines Robles Date: Sun, 6 Sep 2020 01:38:00 +0300 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?B?TWFsacWhYSBWdcSNaW5pxIc=?= Cc: IETF IoT Directorate , draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo.all@ietf.org, roll , last-call@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000065ac2c05ae98a5d5" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 05 Sep 2020 22:38:41 -0000 --00000000000065ac2c05ae98a5d5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Mali=C5=A1a, Many many thanks for your review. Please find below comments in-line. On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 via Datatrack= er < noreply@ietf.org> wrote: > Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 > Review result: Ready with Issues > > As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through > draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is > ready to > proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved. > > I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is appropriate > in the > use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the > sections > updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. > Please > consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6. > In section 3 times the normative vocabulary is used not specially oriented to the use cases but to the general behavior. : -=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero when passing the packet out = to the Internet. The Internet will therefore not see any SenderRank information= =E2=80=9D -=E2=80=9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an extension header (e.g= . RH3 or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate the packet in an (additional) outer IP header=E2=80=9D -=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.=E2=80=9D= : in order to avoid e.g loops In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not used normative language, since they are basically examples. What do you think? > > As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the > IP6-IP6 > acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a mix = of > IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present. > We specify the use of IP6-IP6 in section 2: =E2=80=9CNote: Due to lack of= space in some figures (tables) we refer to IPv6-in-IPv6 as IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D > > My detailed comments are given below. > > Section 1: > > > Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 > encapsulation. > It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the RFC6040 > [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification (ECN) > field > of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any > IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether it i= s > appropriate to have a normative MUST here. > New text: Most of the use cases described therein require the use of IPv6-in-IPv6 packet encapsulation. When encapsulating and decapsulating packets, RFC 6040 [RFC6040] MUST be applied to map the setting of the explicit congestion notification (ECN) field between inner and outer headers. The normative is used in order to highlight support of ECN for any tunnelling solutions. What do you think? > > Section 4.2: > > The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from 0x63 to > 0x23, > as the root can always create the right packet. The type change does not > adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI option > type > should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in Section 4= .3 > would be useful. > > done > Section 4.4: > > > A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the RPI > Option > Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) and > 0x63 > (old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the fla= g > in > the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g. If the > network is > in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - I= f > my > understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data pla= ne > packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the network = is > operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not > possible > before at least one DIO is received. > > In order to be able to decompress, the node should support RFC8138. The DODAG configuration Option indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23. Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indicated in the RPI and should not generate or forward packets for that instance before they receive the first DIO. In the case of reboot, the node (6LN or 6LR) does not remember the RPI Option Type (i.e., whether or not the flag is set), so the node will not trigger DIO messages until a DIO message is received indicating the RPI value to be used. The node will use the value 0x23 if the network supports this feature. > Section 6: > > > The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet. > - How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this not > redundant with RFC6553? > the use of the MUST is to enforce the explanation of the use case when the RPI is present . It tends to add clarification to the reader As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent between RPL r= outers MUST include a RPL Option or RPL Source Route Header ([RFC6554 ]) and MAY include both.=E2=80=9C RFC = 8138 requires it at all times for compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all cases, it is simpler. > > > This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI Option Typ= e > (0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such > redundant. please remove one appearance. > done > > Section 8: > > > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down > - It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the wa= y > down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is > marked as > =E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify. > Corrected, we have deleted =E2=80=9CThe root always have to encapus= late on the way down=E2=80=9D > > Section 8.1.3: > > > When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, will > ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - Figure > 22 > states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is > mandatory which is not consistent with this text. > > corrected on the table > Section 8.2.1: > > - A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is destined > for the > Internet would be useful. > Added: =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information about the RPL domain, it= may encapsulate to the root when the destination is not in the RPL domain of the RAL.=E2=80=9D > Section 8.2.3: > > > As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) will > add an > RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound as > if RUL > originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase. > As the RUL parent adds RPL headers in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) will add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. What do you think? > > Nits: > > The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and > non-storing > use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed > done > > > that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop Header. > - s/hob/hop > done > > > consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed by > - define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop > done > > > The root does not removes the RPI1 > - s/removes/remove > done > > > The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E) > - s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1 > done > > > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down > - s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate > done > > > If the originating node does not not > - s/does not not/does not > done > > > and add it's own > - s/it=E2=80=99s/its > done > > > The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with the > flag > indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is > done > > > Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is capable > of > 0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes > done Changes are displayed in https://github.com/roll-wg/useofrplinfo/blob/master/draft-ietf-roll-useofrp= linfo-41.txt Thank you very much again for your useful comments, Ines. --00000000000065ac2c05ae98a5d5 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Mali=C5=A1a,

Many m= any thanks for your review. Please find below comments in-line.
=
On Wed= , Jul 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 via Datatracker <= ;noreply@ietf.org> wrote:
Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a = Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87
Review result: Ready with Issues

As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through
draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is read= y to
proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved.

I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is appropriate in= the
use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the secti= ons
updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. Pleas= e
consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6.

<Ines> In section 3 times the=C2=A0 normative vocabulary is us= ed not specially oriented to the use cases but to the general behavior. :


-=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero when passing= the packet out to the Internet. The Internet will therefore not see any Se= nderRank=C2=A0 information=E2=80=9D=C2=A0=C2=A0


-=E2=80= =9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an extension header (e.g.=C2=A0= RH3 or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate the packet in an (additional) ou= ter IP header=E2=80=9D


-=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present i= n every single RPL data packet.=E2=80=9D: in order to avoid e.g loops



In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not= used normative language, since they are basically examples.=C2=A0

What do you think?


</Ines>


=C2=A0

As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the IP6-IP= 6
acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a mix of=
IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present.

<= ;Ines>

=C2=A0We specify the use of IP6-IP6=C2=A0 in section= 2: =E2=80=9CNote: Due to lack of space in some figures (tables) we refer t= o IPv6-in-IPv6 as IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D

</Ines>


=C2=A0

My detailed comments are given below.

Section 1:

> Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsul= ation.
It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the RFC6040 [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification (ECN) fie= ld
of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any
IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether it is<= br> appropriate to have a normative MUST here.

<= span id=3D"gmail-docs-internal-guid-a57b6c2a-7fff-57a5-21fa-b607f0c40919"><= p dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><= span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial;background-color:transparent= ;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;vertical-align:= baseline;white-space:pre-wrap"><Ines> New text:=C2=A0

Most of the use cases described therein require = the use of IPv6-in-IPv6 packet encapsulation.=C2=A0

When encapsulating and decapsulating packets, RFC 6040= [RFC6040] MUST be applied to map the setting of the explicit congestion no= tification (ECN) field between inner and outer headers.


The normative is used in order to high= light support of ECN for any tunnelling solutions.=C2=A0=C2=A0

What do you think?


<= ;/Ines>


<= div>=C2=A0

Section 4.2:
> The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from 0x63 t= o 0x23,
as the root can always create the right packet.=C2=A0 The type change does = not
adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI option ty= pe
should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in Section 4.3=
would be useful.

<Ines> done </Ines>
=C2=A0
Section 4.4:

> A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the RPI= Option
Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) and 0x6= 3
(old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the flag = in
the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g.=C2=A0 If the ne= twork is
in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - If = my
understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data plane=
packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the network is=
operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not possib= le
before at least one DIO is received.

<Ines>

=C2=A0In order to be able to decompress, = the node should support RFC8138.


The DODAG configuration Option indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23.=C2= =A0


Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indic= ated in the RPI and should not generate or forward packets for that instanc= e before they receive the first DIO.


In the case of reboot= , the node (6LN or 6LR) does not remember the RPI Option Type (i.e., whethe= r or not the flag is set), so the node will not trigger DIO messages until = a DIO message is received indicating the RPI value to be used. The node wil= l use the value 0x23 if the network supports this feature.


</Ines>


=C2=A0
Section 6:

> The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.
- How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this not
redundant with RFC6553?

<Ines> the use of the MUST is to enforce the explanation = of the use case when the RPI is present . It tends to add clarification to = the reader


As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: =E2=80=9C = Datagrams sent between RPL routers MUST include a RPL Option or RPL Source = Route Header ([RFC6554]) and MAY include both.=E2=80=9C RFC 8138 requires it at all ti= mes for compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all cases, it is simpler.


</Ines>


=C2=A0

>=C2=A0 This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI Opti= on Type
(0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such
redundant. please remove one appearance.

<Ines> done </Ines>= =C2=A0

Section 8:

> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the way<= br> down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is marke= d as
=E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify.

<= span style=3D"background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font= -variant-east-asian:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial;vertical-align:= baseline;white-space:pre-wrap"><Ines>=C2=A0 Corrected, we have delete= d =E2=80=9CThe root always have to encapuslate on the way down=E2=80=9D</Ines>= =C2=A0

Section 8.1.3:

> When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, wil= l
ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - Figure 2= 2
states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is
mandatory which is not consistent with this text.

<Ines> correcte= d on the table </Ines>
=C2=A0
Section 8.2.1:

- A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is destined for= the
Internet would be useful.

<Ines>=C2=A0 Added:= =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information about the RPL domain, it may encapsula= te to the root when the destination is not in the RPL domain of the RAL.=E2= =80=9D

</Ines>



Section 8.2.3:

> As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) will= add an
RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound as if= RUL
originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase.

<Ines> As the R= UL parent adds=C2=A0 RPL headers in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) w= ill add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header.=C2=A0


What do yo= u think?


=C2=A0</Ines>=C2=A0

Nits:
> The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and non-st= oring
use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0<= /div>

> that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop Header= .
- s/hob/hop
<Ines&g= t;=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed by - define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The root does not removes the RPI1
- s/removes/remove
<= ;Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E)
- s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1
= <Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ine= s>=C2=A0=C2=A0
=C2=A0
> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>= =C2=A0

>=C2=A0 If the originating node does not not
- s/does not not/does not
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> and add it's own
- s/it=E2=80=99s/its
&= lt;Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with the = flag
indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines><= /span>=C2=A0

> Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is capabl= e of
0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes
<= div><Ines>=C2=A0 done </= Ines>

Changes are displayed in https://github.com/roll-wg/useofrplinfo/blob/master/draft-i= etf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt=C2=A0


Thank yo= u very much again for your useful comments,


Ines.

=C2=A0
--00000000000065ac2c05ae98a5d5-- From nobody Sun Sep 6 09:35:07 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86BBC3A0C9B; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 09:35:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id byJUUCmuVk4i; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 09:34:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 634493A0C9A; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 09:34:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4F45389BD; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 12:13:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 0b6jFDXGSdQy; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 12:13:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB580389B4; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 12:13:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EE44FB; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 12:34:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks cc: "secdir\@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138.all\@ietf.org" In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Secdir last call review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2020 16:35:01 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you for the review. Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy wrote: > [1] You may want to clarify how the attacker manages to modify a > protected configuration including the "T" flag introduced in this > spec. Every router within every routing protocol can do wrong things :-) RPL is an IGP, so all routers are within the same security control, and at the same level. An attacker would have to introduce malware into the device to modify data. RFC7416 lays out all of these threats: they are no different for the T-bit than other bits. > [2] Is it possible to identify the attacker (or compromised router) w= ho > set the "T" flag to remediation measures ? Maybe. Probably not. There are few things we can do within any routing protocol to identify mis-behaving routers. > [3] If due to an human error one or more of the on-path routers are n= ot > upgraded or if the router sees both settings, I presume an alert could > be sent to the network management for troubleshooting. You may want to > add text to discuss the same. At present, RPL does not include a standard off-path alerting mechanism. This remains a todo item for the WG. Some use NETCONF or HTTP to collect statistics in a proprietary way. We can send ICMPs, but since the affects how the packets are encoded, we likely can't send an ICMP to a relevant router, just one hop in the directi= on it came from. > [4] What do you mean by "subDAG" (I don't see any definition in this = spec and RFC8138) ? It's a sub-portion of a DAG. A sub-tree. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9VD6wACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWCtQf9Gtw30DmX89Oldz88VDG6tAhX2Sjn/iNO+Z0BOMRUZLkYYMTlrz3Bv8fx Wg5XahYseuT7Z9cAhYIrTb4tNs3vMM8iKe8qPa1fJ6aVgMfvJPDiuSGaRUsDhkal y/PC7jlbE+3wN+bEzduq1b/hhPFV7rUTkFEkKbwKw/hCr4EUr9yyIdQRmotRsL8f 5V8HG2Nz1owLweXYBcxwL9HO9sXufjnKUs2mjir8RUi3UI9H2qicdyCKUf3ek4X7 9a0ENXTr+ZoPirS4ImALN0+O4Ofg9/CvXITe6HCgfRbtlDw7+kliL7hX1aU8UG6a rnFhjvQh+kpx7DmLFdN4YmhqVezBPA== =Ae+/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Sun Sep 6 13:24:13 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 911C53A1173; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 13:24:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Murray Kucherawy via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Murray Kucherawy Message-ID: <159942384757.21238.7505714367087385423@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2020 13:24:07 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2020 20:24:08 -0000 Murray Kucherawy has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The glossary lists "OF" and "OCP", but those acronyms are not present in the document. I had to do some bouncing between documents while reading Section 3. Figure 1 shows what appear to be five flags, not four, and says "T" is declared in "position 2", though in the diagram it looks like the third position. If position numbering is zero-based, that should be made clear (it's not in RFC 6550 either). From nobody Sun Sep 6 23:24:26 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4787B3A15AD for ; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 23:24:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=mcafee.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8tde_izxJycV for ; Sun, 6 Sep 2020 23:24:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 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15.20.3348.019; Mon, 7 Sep 2020 12:13:45 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Murray Kucherawy , "Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks" , The IESG CC: "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Roll] Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AdaE8OwctpGBRxVfRoKL+rKottdcvQ== Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2020 12:12:41 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Mon, 7 Sep 2020 12:10:15 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: gmail.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gmail.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [90.118.154.54] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 93f62395-a7d1-4095-6cb8-08d8532777c1 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB4728: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:7219; 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 93f62395-a7d1-4095-6cb8-08d8532777c1 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 07 Sep 2020 12:13:45.0200 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: 9OdJoeZPHUZrM9v7we+PjUySNgWfBJAUG6/drFlrMcdne37BtYvcBaoxkUYfuhUD7XulY4WhM0rkKjWJlUiraA== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB4728 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.14, xch-rcd-004.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-7.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] ARE: Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2020 12:13:50 -0000 Hello Murray: Many thanks for your time, review, and in-depth checking. Let's see below: =20 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > The glossary lists "OF" and "OCP", but those acronyms are not present in = the > document. Removed the terms. Added subDAG instead to comply with Tiru's comment in a = parallel thread. >=20 > I had to do some bouncing between documents while reading Section 3. Fig= ure > 1 shows what appear to be five flags, not four, and says "T" is declared = in > "position 2", though in the diagram it looks like the third position. If= position > numbering is zero-based, that should be made clear (it's not in RFC > 6550 either). Actually it is indicated in RFC 6550, though well hidden, see https://tools= .ietf.org/html/rfc6550#section-20.14 See also https://www.iana.org/assignments/rpl/rpl.xhtml#dodag-config-option= -flags=20 Again, many thanks for your thorough checks,=20 Please see https://github.com/roll-wg/roll-turnon-rfc8138/commit/9984c51ef7= c762dd357362aed7a85e822ccf6c24 and let me know if you think I should change= /clarify something there. Take care, Pascal From nobody Mon Sep 7 05:16:54 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 938D33A0C6F; Mon, 7 Sep 2020 05:16:49 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <159948100955.16655.17909783854666305637@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2020 05:16:49 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2020 12:16:50 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2020-09-07 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and reset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Sep 7 23:38:18 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E7BA3A1311; Mon, 7 Sep 2020 23:38:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke_via_Datatracker?= To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com, carlesgo@entel.upc.edu X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.15.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke?= Message-ID: <159954709313.26081.8822043325346377883@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2020 23:38:13 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke=27s_No_Objection_on_draft-ietf?= =?utf-8?q?-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13=3A_=28with_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 06:38:14 -0000 Éric Vyncke has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you for the work put into this document. Carles Gomez has done a Last Call IoT directorate review at https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/iot-directorate/_UG_q8yutQU28ldYK1cdySTQoNs and had a couple of nits and comments that were discussed and implemented. Thank you Carles for the review and thank you Pascal for updating the document accordingly. I have only one comment/suggestion below. I hope that this helps to improve the document, Regards, -éric -- Section 5 -- I find this text confusing at first read "adding nodes that do not support [RFC8138] after a roll back may be problematic if the roll back did not fully complete" I had to read section 5.3 to fully understand it. Should something like ", the network operator must ensure that the roll back operation is completed before adding nodes that do not support RFC 8138" be easier to understand ? 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Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 07:55:22 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2020-09-08 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and reset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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ZCAiYWRkaW5nIG5vZGVzIHRoYXQgZG8gbm90IHN1cHBvcnQNCj4gPiAgICAgPiBbUkZDODEzOF0g YWZ0ZXIgYSByb2xsIGJhY2sgbWF5IGJlIHByb2JsZW1hdGljIGlmIHRoZSByb2xsIGJhY2sgZGlk IG5vdA0KPiBmdWxseQ0KPiA+ICAgICA+IGNvbXBsZXRlIiBJIGhhZCB0byByZWFkIHNlY3Rpb24g NS4zIHRvIGZ1bGx5IHVuZGVyc3RhbmQgaXQuDQo+ID4gICAgID4NCj4gPiAgICAgPiBTaG91bGQg c29tZXRoaW5nIGxpa2UgIiwgdGhlIG5ldHdvcmsgb3BlcmF0b3IgbXVzdCBlbnN1cmUgdGhhdA0K PiA+IHRoZSByb2xsIGJhY2sNCj4gPiAgICAgPiBvcGVyYXRpb24gaXMgY29tcGxldGVkIGJlZm9y ZSBhZGRpbmcgbm9kZXMgdGhhdCBkbyBub3Qgc3VwcG9ydCBSRkMNCj4gODEzOCINCj4gPiBiZQ0K PiA+ICAgICA+IGVhc2llciB0byB1bmRlcnN0YW5kID8NCj4gPiAgICAgPg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gICAg IExvb2tzIGdvb2QsIEknbGwgbWFrZSB0aGUgY2hhbmdlLiBTaG91bGQgd2UgdXBwZXJjYXNlIHRo ZSBtdXN0Pw0KPiA+DQo+ID4gRVY+IHRoaW5raW5nIG1vcmUgYWJvdXQgaXQsIHdoYXQgYWJvdXQg YSAiU0hPVUxEIiA/DQoNCg== From nobody Tue Sep 8 03:03:06 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97B13A08AE; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 03:02:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.886 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.886 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mngW2UPnUMLl; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 03:02:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr (mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr [192.134.164.83]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3CE993A0529; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 03:02:49 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.76,359,1592863200"; d="scan'208,217";a="466570960" Received: from adsl-bb32-l78.crnagora.net (HELO meganisi.t-com.me) ([95.155.32.78]) by mail2-relais-roc.national.inria.fr with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 08 Sep 2020 12:02:46 +0200 From: =?utf-8?B?TWFsacWhYSBWdcSNaW5pxIc=?= Message-Id: <18354E7B-2F0D-4AF9-96F1-CB87EEF0484D@inria.fr> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_C242030B-C1D5-4E04-8EBE-C23B82B98326" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2020 12:02:46 +0200 In-Reply-To: Cc: IETF IoT Directorate , draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo.all@ietf.org, roll , last-call@ietf.org To: Ines Robles References: <159602896040.32219.18351168129491497436@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 10:02:58 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_C242030B-C1D5-4E04-8EBE-C23B82B98326 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Ines, Thanks for making these changes, they are fine by me. Mali=C5=A1a > On 6 Sep 2020, at 00:38, Ines Robles = wrote: >=20 > Hi Mali=C5=A1a, >=20 > Many many thanks for your review. Please find below comments in-line. >=20 > On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 via = Datatracker > wrote: > Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 > Review result: Ready with Issues >=20 > As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through > draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is = ready to > proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved. >=20 > I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is = appropriate in the > use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the = sections > updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. = Please > consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6. >=20 > In section 3 times the normative vocabulary is used not = specially oriented to the use cases but to the general behavior. : >=20 > -=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero when passing the packet = out to the Internet. The Internet will therefore not see any SenderRank = information=E2=80=9D =20 >=20 > -=E2=80=9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an extension header = (e.g. RH3 or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate the packet in an = (additional) outer IP header=E2=80=9D >=20 > -=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.=E2=80= =9D: in order to avoid e.g loops >=20 >=20 > In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not used = normative language, since they are basically examples.=20 >=20 > What do you think? >=20 > >=20 > =20 >=20 > As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the = IP6-IP6 > acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a = mix of > IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present. >=20 > > We specify the use of IP6-IP6 in section 2: =E2=80=9CNote: Due to = lack of space in some figures (tables) we refer to IPv6-in-IPv6 as = IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D > >=20 > =20 >=20 > My detailed comments are given below. >=20 > Section 1: >=20 > > Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 = encapsulation.=20 > It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the = RFC6040 > [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification = (ECN) field > of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any > IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether = it is > appropriate to have a normative MUST here. >=20 > New text:=20 > Most of the use cases described therein require the use of = IPv6-in-IPv6 packet encapsulation.=20 > When encapsulating and decapsulating packets, RFC 6040 [RFC6040] MUST = be applied to map the setting of the explicit congestion notification = (ECN) field between inner and outer headers. >=20 > The normative is used in order to highlight support of ECN for any = tunnelling solutions. =20 >=20 > What do you think? >=20 > >=20 > =20 >=20 > Section 4.2: > > The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from 0x63 = to 0x23, > as the root can always create the right packet. The type change does = not > adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI = option type > should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in = Section 4.3 > would be useful. >=20 > done > =20 > Section 4.4: >=20 > > A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the = RPI Option > Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) = and 0x63 > (old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the = flag in > the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g. If the = network is > in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. = - If my > understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data = plane > packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the = network is > operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not = possible > before at least one DIO is received. >=20 > > In order to be able to decompress, the node should support RFC8138. >=20 > The DODAG configuration Option indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23.=20 >=20 > Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indicated in the RPI = and should not generate or forward packets for that instance before they = receive the first DIO. >=20 > In the case of reboot, the node (6LN or 6LR) does not remember the RPI = Option Type (i.e., whether or not the flag is set), so the node will not = trigger DIO messages until a DIO message is received indicating the RPI = value to be used. The node will use the value 0x23 if the network = supports this feature. >=20 > >=20 > =20 > Section 6: >=20 > > The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet. > - How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this = not > redundant with RFC6553? >=20 > the use of the MUST is to enforce the explanation of the use = case when the RPI is present . It tends to add clarification to the = reader >=20 > As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent between = RPL routers MUST include a RPL Option or RPL Source Route Header = ([RFC6554 ]) and MAY include = both.=E2=80=9C RFC 8138 requires it at all times for compression. Now we = MUST the RPI in all cases, it is simpler. >=20 > >=20 > =20 >=20 > > This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI Option = Type > (0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such > redundant. please remove one appearance. >=20 > done =20 >=20 > Section 8: >=20 > > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down > - It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the = way > down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is = marked as > =E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify. >=20 > Corrected, we have deleted =E2=80=9CThe root always have to = encapuslate on the way down=E2=80=9D=20 >=20 > Section 8.1.3: >=20 > > When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, = will > ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - = Figure 22 > states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation = is > mandatory which is not consistent with this text. >=20 > corrected on the table > =20 > Section 8.2.1: >=20 > - A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is = destined for the > Internet would be useful. >=20 > Added: =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information about the RPL = domain, it may encapsulate to the root when the destination is not in = the RPL domain of the RAL.=E2=80=9D > >=20 >=20 > Section 8.2.3: >=20 > > As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) = will add an > RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound = as if RUL > originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase. >=20 > As the RUL parent adds RPL headers in the RUL packet, the = first 6LR (6LR_1) will add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header.=20 >=20 > What do you think? >=20 > =20 >=20 > Nits: > > The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and = non-storing > use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed > done =20 >=20 > > that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop = Header. > - s/hob/hop > done =20 >=20 > > consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed by > - define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop > done =20 >=20 > > The root does not removes the RPI1 > - s/removes/remove > done =20 >=20 > > The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E) > - s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1 > done =20 > =20 > > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down > - s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate > done =20 >=20 > > If the originating node does not not > - s/does not not/does not > done =20 >=20 > > and add it's own > - s/it=E2=80=99s/its > done =20 >=20 > > The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with = the flag > indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is > done =20 >=20 > > Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is = capable of > 0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes > done >=20 > Changes are displayed in = https://github.com/roll-wg/useofrplinfo/blob/master/draft-ietf-roll-useofr= plinfo-41.txt = =20 >=20 > Thank you very much again for your useful comments, >=20 > Ines. >=20 > =20 --Apple-Mail=_C242030B-C1D5-4E04-8EBE-C23B82B98326 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hi = Ines,

Thanks for = making these changes, they are fine by me.

Mali=C5=A1a
On 6 = Sep 2020, at 00:38, Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:

Hi Mali=C5=A1a,

Many many thanks for your review. = Please find below comments in-line.

On Wed, Jul = 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 via Datatracker <noreply@ietf.org> = wrote:
Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87=
Review result: Ready with Issues

As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through
draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is = ready to
proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved.

I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is appropriate = in the
use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the = sections
updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. = Please
consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6.

<Ines> In section 3 times the  normative = vocabulary is used not specially oriented to the use cases but to the = general behavior. :

-=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero when passing = the packet out to the Internet. The Internet will therefore not see any = SenderRank  information=E2=80=9D  

-=E2=80=9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an = extension header (e.g.  RH3 or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate = the packet in an (additional) outer IP header=E2=80=9D

-=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data = packet.=E2=80=9D: in order to avoid e.g loops


In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not = used normative language, since they are basically = examples. 

What do you think?

</Ines>

 

As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the = IP6-IP6
acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a mix = of
IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present.

<Ines>
 We specify the use of IP6-IP6  in section 2: = =E2=80=9CNote: Due to lack of space in some figures (tables) we refer to = IPv6-in-IPv6 as IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D
</Ines>

 

My detailed comments are given below.

Section 1:

> Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 = encapsulation.
It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the = RFC6040
[RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification (ECN) = field
of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any
IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether it = is
appropriate to have a normative MUST here.

<Ines> New = text: 
Most of the use cases described = therein require the use of IPv6-in-IPv6 packet = encapsulation. 
When encapsulating and = decapsulating packets, RFC 6040 [RFC6040] MUST be applied to map the = setting of the explicit congestion notification (ECN) field between = inner and outer headers.

The normative is used = in order to highlight support of ECN for any tunnelling = solutions.  

What do you = think?

</Ines>

 

Section 4.2:
> The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from = 0x63 to 0x23,
as the root can always create the right packet.  The type change = does not
adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI option = type
should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in Section = 4.3
would be useful.

<Ines> done </Ines>
 
Section 4.4:

> A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the = RPI Option
Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) and = 0x63
(old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the = flag in
the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g.  If the = network is
in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - = If my
understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data = plane
packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the network = is
operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not = possible
before at least one DIO is received.

<Ines>
 In order to be able to = decompress, the node should support RFC8138.

The DODAG configuration Option = indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23. 

Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indicated in = the RPI and should not generate or forward packets for that instance = before they receive the first DIO.

In the case of reboot, the node (6LN or 6LR) does not = remember the RPI Option Type (i.e., whether or not the flag is set), so = the node will not trigger DIO messages until a DIO message is received = indicating the RPI value to be used. The node will use the value 0x23 if = the network supports this feature.

</Ines>

 
Section 6:

> The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.
- How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this = not
redundant with RFC6553?

<Ines> the use of the MUST = is to enforce the explanation of the use case when the RPI is present . = It tends to add clarification to the reader

As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent = between RPL routers MUST include a RPL Option or RPL Source Route Header = ([RFC6554]) and MAY include both.=E2=80=9C RFC 8138 requires it at all = times for compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all cases, it is = simpler.

</Ines>

 

>  This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI = Option Type
(0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such
redundant. please remove one appearance.

<Ines> done </Ines> 

Section 8:

> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the = way
down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is = marked as
=E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify.

<Ines>  Corrected, we = have deleted =E2=80=9CThe root always have to encapuslate on the way = down=E2=80=9D</Ines> 

Section 8.1.3:

> When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, = will
ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - = Figure 22
states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation = is
mandatory which is not consistent with this text.

<Ines> corrected on the = table </Ines>
 
Section 8.2.1:

- A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is destined = for the
Internet would be useful.

<Ines>  Added: =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information = about the RPL domain, it may encapsulate to the root when the = destination is not in the RPL domain of the RAL.=E2=80=9D
</Ines>


Section 8.2.3:

> As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) = will add an
RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound as = if RUL
originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase.

<Ines> As the RUL parent adds  RPL headers in the RUL packet, = the first 6LR (6LR_1) will add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 = header. 

What do you = think?

 </Ines> 

Nits:
> The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and = non-storing
use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop = Header.
- s/hob/hop
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed = by
- define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> The root does not removes the RPI1
- s/removes/remove
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E)
- s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1
<Ines>  done = </Ines>  
 
> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

>  If the originating node does not not
- s/does not not/does not
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> and add it's own
- s/it=E2=80=99s/its
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with = the flag
indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is
<Ines>  done = </Ines> 

> Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is = capable of
0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes
<Ines>  done = </Ines>

Changes are displayed in https://github.com/roll-wg/useofrplinfo/blob/master/draft-ietf-= roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt 

Thank you very much again for your useful = comments,

Ines.

 

= --Apple-Mail=_C242030B-C1D5-4E04-8EBE-C23B82B98326-- From nobody Tue Sep 8 13:00:38 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C51823A10B7; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 13:00:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8yQnCUkfdlfa; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 13:00:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x536.google.com (mail-ed1-x536.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::536]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 02D4B3A10F0; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 12:59:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x536.google.com with SMTP id c10so324398edk.6; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 12:59:42 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=0rrN+ajnDq0sUQ8DBoTZ5jNfmk7uTH3qY3G7kHGcRIQ=; b=I69rW8lPerhXVnQdKMeITPzGEaVs1CBgaqymRxrnOLjEg5Hs3ZcoPTueolp82dtzze fHZvkd9eUfpZvxW9A4fjCCjAONeJV6YL83ppX9rACNw7cQNN6oQjRq4bJjIywxLLRP0r BTroYItoIteZ/+v9knPzjWL7l4TtOwkon6owYpBfHnWTtOHRc9mgcPgrP3icfPVBo4bA k3555ewVaFZL0UO7ZPxVv0Jk6PJuHbm7AJGovI67G7+1SBj23RXJr5RFcJwge1iWkXjF nzYFD5F/4GoCrWFNHd9T0SxdGVOx93yCLyKuBNiaswr7wltMhVAc0JQFzQ+Bz5BbjGrF khpA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=0rrN+ajnDq0sUQ8DBoTZ5jNfmk7uTH3qY3G7kHGcRIQ=; b=NLCA1CVPK4qeTs7M5y0l4+eyVARmx7aPEX3jE5TZ5vAFqYNuDjvlsuKM1VstQ+thW9 oa0xXaRvrMO2Yn5x8fZLgCW/4B004+UZQwpThudCRgPHMSywmQaz/GtOVHQnsWGMzvHd gwH+CUniVY4LLkAQ3OdO8rrI+r6A1bWRd9Cm90l1fL+M/+E8F98t0/Ns+yBwyExY6hR+ Ze8FYEBPU0wGgHAoBPKTlCcO1TgSbmTWl2Gyo9vYTd21+8+4w5d17SxYJD537R4AyA9Q tRQpyTsy86xFV6K3jQmxOLPkp2HzhHSHBW4h+cVayNF+zTjYiu3WSVQKtLL0Gefc+QH2 ja2g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532ORJc3l7tATcXiEfJ1/Nj0Y2n9F+8uaO18Yj5CYxXnmRYD5tvj H/UMHS1b1zmqnYGhinI8LUHbUsbKgN+tmG2h6MXFWYsW4F8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyJITsth07EyIM/n0df03Klx+7gXUD9as//wGj21y7VscBK18QVatDBA2qRppyqAwspn3meVnTxJks43DjgAp8= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1212:: with SMTP id c18mr692044edw.344.1599595181111; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 12:59:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 12:59:40 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: References: <159954709313.26081.8822043325346377883@ietfa.amsl.com> <8825A66C-6C58-486C-AAF7-B7D86765E314@cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2020 12:59:39 -0700 Message-ID: To: The IESG , "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , "Eric Vyncke (evyncke)" Cc: "carlesgo@entel.upc.edu" , "roll@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Ines Robles Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke=27s_No_Objection_on_draft-ietf?= =?utf-8?q?-roll-turnon-rfc8138-13=3A_=28with_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 20:00:33 -0000 Pascal Hi! Sorry for commenting after you published -14, but I don't think that "SHOULD ensure" is a normatively enforceable action. =C2=A0How about this? OLD> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Though it is possible to roll back (see Section 5.3, the netwo= rk operator =C2=A0 =C2=A0SHOULD ensure that the roll back operation is completed before= adding nodes =C2=A0 =C2=A0that do not support [RFC8138]. NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Though it is possible to roll back (see Section 5.3), the roll= back =C2=A0 =C2=A0operation SHOULD be complete before the network operator adds = nodes that =C2=A0 =C2=A0do not support [RFC8138]. Thanks! Alvaro. On September 8, 2020 at 3:59:18 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) (pthubert@cisco.com(mailto:pthubert@cisco.com)) wrote: > Hello again Eric > > I published as -14: > > URL: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ > Html: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14.html > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14 > Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-= 14 > > Many thanks again! > > Pascal From nobody Tue Sep 8 14:11:28 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87BEB3A148D for ; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:11:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Dc4qCxIV5VJP for ; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-x932.google.com (mail-ua1-x932.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::932]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1FB573A148B for ; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-x932.google.com with SMTP id z46so184133uac.13 for ; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 14:11:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=H16+M7xKk+fjEJXC+N9j7XVlL6hh1lzAlCJ71X92dPg=; b=O4oligpk4pwfT4JPSePyhfxo7Gkj+y98mjYmF6ZEMUigvavtTSKLJibAFKGcqMSzxg JExABsw1DQ9HuzWRvsu+4Ay+UAYiNjpFcon09oxt0ylhR+mrdk1YFR1RirqbH5bGL8s4 kvf9XYz4zuMmf3u3EYCU/lZkoH3pviJiAAETgF0LYryQq1IoI4oaDKgc3PS50MhOJR5X 6WleFxtq9BZsgM3QSRAIB1xeZTnohUekFBoPKpqLRk/tJMhjXX8pwysK5Jqp+luIA6DH ZafaB+5G6cKId5X8ulkk/6BzUuodjoy0PJo+LTTgT8h0svu+4QURsFQBhBPDXLcaxHOa LCRw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=H16+M7xKk+fjEJXC+N9j7XVlL6hh1lzAlCJ71X92dPg=; b=oIxuEyN1d7cWu2P3JZbEvtyeG4RXE/+cp7isXSlVclxcbRQI2/7GRRhRvkwy9Zu+WK GTfBxhJEOFFQbJGZNfMRasYKe3nlR4WYgetKY8Uv46NEPZfari03gpB1aoTPBRrSxQYj goCe8TrG2YfxmtgIxBAONn2fglQvV/LXJk/if7jghwfQ+6KtmFVzOIbQhsHjuJDaXG+Q B6OjPhGR5Ba3kTxYnd/3EC2AMvW5HBqZm4opE3F+R4d6mFrbWqbpTW7UfNq0S8jV+TmS zYLY2Y4HI0YMCvdl5kkCcTOJ8CUjUbzWglZZ2kE0wFNG1BQCY7BMFoMaMctIkiQI06Az dMqQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532l72I1+R+uXt9Hxuxbo9d6GFfNrrjmh2Xd4YykuAdud4XGZEA6 BZ797Os9coFqC9192StVyuTamer+eMuk18/qggxsiL0mjAshnw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzJXuaiaQbk0R7CukdWRPI/URrAvY/TGZg4qFwtbjHDqX0XbE12y2B/ny8HiiSHrg4uq5/jMARCiKq4OHuZZiI= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:32d:: with SMTP id 42mr701787uat.107.1599599483782; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 14:11:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2020 00:10:48 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000003893f05aed3c7be" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Roll Interim Meeting Sept-Oct 2020 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 21:11:27 -0000 --00000000000003893f05aed3c7be Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, This is a kindly reminder, please fill the doodle in order to set the date for the next ROLL Interim Meeting https://doodle.com/poll/rdpisixnkbr7f2cp Thank you very much in advance, Ines and Dominique On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 10:49 AM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > Please find below the doodle to fill in order to set up the next ROLL > Interim Meeting. > > https://doodle.com/poll/rdpisixnkbr7f2cp > > Please fill it before 9th September. > > Please let us know if you require another time/dates. > > Thank you very much in advance, > > Ines and Dominique. > --00000000000003893f05aed3c7be Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

This is a kindly reminder= , please fill the doodle in order to set the date for the next ROLL Interim= Meeting


Thank you very much in advance,

Ines and Dominique

On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 10:= 49 AM Ines Robles <ma= riainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

P= lease find below the doodle to fill in order to set up the next ROLL Interi= m Meeting.



--00000000000003893f05aed3c7be-- From nobody Tue Sep 8 14:12:53 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D601A3A148E; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:12:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.087 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.087 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eAAF0csksluS; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:12:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe2a.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C2C63A148B; Tue, 8 Sep 2020 14:12:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe2a.google.com with SMTP id j3so151121vsm.0; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 14:12:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=kE02lw2X9z/MLrgeg9CVLAHB/DaLodwSwRaXYCUOzUs=; b=PNypYL2pMC6wun5OMvzbIvG1OyGjWKKjzD5+clALg4bbAFmdfVf+tx9emRbZeZr8YM LZm6m80RP5SZYc6bSzUQY9lz5RgZrwjS902MOjGPvFGbFVI9B0q3a2wbvdQhLpD5Hdlx W9V+N7xMNCud14YrTvunQGn9Pxto2NJVi9bZa89aCPE2fCKHTbLfogymZZb/7ZKFvoY9 UYSLY4PLp5P3O9pcQbNW7BOvlPsPWwASq7MDp/77kwlq7QW6GI1PuK4quTqqY1Br3Gnv PBqlxYwn4i4zJqo+URPMyGKGktqq4KUrPclUH1PAjyorhClpa1IJjxwxH/5ATFGGHiWG 41Fg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=kE02lw2X9z/MLrgeg9CVLAHB/DaLodwSwRaXYCUOzUs=; b=avubekgcxfy8lvUYDif7iq5+N2envWdjvy8pChzoMxFwkO2XOTXCWbnGTDX+6zDAeQ ymGQOM/rGmRcTeVu0bC9Hm2oeis6SRh0UlLclzAJwqCfRVFEbtBwd4kPnmQiO7QeLrY2 ZH/mohiLFpzGLNpcOFxh1TTIx0L/bvlf89JBPS+ivQ+SnqJuNjBee9eWCj3oGv2C8Aky dBaA9YiNBYDM1aJZSk5nxhTB1H6RMyRMUu4Y71gdjXgmmx/vFIvqWOoCtEIDYWwsbHzX 5dELn+/0BYxfDhDPV0v4GhPx19acxOuP0QLK6n37iBd8iug1vWhfrURFYBbOwTpa9rTO Vx/g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530sngEcLx9nB1JgK6Lp0upCi6AHj3e3Ip+ZxLBIzGwkRHf/Nxcn 2h/jPatwq5aBW0fwRHNksIxZS3UxXzI2XNkTtvMpGCIABS4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzUhIAZz+lqmzbv4yWx+b5JbGmv7Wo3hBAUFmW6+zer/SNYu/dx7yZZKfOMzgmPXBOZ6wmAGfP0uB5K1IbtbFw= X-Received: by 2002:a67:ea88:: with SMTP id f8mr718721vso.2.1599599560966; Tue, 08 Sep 2020 14:12:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159602896040.32219.18351168129491497436@ietfa.amsl.com> <18354E7B-2F0D-4AF9-96F1-CB87EEF0484D@inria.fr> In-Reply-To: <18354E7B-2F0D-4AF9-96F1-CB87EEF0484D@inria.fr> From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2020 00:12:05 +0300 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?B?TWFsacWhYSBWdcSNaW5pxIc=?= Cc: IETF IoT Directorate , draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo.all@ietf.org, roll , last-call@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009d460305aed3cb2e" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Iotdir telechat review of draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Sep 2020 21:12:45 -0000 --0000000000009d460305aed3cb2e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you very much Malisa for confirming. Best, Ines On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 1:02 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 wrote: > Hi Ines, > > Thanks for making these changes, they are fine by me. > > Mali=C5=A1a > > On 6 Sep 2020, at 00:38, Ines Robles > wrote: > > Hi Mali=C5=A1a, > > Many many thanks for your review. Please find below comments in-line. > > On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 via Datatra= cker < > noreply@ietf.org> wrote: > >> Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 >> Review result: Ready with Issues >> >> As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through >> draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is >> ready to >> proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved. >> >> I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is appropriate >> in the >> use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the >> sections >> updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. >> Please >> consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6. >> > > In section 3 times the normative vocabulary is used not specially > oriented to the use cases but to the general behavior. : > > -=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero when passing the packet ou= t to the > Internet. The Internet will therefore not see any SenderRank information= =E2=80=9D > > -=E2=80=9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an extension header (e= .g. RH3 > or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate the packet in an (additional) outer > IP header=E2=80=9D > > -=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.=E2=80= =9D: in order to > avoid e.g loops > > > In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not used normativ= e > language, since they are basically examples. > > What do you think? > > > > > >> >> As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the >> IP6-IP6 >> acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a mix >> of >> IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present. >> > > > We specify the use of IP6-IP6 in section 2: =E2=80=9CNote: Due to lack = of space > in some figures (tables) we refer to IPv6-in-IPv6 as IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D > > > > >> >> My detailed comments are given below. >> >> Section 1: >> >> > Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 >> encapsulation. >> It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the RFC604= 0 >> [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification (ECN) >> field >> of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any >> IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether it = is >> appropriate to have a normative MUST here. >> > > New text: > Most of the use cases described therein require the use of IPv6-in-IPv6 > packet encapsulation. > When encapsulating and decapsulating packets, RFC 6040 [RFC6040] MUST be > applied to map the setting of the explicit congestion notification (ECN) > field between inner and outer headers. > > The normative is used in order to highlight support of ECN for any > tunnelling solutions. > > What do you think? > > > > > >> >> Section 4.2: >> > The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from 0x63 t= o >> 0x23, >> as the root can always create the right packet. The type change does no= t >> adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI option >> type >> should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in Section >> 4.3 >> would be useful. >> >> done > > >> Section 4.4: >> >> > A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the RPI >> Option >> Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) and >> 0x63 >> (old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the >> flag in >> the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g. If the >> network is >> in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - >> If my >> understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data >> plane >> packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the network >> is >> operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not >> possible >> before at least one DIO is received. >> >> > In order to be able to decompress, the node should support RFC8138. > > The DODAG configuration Option indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23. > > Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indicated in the RPI and > should not generate or forward packets for that instance before they > receive the first DIO. > > In the case of reboot, the node (6LN or 6LR) does not remember the RPI > Option Type (i.e., whether or not the flag is set), so the node will not > trigger DIO messages until a DIO message is received indicating the RPI > value to be used. The node will use the value 0x23 if the network support= s > this feature. > > > > > >> Section 6: >> >> > The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet. >> - How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this not >> redundant with RFC6553? >> > > the use of the MUST is to enforce the explanation of the use case > when the RPI is present . It tends to add clarification to the reader > > As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent between RPL= routers > MUST include a RPL Option or RPL Source Route Header ([RFC6554 > ]) and MAY include both.=E2=80=9C RF= C 8138 > requires it at all times for compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all case= s, > it is simpler. > > > > > >> >> > This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI Option Ty= pe >> (0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such >> redundant. please remove one appearance. >> > > done > >> >> Section 8: >> >> > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down >> - It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the w= ay >> down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is >> marked as >> =E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify. >> > > Corrected, we have deleted =E2=80=9CThe root always have to encap= uslate > on the way down=E2=80=9D > >> >> Section 8.1.3: >> >> > When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, wil= l >> ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - Figur= e >> 22 >> states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is >> mandatory which is not consistent with this text. >> >> corrected on the table > > >> Section 8.2.1: >> >> - A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is destined >> for the >> Internet would be useful. >> > > Added: =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information about the RPL domain, = it may > encapsulate to the root when the destination is not in the RPL domain of > the RAL.=E2=80=9D > > > >> Section 8.2.3: >> >> > As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) will >> add an >> RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound as >> if RUL >> originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase. >> > > As the RUL parent adds RPL headers in the RUL packet, the first > 6LR (6LR_1) will add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. > > What do you think? > > > >> >> Nits: >> > The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and >> non-storing >> use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed >> > done > >> >> > that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop Header= . >> - s/hob/hop >> > done > >> >> > consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed by >> - define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop >> > done > >> >> > The root does not removes the RPI1 >> - s/removes/remove >> > done > >> >> > The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E) >> - s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1 >> done >> > > >> > The root always have to encapuslate on the way down >> - s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate >> > done > >> >> > If the originating node does not not >> - s/does not not/does not >> > done > >> >> > and add it's own >> - s/it=E2=80=99s/its >> > done > >> >> > The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with the >> flag >> indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is >> > done > >> >> > Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is capabl= e >> of >> 0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes >> > done > > Changes are displayed in > https://github.com/roll-wg/useofrplinfo/blob/master/draft-ietf-roll-useof= rplinfo-41.txt > > > Thank you very much again for your useful comments, > > Ines. > > > > > --0000000000009d460305aed3cb2e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you very much Malisa for confirming.

<= div>Best,

Ines

On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 1:02 PM= Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87 <malisa.vucinic@inria.fr> wrote:
Hi Ines= ,

Thanks for making these changes, they are fine by me.<= /div>

Mali=C5=A1a

On 6 Sep 2020, at 00:38, Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.co= m> wrote:

Hi Mali=C5= =A1a,

Many many thanks for your review. Please find belo= w comments in-line.

On Wed, Jul 29, 2020 at 4:22 PM Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4= =8Dini=C4=87 via Datatracker <noreply@ietf.org> wrote:
Reviewer: Mali=C5=A1a Vu=C4=8Dini=C4=87
Review result: Ready with Issues

As part of the IoT-Directorate review process, I went through
draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40. In general, I believe the document is read= y to
proceed once a couple of issues that I outline below are resolved.

I have concerns whether the use of the normative language is appropriate in= the
use cases section. I believe all such cases are covered either in the secti= ons
updating RFC 6553, RFC 6550 and RFC 8138 or in these respective RFCs. Pleas= e
consider using lowercase keywords in Section 6.

<Ines> In section 3 times the=C2=A0 normative= vocabulary is used not specially oriented to the use cases but to the gene= ral behavior. :

-=E2=80=9DThe DODAG root MUST force it to zero whe= n passing the packet out to the Internet. The Internet will therefore not s= ee any SenderRank=C2=A0 information=E2=80=9D=C2=A0=C2=A0

-=E2=80= =9Dan intermediate router that needs to add an extension header (e.g.=C2=A0= RH3 or RPL Option) MUST still encapsulate the packet in an (additional) ou= ter IP header=E2=80=9D

-=E2=80=9CThe RPI MUST be present in every = single RPL data packet.=E2=80=9D: in order to avoid e.g loops
<= br>
= In section 7 where the use cases are explained, we have not used normative = language, since they are basically examples.=C2=A0

What do you thi= nk?

</Ines>

=C2=A0

As a minor note, there also appears to be an inconsistent use of the IP6-IP= 6
acronym. Please use a single acronym throughout the doc, currently a mix of=
IPv6-in-IPv6 and IP6-IP6 is present.

<Ines>
=C2=A0We specify the use of IP6-IP6=C2=A0 in= section 2: =E2=80=9CNote: Due to lack of space in some figures (tables) we= refer to IPv6-in-IPv6 as IP6-IP6.=E2=80=9D
</Ines>
=
=C2=A0

My detailed comments are given below.

Section 1:

> Since some of the uses cases here described, use IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsul= ation.
It MUST take in consideration, when encapsulation is applied, the RFC6040 [RFC6040], which defines how the explicit congestion notification (ECN) fie= ld
of the IP header should be constructed on entry to and exit from any
IPV6-in-IPV6 tunnel. - Please clarify the sentence. Consider whether it is<= br> appropriate to have a normative MUST here.

<= span id=3D"gmail-m_6795153826676212089gmail-docs-internal-guid-a57b6c2a-7ff= f-57a5-21fa-b607f0c40919">
<Ines> New text:=C2= =A0
Most of the use cases described there= in require the use of IPv6-in-IPv6 packet encapsulation.=C2=A0
=
When encapsulating and decapsulating packets, RFC 604= 0 [RFC6040] MUST be applied to map the setting of the explicit congestion n= otification (ECN) field between inner and outer headers.

The normative is used in order to highlight = support of ECN for any tunnelling solutions.=C2=A0=C2=A0

What do you think?

</Ines>
=
=C2=A0

Section 4.2:
> The non-storing mode case does not require the type change from 0x63 t= o 0x23,
as the root can always create the right packet.=C2=A0 The type change does = not
adversely affect the non-storing case. - It is not clear what RPI option ty= pe
should non-storing networks use. A pointer to the discussion in Section 4.3=
would be useful.

<Ines> done </Ines>
=C2=A0
Section 4.4:

> A node that is decompressing this header MUST decompress using the RPI= Option
Type that is currently active: that is, a choice between 0x23 (new) and 0x6= 3
(old). The node will know which to use based upon the presence of the flag = in
the DODAG Configuration option defined in Section 4.3. E.g.=C2=A0 If the ne= twork is
in 0x23 mode (by DIO option), then it should be decompressed to 0x23. - If = my
understanding is correct, this means that in order to decompress data plane=
packets, a node first needs to remember the option type mode the network is=
operating in, advertised in DIOs. Consequently, decompression is not possib= le
before at least one DIO is received.

<= Ines>
=C2=A0In order to be able to dec= ompress, the node should support RFC8138.

The DODAG configuration Option indicates the setting 0x63 or 0x23.=C2= =A0

Note that nodes are not part of the RPL instance indicated in = the RPI and should not generate or forward packets for that instance before= they receive the first DIO.

In the case of reboot, the node (6LN = or 6LR) does not remember the RPI Option Type (i.e., whether or not the fla= g is set), so the node will not trigger DIO messages until a DIO message is= received indicating the RPI value to be used. The node will use the value = 0x23 if the network supports this feature.

</Ines>
=C2=A0
Section 6:

> The RPI MUST be present in every single RPL data packet.
- How is the normative text here appropriate at this point? Is this not
redundant with RFC6553?

<Ines> the use of the MUST is to enforce= the explanation of the use case when the RPI is present . It tends to add = clarification to the reader

As Pascal pointed - RFC 6553 states: = =E2=80=9C Datagrams sent between RPL routers MUST include a RPL Option or R= PL Source Route Header ([RFC6554]) and MAY include both.=E2=80=9C RF= C 8138 requires it at all times for compression. Now we MUST the RPI in all= cases, it is simpler.

</Ines>

= =C2=A0

>=C2=A0 This document assumes that the LLN is using the no-drop RPI Opti= on Type
(0x23). - This statement appears twice in the document and is as such
redundant. please remove one appearance.

<Ines> done </Ines>= =C2=A0

Section 8:

> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- It is not clear how come does root need to always encapsulate on the way<= br> down. In the basic case of root to RAL communication, IPv6-in-IPv6 is marke= d as
=E2=80=9CNo=E2=80=9D. Please clarify.

<= span style=3D"background-color:transparent;font-variant-numeric:normal;font= -variant-east-asian:normal;font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial;vertical-align:= baseline;white-space:pre-wrap"><Ines>=C2=A0 Corrected, we have delete= d =E2=80=9CThe root always have to encapuslate on the way down=E2=80=9D</Ines>= =C2=A0

Section 8.1.3:

> When the RPI is added, the RUL, which does not understand the RPI, wil= l
ignore it (per [RFC8200]); thus, encapsulation is not necessary. - Figure 2= 2
states that for root to RUL communication IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is
mandatory which is not consistent with this text.

<Ines> correcte= d on the table </Ines>
=C2=A0
Section 8.2.1:

- A sentence stating how does RAL recognize that the packet is destined for= the
Internet would be useful.

<= span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial;color:rgb(34,34,34);backgrou= nd-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;= text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap"><Ines= >=C2=A0 Added: =E2=80=9CHaving the RAL information about the RPL domain,= it may encapsulate to the root when the destination is not in the RPL doma= in of the RAL.=E2=80=9D
</Ines>


Section 8.2.3:

> As RPL headers are added in the RUL packet, the first 6LR (6LR_1) will= add an
RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header. - this statement makes it sound as if= RUL
originates a packet with RPL headers. Please rephrase.

<Ines> As the RUL parent adds=C2=A0 RPL headers in the RUL packet, the fir= st 6LR (6LR_1) will add an RPI inside a new IPv6-in-IPv6 header.=C2=A0

Wh= at do you think?

=C2=A0</Ines>=C2=A0

Nits:
> The ROLL WG analysized how [RFC2460] rules apply to storing and non-st= oring
use of RPL. - s/analysized/analyzed
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0<= /div>

> that transports that abstract information in an IPv6 Hob-by-Hop Header= .
- s/hob/hop
<Ines&g= t;=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> consumed Routing Header and to ignore a HbH header as prescribed by - define HbH, assuming Hop-by-Hop
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The root does not removes the RPI1
- s/removes/remove
<= ;Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The 6LR_ia (ia=3D1) (Node E)
- s/6LR_ia (ia=3D1)/6LR_1
<Ines>=C2= =A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0=C2=A0
=
=C2=A0
> The root always have to encapuslate on the way down
- s/have to encapuslate/has to encapsulate
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>= =C2=A0

>=C2=A0 If the originating node does not not
- s/does not not/does not
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> and add it's own
- s/it=E2=80=99s/its
&= lt;Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines>=C2=A0

> The migration procedure it is triggered when the DIO is sent with the = flag
indicating the new RPI Option Type. - s/it is/is
<Ines>=C2=A0 done </Ines><= /span>=C2=A0

> Namely, it remains at 0x63 until it is sure that the network is capabl= e of
0x23, then it abruptly change to 0x23. - s/change/changes
<= div><Ines>=C2=A0 done </= Ines>


Thank you very much again for your useful comments,

Ines.

=C2=A0

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auth=pass smtp.auth=CUSA40A35 smtp.mailfrom=tirumaleswarreddy_konda@mcafee.com X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0.004 X-Mimecast-Originator: mcafee.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Secdir last call review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-12 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 07:23:18 -0000 Thanks Pascal, update looks good. -Tiru > -----Original Message----- > From: secdir On Behalf Of Pascal Thubert > (pthubert) > Sent: Monday, September 7, 2020 1:52 PM > To: Michael Richardson ; Routing Over Low power > and Lossy networks > Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138.all@ietf.org; secdir@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [secdir] [Roll] Secdir last call review of draft-ietf-roll-t= urnon- > rfc8138-12 >=20 > CAUTION: External email. Do not click links or open attachments unless yo= u > recognize the sender and know the content is safe. >=20 > Hello Tiru and Michael: >=20 > Many thanks for your time, your review and your help. >=20 > Let's explore how we can improve the text to reduce the reader's > puzzlements. >=20 >=20 > > > > Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy > > wrote: > > > [1] You may want to clarify how the attacker manages to modify a > > > protected configuration including the "T" flag introduced in this > > > spec. > > > > Every router within every routing protocol can do wrong things :-) RPL > > is an IGP, so all routers are within the same security control, and at = the > same level. > > > > An attacker would have to introduce malware into the device to modify > data. > > RFC7416 lays out all of these threats: they are no different for the > > T-bit than other bits. > > >=20 > Good point, I will add an informative ref to RFC7416: > " > It is worth noting that in RPL [RFC6550], every node in the LLN that > is RPL-aware and has access to the RPL domain can inject any RPL- > based attack in the network, more in [RFC7416]. >=20 > " >=20 >=20 > > > [2] Is it possible to identify the attacker (or compromised route= r) who > > > set the "T" flag to remediation measures ? > > > > Maybe. Probably not. > > There are few things we can do within any routing protocol to identify > > mis- behaving routers. >=20 > And during a transition there will be parents that advertise a different = setting. > As Michael said, this is true for any other information as well, so the a= rt of > debunking applies. >=20 > > > [3] If due to an human error one or more of the on-path routers a= re not > > > upgraded or if the router sees both settings, I presume an alert = could > > > be sent to the network management for troubleshooting. You may > want to > > > add text to discuss the same. > > > > At present, RPL does not include a standard off-path alerting mechanism= . > > This remains a todo item for the WG. > > Some use NETCONF or HTTP to collect statistics in a proprietary way. > > We can send ICMPs, but since the affects how the packets are encoded, > > we likely can't send an ICMP to a relevant router, just one hop in the > > direction it came from. >=20 > Agreed. In addition, I would not add code in a constrained router to dete= ct > this mistake, though. > Either you know your network (through management) and you can do the > live upgrade, or, for a small network you do the flag day alternative and > check everything is back up. >=20 >=20 >=20 > > > > > [4] What do you mean by "subDAG" (I don't see any definition in > > this spec and RFC8138) ? > > > > It's a sub-portion of a DAG. A sub-tree. >=20 > I made a small clarifying change: > " > An attacker in the middle of the network may reset the "T" flag to > cause extra energy spending in the subset of the DODAG formed by its > descendants (its subDAG). > " >=20 > The diffs are visible here: https://github.com/roll-wg/roll-turnon- > rfc8138/commit/889faccec19038b2b68685bb0e31e9cb91d4da62 >=20 > Again, many thanks! >=20 > Please let us know if you see we need to do more. >=20 > Keep safe >=20 > Pascal > _______________________________________________ > secdir mailing list > secdir@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/secdir > wiki: http://tools.ietf.org/area/sec/trac/wiki/SecDirReview From nobody Wed Sep 9 02:30:28 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5F9B3A11A8; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 02:30:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Wed, 9 Sep 2020 07:51:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Roman Danyliw via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Roman Danyliw Message-ID: <159966310991.32249.4584030650116177263@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 07:51:50 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 14:51:51 -0000 Roman Danyliw has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 5. Typo. s/an homogenous/a homogeneous/ Section 7. Editorial. To be clearer on where the attacker is in the topology and on who is incurring the cost: OLD An attacker in the middle of the network may reset the "T" flag to cause extra energy spending in its subDAG. NEW An on-path attacker may reset the “T” flag to force additional energy consumption by the nodes in the subDAG. 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Wed, 9 Sep 2020 15:24:48 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Roman Danyliw , The IESG CC: "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" Thread-Topic: Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhrjDA/p5NhV/YE21cylcrcYTp6lgaDqg Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2020 15:24:45 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Wed, 9 Sep 2020 15:24:14 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159966310991.32249.4584030650116177263@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <159966310991.32249.4584030650116177263@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: cert.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;cert.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [90.118.154.54] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: efda6a9a-bd49-49a8-64b5-08d854d47d34 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3855: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: efda6a9a-bd49-49a8-64b5-08d854d47d34 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 09 Sep 2020 15:24:48.1931 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: kstUQHCGTD2oboRjac5N37QVsoJe8030oicoMT03wkZCd0Z4mY4QUvgMYdvLvbtdBr5WwN9XJD0suDV+K6Mv+g== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3855 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.36.7.11, xch-aln-001.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-9.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 15:25:01 -0000 SGVsbG8gUm9tYW4NCg0KTWFueSB0aGFua3MgZm9yIHlvdXIgdGltZSBvbiB0aGlzIHJldmlldywg YW5kIGZvciB5b3VyIGNvbW1lbnRzIGJlbG93IDogKQ0KDQpMZXQncyBzZWU6DQogDQo+IC0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0NCj4gQ09NTUVOVDoNCj4gLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLQ0KPiANCj4gU2VjdGlvbiA1LiAg VHlwby4gcy9hbiBob21vZ2Vub3VzL2EgaG9tb2dlbmVvdXMvDQoNCkZpeGVkDQoNCj4gDQo+IFNl Y3Rpb24gNy4gIEVkaXRvcmlhbC4gVG8gYmUgY2xlYXJlciBvbiB3aGVyZSB0aGUgYXR0YWNrZXIg aXMgaW4gdGhlIHRvcG9sb2d5IGFuZA0KPiBvbiB3aG8gaXMgaW5jdXJyaW5nIHRoZSBjb3N0Og0K PiANCj4gT0xEDQo+IEFuIGF0dGFja2VyIGluIHRoZSBtaWRkbGUgb2YgdGhlIG5ldHdvcmsgbWF5 IHJlc2V0IHRoZSAiVCIgZmxhZyB0byBjYXVzZSBleHRyYQ0KPiBlbmVyZ3kgc3BlbmRpbmcgaW4g aXRzIHN1YkRBRy4NCj4gDQo+IE5FVw0KPiBBbiBvbi1wYXRoIGF0dGFja2VyIG1heSByZXNldCB0 aGUg4oCcVOKAnSBmbGFnIHRvIGZvcmNlIGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgZW5lcmd5DQo+IGNvbnN1bXB0aW9u IGJ5IHRoZSBub2RlcyBpbiB0aGUgc3ViREFHLg0KPiANCg0KSHVtLCBJIGJlbGlldmUgd2UncmUg bm90IHRoZXJlIHlldCwgYmVjYXVzZSB3b3JkZWQgYXMgdGhpcyBpdCBsb29rcyBsaWtlIHRoZSBh dHRhY2tlciBpcyBhbG9uZyBhIHVuaWNhc3QgcGF0aC4gVGhpcyBpcyBub3QgdGhlIGNhc2UuDQoN ClRoZSAiVCIgZmxhZyBpcyBpbiBhIG1lc3NhZ2UgKHRoZSBESU8pIHRoYXQgaXMgcHJvcGFnYXRl ZCBpbiBhIGZhc2hpb24gdGhhdCBpcyBha2luIHRvIG11bHRpY2FzdCB0aG91Z2ggaXQncyBub3Qu IFRoZSBSUEwgbm9kZSByZWNlaXZlcyBESU8gbWVzc2FnZXMgZnJvbSBuZWlnaGJvcnMgdGhhdCBh cmUgd2lsbGluZyB0byBiZSBwYXJlbnRzLiBJZiB0aGlzIG5vZGUgZGVjaWRlcyB0byBhbHNvIGJl IGEgcGFyZW50LCBpdCB3aWxsIHJlZ2VuZXJhdGUgYSBESU8gdGhhdCBjb250YWlucyBzb21lIGZp ZWxkcyB1bmNoYW5nZWQsIGluY2x1ZGluZyB0aGUgRE9EQUcgY29uZmlndXJhdGlvbiBvcHRpb24u IA0KDQpJbiB0aGF0IHByb2Nlc3MsIHRoZSBiYWQgZ3V5IG1heSBjaGFuZ2Ugc29tZSBmaWVsZHMg aXQgc2hvdWxkbid0LCBpbmNsdWRpbmcgdGhlICJUIiBmbGFnLCBidXQgaXQncyBqdXN0IG9uZSBv ZiBtYW55IGZpZWxkcyBpbiB0aGF0IHNhbWUgc2l0dWF0aW9uLiBIaXMgY2hpbGRyZW4gYW5kIHRo ZWlyIGRlc2NlbmRhbnQgd2lsbCByZXBlYXQgdGhhdCB3cm9uZyBzZXR0aW5nLiBOb3RlIHRoYXQg dGhpcyBpcyBub3QgYSB0cmVlIGJ1dCBhIERPREFHLiBTbyB5b3UgZ2V0IERJT3MgZnJvbSBub3Qg b25lIChjYW5kaWRhdGUpIHBhcmVudCBidXQgbXVsdGlwbGUgb25lcy4gQSBkZXNjZW5kYW50IG1h eSBkaXNjb3ZlciBhbiBpbmNvbnNpc3RlbmN5IGJldHdlZW4gaXRzIHBhcmVudHMgKGlmIHNvbWUg ZGVzY2VuZCBmcm9tIHRoZSBhdHRhY2tlciBhbmQgb3RoZXJzIGRvIG5vdCkgYW5kIGNvdWxkIHJh aXNlIGFuIGFsZXJ0LCBidXQgdGhlIGNhc2UgY2FuIGJlIG5vcm1hbCwgZS5nLiwgZHVyaW5nIGEg dHJhbnNpdGlvbi4gUlBMIGRvZXMgbm90IHJlYWxseSBzcGVjaWZ5IHRoYXQsIGl0IGlzIGxlZnQg dG8gaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb25zLCBlLmcuLCBjb25zdHJhaW5lZCBub2RlcyB3aWxsIG5vdCBzcGVu ZCBjb2RlIGxvb2tpbmcgZm9yIGFub21hbGllcy4NCg0KQm90dG9tIGxpbmUsIHRoZXJlIGlzIG5v IHBhdGggdG8gYmUgb24uIFRoZXJlJ3MgYSB3YXZlIGNvbWluZywgdGhlIGF0dGFja2VyIHJlbGF5 cyB0aGF0IHdhdmUsIGFuZCBtb2RpZmllcyBpdC4gSWYgaXQgaXMgaW4gdGhlIG1pZGRsZSBvZiB0 aGUgbmV0d29yayB0aGlzIGhhcyBhbiBlZmZlY3QgLSBvbiBpdHMgZGVzY2VuZGFudHMuIElmIHRo ZSBhdHRhY2tlciBpcyBhdCB0aGUgbGVhZiBlZGdlLCB0aGUgYXR0YWNrIGFzIG5vIGVmZmVjdCBz aW5jZSB0aGlzIG5vZGUgaGFzIG5vIGRlc2NlbmRhbnQuIA0KDQpXaGF0IGRvIHlvdSB0aGluaz8N Cg0KVGFrZSBjYXJlLA0KDQpQYXNjYWwNCg== From nobody Wed Sep 9 14:09:05 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEFC93A0E8B; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 14:09:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Warren Kumari via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com, naikumar@cisco.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Warren Kumari Message-ID: <159968574323.9646.18126092259187055059@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 14:09:03 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Warren Kumari's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 21:09:04 -0000 Warren Kumari has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks to Nagendra for the OpsDir review (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/review-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-10-opsdir-lc-nainar-2020-08-17/ ) and to the authors for working to address these. This has made the document clearer and better - thank you! From nobody Wed Sep 9 15:15:35 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D29273A0F5F; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 15:15:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org, roll-chairs@ietf.org, roll@ietf.org, Ines Robles , aretana.ietf@gmail.com, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Benjamin Kaduk Message-ID: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 15:15:28 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2020 22:15:29 -0000 Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The situation w.r.t. MOP values 5, 6, and 7 seems inconsistent to me. We are not allocating them, but we are changing the RFC 6550 behavior in the presence of at least one of them (but are not currently claiming to Update 6550). I have some further thoughts in the COMMENT section, but I don't think the current state is consistent enough to be approved as-is. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The description of the RFC 8138 as a "packet compression technique" throughout the document (e.g., "with the [RFC8138] compression turned on") has been fairly confusing to me, since as I understand it, RFC 8138 defines a new routing header that just happens to have, as a primary design consideration, a compression technique included. So, the incompatibility between non-8138 and 8138 nodes relates to the understanding of the header, not the compression within the header. As 8138 itself puts it: "It is expected that a router that does not recognize the 6LoRH general format detailed in Section 4 will drop the packet when a 6LoRH is present." The discussion in (e.g.) section 5.2 then makes more sense when we have a mix of different header formats in the same network, etc. In my mind, the "T" flag is controlling "do we use RFC 8138" and not "do we use RFC 8138 compression" (but perhaps I'm just confused!). This also (perhaps tangentially) relates to the concern brought up at WG-adoption time relating to whether this is an appropriate mechanism for conveying this kind of configuration. If the intent is to say "this DODAG uses RPL with a given routing header format", that seems a fairly reasonable match for DODAG configuration information (though not perfect), whereas "use this compression format for your RPI" seems somewhat farther removed. I say it's not a perfect fit for two reasons: (1) as I understand it, the routing header behavior applies to the whole RPL instance, not just the specific DODAG, so if there was an "RPL Instance Configuration Option" that would be better; and (2) the description in RFC 6550 of the Option is "used to distribute configuration information for DODAG Operation", but "DODAG Operation" is not defined. If it was defined to be affecting the global configuration for RPL operation within the DODAG that seems a better match for my understanding of what it's intened to do. (To be fair, my understanding is shaped largely by looking at the existing 'A' flag and pondering that it's not really related to DODAG formation/modification, and extrapolating from a single data point is risky.) An Update to RFC 6550 to clarify this aspect of the DODAG Configuration Option would make me more comfortable with using this mechanism to affect what routing header is used on the network. Section 1 Enabling [RFC8138] requires a Flag Day where the network is upgraded and rebooted. Otherwise, if acting as a Leaf, a node that does not [My inner pedant notes that this is not true for greenfield deployments, where the "upgrade" is in place on first boot.] Section 2.2 SubDAG: Subset of a DAG that is a child of a node (nit) This seems a little ambiguous as to whether the node in question is included (and also whether inclusion is based on transitive child relationship vs. direct, though that interpretation doesn't acutally make sense); perhaps "subset of a DAG that is itself a DAG, rooted at a given node"? Section 3 This specification defines a new flag "Enable RFC8138 Compression" (T). The "T" flag is set to turn-on the use of the compression of RPL artifacts with [RFC8138] within the DODAG. The new "T" flag is encoded in position 2 of the reserved Flags field in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option, and set to 0 in legacy implementations as specified in Section 6.7.6 of [RFC6550]. (I agree with the other comments about "position 2" needing further explanation, even if that's just a more prominent pointer to the relevant IANA registry.) Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. I see that this is getting discussed elsewhere already, but it's not entirely clear to me why we need to be so precise about the future behavior. Won't it be fine if whatever document allocates MOP value 7 also says whether or not to use compression^Wthe 8138 header format? We could say something about "unless otherwise specified by the document allocating the MOP value, this specification applies", even. Section 5.2 the RPL Instance may potentially join any DODAG. The network MUST be operated with the "T" flag reset until all nodes in the RPL Instance are upgraded to support this specification. nit: maybe s/reset/unset/? From nobody Wed Sep 9 18:35:56 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D92D43A0A06; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 18:35:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tmXdwwXpt7aW; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 18:35:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E60C03A0A03; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 18:35:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78278389CD; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 21:14:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 4IB2884ukksA; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 21:14:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41672389CB; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 21:14:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CB8FA94; Wed, 9 Sep 2020 21:35:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Benjamin Kaduk , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks cc: "The IESG" , roll-chairs@ietf.org, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com, draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 01:35:55 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker wrote: > The situation w.r.t. MOP values 5, 6, and 7 seems inconsistent to me. > We are not allocating them, but we are changing the RFC 6550 behavior > in the presence of at least one of them (but are not currently claimi= ng > to Update 6550). I have some further thoughts in the COMMENT section, I don't know why we aren't Updating 6550. That's news to me. I had just assumed we were, and hadn't checked. I should have. I see that we are updating 8138, which itself does not upda= te 6550, because 8138 deals with dataplane things only. We are changing the RFC6550 behaviour in the presence of 0,1,2,3,4,5,6. But, we are leaving the meaning of this bit when MOP=3D7 UNDEFINED, to be defined in a future document. In short: the bits are really valuable, and we want them back when we do wh= at we colloquially call "RPLv2". Because every bit counts for this header that is always present. MOP is mostly the highest-level concept. A node that does not know the MOP can participate as an RPL aware leaf. (And we now admit RPL unaware leaves, aka "hosts" in another document) We figure we might discover some horrible pathology in one of the other MOP= s, and we might need 5 or 6 to be able fix it quickly. We are using MOP=3D7 as our escape to get more bits, and to let us remove a decade of accumulated crud. For instance, the in-band security stuff whi= ch can never work, and which was published against my advice. We will need a bit of time to get the mopex and planned capabilities sorted right, and the set of people working on this stuff, and participating in the IETF is unfortunately still small. turnon-rfc8138 is the first document that really attempts to address non-greenfield deployments! =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9ZgvIACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVc+wf+NZX0e7XBxr9ffoMvrn8ttHJSPKhwBXQQaVv0TOQZ9B4oiO3Ve7Oqjt6x kcjfKQFXnyvusd0QPMmJcl83CSl/HnWuJmbz1fNehPNAytgfJ3CkxwAUZFDMe8EF zUJLKsF1e0CIp4seOlVWU5Ff5+5hr/KGd1ppsySy1mq6KbWo1SoAq6Q/Rq9+WR2U qF/0C8y6Ci7DRcxo9j5VTtJ/gfLKMLoJS0kS6E9R5irGQu8Aj0VZ5BfeuT2TOnSv qEkMThmdaylOEpJhjP2VhvG++ka+BVz5j9gccCWjq4Ci30aiFbhduSgB1+KxL6hQ 9n0IGZWqpbdk+RBE+K5A3SBeTYJtjA== =TYUL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Thu Sep 10 04:57:48 2020 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:57:46 -0000 SGkgUGFzY2FsIQ0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IFBhc2Nh bCBUaHViZXJ0IChwdGh1YmVydCkgPHB0aHViZXJ0QGNpc2NvLmNvbT4NCj4gU2VudDogV2VkbmVz ZGF5LCBTZXB0ZW1iZXIgOSwgMjAyMCAxMToyNSBBTQ0KPiBUbzogUm9tYW4gRGFueWxpdyA8cmRk QGNlcnQub3JnPjsgVGhlIElFU0cgPGllc2dAaWV0Zi5vcmc+DQo+IENjOiBkcmFmdC1pZXRmLXJv bGwtdHVybm9uLXJmYzgxMzhAaWV0Zi5vcmc7IHJvbGwtY2hhaXJzQGlldGYub3JnOyByb2xsQGll dGYub3JnOw0KPiBJbmVzIFJvYmxlcyA8bWFyaWFpbmVzcm9ibGVzQGdvb2dsZW1haWwuY29tPjsg YXJldGFuYS5pZXRmQGdtYWlsLmNvbQ0KPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSRTogUm9tYW4gRGFueWxpdydzIE5v 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b=oLPKCSCA8iODOHr1kTVSnJ2lgnbb/7XgL7sxRaQTFKxoPPM0E54vEBWSU9GCvSiI4jnodGW+lUXLmUU8VeVUXpwhfyhlodI/Y6E2x7xKd6vEi1mx23O8ms612oYCu3xUi6ALPpDE7rqb78JfgfScnQSGABkc+yPyNsiQ3VL6F2c= Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:ea::31) by MN2PR11MB3581.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:f0::22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3348.15; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 12:30:48 +0000 Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95]) by MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95%4]) with mapi id 15.20.3348.019; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 12:30:48 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Roman Danyliw , The IESG CC: "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" Thread-Topic: Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: 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Cg0KUGxlYXNlIGxldCBtZSBrbm93IGlmIHdlIGFyZSBnb29kIG5vdy4NCg0KVGFrZSBjYXJlLA0K DQpQYXNjYWwNCg== From nobody Thu Sep 10 05:42:39 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1BA43A0B77; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 05:42:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cert.org Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Yzo9Aov8aNVz; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 05:42:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from taper.sei.cmu.edu (taper.sei.cmu.edu [147.72.252.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7532A3A0AE4; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 05:42:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korb.sei.cmu.edu (korb.sei.cmu.edu [10.64.21.30]) by taper.sei.cmu.edu (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 08ACgF3K001247; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 08:42:16 -0400 DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 taper.sei.cmu.edu 08ACgF3K001247 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cert.org; s=yc2bmwvrj62m; t=1599741736; bh=SfuRK6MDsYnSUlBdhfI/3aynXUZKgEXpm23vUKTbC9o=; h=From:To:CC:Subject:Date:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=bLD6l3N5FriJXEokykKxeGwHmdbpsRe0HT7FkKgmuQkbuzht7Fhb2qMDacFrtTjH8 id0B/Xkw/WWqHB+fUSrPFpDlzGWbuj4kKlJie1eDR4bxfzbOmPQet6k+axSRDhpRs4 b7BfvPLbnE8lfUj7UeieM/2bFBtjfoz8WByimZcA= Received: from MORRIS.ad.sei.cmu.edu (morris.ad.sei.cmu.edu [147.72.252.46]) by korb.sei.cmu.edu (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id 08ACgEfb018587; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 08:42:14 -0400 Received: from MORRIS.ad.sei.cmu.edu (147.72.252.46) by MORRIS.ad.sei.cmu.edu (147.72.252.46) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.1979.3; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 08:42:14 -0400 Received: from MORRIS.ad.sei.cmu.edu ([fe80::555b:9498:552e:d1bb]) by MORRIS.ad.sei.cmu.edu ([fe80::555b:9498:552e:d1bb%13]) with mapi id 15.01.1979.003; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 08:42:14 -0400 From: Roman Danyliw To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , The IESG CC: "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" Thread-Topic: Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhrjGMfxr+M3irEunf+Ap7+JkrKlgsE6A///AtACAAaEHAP//v+AQ Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 12:42:12 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159966310991.32249.4584030650116177263@ietfa.amsl.com> <63f9e20b35ec4cd7afdcd0cd08eccfcc@cert.org> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.64.202.159] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Roman Danyliw's No Objection on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 12:42:38 -0000 SGkgUGFzY2FsIQ0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IFBhc2Nh bCBUaHViZXJ0IChwdGh1YmVydCkgPHB0aHViZXJ0QGNpc2NvLmNvbT4NCj4gU2VudDogVGh1cnNk YXksIFNlcHRlbWJlciAxMCwgMjAyMCA4OjMxIEFNDQo+IFRvOiBSb21hbiBEYW55bGl3IDxyZGRA Y2VydC5vcmc+OyBUaGUgSUVTRyA8aWVzZ0BpZXRmLm9yZz4NCj4gQ2M6IGRyYWZ0LWlldGYtcm9s bC10dXJub24tcmZjODEzOEBpZXRmLm9yZzsgcm9sbC1jaGFpcnNAaWV0Zi5vcmc7IHJvbGxAaWV0 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DQo+IEkgbG92ZSBpdCwgUm9tYW4hDQo+IA0KPiBJJ2xsIGJlIGhvbGRpbmcgdGhlIHB1YmxpY2F0 aW9uIHRpbGwgQWx2YXJvIGFuZCBCZW5qYW1pbiByZWFjaCBhbiBhZ3JlZW1lbnQgb24NCj4gd2hl dGhlciB0aGlzIHVwZGF0ZXMgUkZDIDY1NTAgb3Igbm90Lg0KPiANCj4gVGlsbCB0aGVuIEkgY29t bWl0dGVkIHRoZSBkaWZmcyBhcyAgaHR0cHM6Ly9naXRodWIuY29tL3JvbGwtd2cvcm9sbC10dXJu b24tDQo+IHJmYzgxMzgvY29tbWl0LzgwZmEzNDI1ZThjMGM2MGE4NDgyZGRiMjU4M2Y3NWY0MDVm ZTQ5MGENCj4gDQo+IFBsZWFzZSBsZXQgbWUga25vdyBpZiB3ZSBhcmUgZ29vZCBub3cuDQoNCkxv b2tzIGdvb2QgdG8gbWUhICBUaGFua3MgZm9yIHRoZSBxdWljayB0dXJuYXJvdW5kLg0KDQpSZWdh cmRzLA0KUm9tYW4NCg== From nobody Thu Sep 10 13:08:04 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 280DA3A07E0; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:07:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fZKU7kxVRKA4; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:07:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CEBA33A0113; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 08AK7jW7004276 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 10 Sep 2020 16:07:47 -0400 Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:07:44 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Alvaro Retana , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , The IESG Message-ID: <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.1 (2019-06-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 20:08:00 -0000 Hi Pascal! On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 12:18:48PM +0000, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Benjamin > > Many thanks for the depth of your review and the considerable amount of time you must have spent on it! > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > DISCUSS: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > The situation w.r.t. MOP values 5, 6, and 7 seems inconsistent to me. > > We are not allocating them, but we are changing the RFC 6550 behavior in the > > presence of at least one of them (but are not currently claiming to Update > > 6550). I have some further thoughts in the COMMENT section, but I don't > > think the current state is consistent enough to be approved as-is. > > As Michael said on this thread. > > You'll find that we had a mention that we update RFC 6550 till -07, e.g., https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-05 > > This changed with "AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-07" Ah, that would explain why I remembered seeing an "Updating RFC 6550" section but couldn't find it in the -14! > " > > 155 3. Updating RFC 6550 > > [major] I don't think that a formal Update to rfc6550 is necessary. > In general, a formal Update indicates (at least to me) that an rfc6550 implementation has to also support this specification. IOW, all RPL routers will have to support the new flag to be compliant with rfc6550. Also, rfc8138 did not formally Update rfc6550. > " > > So on that one, I will ask you to talk to Alvaro (cc). I am still looking for the final words on what "updates" means! > > I'm holding the publication till you and Alvaro agree on this item. For the rest, let's see below: With thanks to Michael for the explanation, I will quote a bit and reply here since I am replying to the other bits, too: % We are changing the RFC6550 behaviour in the presence of 0,1,2,3,4,5,6. % But, we are leaving the meaning of this bit when MOP=7 UNDEFINED, to be % defined in a future document. Defining the behavior when the bit is set seems like fairly normal procedures for allocating something from an IANA registry -- your implementation knows that the flags are managed by the registry and what to do if a bit is set that you don't support is well-specified. That applies to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that situation, that is probably also something that we can do in a normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" document without need for Updates. But that's not all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP==7, then you have to use the 8138 header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are *not* allocating MOP==7. So either we are changing the RFC 6550 semantics for the DODAG Configuration Option or we are placing normative requirements on some future document that does allocate MOP==7, and I think we have significant experience to suggest that one RFC placing normative requirements on future RFCs is not a reliable mechanism ... which makes me want to go with the "updates 6550" option. Perhaps marking MOP==7 in the registry as a placeholder with this doc as a reference could also work, but it might make mopex a bit messier, procedurally. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > COMMENT: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > The description of the RFC 8138 as a "packet compression technique" > > throughout the document (e.g., "with the [RFC8138] compression turned > > on") has been fairly confusing to me, since as I understand it, RFC 8138 defines > > a new routing header that just happens to have, as a primary design > > consideration, a compression technique included. > > Well, I see it differently. RFC 8138 does not define new IPv6 headers. You can always transform an IPv6 packet to the RFC 8138 encoding and back with the IPv6 headers that already exist. It is an extension of the 6LoWPAN Header Compression. > The reason for so many words in the RFC is that we define how to perform the forwarding operations without the need to uncompress. > Making the forwarding a lot simpler for the constrained code than it is with normal IPv6 (think of the swapping with the RH etc...) was another goal of that spec. I am willing to admit the possibility that an outcome leaving me (but not many other people) confused is the best outcome. To phrase it differently: "the wire representation of the header is different (and in at least most cases a lot shorter)". I can see how calling this "compression" makes sense, and "the [RFC8138] compressed header" would not have left me as confused. I think that seeing "the [RFC8138] compression" had gotten me thinking that compression was an optional feature of 8138, so you could have 8138-with-compression and 8138-without-compression, and somehow only the formmer was problematic. > > > So, the incompatibility > > between non-8138 and 8138 nodes relates to the understanding of the header, > > not the compression within the header. > > True, regardless on whether we agree on the sentence above. > > > As > > 8138 itself puts it: "It is expected that a router that does not recognize the > > 6LoRH general format detailed in Section 4 will drop the packet when a 6LoRH > > is present." The discussion in (e.g.) section 5.2 then makes more sense when > > we have a mix of different header formats in the same network, etc. In my > > mind, the "T" flag is controlling "do we use RFC 8138" and not "do we use RFC > > 8138 compression" (but perhaps I'm just confused!). > > I can live with that. We never went into that discussion doing, say https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6282. > We just call that compression but the same concern applies. (Oops, maybe my remark above fits better here.) > > > This also (perhaps tangentially) relates to the concern brought up at WG- > > adoption time relating to whether this is an appropriate mechanism for > > conveying this kind of configuration. If the intent is to say "this DODAG uses > > RPL with a given routing header format", that seems a fairly reasonable match > > for DODAG configuration information (though not perfect), whereas "use this > > compression format for your RPI" seems somewhat farther removed. > > OK > > > > I say it's not a perfect fit for two reasons: > > (1) as I understand it, the routing header behavior applies to the whole RPL > > instance, not just the specific DODAG, so if there was an "RPL Instance > > Configuration Option" that would be better; > > We went through that, and initially I wanted per-instance operation too. But this would have required a synchronization between multiple roots in a large instance and RPL has nothing to ensure at that. So we went for a per DODAG operation. Note that packets in a DODAG stay in that DODAG. Hmm "packets in a DODAG stay in that DODAG" suggests that my understanding was incorrect about the scope for which the routing header applies. IIRC there's expected to be some backbone bridging going on between DODAG roots in a multi-DODAG RPL instance but I forget the details (and whether they can do the necessary packet munging to translate to/from 8138 format). > > > and (2) the description in RFC > > 6550 of the Option is "used to distribute configuration information for DODAG > > Operation", but "DODAG Operation" is not defined. If it was defined to be > > affecting the global configuration for RPL operation within the DODAG that > > seems a better match for my understanding of what it's intended to do. (To be > > fair, my understanding is shaped largely by looking at the existing 'A' flag and > > pondering that it's not really related to DODAG formation/modification, and > > extrapolating from a single data point is risky.) > > Maybe you and Alvaro could also consider https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-40#section-4. In this draft, which is rather simple, we went through a sequence of do / undo's in the review handling of IETF last call and beyond. Those opposite pieces of advice came from very seasoned reviewers, Stewart, Alvaro, Eric V. and yourself. > > This is not an easy experience for the authors. I guess I can live with it, having gone through IETF last calls before. But maybe there's something to look at a bit more. There may be a broader picture to look at, yes. I suspect that we are having to give so much attention and seeing so much churn because this is a setting where the bits are precious and we want to conserve them as much as we can, while ensuring that what we specify willy actually work at conserving them so they are available for reuse (as opposed to discovering later that we inadvertenly left something that was interpreting the bit and would break if we tried repurposing it). > To your point, the intent of the option is to carry the parameters that dictate how RPL operates in the DODAG, in lieu of the traditional way of using CLI on each node, which arguably is not an easy thing in a large network of constrained nodes. We wanted RPL to be self-descriptive, more autonomic if you like, and that made it attractive to ANIMA. Sadly we missed homenet. Okay, thanks for confirming. > > An Update to RFC 6550 to > > clarify this aspect of the DODAG Configuration Option would make me more > > comfortable with using this mechanism to affect what routing header is used > > on the network. > > That was my intention. I'll trust you guys on that once you reach an agreement. To be clear, I'm looking at something vaguely along the lines of OLD: The DODAG Configuration option is used to distribute configuration information for DODAG Operation through the DODAG. NEW: The DODAG Configuration option is used to distribute configuration information affecting the construction and maintenance of the DODAG, as well as operational parameters for RPL on the DODAG, through the DODAG. > > > > Section 1 > > > > Enabling [RFC8138] requires a Flag Day where the network is upgraded > > and rebooted. Otherwise, if acting as a Leaf, a node that does not > > > > [My inner pedant notes that this is not true for greenfield deployments, where > > the "upgrade" is in place on first boot.] > > > > True; Isn't that the flaggest days of all ; ) ? > > What about > " > Enabling [RFC8138] on a running network requires a Flag Day where the > network is upgraded and rebooted. > " Thanks for indulging me :) > > Section 2.2 > > > > SubDAG: Subset of a DAG that is a child of a node > > > > (nit) This seems a little ambiguous as to whether the node in question is > > included (and also whether inclusion is based on transitive child relationship vs. > > direct, though that interpretation doesn't acutally make sense); perhaps > > "subset of a DAG that is itself a DAG, rooted at a given node"? > > My reading, and the intention, is that the node is excluded. One is not one's child. > > What I like in your proposal is that it indicates that the subDAG is a DAG, which is a property of the subDAG. > Another property is that it is a DODAG even if the outer DAG itself is not. > Please look at https://www.nist.gov/dads/HTML/subtree.html; I do not feel like debating with Paul Black myself 😉 > What about (placing redundant dots on i's which Paul's definition does not) > " > A DODAG rooted at a node which is a child of that node and a subset of a larger DAG > " I think my confusion stems from trying to interpret "child" as being a node (as in the parent/child node relationship) vs a tree. If you think it's clear, please keep it unchanged, but your proposal looks fine to me as well (though there might be singular/plural questions if the node in question has multiple children). > > Section 3 > > > > This specification defines a new flag "Enable RFC8138 Compression" > > (T). The "T" flag is set to turn-on the use of the compression of > > RPL artifacts with [RFC8138] within the DODAG. The new "T" flag is > > encoded in position 2 of the reserved Flags field in the RPL DODAG > > Configuration Option, and set to 0 in legacy implementations as > > specified in Section 6.7.6 of [RFC6550]. > > > > (I agree with the other comments about "position 2" needing further > > explanation, even if that's just a more prominent pointer to the relevant IANA > > registry.) > > OK then. What about: > > " > The new "T" flag is > encoded in position 2 of the reserved Flags field in the RPL DODAG > Configuration Option (counting from bit 0 as the most significant > bit) and set to 0 in legacy implementations as specified respectively > in Sections 20.14 and 6.7.6 of [RFC6550]" Works for me, thanks. > > > Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in > > the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to > > 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > > I see that this is getting discussed elsewhere already, but it's not entirely clear > > to me why we need to be so precise about the future behavior. Won't it be > > fine if whatever document allocates MOP value 7 also says whether or not to > > use compression^Wthe 8138 header format? > > We could say something about "unless otherwise specified by the document > > allocating the MOP value, this specification applies", even. > > What we aim to do is provide a well-defined behavior for RPL V1 (MOP<7) and for RPL V2 (MOP==7) in the code that is written today. Understood. I think (as I managed to clarify my own thinking earlier) that I'm mostly concerned about the V2 (MOP==7) case. > Say that the MOP 6 spec redefines the "T" flag. A legacy node written today will misunderstand it and misbehave. We want to avoid that and ensure backwards compatibility so we lock the flag, make it MOP independent for RPL V1. But then, the flags will be obsolete in a future world where all nodes support RFC 8138 and encode the RPI as 0x23. So we decided for this spec as well as for https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo to lock the flags we define for all MOPs in RPL V1 and reopen their definition in RPL V2 (where MOP is 7) and above. > > This way a spec that define MOP 6 will know that the "T" flag is understood in a certain fashion by the nodes even if they do not know what to do with the MOP. The conjunction of this and RFC 6550 will for a node running code written today to operate as a leaf in a MOP 6 DODAG - because it does not understand MOP 6 - yet have the default behavior of complying with the "T" flag as defined here, so it can be a well-behaved leaf. > > For MOP 7 all bets are off. The expectation is that the "T" flag will not be needed because RFC 8138 will be part of the base mandate. If it Is not, will people can still define the "T" flag again, but that will be part of the new spec. The trouble is that an implementation of today will not use the redefined flag but take compression for granted. If the MOP 7 redefines the flag, an implementation of today will not operate properly. So we accept for MOP 7 what we refuse for MOP < 7. I am interpreting "an implementation of today will not use the redefined flag but take compression for granted" as meaning that if this document just allocates the "T" flag normally, an implementation written ~now that supports the "T" flag would have to interpret that bit as indicating use of 8138/compression even for MOP==7, and we don't want do do that since we expect it to be redundant for MOP==7. This, in light of my comment above, makes me think that what we really want to do is just say that "the allocation of the T flag applies only for MOP values 0 through 6; the bit in position 2 is considered unallocated for MOP==7 at the time of this writing (consult IANA for current information)". Whether or not 8138 compression actually is the only choice for MOP==7 can then be left to the mopex spec, without prior restraint from this document. > As it goes, I do not expect people will keep legacy nodes in a RPL V2 network. Too many things change. We add capability negotiation, we add SDN (P-DAO), the MOP is in a MOP-EXT option, ... a RPL V1 will be a second class citizen. > > > > > > > Section 5.2 > > > > the RPL Instance may potentially join any DODAG. The network MUST be > > operated with the "T" flag reset until all nodes in the RPL Instance > > are upgraded to support this specification. > > > > nit: maybe s/reset/unset/? > > > > Done. > > The temporary diff is stored in https://github.com/roll-wg/roll-turnon-rfc8138/commit/c581c66eed7efbaf4476c0a6cd8bb70714aa56ae > Please let me know if I need to do more for the COMMENT piece That doesn't inspire any further comments from me. Thanks! Ben From nobody Thu Sep 10 13:58:44 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ACD63A00C9; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:58:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.096 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AIYJ_ndlyc-o; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:58:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x534.google.com (mail-ed1-x534.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::534]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06C663A003F; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:58:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x534.google.com with SMTP id l17so7734203edq.12; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:58:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=d+t5yjmUqSmoHc1K6Xseok7UBJmX+98is4r8NMHvWLU=; b=WEPXdNAF/mMFFRM0BTsA+Ss+4TWLM7FWeNkeb5hl6l29EOQPObwFQRekyLb8aiK1nP wJa1UU+7U9OKfh1QyM6g9gKdy46kbLfLK8MCzFedb9ArmSFEx6YKVY4uauTboAevWBtM 8hLE+hipxIK2plrwrvVHRNYt0xlJx6Gx4tLn7+5QJJhHpWKzkN7UkYXDO2Ma5i5bJ417 WRpcX9xBfU2FvdUvBbCemGNiuHlFklNhTzjEcXsWaVksoW/fteKh2ADJ8EYJ3svVuuhV ZkV97zHQm3zqm3sh47q0B0V3wB1wmRugc4TmHj+yzHZMOkbdHmB/zJ1nVEW61F3sY/rb nSUQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=d+t5yjmUqSmoHc1K6Xseok7UBJmX+98is4r8NMHvWLU=; b=FsTFj1swuJao57yiFomzF6JtgcSc4iHgNCtUn46eBvJ1grtapOCIMAmHny5hRZfk2/ tSZu292YLyoBVo01njklso0pI4MrnCPOLkGxDosUayUEFud3kn1cf/t18zc9BT2mq+jn uVJoDbk2NUApYuoyVqFrGhtBYZv09kR9Ig+eWrrfRfg41ua4X23/b/Q+9ZTrj7v65Ir4 QOEQ+7BBsbxUIHro14ktzBc0d6SfU6QdkyOOKNthG9PrARhak4y6EDTTcRj2W49b3l9r gRNst8/gUZadMzjU0z1ky1VLAdAyZgerYpX4+zlJmocLAbZE/+a9+Hv7Ud2CP2e5pAqf 9VdQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532hZidVmZP00/QBiGnZWIoNgODvGiemni8BSW13vCbQCoTxCTwl kveB8vayUJxA+EtYV0n9jWm+NjUGGfnEWBIUZX8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxateIY9Jq7L85DUNaAWe8+TpxQxuycrqRExtwpxoRvC8KnpN5OT7rMhBZaMIurbkcfwAI+PSbRTENadA86+Xc= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:ca46:: with SMTP id j6mr11101561edt.155.1599771514546; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 13:58:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 16:58:33 -0400 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 16:58:33 -0400 Message-ID: To: Benjamin Kaduk , "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Alvaro Retana , The IESG , "roll@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Ines Robles Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d8ad7105aefbd474" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 20:58:39 -0000 --000000000000d8ad7105aefbd474 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! Jumping in here on the Updates/MOP 7 point. The only reason we=E2=80=99re trying to treat MOP 7 differently is because = we (the WG) know that the mopex draft is coming=E2=80=A6which is the future documen= t that will define what 7 really means. However, we=E2=80=99re still not there=E2=80=A6and the mopex draft should b= e the one defining all the changes. I think the easiest thing to do at this point is to ignore mopex, and the knowledge that things will change in the future=E2=80=A6because we still do= n=E2=80=99t know exactly what that future will be=E2=80=A6this extension should then simply = be defined as other extensions have been: applicable to all MOPs. When mopex comes we can deal with the respective Updates, changes to the registries, etc. Alvaro. On September 10, 2020 at 4:07:54 PM, Benjamin Kaduk (kaduk@mit.edu) wrote: Hi Pascal! On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 12:18:48PM +0000, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Benjamin > > Many thanks for the depth of your review and the considerable amount of time you must have spent on it! > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > DISCUSS: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > The situation w.r.t. MOP values 5, 6, and 7 seems inconsistent to me. > > We are not allocating them, but we are changing the RFC 6550 behavior in the > > presence of at least one of them (but are not currently claiming to Update > > 6550). I have some further thoughts in the COMMENT section, but I don't > > think the current state is consistent enough to be approved as-is. > > As Michael said on this thread. > > You'll find that we had a mention that we update RFC 6550 till -07, e.g., https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-05 > > This changed with "AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-07" Ah, that would explain why I remembered seeing an "Updating RFC 6550" section but couldn't find it in the -14! > " > > 155 3. Updating RFC 6550 > > [major] I don't think that a formal Update to rfc6550 is necessary. > In general, a formal Update indicates (at least to me) that an rfc6550 implementation has to also support this specification. IOW, all RPL routers will have to support the new flag to be compliant with rfc6550. Also, rfc8138 did not formally Update rfc6550. > " > > So on that one, I will ask you to talk to Alvaro (cc). I am still looking for the final words on what "updates" means! > > I'm holding the publication till you and Alvaro agree on this item. For the rest, let's see below: With thanks to Michael for the explanation, I will quote a bit and reply here since I am replying to the other bits, too: % We are changing the RFC6550 behaviour in the presence of 0,1,2,3,4,5,6. % But, we are leaving the meaning of this bit when MOP=3D7 UNDEFINED, to be % defined in a future document. Defining the behavior when the bit is set seems like fairly normal procedures for allocating something from an IANA registry -- your implementation knows that the flags are managed by the registry and what to do if a bit is set that you don't support is well-specified. That applies to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that situation, that is probably also something that we can do in a normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" document without need for Updates. But that's not all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, then you hav= e to use the 8138 header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. So either we are changing the RFC 6550 semanti= cs for the DODAG Configuration Option or we are placing normative requirements on some future document that does allocate MOP=3D=3D7, and I think we have significant experience to suggest that one RFC placing normative requirements on future RFCs is not a reliable mechanism ... which makes me want to go with the "updates 6550" option. Perhaps marking MOP=3D=3D7 in th= e registry as a placeholder with this doc as a reference could also work, but it might make mopex a bit messier, procedurally. --000000000000d8ad7105aefbd474 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =
Hi!

Jumping in here on the Updates/MOP 7 point.


The only reason we=E2=80=99re trying to treat= MOP 7 differently is because we (the WG) know that the mopex draft is comi= ng=E2=80=A6which is the future document that will define what 7 really mean= s.=C2=A0
However, w= e=E2=80=99re still not there=E2=80=A6and the mopex draft should be the one = defining all the changes.

I think the easiest thing to do at this point is to ignore mopex, an= d the knowledge that things will change in the future=E2=80=A6because we st= ill don=E2=80=99t know exactly what that future will be=E2=80=A6this extens= ion should then simply be defined as other extensions have been: applicable= to all MOPs.=C2=A0 When mopex comes we can deal with the respective Update= s, changes to the registries, etc.


Alvaro.


On September 10, 2020 at 4:07:54 PM, B= enjamin Kaduk (kaduk@mit.edu) wrote:

= Hi Pascal!

On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 12:18:48PM +0000, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wro= te:
> Hello Benjamin
> =20
> Many thanks for the depth of your review and the considerable amou= nt of time you must have spent on it!
> =20
> =20
> > -------------------------------------------------------------= ---------
> > DISCUSS:
> > -------------------------------------------------------------= ---------
> > =20
> > The situation w.r.t. MOP values 5, 6, and 7 seems inconsisten= t to me.
> > We are not allocating them, but we are changing the RFC 6550 = behavior in the
> > presence of at least one of them (but are not currently claim= ing to Update
> > 6550). I have some further thoughts in the COMMENT section, = but I don't
> > think the current state is consistent enough to be approved a= s-is.
> =20
> As Michael said on this thread. =20
> =20
> You'll find that we had a mention that we update RFC 6550 till= -07, e.g., https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-05
> =20
> This changed with "AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc813= 8-07"

Ah, that would explain why I remembered seeing an "Updating RFC 65= 50"
section but couldn't find it in the -14!
> "
> =20
> 155 3. Updating RFC 6550
> =20
> [major] I don't think that a formal Update to rfc6550 is neces= sary.
> In general, a formal Update indicates (at least to me) that an rfc= 6550 implementation has to also support this specification. IOW, all RPL r= outers will have to support the new flag to be compliant with rfc6550. Als= o, rfc8138 did not formally Update rfc6550.
> "
> =20
> So on that one, I will ask you to talk to Alvaro (cc). I am still = looking for the final words on what "updates" means!
> =20
> I'm holding the publication till you and Alvaro agree on this = item. For the rest, let's see below:

With thanks to Michael for the explanation, I will quote a bit and repl= y
here since I am replying to the other bits, too:

% We are changing the RFC6550 behaviour in the presence of 0,1,2,3,4,5,= 6.
% But, we are leaving the meaning of this bit when MOP=3D7 UNDEFINED, t= o be
% defined in a future document.

Defining the behavior when the bit is set seems like fairly normal
procedures for allocating something from an IANA registry -- your
implementation knows that the flags are managed by the registry and wha= t to
do if a bit is set that you don't support is well-specified. That = applies
to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. If= we
were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that situation,
that is probably also something that we can do in a normal "alloca= te a bit
from an IANA registry" document without need for Updates. But tha= t's not
all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, = then you have to
use the 8138 header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we = are
*not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. So either we are changing the RFC 6550 se= mantics
for the DODAG Configuration Option or we are placing normative requirem= ents
on some future document that does allocate MOP=3D=3D7, and I think we h= ave
significant experience to suggest that one RFC placing normative
requirements on future RFCs is not a reliable mechanism ... which makes= me
want to go with the "updates 6550" option. Perhaps marking M= OP=3D=3D7 in the
registry as a placeholder with this doc as a reference could also work,= but
it might make mopex a bit messier, procedurally.
--000000000000d8ad7105aefbd474-- From nobody Thu Sep 10 14:09:25 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90FCC3A0839; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:09:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vlLC-VCy27Sf; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:09:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA6A53A0906; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:09:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 08AL8va6030553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 10 Sep 2020 17:08:59 -0400 Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:08:57 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: Alvaro Retana Cc: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , Alvaro Retana , The IESG , "roll@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Ines Robles Message-ID: <20200910210857.GI89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.1 (2019-06-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 21:09:21 -0000 On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 04:58:33PM -0400, Alvaro Retana wrote: > Hi! > > Jumping in here on the Updates/MOP 7 point. > > > The only reason we’re trying to treat MOP 7 differently is because we (the > WG) know that the mopex draft is coming…which is the future document that > will define what 7 really means. > > However, we’re still not there…and the mopex draft should be the one > defining all the changes. > > I think the easiest thing to do at this point is to ignore mopex, and the > knowledge that things will change in the future…because we still don’t know > exactly what that future will be…this extension should then simply be > defined as other extensions have been: applicable to all MOPs. When mopex > comes we can deal with the respective Updates, changes to the registries, > etc. That seems like it's setting us up for exactly the situation that Pascal/Michael want to avoid -- if we allocate the T flag "normally" then an implementation written next month will treat the bit in position 2 as the T flag, independnetly of the MOP value. When MOP==7 finally comes along then the bit is burned and can't be repurposed, so long as that implementation is still deployed, and that can't be fixed by Updates or registry changes. Is it so bad to say that the bit allocation is only defined for a subset of MOPs? -Ben From nobody Thu Sep 10 22:42:34 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 940EB3A1443; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 22:42:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com header.b=dJqwpNWK; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.onmicrosoft.com header.b=y2HRsrD9 Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost 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15.20.3370.017; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 05:42:28 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Benjamin Kaduk CC: Alvaro Retana , Alvaro Retana , The IESG , "roll@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Ines Robles Thread-Topic: Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAA4zgIAAAueAgACPedU= Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 05:42:28 +0000 Message-ID: <8CD8472F-B8C0-4396-8223-1AECF7FE0CB1@cisco.com> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> , <20200910210857.GI89563@kduck.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: <20200910210857.GI89563@kduck.mit.edu> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: gmail.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gmail.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [90.118.154.54] 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(2603:10b6:208:ea::31) by MN2PR11MB3824.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:f4::18) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3370.16; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 08:10:32 +0000 Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95]) by MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95%4]) with mapi id 15.20.3370.017; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 08:10:32 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Benjamin Kaduk CC: Alvaro Retana , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , The IESG Thread-Topic: Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAK+K0A== Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 08:10:29 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 08:10:00 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> 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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <159983274829.19791.3262658341565906440@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 06:59:08 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:59:08 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Root initiated routing state in RPL Authors : Pascal Thubert Rahul Arvind Jadhav Matthew Gillmore Filename : draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11.txt Pages : 32 Date : 2020-09-11 Abstract: This document enables a RPL Root to install and maintain Projected Routes within its DODAG, along a selected set of nodes that may or may not include self, for a chosen duration. This potentially enables routes that are more optimized or resilient than those obtained with the classical distributed operation of RPL, either in terms of the size of a source-route header or in terms of path length, which impacts both the latency and the packet delivery ratio. Projected Routes may be installed in either Storing and Non-Storing Modes Instances of the classical RPL operation, resulting in potentially hybrid situations where the mode of some Projected Routes is different from that of the other routes in the RPL Instance. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Sep 11 09:14:59 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CC7A3A0999; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:14:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IESG Secretary To: "IETF-Announce" Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.16.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:14:53 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:14:54 -0000 The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. Agenda: To Be Determined Information about remote participation: ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting From nobody Fri Sep 11 09:24:00 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 773E93A13A2; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:23:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vT2OxB3guLvE; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:23:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7FABF3A13AE; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:23:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A565389D8; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:02:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 63JkloQiVaET; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:02:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00630389D5; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:02:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6662875; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:23:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks cc: "Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\)" , "roll-chairs\@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138\@ietf.org" , The IESG In-Reply-To: <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:23:59 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. = If we > were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that situatio= n, > that is probably also something that we can do in a normal "allocate = a bit > from an IANA registry" document without need for Updates. Up to here, we agree. > But that's not > all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, then y= ou have to > use the 8138 header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet w= e are > *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7. Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, and how it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be up to a document th= at specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex) As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-became-ECN change, we did this for IP_version=3D=3D4 and IP_version=3D=3D6. We specifically did not change it for IP_version=3D=3D7 or 8. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9bpJYACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUn6Qf/SnulivSQf4ww+p4HLD390Lg9FvsKXbiU1hcOk2+e1brTSvjSvBQ7QHNF vlx0J/QDz2yNgN7ROeUjsjEnzV5tb+CoBqq0L+21Bjlg/1uhtgnB3rqoTAFH3/u1 M21ypuXfGnzipWjnilQDPV70GzXkngAbNFROw4LsAyXDN+XSVa3PYMjV/6kedLQs eeb4V8Renbs3HPeNZq9ja68ybRQvBYyAQawADEw2cKW+jdjasQXCxuAzexI2PNpG Qt2p1noNnEkn3TyRWpMuDgM/DhDYJsAHAAA+Zkb4ebuCUfCgB2a6Senaf06TIYOj nh9bLMTR3rTcaXi4m8s2FlRFZ6bWbA== =KLMT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Sep 11 09:26:50 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A818B3A1477; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:26:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B7UUGa7U2wPq; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:26:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 807D93A1408; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:26:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 08BGQHuQ023399 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:26:19 -0400 Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 09:26:17 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: Michael Richardson Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG Message-ID: <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <17053.1599841430@localhost> User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.1 (2019-06-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:26:46 -0000 On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Richardson wrote: > > Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > > to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. If we > > were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that situation, > > that is probably also something that we can do in a normal "allocate a bit > > from an IANA registry" document without need for Updates. > > Up to here, we agree. > > > But that's not > > all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP==7, then you have to > > use the 8138 header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are > > *not* allocating MOP==7. > > Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > > We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP==7. > Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). That's not how I read: For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, and how it it > negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be up to a document that > specifies MOP=7 (or larger mopex) What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expected. -Ben > As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-became-ECN > change, we did this for IP_version==4 and IP_version==6. > We specifically did not change it for IP_version==7 or 8. > > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 IT consulting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > From nobody Fri Sep 11 12:16:41 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F4633A1695; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:16:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com 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b=M23WE0cNNfU3HmVV+8mZ9JtUZT/i02Ib7zUG9Q0DbhPtgBraTPWNuy4AX+5cUFKYq2YovCCQGEBigcXJ3OQ31psdl0o+7lCt1ioNvsc9QIKNhJdNjUYTx49WcDvqz/0JjjBwql/5DFfppwQRbJfNGnfmq1Ic/oMwOccby4f5e/I= Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:ea::31) by MN2PR11MB3854.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:f0::23) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3370.16; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 19:16:35 +0000 Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95]) by MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95%4]) with mapi id 15.20.3370.017; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 19:16:35 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Benjamin Kaduk CC: Michael Richardson , "Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 11 Sep 2020 19:16:35.3205 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: T1k1GH0UjcZbvqE4Rdjg1s3rStfTiWR3Q0Jw4HoGQyw4aC0kO26amwuW99w87hdiKwrJkQmFq5fVYvUo4PAmiA== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3854 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.36.7.13, xch-aln-003.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-9.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 19:16:41 -0000 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IGhvdyBpdCBpdA0KPj4gbmVnb3RpYXRlZCwgYW5kIGhvdyB0aGUgcmVzdWx0cyBhcmUgdHVybmVk IG9uLCB3b3VsZCBiZSB1cCB0byBhIGRvY3VtZW50IHRoYXQNCj4+IHNwZWNpZmllcyBNT1A9NyAo b3IgbGFyZ2VyIG1vcGV4KQ0KPiANCj4gV2hhdCB5b3UgZGVzY3JpYmUgaGVyZSBpcyBtb3JlIGFs b25nIHRoZSBsaW5lcyBvZiB3aGF0IEkgZXhwZWN0ZWQuDQo+IA0KPiAtQmVuDQo+IA0KPj4gQXMg YW4gYW5hbG9neSwgd2hlbiB3ZSBkaWQgdGhlIFRvUy0+RFNDUCArIGJpdHMtdGhhdC1iZWNhbWUt RUNODQo+PiBjaGFuZ2UsIHdlIGRpZCB0aGlzIGZvciBJUF92ZXJzaW9uPT00IGFuZCBJUF92ZXJz aW9uPT02Lg0KPj4gV2Ugc3BlY2lmaWNhbGx5IGRpZCBub3QgY2hhbmdlIGl0IGZvciBJUF92ZXJz aW9uPT03IG9yIDguDQo+PiANCj4+IC0tDQo+PiBNaWNoYWVsIFJpY2hhcmRzb24gPG1jcitJRVRG QHNhbmRlbG1hbi5jYT4gICAuIG8gTyAoIElQdjYgScO4VCBjb25zdWx0aW5nICkNCj4+ICAgICAg ICAgICBTYW5kZWxtYW4gU29mdHdhcmUgV29ya3MgSW5jLCBPdHRhd2EgYW5kIFdvcmxkd2lkZQ0K Pj4gDQo+IA0KPiANCg== From nobody Fri Sep 11 12:37:35 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D50A3A03EE; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:37:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gkWxqT2a2qJR; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:37:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5E9DF3A0123; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:37:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BBC1389BB; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 15:16:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id Br_2OwqtQb36; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 15:16:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1781389B5; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 15:16:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 333817B; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 15:37:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Benjamin Kaduk , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\)" , "roll-chairs\@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138\@ietf.org" , The IESG In-Reply-To: <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 19:37:30 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Benjamin Kaduk wrote: >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. >> >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7. >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > That's not how I read: > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. While I think that's probably what we'll conclude, this wasn't in for WGLC that I recall. I think that this also must have gotten in during IESG revi= ew. Pascal, can we make this say: For a MOP value of 7, there is no "T" flag, and the compression behaviour will be defined by future work. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9b0fQACgkQgItw+93Q 3WX7AQf/RvTdsLa/5vyZAb0YtVRbnv3C4gKTkKCrX1koLh7ZfH/0bHG8IDzPwe05 by7goZRD6pHq0LKteAuA1O9FVbpOdpnWBuq/4xoFAY48Znhc2tZSB71hxY2+onhO x2DC0rYFaDw0RNhIp/mSHOOuzu4/Hgw/B5yU3iykNPawUMzuMXNZhM979y2M0DNB wMxuMrIqOnQqJzSlN2Qn3FRoA4Dk1XyZY/43CnTkRetljOW6eCndvw7pgmY/soVE uQAiYWj95El0sfidpi0UhxOEsG+tcpn3SmUBHh2RQhZ8X8uIay3OvuHWLIGbmBkI 3dFqUHtntUu2+tQT27ASu9yoU4sGKg== =rzxb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Sep 11 12:53:27 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47B473A0770; 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Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:53:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <4724.1599853045@localhost> In-Reply-To: <4724.1599853045@localhost> From: Martin Duke Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 12:53:08 -0700 Message-ID: To: Michael Richardson Cc: Benjamin Kaduk , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000514c7b05af0f09e0" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 19:53:21 -0000 --000000000000514c7b05af0f09e0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:37 PM Michael Richardson wrote: > > Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > >> > >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP==7. > >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > > > That's not how I read: > > > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > While I think that's probably what we'll conclude, this wasn't in for WGLC > that I recall. I think that this also must have gotten in during IESG > review. > > Pascal, can we make this say: > For a MOP value of 7, there is no "T" flag, and the compression > behaviour will be defined by future work. > > I believe this text would be sufficient to lift my DISCUSS, though I don't completely understand the interaction between MOP and versioning in this protocol. --000000000000514c7b05af0f09e0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:37 PM Michael = Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelma= n.ca> wrote:

Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk= @mit.edu> wrote:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 >>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7.=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn= 9;t exist).

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > That's not how I read:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by de= fault
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.

While I think that's probably what we'll conclude, this wasn't = in for WGLC
that I recall.=C2=A0 I think that this also must have gotten in during IESG= review.

Pascal, can we make this say:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 For a MOP value of 7, there is no "T" flag, and the= compression
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 behaviour will be defined by future work.


I believe this text would be sufficient to lift my DIS= CUSS, though I don't completely understand the interaction between MOP = and versioning in this protocol.
--000000000000514c7b05af0f09e0-- From nobody Fri Sep 11 13:25:03 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0DB83A0955; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:24:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id krwD5oqvP0XX; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:24:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ej1-x635.google.com (mail-ej1-x635.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::635]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6BC8E3A0812; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:24:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x635.google.com with SMTP id i26so15352874ejb.12; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:24:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=/KhjEFzBT4AGgqjp/lKFZFdebdF627pmShYaHKO9fCU=; b=MKpvxIuhePE7JMkoDIjr2SH8Oyya9n2VWoXHRbr0vFH2shOkJBkRgJ50P2MaOxlBhJ uFXAGXFGoYMY8z9qzI+hpd7nSSL4GoN94A1AKmzcUqQZ0Biz5N2MB9lNCW+cb1pIaJSI U++6l8IXgApNf4e5Z8RXW+4L491mA2vKkYFO9Z/UlMi0ASFG5g+nqwhf8bv2WQfow2VA P6QOMOYjB42buPJky7h6JwWtajJcUnIaQns5vsrYRoNofwqSTzFTWVGpnpKnPy0Bg5fY 8n7FpxGzfzbop05yAt6TZibt+lRAg/MmJ/L0RWCepcyat4mxILKLPDmy3te5lvKxbyIE tYvw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=/KhjEFzBT4AGgqjp/lKFZFdebdF627pmShYaHKO9fCU=; b=dU19yrzzoeksG4hR8Uz8o3m2SbjMYjNk/LU2Xe2ZsQnac19D1Mwqrrf2XyR/ZT6MqF EgGKNSad6hh9+VtQ+2HqLsg0r4rfmt/jQKEJmyRp8QIF8o7n5khrAucxHcQmvfbJI7T5 /jPfd9JleqQWbZQZG8DGwpBkObaqRixd+Idfeg0oUrxA1SOjfTnZuo3JtMj+fD/Rdlm2 hZJSNr6l7JxX44o03/o0O4KIXm/5zeA+EJxg8apzkszZ1+nQbHpNVgL+5JhtsBp5vK3f iS6BkdR9UmKznLBffDoqKMMeGB9AbGVXgTkPNpS2Y8bxhrybJm14AMUjlTEPGf4NrTI/ 8CrQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533difmgMmQD89ePSTOBp5JBcKnEiLxdO6XqleZrOZD2cTfw3e2M m3bIOtQWeLCfLXLhYMCEkr6OMFIhYsUL7vZPfhU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxt2mYAFH1M6rhAWEDnP2EnzRiLeifD1QBLjDIt6x5iA+FFSexSeVS8lCt5ywxrTmK9NDMJjS0tkXqtX6uWuiE= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:1690:: with SMTP id s16mr3659712ejd.122.1599855893908; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 13:24:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:24:52 -0400 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: <4724.1599853045@localhost> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <4724.1599853045@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 16:24:52 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , Benjamin Kaduk , The IESG , Alvaro Retana , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , Ines Robles , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 20:24:57 -0000 On September 11, 2020 at 3:37:32 PM, Michael Richardson wrote: > Pascal, can we make this say: For a MOP value of 7, there is no "T" flag, > and the compression behaviour will be defined by future work. If we do that, this would be the first document to indicate that the flags apply to some MOPs and not other. =C2=A0In this case the bit used for the T flag would still be available for MOP 7. Besides possibly updating rfc6550 to indicate that this is possible, we will also need to update the registry so that we can show how the bits are allocated: bit 2 is allocated for 0-6, and available for MOP 7. All that can be done. I was trying to avoid that work given that we don't know exactly what MOP 7 will be; while there's a chance that the mopex draft will build on the changes we would do here, there could also be a chance that it doesn't. In any case, this is probably something that needs to be discussed in the W= G. Alvaro. From nobody Fri Sep 11 18:17:40 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 306203A09A2; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:17:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NtfcX4TDJToa; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:17:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 077753A0998; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:17:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 08C1HLCY008584 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 11 Sep 2020 21:17:23 -0400 Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:17:21 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Alvaro Retana , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "roll@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "aretana.ietf@gmail.com" , The IESG Message-ID: <20200912011721.GV89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.1 (2019-06-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 01:17:35 -0000 On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 08:10:29AM +0000, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Benjamin: > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -- > > > > DISCUSS: > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -- > > > > > > > " > > > > > > 155 3. Updating RFC 6550 > > > > > > [major] I don't think that a formal Update to rfc6550 is necessary. > > > In general, a formal Update indicates (at least to me) that an rfc6550 > > implementation has to also support this specification. IOW, all RPL routers will > > have to support the new flag to be compliant with rfc6550. Also, rfc8138 did > > not formally Update rfc6550. > > > " > > > > > > So on that one, I will ask you to talk to Alvaro (cc). I am still looking for the > > final words on what "updates" means! > > > > > > I'm holding the publication till you and Alvaro agree on this item. For the rest, > > let's see below: > > > > With thanks to Michael for the explanation, I will quote a bit and reply here > > since I am replying to the other bits, too: > > > > % We are changing the RFC6550 behaviour in the presence of 0,1,2,3,4,5,6. > > % But, we are leaving the meaning of this bit when MOP=7 UNDEFINED, to be > > % defined in a future document. > > > > Defining the behavior when the bit is set seems like fairly normal procedures > > for allocating something from an IANA registry -- your implementation knows > > that the flags are managed by the registry and what to do if a bit is set that you > > don't support is well-specified. That applies to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for > > MOP 7 seems slightly different. If we were *just* leaving the bit > > undefined/free for reuse in that situation, that is probably also something that > > we can do in a normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" document without > > need for Updates. But that's not all we're doing; we're also saying that if you > > see MOP==7, then you have to use the 8138 header/compression/whatever- > > we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are > > *not* allocating MOP==7. So either we are changing the RFC 6550 semantics > > for the DODAG Configuration Option or we are placing normative requirements > > on some future document that does allocate MOP==7, and I think we have > > significant experience to suggest that one RFC placing normative requirements > > on future RFCs is not a reliable mechanism ... which makes me want to go with > > the "updates 6550" option. Perhaps marking MOP==7 in the registry as a > > placeholder with this doc as a reference could also work, but it might make > > mopex a bit messier, procedurally. > > We considered that latter option and dismissed it. Will create a IANA registry when a MOP-EXT needs to reuse the flags. > Might not be needed for a while. > > I read that the proposal on the table is to restore the 'updates' to support the fact that we timebomb the DODAG configuration flags to MOP<7. I tend to agree with it. > > Yes, let us follow that up separately with Alvaro. Indeed, that thread is progressing separately. > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -- > > > > COMMENT: > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -- > > > > > > To phrase it differently: "the wire representation of the header is different > > (and in at least most cases a lot shorter)". > > Yes > > > I can see how calling this > > "compression" makes sense, and "the [RFC8138] compressed header" would > > not have left me as confused. I think that seeing "the [RFC8138] compression" > > had gotten me thinking that compression was an optional feature of 8138, so > > you could have 8138-with-compression and 8138-without-compression, and > > somehow only the former was problematic. > > Oh, that I can do. I looked at the first and third paragraphs and from this discussion it seem I could improve them a bit: > > " > The design of Low Power and Lossy Networks (LLNs) is generally > focused on saving energy, which is the most constrained resource of > all. The routing optimizations in the "Routing Protocol for Low > Power and Lossy Networks" [RFC6550] (RPL) such as routing along a > Destination-Oriented Directed Acyclic Graph (DODAG) to a Root Node > and the associated routing header compression and forwarding > technique specified in [RFC8138] derive from that primary concern. > > Enabling [RFC8138] on a running network requires a Flag Day where the > network is upgraded and rebooted. Otherwise, if acting as a Leaf, a > node that does not support the compression would fail to communicate; > if acting as a router it would drop the compressed packets and black- > hole a portion of the network. This specification enables a hot > upgrade where a live network is migrated. During the migration, the > compression remains inactive, until all nodes are upgraded. > > This document complements [RFC8138] and signals whether it should be > used within a RPL DODAG with a new flag in the RPL DODAG > Configuration Option. The setting of this new flag is controlled by > the Root and propagates as is in the whole network as part of the > normal RPL signaling. > > " Yes! That looks really nice to me; thanks. > > > > > > > > > I say it's not a perfect fit for two reasons: > > > > (1) as I understand it, the routing header behavior applies to the > > > > whole RPL instance, not just the specific DODAG, so if there was an > > > > "RPL Instance Configuration Option" that would be better; > > > > > > We went through that, and initially I wanted per-instance operation too. But > > this would have required a synchronization between multiple roots in a large > > instance and RPL has nothing to ensure at that. So we went for a per DODAG > > operation. Note that packets in a DODAG stay in that DODAG. > > > > Hmm "packets in a DODAG stay in that DODAG" suggests that my > > understanding was incorrect about the scope for which the routing header > > applies. IIRC there's expected to be some backbone bridging going on > > between DODAG roots in a multi-DODAG RPL instance but I forget the details > > (and whether they can do the necessary packet munging to translate to/from > > 8138 format). > > OK, I need to reword. > Your memory serves you well: an instance can aggregate multiple DODAGs, with a backbone, each DODAG having its own root connected to the same backbone. This is where the backbone router draft plays by the way. There could also be a routing protocol forming an "area 0". > What I meant is that the packets that are in the DODAG do not jump into another DODAG with the same instance. That's the nature of the graph. > Initially the DODAG was a stub, so the packet could only enter / exit via the root. With useofRPL info and unaware leaves, we opened to external destination connected at the leaf edge. Okay; thanks for walking through this with me. > > > > > > An Update to RFC 6550 to > > > > clarify this aspect of the DODAG Configuration Option would make me > > > > more comfortable with using this mechanism to affect what routing > > > > header is used on the network. > > > > > > That was my intention. I'll trust you guys on that once you reach an > > agreement. > > > > To be clear, I'm looking at something vaguely along the lines of > > > > OLD: > > > > The DODAG Configuration option is used to distribute configuration > > information for DODAG Operation through the DODAG. > > > > NEW: > > > > The DODAG Configuration option is used to distribute configuration > > information affecting the construction and maintenance of the DODAG, as > > well as operational parameters for RPL on the DODAG, through the DODAG. > > > > This text is from RFC 6550 not this draft. What I can do to implement this change is this: (Right; sorry that was unclear.) > " > 3. Updating RFC 6550 > > The DODAG Configuration Option is defined in Section 6.7.6 of > [RFC6550]. Its purpose is extended to distribute configuration > information affecting the construction and maintenance of the DODAG, > as well as operational parameters for RPL on the DODAG, through the > DODAG. As shown in Figure 1, the Option was originally designed with > 4 bit positions reserved for future use as Flags. > > " That's along the lines of what I was imagining (but I recognize that it's kind of a significant change at a late stage in the process, and am not trying to push for making this change if this is not reflecting what the intent and consensus of the WG has been all along. One nit about the specific text: the construction "is extended to as well as " is often used to indicate that a thing was originally specified to do is being modified to also allow , which is in some sense the reverse of what is happening here. (But perhaps only in some sense, and not unambiguously so.) Alternately, if this is just clarifying the original intent, different wordings are possible, but I don't have the background to know if that's the case. > > > > > > > Section 2.2 > > > > > > > > SubDAG: Subset of a DAG that is a child of a node > > > > > > > > (nit) This seems a little ambiguous as to whether the node in > > > > question is included (and also whether inclusion is based on transitive child > > relationship vs. > > > > direct, though that interpretation doesn't acutally make sense); > > > > perhaps "subset of a DAG that is itself a DAG, rooted at a given node"? > > > > > > My reading, and the intention, is that the node is excluded. One is not one's > > child. > > > > > > What I like in your proposal is that it indicates that the subDAG is a DAG, > > which is a property of the subDAG. > > > Another property is that it is a DODAG even if the outer DAG itself is not. > > > Please look at https://www.nist.gov/dads/HTML/subtree.html; I do not > > > feel like debating with Paul Black myself 😉 > > > What about (placing redundant dots on i's which Paul's definition does > > > not) " > > > A DODAG rooted at a node which is a child of that node and a subset of > > > a larger DAG " > > > > I think my confusion stems from trying to interpret "child" as being a node (as > > in the parent/child node relationship) vs a tree. If you think it's clear, please > > keep it unchanged, but your proposal looks fine to me as well (though there > > might be singular/plural questions if the node in question has multiple > > children). > > The change was applied in the previous commit. I'm happy with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in > > > > the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to > > > > 6. For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > > > > > > I see that this is getting discussed elsewhere already, but it's not > > > > entirely clear to me why we need to be so precise about the future > > > > behavior. Won't it be fine if whatever document allocates MOP value > > > > 7 also says whether or not to use compression^Wthe 8138 header format? > > > > We could say something about "unless otherwise specified by the > > > > document allocating the MOP value, this specification applies", even. > > > > > > What we aim to do is provide a well-defined behavior for RPL V1 (MOP<7) > > and for RPL V2 (MOP==7) in the code that is written today. > > > > Understood. I think (as I managed to clarify my own thinking earlier) that I'm > > mostly concerned about the V2 (MOP==7) case. > > Yep, that will continue in the other thread with Alvaro. > > > > > > > For MOP 7 all bets are off. The expectation is that the "T" flag will not be > > needed because RFC 8138 will be part of the base mandate. If it Is not, will > > people can still define the "T" flag again, but that will be part of the new spec. > > The trouble is that an implementation of today will not use the redefined flag > > but take compression for granted. If the MOP 7 redefines the flag, an > > implementation of today will not operate properly. So we accept for MOP 7 > > what we refuse for MOP < 7. > > > > I am interpreting "an implementation of today will not use the redefined flag > > but take compression for granted" as meaning that if this document just > > allocates the "T" flag normally, an implementation written ~now that supports > > the "T" flag would have to interpret that bit as indicating use of > > 8138/compression even for MOP==7, and we don't want do do that since we > > expect it to be redundant for MOP==7. > > > > This, in light of my comment above, makes me think that what we really want > > to do is just say that "the allocation of the T flag applies only for MOP values 0 > > through 6; the bit in position 2 is considered unallocated for MOP==7 at the > > time of this writing (consult IANA for current information)". > > Yes, this is what the text tries to say. Your wording might be more accurate, though. > What about > " > > Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (MOP) in > the DIO Base Object. This specification applies to MOP values 0 to > 6. For a MOP value of 7, the bit in position 2 is considered > unallocated and [RFC8138] MUST be used by default. > " > > > Whether or not 8138 compression actually is the only choice for MOP==7 can > > then be left to the mopex spec, without prior restraint from this document. > > I do not believe so. It seems that this part is going to depend on the other thread, so I won't touch on it here. I do see your point that getting the implementations to do the right thing is ultimately what we need to get right. Thanks, Ben > People who implement this spec will write code like > If (MOP<7) { /* use the T flag */ } else { /* argl what do I do here ???? */ } > > We cannot leave that open ended can we? > > We discussed that in the ML and decided to provide the sensible default that is that RPL v2 will mandate support of RFC 8138. > > I pushed the new set of diffs in github as https://github.com/roll-wg/roll-turnon-rfc8138/commit/f330051fa0286c4ea5efa5d7dcff61bec81e486b > > The other recent changes I made for your review are also visible, here https://github.com/roll-wg/roll-turnon-rfc8138/commits/master > > Please note that the change set includes restoring the update thingy. > > Many thanks again!!! > > Take care, > > Pascal > > From nobody Fri Sep 11 18:22:09 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3558F3A09A2; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:22:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WrbbiL8ddnNM; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:22:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 51FC53A0998; Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:22:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 08C1LsRx009671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 11 Sep 2020 21:21:57 -0400 Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 18:21:54 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: Michael Richardson Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , Martin Duke , "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG Message-ID: <20200912012154.GW89563@kduck.mit.edu> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <4724.1599853045@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.12.1 (2019-06-15) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 01:22:07 -0000 On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:53:08PM -0700, Martin Duke wrote: > On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:37 PM Michael Richardson > wrote: > > > > > Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > > >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > > >> > > >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP==7. > > >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > > > > > That's not how I read: > > > > > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > > While I think that's probably what we'll conclude, this wasn't in for WGLC > > that I recall. I think that this also must have gotten in during IESG > > review. > > > > Pascal, can we make this say: > > For a MOP value of 7, there is no "T" flag, and the compression > > behaviour will be defined by future work. > > > > > I believe this text would be sufficient to lift my DISCUSS, though I don't > completely understand the interaction between MOP and versioning in this > protocol. I believe it would also be sufficient to lift my DISCUSS (given the discussion we've had already) ... but it is unclear whether it is actually the right thing to do. I'm hoping that Michael (or others in the WG, of course) will chime in on the "what do we want an implementation to do?" question. -Ben From nobody Sat Sep 12 10:52:01 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D4ED3A0C76; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 10:51:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yGwzgE_NCsp5; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 10:51:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0DB23A0870; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 10:51:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2778389D6; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 13:21:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id kCeZv5zKPvwc; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 13:21:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BA02389CE; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 13:21:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2929215; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 13:42:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks cc: Benjamin Kaduk , "roll-chairs\@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138\@ietf.org" , The IESG , Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost>, <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 17:51:53 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\) wrote: > Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore. > What will today=E2=80=99s developer code? > We ask him to test if mop is < 7 > What value will the developer place in his code if the test returns > false? That's a good question. Pascal, it your intention that 8138 be turned on in this case? I'm not opposed to that conclusion, but I thought that the goal was to move the signaling to mopex/capabilities/TBD? Would there be cases in the future where ONLY 8138 compression would be cod= ed? We have set the situation where if a node does not understand the MOP, it c= an be a leaf, but 8138 incompatibility makes that not work. > Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose true and > others false. This is not what we want. > We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the futu= re > and build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge. > Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally since > initially it did not exist. > Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUST s= upport the compression. Just consider that for some link layers, 8138 compression might not make se= nse. > In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide to u= se > the compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it? > I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it! We're assuming someone coding today. Someone who is not writing MOP=3D7 code, has no mopex or capabilities code, because we haven't defined that. We agree that the "T" flag does not exist, and should be checked. Such a node would be a leaf. I can live with defaulting 8138 to be on for MOP=3D7 for link layers for wh= ich 8138 is appropriate. (Someone coding today will know what link layers they have) =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9dCJQACgkQgItw+93Q 3WXgMggArQeF4EKZseHnbNBlCOgH1SbW+YF3x2FzRwEMIyXmTka2F5hAjlsm30gm s8ymr/poKTOO7fqeWhA0I2jqNZO6bgRlXb7fWcaMokzrCqOM0eijqzFqz0PEGtvE JckiPOYhKJt9j+QIXZ3JYdOAmYK/op36zGhb6xUqA1jS2i/twYvF0z/IdWJhLcru XVoinbfAyLWl2527wWIS+YAIN2necvlbdzWjnZyVuEBC15XVLaFIKAmWbXm7I4bZ SkeJK7YHrbQmCrcQUwYGJGYbFPA7zmsrq9gZhgawZDVddpXeFQIn+EFPDiMBNtuw nzFKHCKAq9udke0o4lYz1ftjX+h+tw== =48Lq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Sat Sep 12 14:52:26 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D80863A0942; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 14:52:20 -0700 (PDT) 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b=R3fKSDXo+VEMjqwCJzZ8DnkhmCe7tVWNa6Uy+zIQXDANZe+1a4v7aOMbN6hQQZ1hTjyyUpBk78dhLhFZOusOw2d30afhu/zvTbxh1tQjzidy/rVBmFMiojpg+AzVsHw/XOIYtvSMmvfR5zAlSLDbJ8kPGoMsnGaEf9+Cs7MMysM= Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:ea::31) by MN2PR11MB3965.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:13c::24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3370.17; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 21:52:13 +0000 Received: from MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95]) by MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::119:f851:5860:da95%4]) with mapi id 15.20.3370.017; Sat, 12 Sep 2020 21:52:13 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Michael Richardson CC: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , Benjamin Kaduk , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG , "Alvaro Retana" Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyAAXgcAIAARbX4 Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2020 21:52:13 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost>, <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com>, <13242.1599932564@localhost> In-Reply-To: <13242.1599932564@localhost> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:950d:74a1:cbf:4d5d] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: b47ae5a5-b69c-42ef-c13a-08d857661ba5 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3965: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 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c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=H4SaFklPYbbl4AEku560yH9qFgFATzfvVqDrTxYP6mc=; b=gtRwDK/TU6PZnytdT+wWrY7WUoUKxnMToiY4TCfCPs+z4YJOVycPV2EiCYOyX2Vr8S CdWk2/YkvaXUDAkwd8uwTFwpMNlhfMoMhxd7GM6k5kLjZR6yquRVENlb4N8KVvcQELBc iGzVxCXR76VkV7ngbEZkP6jp/kooIKESB6FlramYfCMiy2YkOAnJklVtcRRDy6RlFTtA U7icwIz1c98GVxkdTu69CbfJz90aZYaQhBww/hpecQWZDfwWadg49WMVZpUMZzJ9pmSN BSvKi3ONGI9+Yk6JWswNXV5a/YkYstI9bL6ZZkgopkt6DSzQzJdTWdY3CxpbxZ+B2j95 Bi5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=H4SaFklPYbbl4AEku560yH9qFgFATzfvVqDrTxYP6mc=; b=C2eLsn4aDQmqRL1IDhO6Sbtcmc35LyfFWlOS1+MSGgAzZ5WpMc4m4M5BfP8M5/uh7I CagKytdFH/INALez1Lxx4M1PoOswzbl3VQOH1KdpzE86t+8fuTrQqR7zDmCo8FvIs0z3 ZdhuG85oP0QvV02qsET/E+ze6IcN9gjxMmw6RXD1fv945oHPMWfnu9wX74YXqaVvat0t rkp7twjUy35R7drGGXdHSPyAyh/l9WQ7slO72VzFLbdvMz8gn+9FNswQO3t/y/rxIb3R 1kYz+NL9abTDbohOT9Ch4SQvvZ5cELiArCVAfR3J8DiW7Cynxvvb2iXAoO3IXRIZohOC gmJw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5326Dc5wo2NnNzk1h4tsuMyPzBwDQwrFzHs7AVenxZePHqU2ETvD H0Mu6Rv2Qbq+lK5eCKgmL+SkNiGP0rhQW/9NEM+tvUQohDWEQA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzTANdtZKqLe1bS3JsPMWx+cewzATWNiwxca9R7A+9/Q/X9y+d79YbYjyQaEqNj/BS3+mG+1tcNpCbBUg3vnao= X-Received: by 2002:a67:6b87:: with SMTP id g129mr5482197vsc.53.1600029462487; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 13:37:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Ines Robles Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2020 23:37:05 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000bdea8e05af37e3bb" Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2020 20:37:48 -0000 --000000000000bdea8e05af37e3bb Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic during the next roll interim meeting indicating: - Topic to Present. - Presenter - Time needed. Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kMr6RM_ao4]: Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control option (12:00min-14:00min) Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying for available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs ) Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? Material: Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll icalendar (UTC): https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.ics jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join Webex: https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 Please note that we aim to record the meeting. Material of the previous interim meetings: https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting Thank you very much, Ines and Dominique ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: IESG Secretary Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 To: IETF-Announce Cc: The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. Agenda: To Be Determined Information about remote participation: ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting _______________________________________________ Roll mailing list Roll@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll --000000000000bdea8e05af37e3bb Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

Thank you very much= for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim meeting on 30th Septe= mber with a duration of two hours.

Please= let us know by 18th September if you want to present a topic during= the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- Topic= to Present.
- Presenter
- Time needed.=C2=A0

Some discussions points from last interim meeting [https://www.youtube.com/watc= h?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]:

Mopex: Discussion o= n 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control option (12:00min-14:00min= )
Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of = capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min),=C2=A0 roll querying all nodes, querying= for available memory on nodes (23:00 min=20 -31:00 min=20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Etherpa= d:=C2=A0https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll
Webex:=C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTI= D=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 = 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we= aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materi= al of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting<= /a>


Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded message ---------
Fr= om: IESG Secretary= <iesg-sec= retary@ietf.org>
Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Sub= ject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Me= eting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low powe= r and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
--000000000000bdea8e05af37e3bb-- From nobody Sun Sep 13 14:12:57 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A49DE3A0C29 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 14:12:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id L6znLWvQq936 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 14:12:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 74EC53A0C27 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 14:12:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id D51FF389A5 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 16:51:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id FNcNNOZ2y3pG for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 16:51:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6304389A2 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 16:51:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F311215 for ; Sun, 13 Sep 2020 17:12:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2020 21:12:57 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ines Robles wrote: > Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic > during the next roll interim meeting indicating: > - Topic to Present. > - Presenter > - Time needed. I think that we need to discuss how we get to RPLv2, what it is, how many documents, and how much energy we have to get there. Call this a partial rechartering discussion if you like. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9ei1UACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVqYggAhq3j29HicQmlrnhC0gMpLvAm574HiOUrEa0WtxCQHbwmpZIK03TKOfkc 1ys9WPt/ByGhtvloQUuqx2HqsQiKk4FMbzYb7ssboOrMXIMxFMBXbKxE6VbJfLUQ crrczoNKcZgs3aHRNztg7s48xafrY36FWMf6aXQhOxAeShoCdgTAQLUZWBXuW9dE cfLX0tSCBsnhROpBP6F2NsobwKafS6782rxSSydg3O4AEIyi+rIL8uPU+Ir2SFyf PFImFx352yy/YQBKgecOroYsUYcP7szbQVmsPZSpjhMJIw/DBXp+QcBmBGUGWDZ3 txmRDXx2MXGJMQn5f08LLo3N6LcOYw== =rlXx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 01:20:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCCE53A0A08 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nQhgFQnOBnOH for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr1-x42e.google.com (mail-wr1-x42e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::42e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A64AD3A09F9 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr1-x42e.google.com with SMTP id s12so17630397wrw.11 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:subject:date:references :to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=yuwqSMYXJsZzo84VrepK+fm7CMCuU6mkHxuc0Xy3P50=; b=qoNoZhS5UpR2LJpw8f6AWDo2TR0oFF9gkb6WToKMEtmkmrjxMgqGxsSkat4Bv70+jp iGt039hOAr68sWEiSd/nbKaY2XzA1alDoaGR6atwGIN8F1+cxr1cqrIUEEGNmVv9wzQ7 Ct+tg8tphfpKh/1vU9nJFZhnc1E0gCl30voNqI40juvatBxolrJJ/tXbXDg+eXT9j75V kK78YNJ3eILF17+MOWtarmFt64FyFn3QBaz/P5sh+zUr7HeMiSP2gw8e9kENjAafeBCA H4Mggo7GRerW21Z4eXUTOw6/xw6pzVfLilay2jaJLdNkKo7xM5Ks7M4KczKZbx1jNVwX btww== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version :subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=yuwqSMYXJsZzo84VrepK+fm7CMCuU6mkHxuc0Xy3P50=; b=DsggJY3TX1JHDD7ji0CY+iwtwP+kqkWWWEr/UBBZQiAWQXqibXItttd4JLS4ru/6E5 Zv4LbG3g9zf7SyLukJmDh+BJ4TdODa/oJUxFGT3Ol17FsWuqUIYdG2hfnLDIuORuMzWm qGlrYsuZ5amXspqySswoLIueGTJn+lrx8vtLZUlVLZHOt0T37hA1fHJBgO3lZKIEH1BV OnpuvQLMEkAUolhpI2qQ16kLBeBc8o78gc3TKSB/9TUYtl+unrSwW+wriKIZVXLYjo8+ 25olEssrZy9lV12BoFpHkVIcjw9zAZg264ZJ8kO1eHVccTU++7LpYsb6K/zjFBilfcAm 5r2A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530bblFPZrjJccLnQg4WaA/M5DA7l+xX20gQNR7RLvB3AEESvEcK wqTqWYXR3wloIKD43u4MhM6aAAZSa0M= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzQ4p2UHW2/ZX9dHH/rpcrguwuRkRO4KyZpvAq8LFCmU6ShEfHxcwJIBlF885R28f81ie+T4A== X-Received: by 2002:adf:92c2:: with SMTP id 60mr15703528wrn.220.1600071630873; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2001:660:7301:3728:59ab:e259:2e51:8b1b? ([2001:660:7301:3728:59ab:e259:2e51:8b1b]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id b188sm23138538wmb.2.2020.09.14.01.20.30 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:20:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Georgios PAPADOPOULOS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.1\)) Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:20:29 +0200 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> <29587.1600031573@localhost> To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: <29587.1600031573@localhost> Message-Id: <0F5A5F26-B3DC-4831-B1D1-8E8EC701E965@gmail.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.1) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:20:35 -0000 Hello all, Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possible to have at the = end of the day everything in one single document? In stead of going over multiple documents, and multiple RFCs tomorrow, = imho, it would be more efficient to have one single RFC for the RPLv2 = like the RFC 6550 for RPL. What do you think? Giorgos > On 13 Sep 2020, at 23:12, Michael Richardson = wrote: >=20 >=20 > Ines Robles wrote: >> Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic >> during the next roll interim meeting indicating: >=20 >> - Topic to Present. >> - Presenter >> - Time needed. >=20 > I think that we need to discuss how we get to RPLv2, what it is, how = many > documents, and how much energy we have to get there. >=20 > Call this a partial rechartering discussion if you like. >=20 > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T = consulting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll From nobody Mon Sep 14 01:39:41 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 720F73A0D3D for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:39:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id El9LEbEJnBul for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:39:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AF8D23A0BE6 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:39:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97C3C389A2 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 04:18:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id fiD0upP4wCov for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 04:18:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:103c:9eff:fecb:2eac]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id D06E8389A1 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 04:18:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90FBBAC3 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 04:39:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: <0F5A5F26-B3DC-4831-B1D1-8E8EC701E965@gmail.com> References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> <29587.1600031573@localhost> <0F5A5F26-B3DC-4831-B1D1-8E8EC701E965@gmail.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:39:40 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Georgios PAPADOPOULOS wrote: > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possible to have at the > end of the day everything in one single document? Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Interne= t Standard. > In stead of going over multiple documents, and multiple RFCs tomorrow, > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single RFC for the RPLv2 > like the RFC 6550 for RPL. > What do you think? It's just too soon. We actually need to sort out the things we want to do. Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9fLDwACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVsFQf/UYh6Fz1aZDHZjc1nhpmcqkx+2X/jY9bX/iIlFVrRXcngV+/7DZzmQy2E GKaiMxz+EyWRCWEBJGT25gSBBgPBDE3pWmNYek5P22xatGDWjkwF/8WDHyaFK/mi BlIImdiQY0l+RX5THGUmnPwFSfRVd9tbVR3xDmO03lLvGcW+Ve5ffm+J27EcrGta 7IhWvaMsq7BBLT5Xl/ereagRnZCdigv+QPoRyi3JOz31vzWZhP+q5x3r1eQCOj8I /rt6dbcS49XjDfvqCqyouqU86fJDHnU2eNpNKDwatol6h2i76HK2TJu8zRTMGcZh 0mP27AEYFutx9XQST74mnQIt5eGNPg== =Uq1L -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 01:44:02 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E73C3A0D41 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:44:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rSnwJttL9yOt for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:44:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-x932.google.com (mail-ua1-x932.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::932]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 396AE3A0D40 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:44:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-x932.google.com with SMTP id 77so786624uaj.2 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:44:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=jr+p1Z2WIR6QvZ69GSI82PnDdcdOtA9a8PFMn474C6c=; b=efz57+vNBI8tTx3IZraF68h8dLEKGeUZsRGbAaUu8MhF10AxCiUF5Fuqie8OL6cHIo c780eLSkvhjZlerI3tu6zLzHG/rFTJ9q6lm0OIGW5D+t/69lS3Zu6Ik4qH4zPuXRtLbL HL4Nt4Zzw3qy5pyetJCdHB7rAjpXZWvQ8dXDOrIaCc1+b+5lE6n6K+GzU4KtOggkABFz b23EPa1MtUUIjLW+JiAPsuiw0lcXAaWBkcKudeI4e5LI5BRTW4su0AlFdaU/9EnyDM1s 7iTAzxo73uE4CXDYrfYfHUyIG3k7svHzqGOUg0qlkQwva9ZOizLTm38qAu0s216yo4XB hRkg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=jr+p1Z2WIR6QvZ69GSI82PnDdcdOtA9a8PFMn474C6c=; b=FK/37IvN7lU0xgCAKOOzlz+rAKfcvBaZJQXu+3jeyM0Y26dFUaaHcv7/0V8N4T+Xwt lz1+8aF3Ha78zIHQdm9kC07gcGc3wAKJr+7HLDSvkWJXQckJlu/qRbe/kOEyX8XOSTgH EyhsdLpVqZwG9p+o9yFbiXZv1uQbFn9QfUpsShF4Zs6tIJzuhvAu9Nk152r7gzXibCbf hcRDnsMZRmME7ep5bb/vvirI4bocPlaYSyaXLjY18JyKfMAE5tBGpSN77TBZATg+QrJu vfvJHM2pL3hxqovf4A0ckNUTVQL+xyElHo7suN6feKbWq+hPzWqwJb9ClkYSiU7N/8la VQ4A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531ghpBBqq0hPY21fljfJkk9Z5ORYJE/IOnTbEkvksOiIk6cAJNL BhYao2VE0HmCvA/jlfw26x8y0Y4sPQiCLqdlrbHsN0JeluNTZQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwvidTnTCgf6tDu0o3gUY+lSAupu2Bxp6nj/abNA/nYQtOlrN+cCLpwP+VNthHp0HRCZm3DOk+i+CYO3lNkUhs= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:22c9:: with SMTP id z9mr6180035uam.17.1600073039000; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:43:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ines Robles Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:43:23 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000001ab93105af4209bb" Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] ROLL Meeting at the IETF 109 - Request for comments X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:44:02 -0000 --0000000000001ab93105af4209bb Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, We kindly request to fill the following survey in order to know if we should have a ROLL meeting as part of the IETF 109. https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH Please fill the survey by *25th September.* Thank you very much for your input. Ines and Dominique. --0000000000001ab93105af4209bb Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

We kindly request to fill the= following survey in order to know if we should have a ROLL meeting as part= of the IETF 109.


Please fill the survey by 25th September.
=
Thank you very much for your input.

Ines and Dominique.
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charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what behaviour= may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind: 1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI O= ption Type value). 2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (no= n-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discussed in= context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently. 3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2) 4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for new = extns... part for same mopex draft) 5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows increm= ental feature support) There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be clarif= ied as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go in as part= of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3] WG could provide feedback on the following aspects: 1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated? 2. Do you feel there is some other point which needs to be addressed? [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -10 [2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-obser= vations-04 [3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -7 ________________________________ From: Roll on behalf of Michael Richardson Sent: 14 September 2020 02:09 PM To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda I= tems- Georgios PAPADOPOULOS wrote: > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possible to have at the > end of the day everything in one single document? Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Interne= t Standard. > In stead of going over multiple documents, and multiple RFCs tomorrow= , > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single RFC for the RPLv2 > like the RFC 6550 for RPL. > What do you think? It's just too soon. We actually need to sort out the things we want to do. Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point. -- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=F8T consulting = ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --_000_MA1PR01MB24910F67DE6D141C3B6FE451A9230MA1PR01MB2491INDP_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what behaviour= may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2?

Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind:

1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 = RPI Option Type value).
2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SR= H (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discuss= ed in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently.
3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2)
4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for= new extns... part for same mopex draft)
5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows i= ncremental feature support)

There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be c= larified as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go = in as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 655= 0 [1] ... 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3]

WG could provide feedback on the following aspects:
1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated?
From: Roll <roll-bounces= @ietf.org> on behalf of Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>=
Sent: 14 September 2020 02:09 PM
To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org><= br> Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for A= genda Items-
 

Georgios PAPADOPOULOS <gpapadopoulos.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
    > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possi= ble to have at the
    > end of the day everything in one single document?
Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Interne= t Standard.

    > In stead of going over multiple documents, and mult= iple RFCs tomorrow,
    > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single= RFC for the RPLv2
    > like the RFC 6550 for RPL.

    > What do you think?

It's just too soon.
We actually need to sort out the things we want to do.
Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>   . o O ( IPv6 I= =F8T consulting )
           Sandelman Soft= ware Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide




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Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:30:21 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: Which functions in RPLv2? 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X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:30:26 -0000 --_000_MN2PR11MB35656D743C23C2884D7ECDFAD8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Rahul I renamed the thread. In your first list 1..5 I'd say they are all mandatory and the first 2 alwa= ys on. There's also: 6) P-DAO for SDN-RPL and 7) AODV-RPL. I'd make those 2 optional And yes I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed. Each deserves a thread I believe. Let me start a few based on your email as= well... Take care, Pascal From: Roll On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 2020 12:38 To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda I= tems- Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what behaviour= may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind: 1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI O= ption Type value). 2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (no= n-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discussed in= context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently. 3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2) 4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for new = extns... part for same mopex draft) 5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows increm= ental feature support) There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be clarif= ied as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go in as part= of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3] WG could provide feedback on the following aspects: 1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated? 2. Do you feel there is some other point which needs to be addressed? [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -10 [2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-obser= vations-04 [3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -7 ________________________________ From: Roll > on behalf = of Michael Richardson > Sent: 14 September 2020 02:09 PM To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda I= tems- Georgios PAPADOPOULOS > wrote: > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possible to have at the > end of the day everything in one single document? Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Interne= t Standard. > In stead of going over multiple documents, and multiple RFCs tomorrow= , > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single RFC for the RPLv2 > like the RFC 6550 for RPL. > What do you think? It's just too soon. We actually need to sort out the things we want to do. Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point. -- Michael Richardson > = . o O ( IPv6 I=F8T consulting ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --_000_MN2PR11MB35656D743C23C2884D7ECDFAD8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello Rahul

 

I renamed the thread.

 

In your first list 1..5 I’d say they are all mandatory= and the first 2 always on.

 

There’s also:

6) P-DAO for SDN-RPL and

7) AODV-RPL.

I’d make those 2 optional

 

And yes I believe that the points in observations need to be= addressed.

Each deserves a thread I believe. Let me start a few based o= n your email as well…

 

Take care,

 

Pascal

 

From: Roll <roll-bo= unces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 202= 0 12:38
To: Routing Over Low power a= nd Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG = Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items-

 

Will now be the right time to ch= eck consensus with the WG on what behaviour may have to be mandated as part= of RPLv2?

 <= /p>

Following are some of the points= which immediately comes to my mind:

 <= /p>

1. Use of revised Option Type (0= x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI Option Type value).

2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (R= FC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode= )). This is something that was discussed in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently.

3. Use of MOPex (This is how we = know the instance is RPLv2)

4. Support for Ext Control Optio= ns. (Allows Backward compatibility for new extns... part for same mopex dra= ft)

5. Support for Capabilities. (En= ables backward compatibility, allows incremental feature support)

 <= /p>

There are some points from RPL O= bservations draft [2] which could be clarified as part of this work it= em. Not sure if those points could go in as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3]

 <= /p>

WG could provide feedback on the= following aspects:

1. Do you feel one of the points= above need not be mandated?

2. Do you feel there is some oth= er point which needs to be addressed?

 <= /p>

 <= /p>

From:= Roll <roll-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
Sent: 14 September 2020 02:0= 9 PM
To: Routing Over Low power a= nd Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>= ;
Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG = Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items-

 


Georgios PAPADOPOULOS <g= papadopoulos.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
    > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possi= ble to have at the
    > end of the day everything in one single document?
Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Interne= t Standard.

    > In stead of going over multiple documents, and mult= iple RFCs tomorrow,
    > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single= RFC for the RPLv2
    > like the RFC 6550 for RPL.

    > What do you think?

It's just too soon.
We actually need to sort out the things we want to do.
Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sa= ndelman.ca>   . o O ( IPv6 I=F8T consulting )
           Sandelman Soft= ware Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide


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Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:32:51 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 Thread-Index: AdaKinpj9SM0V5J0TieCuJ89j6MK0A== Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:32:31 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:32:04 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:d0f3:e330:1d:e06c] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 0cb064fd-991f-43e1-5063-08d858a1e9ec x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3821: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: BQbwE89mvF07zZG8o1vvS+9nAPwxqTrU1r7UD2kkQ4eMhc1NUve3Dn2YZXJ5GC9F3RpF+RXR0pPSHPd4MyiFor61tpVd0vfOc0O7dmeDmzR6WdpclwqMeAmZI4T3BGePqIBTFEoVJIHzgqGd3aabs2FYm6sF8uKRiZOpmUutBidJN5WO9CthFl/DUTv3zWQ7bHxn1DhwfQG5mAEd2HaXrHCKGzewz6g5+MEDKULqFU7RVHmnpMY+mVg/9pOuJHo+JgwuDSsABaU99AFb6du8YQdZhtRcFxCaXsO/7R9TLTKVUKxqJyPfSvoXGfIBSQ1V81W/7C85mt6bN/j8cQ0CZuwB5+23oiloxi2+zKvK4LWf9cdzVDgIjxNOLGRAwqhqaG+X7A2zCnAKSr8DJnnm9g== x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; 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boundary="_000_MN2PR11MB356557D3DA819D8D788A0CE1D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 0cb064fd-991f-43e1-5063-08d858a1e9ec X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 14 Sep 2020 11:32:50.9653 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: OGxDVGH64/ejLavQV6G+uXFi515ImHpxdSEziueQm3wJhBU06XLf3lx9iPzXPXu5sU6IbmmvRONKx7TVV6BD4A== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3821 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.36.7.13, xch-aln-003.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-7.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 11:32:56 -0000 --_000_MN2PR11MB356557D3DA819D8D788A0CE1D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Rahul Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed. I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550. Take care, Pascal From: Roll On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 2020 12:38 To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda I= tems- Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what behaviour= may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind: 1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI O= ption Type value). 2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (no= n-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discussed in= context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently. 3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2) 4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for new = extns... part for same mopex draft) 5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows increm= ental feature support) There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be clarif= ied as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go in as part= of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3] WG could provide feedback on the following aspects: 1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated? 2. Do you feel there is some other point which needs to be addressed? [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -10 [2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-obser= vations-04 [3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -7 --_000_MN2PR11MB356557D3DA819D8D788A0CE1D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello Rahul

 

Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be ad= dressed.

I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550.

 

Take care,

 

Pascal

 

From: Roll <roll-bo= unces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 202= 0 12:38
To: Routing Over Low power a= nd Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG = Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items-

 

Will now be the right time to ch= eck consensus with the WG on what behaviour may have to be mandated as part= of RPLv2?

 <= /p>

Following are some of the points= which immediately comes to my mind:

 <= /p>

1. Use of revised Option Type (0= x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI Option Type value).

2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (R= FC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode= )). This is something that was discussed in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently.

3. Use of MOPex (This is how we = know the instance is RPLv2)

4. Support for Ext Control Optio= ns. (Allows Backward compatibility for new extns... part for same mopex dra= ft)

5. Support for Capabilities. (En= ables backward compatibility, allows incremental feature support)

 <= /p>

There are some points from RPL O= bservations draft [2] which could be clarified as part of this work it= em. Not sure if those points could go in as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3]

 <= /p>

WG could provide feedback on the= following aspects:

1. Do you feel one of the points= above need not be mandated?

2. Do you feel there is some oth= er point which needs to be addressed?

 <= /p>

[1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#sect= ion-10

[2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-= 04

[3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#secti= on-7

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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Rahul Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed. I started this for the issue of mandating handling (not sending) of multipl= e targets in DAO. Take care, Pascal From: Roll > On Behalf = Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 2020 12:38 To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda I= tems- Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what behaviour= may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind: 1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI O= ption Type value). 2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (no= n-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discussed in= context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently. 3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2) 4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for new = extns... part for same mopex draft) 5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows increm= ental feature support) There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be clarif= ied as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go in as part= of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3] WG could provide feedback on the following aspects: 1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated? 2. Do you feel there is some other point which needs to be addressed? [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -10 [2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-obser= vations-04 [3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section= -7 --_000_MN2PR11MB35653CE31A3B5F9A0C1A0A3FD8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello Rahul

 

Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be ad= dressed.

I started this for the issue of mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targ= ets in DAO.

 

Take care,

 

Pascal

 

From: Roll <roll-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav Sent: lundi 14 septembre 202= 0 12:38
To: Routing Over Low power a= nd Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>= ;
Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG = Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items-

 

Will now be the right time to ch= eck consensus with the WG on what behaviour may have to be mandated as part= of RPLv2?

 <= /p>

Following are some of the points= which immediately comes to my mind:

 <= /p>

1. Use of revised Option Type (0= x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI Option Type value).

2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (R= FC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode= )). This is something that was discussed in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently.

3. Use of MOPex (This is how we = know the instance is RPLv2)

4. Support for Ext Control Optio= ns. (Allows Backward compatibility for new extns... part for same mopex dra= ft)

5. Support for Capabilities. (En= ables backward compatibility, allows incremental feature support)

 <= /p>

There are some points from RPL O= bservations draft [2] which could be clarified as part of this work it= em. Not sure if those points could go in as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3]

 <= /p>

WG could provide feedback on the= following aspects:

1. Do you feel one of the points= above need not be mandated?

2. Do you feel there is some oth= er point which needs to be addressed?

 <= /p>

[1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#sect= ion-10

[2] RPL Observations: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-= 04

[3] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#secti= on-7

 

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boundary="_000_MN2PR11MB3565DBB8405F5175C9C359F8D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: cd31d874-8b92-4238-4c12-08d858a868f2 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 14 Sep 2020 12:19:20.9755 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: wjdDBfMqoTIg8aTyvOsABXxk1laIZPoxoY3nAzllUieDNes8BTQOTaYt5wRH/krNuOAMXqxuW+qw8BFHTBPF3w== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3853 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.14, xch-rcd-004.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-8.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] P-DAO refresh X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 12:19:27 -0000 --_000_MN2PR11MB3565DBB8405F5175C9C359F8D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear all I published https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11 t= o address issues that were signaled to me unicast; I took advantage of the refresh to do some editorial rewording, based on re= cent experience with IESG reviews. One issue was the capability to factorize multiple projected routes for one= target. This is doable for non-storing, but hard for storing P DAO since t= he end point is the one answering, so one request would generate multiple d= ao acks. I thought it was easier NOT to factorize storing mode P DAOs. Does= that make sense? Also in the RPO: - the format forced a single compression format for all addresses. It is le= ss error prone to fully inline in the option the sequence of SRH-6LoRH tha= t will be added in the packet, in the exact same shape, don't you think? - The lifetime and the sequence apply to the segment, not the whole track. = A node may not be conscious of the whole track. I fixed that. The diffs are here https://tools.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-da= o-projection-11.txt Please let me know if that works! Keep safe Pascal --_000_MN2PR11MB3565DBB8405F5175C9C359F8D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear all

 

I published https://tools.ietf.org/= html/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11 to address issues that were signaled to me unicast;

 

I took advantage of the refresh to do some editorial rewordi= ng, based on recent experience with IESG reviews.<= /p>

 

One issue was the capability to factorize multiple projected= routes for one target. This is doable for non-storing, but hard for storin= g P DAO since the end point is the one answering, so one request would generate multiple dao acks. I thought it was easier N= OT to factorize storing mode P DAOs. Does that make sense?

 

Also in the RPO:

- the format forced a single compression format for all addr= esses. It is less error prone to fully inline in the option the  seque= nce of SRH-6LoRH that will be added in the packet, in the exact same shape, don’t you think?

- The lifetime and the sequence apply to the segment, not th= e whole track. A node may not be conscious of the whole track. I fixed that= .

 

The diffs are here https://tools.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-11.txt=

 

Please let me know if that works!

 

Keep safe

 

Pascal

--_000_MN2PR11MB3565DBB8405F5175C9C359F8D8230MN2PR11MB3565namp_-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 06:37:57 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DBA53A0CDD for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 06:37:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OgruI0B0_WcZ for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 06:37:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 47A973A0B54 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 06:37:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com with SMTP id e23so9646953vsk.2 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 06:37:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=+Sip0fFy9/qeyMLKEQpLGvHNkwULTdgooEaGgSTVPgk=; b=tCxUyJnTaAxIm67FwAj2d3d/bVrhQAsepzbelWZauT3gG+K0dc6x1EJTKMuYY3yH30 aSxQ9d9ApkactpD+ee/azKemWHoHdvsOCgft4eecC8DFQkLt+4TdIHyYg6VeWnbp9XM+ jVcjQjyUb+QGSD+I2J4BKdami8P85yj+mnbCmJD2igWXiWiIj38Al8wFPwhQ9DZSlm3N Z/Q3KmOpOvyzOW5TOUOYSHZgzAg2h0ds4ZUnmhgk4mHAg9soOxtQ1dp9ZJLp1MtrhWhb hFuEGj9KiIpUNBBNkOQIRMlHAopuluxbfkNu6PIOBHitYCuGaZU44wTB91Q0DXt2esLg TxDA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=+Sip0fFy9/qeyMLKEQpLGvHNkwULTdgooEaGgSTVPgk=; b=Pa4cUu7E7l1m5QWPBfjGMyeb+VfVdF22rQYaDLpQYnkbe8YN75TmfdAAaNxXpDuVml DG0usPbZg+ofg+ATshuagTOHnRZRQW+lfarwPOzc4M4T+qipaqKtivhbbo+WMWV10NTh 3BGLJMNblm1jOTtJr4+LovKjLNOohclJH75yVcTKUXvRoh/A9ShtJ7cg7y1Pixxyso8f GOGX6f1gtRDs0qUCZSs3IfAc8VGMlctX4Ez6Pk0jum85EOtC5uHMPtwUvIr3VaO/J3T6 lB6fYIFFoejkui5bsKCXA62lCp8DOO7nBD9dlNSsAvDXuOLA+HE7/z9kRuc/HnSzWi/8 ixMg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531aBudP+55VzMVk6n2Txh/u6LsLZoeGFu07SJPs108insTdx57C fzlcdy5GpPIPU39mLM4YNS3OGwY/BFlRu1XhwhCBdLRE4BbTAQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxE/99j7ebhMB3kIYhgI91F5rq6DukM182DculVuv9swfuhD90SRcgl+Q2sh3v2uN4Uq4x6rwpoeSG3LlXCsZ8= X-Received: by 2002:a67:6b87:: with SMTP id g129mr6861172vsc.53.1600090656298; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 06:37:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 16:37:00 +0300 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002d5b8505af462318" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Which functions in RPLv2? X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 13:37:56 -0000 --0000000000002d5b8505af462318 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Suggested topics are collected here: https://github.com/roll-wg/RPL_v2_topics Thank you, Ines On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 2:30 PM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Rahul > > > > I renamed the thread. > > > > In your first list 1..5 I=E2=80=99d say they are all mandatory and the fi= rst 2 > always on. > > > > There=E2=80=99s also: > > 6) P-DAO for SDN-RPL and > > 7) AODV-RPL. > > I=E2=80=99d make those 2 optional > > > > And yes I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed. > > Each deserves a thread I believe. Let me start a few based on your email > as well=E2=80=A6 > > > > Take care, > > > > Pascal > > > > *From:* Roll *On Behalf Of *Rahul Jadhav > *Sent:* lundi 14 septembre 2020 12:38 > *To:* Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > *Subject:* Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for > Agenda Items- > > > > Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what > behaviour may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? > > > > Following are some of the points which immediately comes to my mind: > > > > 1. Use of revised Option Type (0x23) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI > Option Type value). > > 2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH > (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode)). This is something that was discuss= ed > in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently. > > 3. Use of MOPex (This is how we know the instance is RPLv2) > > 4. Support for Ext Control Options. (Allows Backward compatibility for ne= w > extns... part for same mopex draft) > > 5. Support for Capabilities. (Enables backward compatibility, allows > incremental feature support) > > > > There are some points from RPL Observations draft [2] which could be > clarified as part of this work item. Not sure if those points could go in > as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 > [1] ... 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3= ] > > > > WG could provide feedback on the following aspects: > > 1. Do you feel one of the points above need not be mandated? > > 2. Do you feel there is some other point which needs to be addressed? > > > > [1] > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section-1= 0 > > [2] RPL Observations: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04 > > [3] > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-observations-04#section-7 > > > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Roll on behalf of Michael Richardson < > mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> > *Sent:* 14 September 2020 02:09 PM > *To:* Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > *Subject:* Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for > Agenda Items- > > > > > Georgios PAPADOPOULOS wrote: > > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possible to have at t= he > > end of the day everything in one single document? > > Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the documents, > throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to > Internet Standard. > > > In stead of going over multiple documents, and multiple RFCs > tomorrow, > > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single RFC for the RPL= v2 > > like the RFC 6550 for RPL. > > > What do you think? > > It's just too soon. > We actually need to sort out the things we want to do. > Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point. > > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consul= ting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --0000000000002d5b8505af462318 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

Suggested topics are collected here= :=C2=A0https://github.= com/roll-wg/RPL_v2_topics

Thank you,

Ines

On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 2:30 PM Pascal Thubert (p= thubert) <pthubert=3D40cis= co.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

Hello Rahul

=C2=A0

I renamed the thread.

=C2=A0

In your first list 1..5 I=E2=80=99d say they are all mandatory= and the first 2 always on.

=C2=A0

There=E2=80=99s also:

6) P-DAO for SDN-RPL and

7) AODV-RPL.

I=E2=80=99d make those 2 optional<= /p>

=C2=A0

And yes I believe that the points in observations need to be a= ddressed.

Each deserves a thread I believe. Let me start a few based on = your email as well=E2=80=A6

=C2=A0

Take care,

=C2=A0

Pascal

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Will now be the right time to chec= k consensus with the WG on what behaviour may have to be mandated as part o= f RPLv2?

=C2=A0=

Following are some of the points w= hich immediately comes to my mind:

=C2=A0=

1. Use of revised Option Type (0x2= 3) in RPI ... (Obsolete use of 0x63 RPI Option Type value).

2. Mandating the use of 6LoRH (RFC= 8138) ... (Allows compression of SRH (non-storing) and RPI (storing mode))= . This is something that was discussed in context to turnon-8138 T-bit draft recently.

3. Use of MOPex (This is how we kn= ow the instance is RPLv2)

4. Support for Ext Control Options= . (Allows Backward compatibility for new extns... part for same mopex draft= )

5. Support for Capabilities. (Enab= les backward compatibility, allows incremental feature support)

=C2=A0=

There are some points from RPL Obs= ervations draft [2] which could be clarified=C2=A0as part of this work item= . Not sure if those points could go in as part of this draft? For e.g., Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 [1] ... = 2) Mandating handling (not sending) of multiple targets in DAO [3]

=C2=A0=

WG could provide feedback on the f= ollowing aspects:

1. Do you feel one of the points a= bove need not be mandated?

2. Do you feel there is some other= point which needs to be addressed?

=C2=A0=

=C2=A0=

From: Roll <roll-bounces@ietf.org<= /a>> on behalf of Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
Sent: 14 September 2020 02:0= 9 PM
To: Routing Over Low power a= nd Lossy networks <ro= ll@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG = Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items-

=C2=A0


Georgios PAPADOPOULOS <gpapadopoulos.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > Regarding the RPLv2, do you think it would be possi= ble to have at the
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > end of the day everything in one single document?
Yes, eventually, we'd do rfc6550bis, and we'd merge in all the docu= ments,
throw out the pieces that we didn't implement, and maybe advance to Int= ernet Standard.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > In stead of going over multiple documents, and mult= iple RFCs tomorrow,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > imho, it would be more efficient to have one single= RFC for the RPLv2
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > like the RFC 6550 for RPL.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 > What do you think?

It's just too soon.
We actually need to sort out the things we want to do.
Editing the huge rfc6550 won't be productive at this point.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>=C2=A0=C2=A0 . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T cons= ulting )
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Sandelman Soft= ware Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide


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--0000000000002d5b8505af462318-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 07:58:58 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C443A3A0B0E for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 07:58:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id J0fuh_dWY1_p for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 07:58:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AF1243A0B0C for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 07:58:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5AB63899E for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:37:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id b9Ggc3Vasggn for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:37:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:103c:9eff:fecb:2eac]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id E47A93899A for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7F1E11A3 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:58:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Which functions in RPLv2? X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 14:58:57 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rahul> Will now be the right time to check consensus with the WG on what Rahul> behaviour may have to be mandated as part of RPLv2? I don't believe that it's yet time to do that. I think that the path is to design and deploy capabilities. To my mind, RPLv2 is not a set of knobs that are mandated to be on, but rather the ability to determine what is available and turn them on. Sure, we may well write a document that says all of your three points are mandatory to implement, and turned on by default. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9fhSsACgkQgItw+93Q 3WVogAf6AmrCFcmEep5ROD85QFoLJ88YSHAD+teyxdbc5R7W15mnBOzEYCU3bPyp Qn/u0PT+lfR+s/rgdWmKB5PaMTIQWMYKOc5NkLtJxDqy/kJmQyQuSnKkg4Zdhyre xJ9VflNgrJcoxMDdN6ad/8lNjvwDf29AtRT8Xy23RlMWuUnDS7eFICFakNfQQ3sL sytk4sTaxcvfgCplTiNZrY2Cggo8edn9GPzcX/OKJkpR1d/nH9K0miDsTlXiZUUD 94+ShHuTwMq9XUeBCvTwtgSTX01gtX76paUZUxcH6uG4a9rdcRwf7KySUkN94SWh k/fO03pXxYC+JQE4ORK5fyx4zTBl3g== =8PTn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 08:00:15 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC3343A09DF for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:00:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kmNGFKjOTDrA for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:00:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 593763A0A6E for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 07:59:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AF02389A0 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:38:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id ZjLzpMko-WQA for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:38:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.21]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 677B13899E for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:38:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7157711A3 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 10:59:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 15:00:08 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\) wrote: > Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed. > I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550. can you explain what you mean bby Path Control Bits? Is "T" one of those bits? =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9fhWEACgkQgItw+93Q 3WW5Dwf8DL8G0zpkgVwQbtnbaitXd7S20w0/EVMCAdlRQ2nZWslJ95toEwAzciSW 7pR5kpHUSmp9qwb1yrl2tt7J5p6x8LfK9AGTjn/VJ0WLtrYwBHp2eIboita3ezD7 2NfgXa+hXxOTMMHrli+yfx5iTgWNNLmjESgrnEfaUQ9+lqGEGYEUFQUFEeWNKD0J UoyJ3voKVWe+D36X7ItSRF3WXDka2cCf7F8qYMIKbtCI1s3UdkWA9PwxjS90YrPj LDiOABCxP0aaLJ9FvWexn9SLvEw5cPUgNtko7GHXYYtM+AjWMwVFAoHNx63JdAR9 F51nWux2b+olfeptDL5ndaruFss+3w== =jm7t -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Sep 14 08:59:11 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4CC23A0C2E for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:59:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IRpvdvWqbHqJ for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:59:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x535.google.com (mail-ed1-x535.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::535]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1D8F43A0C26 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:59:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x535.google.com with SMTP id k14so118329edo.1 for ; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:59:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WsjG4iH35kzAT+9O0v6ItFk0v0Cn2Rc5LjTAMUS31LY=; b=c0fuHXHbLMy3H3/jaYhUpfgoYVUpiTtJ8bD/XNnF3S4hyw5yvYmTNVT4YN0a7aEzFi O/p/rDQlpDoKSD4Bj53QznncTirov9H4ZGwXMZf6N5EkkE99yYHtd5X96BZi2n+vPnd0 MkWyhjiIDHCKeK1j/Mh9Gmho8Zh5/03zYmLFqdEWOKUEhqz+9gPoTIkxWfJHOPgEJZe9 WNJ5pnFPmbcRtDh7CBezFag7VkswKXAvJIIh4xrCpDKPlrXKonExey4Csxe2wdYpiAwt 6xd1elkpXDGB/WUBoH7U3lcqYjD2w8Jtz/wmEOnX5fsC0s2X/BdCyb2GlFJEZU3TtsiI JBgw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=WsjG4iH35kzAT+9O0v6ItFk0v0Cn2Rc5LjTAMUS31LY=; b=PuwwlpCdo6KB+vky4SfzyqVO7ZHzl5DeBcChrwxm5aKFE2ZDw0sZn2xaYUdGk7ntXS pwkA9GWEZ1XA7J03poeO6Rk0jKlpL2p1y9XZH9wsh1MB4SLuzqdd0LYcnQ88vky9xlcr fdLm7bVbbSqLLfcBxuXg4MCzATc2PHy1AZglTmVOluQ8lyV+QFTXTvwkv9sc9GVrDTSn ioEpGe1tyfRxpSxyQFwT1WxjyTOK70hhPKTptfv0Bj3ac510xSvpQJYu//J8TupGSW6n ezMR88fhLBgnCWSDY/BMeQ4yWHkFtCOX/x9INjBfUxJDFabhEvkP4w/JIbrazgHqaDzF w+2g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531JBPbeoNZ8WhxJg/l7Wj03dXoDySPKZBJSOrtFciocydcY+9Zl uXmQu1ZhuzXCq0T2Xf+tutuHiicZ+tTr8PaCoQ4ZCXz2H/z7tw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxZ9FeP7PKhKn25AImduZfwJJ/2rnPzQv+td4Lm2e9miOSMC7YWGsOXKfoods+vFXoD6rPac1yIfzJHqimTmxs= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:1819:: with SMTP id g25mr17374181edy.292.1600099146326; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 08:59:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <30698.1600095585@localhost> In-Reply-To: <30698.1600095585@localhost> From: Rahul Jadhav Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 21:28:55 +0530 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000038e46805af481d7f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 15:59:10 -0000 --00000000000038e46805af481d7f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be addressed= . > > I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550. > > can you explain what you mean bby Path Control Bits? > Is "T" one of those bits? > https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6550#section-9.9 explains Path Control. The DIO(Config Option) in the control plane carries PCS bits... Also the DAO(TIO) carries Path control related information. The strange part is very few really understand Path Control ... No open source implements it. But it occupies a good amount of real estate in 6550. > > -- > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consul= ting ) > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --00000000000038e46805af481d7f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > Yes, I believe that th= e points in observations need to be addressed.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 > I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue = in 6550.

can you explain what you mean bby Path Control Bits?
Is "T" one of those bits?

The = DIO(Config Option) in the control plane carries PCS bits... Also the DAO(TI= O) carries Path control related information.

The s= trange part is very=C2=A0few really understand=C2=A0Path Control ... No ope= n source implements it. But it occupies a good amount of real estate in 655= 0.

=C2=A0

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>=C2=A0 =C2=A0. o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T co= nsulting )
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Sandelman Software Works Inc, Otta= wa and Worldwide




_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
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15.20.3370.019; Mon, 14 Sep 2020 16:30:21 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: [Roll] Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 Thread-Index: AdaKinpj9SM0V5J0TieCuJ89j6MK0AAHTReAAAIQ/oAAAN944A== Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 16:30:02 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Mon, 14 Sep 2020 16:29:54 +0000 Message-ID: References: <30698.1600095585@localhost> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [173.38.220.54] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3be7d354-e624-4bb5-5cbe-08d858cb7979 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3567: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:6790; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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with ESMTP id 42F2911A3 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 03:12:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: <30698.1600095585@localhost> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2020 07:12:38 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rahul Jadhav wrote: >> > Yes, I believe that the points in observations need to be addresse= d. >> > I started this for the Path Control Bits handling issue in 6550. >> >> can you explain what you mean bby Path Control Bits? >> Is "T" one of those bits? >> > https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6550#section-9.9 explains Path Control. > The DIO(Config Option) in the control plane carries PCS bits... Also = the > DAO(TIO) carries Path control related information. Oh, yes. I remember that I never thought very much about that part. > The strange part is very few really understand Path Control ... No op= en > source implements it. But it occupies a good amount of real estate in= 6550. I'll need to re-read it again and think about it. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9gaV4ACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUvTgf/R1Q4R0nrmabLPBo1FbFGLZZF+U2qQz6nr0fan7EAS8v+O6xZdFaDAkOg 5i7P12BJc03n9y5c51Y8jhWI72E7Bs6pj3IuXVveSDzu8HpglnLHytVLLqN0y2Td f9Mw/ccu+N/csxbHLcb6uwbH0x3wVskP3thTHIhEIf1j1CsGCMNC7FzXVjIh+ldO kjpZwhrejinn044daENI25L73i0pgyD5Os6/0Va3O85ny+Dtz8VavnsB1ecQ5Tha es//ZyK5FqJDuGCfTn7chRlASqQFW7tMauLrb79G4ygO2ygsCBesJ38kiQxWTAow 4Ydx8bZPKQ1Mzp9/I+eZPSb2IcdvcQ== =Y1Vk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Tue Sep 15 22:46:19 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E26523A0CB7 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 22:46:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id N2226jaR1GdD for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 22:46:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-x933.google.com (mail-ua1-x933.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::933]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF4FF3A0CA9 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 22:46:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-x933.google.com with SMTP id u14so1833960uaq.1 for ; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 22:46:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=tl/0AGiYn/Xx1HtiULAn4gDo3VWVsItSznkGEKrpgoU=; b=coewDvXnqAkTax7dF6P1S+jPbOJLnMFHkbyexmwz4+k5smwzaNo6qlKeB/E7Tp3y41 fcGlrlQRVG/vCKwW2UggDNFNo4HUvwW3Cb9sluG0wN6STXVt8xTr6L08D+rfJqOmLF80 ve5dkY/tpxBsAalD5rz/w6LBZTIQ1Xu8nc+E46F9UhTLIkRNj4WQiImMyTdy2IxMmMZi 7TG+13+CG5WIlB8eg9EYrJWKAfBRqm9q0BV4fdQnfJNdsVy2MIQTefGIxFXIrS6/jOBc +LXPXpdYoib1NaBoPYStUCbKJoMMtStRs+VocnDjypvoiQgPatYI4C9MzUSSYeNEFGVx DRuQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=tl/0AGiYn/Xx1HtiULAn4gDo3VWVsItSznkGEKrpgoU=; b=n5xHUuySz7RUDpvjrDPEFw+EBEBzFHPB/bwXN0ac5V9Z3LQCxCwC2CK3Vjnshi6Ob3 EhVAlhJanxlbTlaDaXKHUvaf74qjduxgYi/lRXWSU2GM5tKPPuV7AR4c/1zc8GhDoQh9 9ONtnvUyYVXE/IE242NF3MEiyfyEOvJJHVsQrZ+U/PRsQ4tz8RYKoWGs4AHtdru3i2Mg zl88UCotDnKQnJA9WOXtxgZG1KjWqTwYHKpt+BMUQVKUElPI9tD9RFfmpQyDcVyZjs40 YdIZ+9E7PFBEmkiPKRSmFsCRFMrxdjsVlL467oR31Gf47vsgNKOVB9x0DyhC98Q/g61u hVVw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531j/9zGJkgRnNhJxR3lCT82uw/EEm6DTGvTCEvGNe51ByuJkLHB PcQU5gv/RPd16OvlL8XrC+u0Zj52xUSpXj4pSNY3wAwOW3e1yQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwl2jSl4YHEY0f31eftK8ftxlVXVyRjs4HiLp268V/2fEgbwuyWbmvLzdbU5jEJdtBA5JMSY8ahuUus0JuHa9c= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:22c9:: with SMTP id z9mr11785623uam.17.1600235175603; Tue, 15 Sep 2020 22:46:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 08:45:39 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000032f04b05af67c914" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 05:46:19 -0000 --00000000000032f04b05af67c914 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, So far we have in the agenda: - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) - RPLv2 Topics Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18t Sept. Thank you, Ines and Dominique. On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim > meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. > > Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic > during the next roll interim meeting indicating: > > - Topic to Present. > - Presenter > - Time needed. > > Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kMr6RM_ao4]: > > Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control > option (12:00min-14:00min) > Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of > capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying for > available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) > DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:15 > hs - 1:17hs ) > Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? > > Material: > Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll > icalendar (UTC): > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.ics > jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join > Webex: > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 > Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > > Please note that we aim to record the meeting. > > Material of the previous interim meetings: > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting > > Thank you very much, > > Ines and Dominique > > ---------- Forwarded message --------- > From: IESG Secretary > Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM > Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG > Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 > To: IETF-Announce > Cc: > > > The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold > a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. > > Agenda: > To Be Determined > > Information about remote participation: > ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, 2020 > 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) > Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 > Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial > 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 > Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 > > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --00000000000032f04b05af67c914 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

So far we have in the age= nda:

- WG Status: wg documents and related-ID stat= us=C2=A0
- ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.com/r= /5KDZ8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some addit= ional topics=C2=A0 would you like to discuss? Please send us your request b= y 18t Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

<= div>Ines and Dominique.

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles= <mariainesrobles@goog= lemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

Thank yo= u very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim meeting on= 30th September with a duration of two hours.

=
Please let us know by 18th September if you want to present a t= opic during the next roll interim meeting indicating:

<= div>- Topic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time needed.=C2= =A0

Some discussions points from last interim meet= ing [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]:

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extend= ed control option (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Signaling, bi= ts to say which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min),=C2= =A0 roll querying all nodes, querying for available memory on nodes (23:00 min=20 -31:00 min=20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:= =C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID= =3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 1= 02 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we = aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materia= l of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL= -Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,
<= /div>

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded messag= e ---------
From: IESG S= ecretary <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Date: = Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and = Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce &= lt;ietf-announc= e@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power an= d Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
--00000000000032f04b05af67c914-- From nobody Wed Sep 16 03:46:18 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA52D3A0FB7 for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.096 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pMI-lb-1-XpY for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ej1-x630.google.com (mail-ej1-x630.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::630]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8BF923A0DF2 for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x630.google.com with SMTP id gr14so9700656ejb.1 for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=turhM22eB6P6ZNXSdd5kD90C5GV49eRWw+li3ggOUJA=; b=faicjsJs4Uf1Ms2yKqi8tWJaI3KGLgJLLiVERcODrFZDN5whGxLDzqVnDFWCnuduDS dJ4Vrac65SEXYzPdSfBS2yrHOqxc/bymsZA57ZVVsZUgewWuGCrFGEEiJtnfSoz3TWlI j+eMdP9Y39ocK27mTQzNhSXvMce+so/5Otqlcx7dqvWkMaMAegVdTUi514uk8qWUFSdb eI8Ann3pVwp+TKNzcYIilk6potsT7cbWZ+VqE83/t9xwFdrFe96PFImSC3ez0zJ1CbyU ru3imIc0bcS5qzUkErVk8srcS4WtrJNMA3yWho0ZNkW5Er6GnUqdKFC/G72Sj2F9Kewv 6Eew== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=turhM22eB6P6ZNXSdd5kD90C5GV49eRWw+li3ggOUJA=; b=WVAmywlYYavbhhSqjVkkwioAhYt+SRFsuY9XL1TXMRlw2/31mL+LGUPpsMCYgqBcox V+s72KF/5B54kVwcVpZ9OzN0iB7mDT0jmGmSzKdFfjOlJvVo2YHW0EX5K8ZedWcUFb5M 4FPdFoWO1RXzlLaNfTOmnkIlFm3bpuNBBUod0B+QKw59bkeB/281OV7d5U28wj/3WoFc U0LXrW8fXdbjr9BHZvaKBdxXfwGGZxc0Ec3SCrSXc2q1n7rboHLWuPKhVELhzZ/zIvwC VtzuvLDj8qYcHXpcTVyxn/eINZGyR1tMdeTgpO3wIJGviBxSDbAIdM2CoaqJfa5+wZ89 C4CQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532jyjCN0D5ZBq8xw5h21q+Xwkb/SWr2M/m/VCJr0pLAqLrhKw3r uc4OjyTw1qAbPScft2pws6U6A9nb9uIAGSrEetHBCRRK X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzpsK3k44/+sRkPYcZMNcwfgSqowZtybUH2tpkqkQ4Br8Npd8L1flV3jPaXMmIG6n5o5xyNyr7d83UkWVcyWRo= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:8c1:: with SMTP id o1mr25498136eje.478.1600253173358; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:12 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 03:46:12 -0700 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f2e52d05af6bf966" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 - Call for Agenda Items- X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 10:46:18 -0000 --000000000000f2e52d05af6bf966 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In=C3=A9s: Hola! C=C3=B3mo vas? Esta reuni=C3=B3n es a las 1045 GMT, cierto? Pregunto porque en el calenda= rio aparece a las 1045 ET (US East), que es 4 horas despu=C3=A9s. https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/upcoming.ics Ser=C3=ADa bueno que lo revis=C3=A9s y le dig=C3=A1s al Secetariat si es ne= cesario corregir. Saludos! Alvaro. On September 16, 2020 at 1:46:25 AM, Ines Robles ( mariainesrobles=3D40googlemail.com@dmarc.ietf.org) wrote: Dear all, So far we have in the agenda: - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) - RPLv2 Topics Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18t Sept. Thank you, Ines and Dominique. On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim > meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. > > Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic > during the next roll interim meeting indicating: > > - Topic to Present. > - Presenter > - Time needed. > > Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]: > > Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control > option (12:00min-14:00min) > Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of > capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying fo= r > available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) > DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:15 > hs - 1:17hs ) > Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? > > Material: > Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll > icalendar (UTC): > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.i= cs > jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join > Webex: > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f1= 2 > Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > > Please note that we aim to record the meeting. > > Material of the previous interim meetings: > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting > > Thank you very much, > > Ines and Dominique > > ---------- Forwarded message --------- > From: IESG Secretary > Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM > Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG > Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 > To: IETF-Announce > Cc: > > > The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold > a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. > > Agenda: > To Be Determined > > Information about remote participation: > ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, 202= 0 > 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) > Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f1= 2 > Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial > 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 > Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 > > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > _______________________________________________ Roll mailing list Roll@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll --000000000000f2e52d05af6bf966 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In=C3=A9s:

Hola!=C2=A0 C=C3=B3mo vas?

Esta reuni=C3=B3n es a= las 1045 GMT, cierto?=C2=A0 Pregunto porque en el calendario aparece a las= 1045 ET (US East), que es 4 horas despu=C3=A9s.

https://datatracker.ietf.org/mee= ting/upcoming.ics=C2=A0

Ser=C3=ADa bueno que lo revis=C3=A9s y l= e dig=C3=A1s al Secetariat si es necesario corregir.

Saludos!
Alvaro.

On September 16, 2020 at 1:46:25 AM, I= nes Robles (mariainesrobles=3D40googlemail.com@dmarc.ietf.org) wrote:

Dear all,

So far we have in the agenda:

- WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status=C2= =A0
- ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ= 8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some additional= topics=C2=A0 would you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18t= Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

I= nes and Dominique.

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles <<= a href=3D"mailto:mariainesrobles@googlemail.com">mariainesrobles@googlemail= .com> wrote:
Dear all,

Thank you very = much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim meeting on 30th S= eptember with a duration of two hours.

Pl= ease let us know by 18th September if you want to present a topic du= ring the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- T= opic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time needed.=C2=A0
=

Some discussions points from last interim meeting [h= ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]:

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended contro= l option (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say= which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min),=C2=A0 roll q= uerying all nodes, querying for available memory on nodes (23:00 min =20 -31:00 min =20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:= =C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID= =3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 1= 02 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we = aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materia= l of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL= -Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,
<= /div>

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded messag= e ---------
From: IESG S= ecretary <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Date: = Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and = Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce &= lt;ietf-announc= e@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power an= d Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
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--000000000000f2e52d05af6bf966-- From nobody Wed Sep 16 07:58:26 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D20A3A0957; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nCXDXkCeLcPR; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ej1-x62a.google.com (mail-ej1-x62a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3BFE43A093D; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x62a.google.com with SMTP id o8so10765882ejb.10; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc :content-transfer-encoding; bh=nlQe4W15aDxBr4UOOsDrK4ZNjLxZnTaRLmxcmyfwd5M=; b=oIofQOxokz9r4IRqDnKEY/LKF5/N4JCt2mS5HHdThlFIjXqEdnqIhcllGg8jT+fOad 4SoE2AGjF2CPvaJkygWk/YA0OWBllnGu5mpyPhdX6AbCQMuqnSeLC9E1I2ZCDygDGdVY sZYX0wRMBhv2eGdCf3VPDrJg4yoMCS/m9iGkAW29H2KxxhaEZ9rG2zW4pn71LCIF+8sW 9IcNqLYNxmOFMwYG//ZQn2hGkdb91Qr7O3VbURbP92nkVvegdmP9CsULaV+Ms41ZZlBN x5vo4iXV2UAa4Rqf7bXrYGpuETOBrfVC64/qYhlFwHEHjdYiOuOSS0ExY05OaYeTZVcE JRHQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc :content-transfer-encoding; bh=nlQe4W15aDxBr4UOOsDrK4ZNjLxZnTaRLmxcmyfwd5M=; b=nA5I4wR9oBrwHbx8NrrRpcLZqh4uuU1h/eq9ppC8ZnA8u2tNZDbn1VAG7WMvwWDL4h dhjU6d+Dlzbau+5weP9A4fMLv6CE2Hfbp4OBipim13RontHi1LJH0lrhzQ89uQXOKcy0 AdM2x8SXFnnJYxMckIBWd1lF6u9R6Vpml8hewFijsQJMSMMaDFG1ZflLqXyTcLWPK+7A Cy75lkHysZxfMGe2X4J2a6usLKnd/k6sKI9IMC0vSkc1ggDWFHIP/APnJwdrTU3L4l0g KclVH1DFlctdTPFgRVxDiFnolA81c9Pp5kQQzut/SM3O2MlEUoL0J7n8v9+47vvnBMjK 8a9w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531oe0rFDl1nCxBhLeXtOnTinPDilYw+Cgh1JQm3qwhHb2RG1gPs P4hbaRwGRaimGEtTgXy6booDRzmQjxQdT5MqyCQ/FWey X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxfv+s2yqakp3ZakstKZXwLeEi3jcG7DymANMF4vuI9WtBoTSwghj/HCxSU1fQsi2vUJRkvIoqFcCDnIguXRh8= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:8c1:: with SMTP id o1mr26653743eje.478.1600268293578; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:12 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:58:12 -0700 Message-ID: To: draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves@ietf.org Cc: Rahul Jadhav , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-18 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 14:58:25 -0000 Dear Pascal/Michael: Thank you for working on this document! I just finished reviewing it and find myself with a lot more comments, questions, and concerns that I thought I would. =C2=A0I'm highlighting some of my major issues here, and have detailed comments in-line. (1) What is a RUL? =C2=A0I assumed that a RUL would be a "plain" IPv6 node that is not aware o= f RPL =C2=A0at all. =C2=A0That definition would include, of course, not being awa= re of this =C2=A0document...but =C2=A77 normatively defines requirements and expected = behaviors =C2=A0for the RUL. =C2=A0It feels like the chicken and the egg: the RUL is = not =C2=A0aware...but it is expected to comply with this specification....but i= t's not =C2=A0aware... =C2=A0The definition of a RUL starts in the Introduction with a simple =C2=A0description: "RUL is an IPv6 Host [RFC8504]". =C2=A0I know that rfc85= 04 includes =C2=A0a section on "Constrained Devices", but it just mentions that "compro= mises =C2=A0may need to be made". =C2=A0This document, in the very next paragraph= (!), adds =C2=A0other expectations (beyond rfc8504): support for 6LoWPAN ND... =C2=A0I can see in the email archive that going beyond rfc8504 is the inten= t, but =C2=A0that is not clearly reflected in the document. =C2=A0I would like to = see, at =C2=A0least, an early discussion (don't wait until =C2=A77!) of the expecta= tions for a =C2=A0RUL. =C2=A0Move =C2=A77 *before* you start discussing 6LoWPAN ND. =C2=A0I believe that describing the expectations may not preclude from assu= ming =C2=A0that the RUL is, in fact, unaware (of this document and RPL). =C2=A0F= or example, =C2=A0instead of saying "a RUL MUST implement [RFC8505]", the text could sa= y =C2=A0something like this: =C2=A0 =C2=A0This document is based on the assumption that a RUL supports r= fc8505... =C2=A0 =C2=A0If the RUL doesn't support rfc8505, then the following behavio= r is not =C2=A0 =C2=A0possible...or the node won't be able to join the LLN at all...= or... =C2=A0IOW, instead of specifying how the unaware node should behave, descri= be what =C2=A0is expected and the resulting effect if those expectations are not me= t. =C2=A0Honestly, given some of the specifics in =C2=A77.1, for example "MUST= ...set the =C2=A0"R" and "T" flags in the EARO", I'm not sure it is possible to descri= be a =C2=A0general RUL without it having to comply with this document...but mayb= e worth =C2=A0a try. =C2=A0I don't think this specification can support an rfc8504 node trying t= o join =C2=A0the LLN, right? =C2=A0What about cases where RPL is not used in a 6Lo= WPAN? =C2=A0[Aside: I ran into the "Advocating a generalisation of RFC8505 to non= -6lo =C2=A0LANs" thread [1]. =C2=A0Did anything come out of that? =C2=A0Is there= a draft we can =C2=A0Informatively reference?] [1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/6lo/mKWgLd5013cTBIOlgPg1op614z0/ (2) RUL vs. 6LN: does the RUL act as a 6LN, or does the 6LN act like a RUL? =C2=A0The text talks about a "6LN that is also a RUL", "a RUL acting as 6LN= ", a =C2=A0"6LN acting as a RUL"...and =C2=A710 specifies the behavior of the "6= LN/RUL", =C2=A0which seems to imply that they are the same, or at least have the sam= e =C2=A0functionality...or that one is acting as the other... =C2=A0If I understand correctly, the main difference between a RUL and a 6L= N (as =C2=A0defined in USEofRPLinfo) is that a 6LN connects to the RPL network th= rough a =C2=A0LoWPAN, but the RUL may not. =C2=A0But, as pointed out above, it seem= s that this =C2=A0document (=C2=A77) expects the RUL to be a 6LN (support rfc6775/rfc85= 05...). =C2=A0In most cases, the two terms seem to be used interchangeably, but in = others, =C2=A0a clear distinction is made -- for example in this text from =C2=A77.= 2.1: =C2=A0 =C2=A0To terminate the IP-in-IP tunnel, the 6LN, as an IPv6 Host, mu= st be able to =C2=A0 =C2=A0decapsulate the tunneled packet and either drop the inner pack= et if it is =C2=A0 =C2=A0not the final destination, or pass it to the upper layer for f= urther =C2=A0 =C2=A0processing. =C2=A0Unless it is aware by other means that the R= UL can handle =C2=A0 =C2=A0IP-in-IP properly, which is not mandated by [RFC8504], the Roo= t terminates =C2=A0 =C2=A0the IP-in-IP tunnel at the parent 6LR. =C2=A0It is thus not ne= cessary for a RUL =C2=A0 =C2=A0to support IP-in-IP decapsulation. =C2=A0As part of clarifying the expectations for the RUL (from above), plea= se also =C2=A0clearly distinguish between the definition of RUL and 6LN...or tell t= he =C2=A0reader how they are (?) considered the same in this document. =C2=A0C= onsistency =C2=A0and clarity throughout the document is important. (3) Formal Updates =C2=A0Please take a close look at my comments in =C2=A74, 5 and 6 about for= mally =C2=A0Updating other documents. =C2=A0In short, I don't believe that a form= al Update is =C2=A0necessary for all the changes mentioned in those sections. =C2=A0Having said that, I did mention a couple of places where I think rfc6= 775 =C2=A0should (also) be Updated...and others for rfc6550 and rfc8505 that we= re not =C2=A0listed. I expect the resolution of the major issues before moving the document forw= ard. Thanks! Alvaro. P.S.: I noticed too late the GitHub location...I could have at least included some of the nits as a PR there. =C2=A0Maybe it would be a good idea to indicate in the draft and the datatracker when GitHub is being used. :-) [Line numbers from idnits.] ... 12 Abstract 14 =C2=A0 This specification extends RFC6550 and RFC8505 to provide routin= g 15 =C2=A0 services to Hosts called RPL Unaware Leaves that implement 6LoWP= AN ND 16 =C2=A0 but do not participate to RPL. =C2=A0This specification also ena= bles the 17 =C2=A0 RPL Root to proxy the 6LoWPAN keep-alive flows in its DODAG. [nit] s/participate to/participate in/g [major] A mention of Updating draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao is missing in the Abstract. =C2=A0See also the comments in =C2=A75. ... 98 1. =C2=A0Introduction [nit] It would be nice to offer a roadmap ("Section x talks about y, ...") in the Introduction...perhaps at the end of the section. ... 113 =C2=A0 To save signaling and routing state in constrained networks, RP= L 114 =C2=A0 allows a routing stretch (see [RFC6687]), whereby routing is on= ly 115 =C2=A0 performed along an acyclic graph optimized to reach a Root node= , as 116 =C2=A0 opposed to straight along a shortest path between 2 peers, what= ever 117 =C2=A0 that would mean in a given LLN. =C2=A0This trades the quality o= f peer-to- 118 =C2=A0 peer (P2P) paths for a vastly reduced amount of control traffic= and 119 =C2=A0 routing state that would be required to operate a any-to-any sh= ortest 120 =C2=A0 path protocol. =C2=A0Finally, broken routes may be fixed lazily= and on- 121 =C2=A0 demand, based on dataplane inconsistency discovery, which avoid= s 122 =C2=A0 wasting energy in the proactive repair of unused paths. [minor] "routing stretch (see [RFC6687])" =C2=A0The term "routing stretch" is not in rfc6687...but there are other terms that might be what you meant. [nit] s/as opposed to straight along a shortest path between 2 peers, whatever that would mean in a given LLN./as opposed to along the shortest path between 2 peers. [nit] s/a any-to-any /an any-to-any [] "lazily" =C2=A0Maybe I'm not getting the proper meaning, but it doesn't sound good... ... 145 =C2=A0 RPL can be deployed as an extension to IPv6 Neighbor Discovery = (ND) 146 =C2=A0 [RFC4861][RFC4862] and 6LoWPAN ND [RFC6775][RFC8505] to maintai= n 147 =C2=A0 reachability within a Non-Broadcast Multi-Access (NBMA) subnet.= =C2=A0In 148 =C2=A0 that mode, some nodes may act as Routers and participate to the 149 =C2=A0 forwarding operations whereas others will only terminate packet= s, 150 =C2=A0 acting as Hosts in the data-plane. =C2=A0In [RFC6550] terms, a = Host that 151 =C2=A0 is reachable over the RPL network is called a Leaf. [nit] s/][/] [/g [minor] Do we really need rfc4862 as a reference for IPv6 ND? [nit] s/operations whereas/operations, whereas 153 =C2=A0 "When to use RFC 6553, 6554 and IPv6-in-IPv6" [USEofRPLinfo] 154 =C2=A0 introduces the term RPL-Aware-Leaf (RAL) for a Leaf that inject= s 155 =C2=A0 routes in RPL to manage the reachability of its own IPv6 addres= ses. 156 =C2=A0 In contrast, the term RPL-Unaware Leaf (RUL) designates a Leaf = that 157 =C2=A0 does not participate to RPL at all. =C2=A0A RUL is an IPv6 Host= [RFC8504] 158 =C2=A0 that needs a RPL-Aware Router to obtain routing services over t= he RPL 159 =C2=A0 network. [minor] s/"When to use RFC 6553, 6554 and IPv6-in-IPv6" [USEofRPLinfo]/"Using RPI Option Type, Routing Header for Source Routes and IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation in the RPL Data Plane" [USEofRPLinfo] ...or perhaps simply [USEofRPLinfo], since there will be an RFC number by the time we publish. 161 =C2=A0 This specification leverages the Address Registration mechanism 162 =C2=A0 defined in 6LoWPAN ND to enable a RUL as a 6LoWPAN Node (6LN) t= o 163 =C2=A0 interface with a RPL-Aware Router as a 6LoWPAN Router (6LR) and 164 =C2=A0 request that the 6LR injects a Host route for the Registered Ad= dress 165 =C2=A0 in the RPL routing on its behalf. =C2=A0A RUL may be unable to = participate 166 =C2=A0 because it is very energy-constrained, or because it is unsafe = to let 167 =C2=A0 it inject routes in RPL, in which case using 6LowPAN ND as the 168 =C2=A0 interface for the RUL limits the surface of the possible attack= s and 169 =C2=A0 optionally protects the address ownership. [major] "unsafe to let it inject routes in RPL" =C2=A0 This is a good topic to talk about more in the Security Considerations section. [major] Even if 6LoWPAN ND is used, a rogue router can still inject instability, or too much control information in the LLN by adding/removing addresses constantly, for example. =C2=A0Maybe a risk to be flagged in the Security Considerations. ... 186 2.1. =C2=A0BCP 14 [] s/BCP 14/Requirements Language ... 194 2.2. =C2=A0References ... 202 =C2=A0 "RPL", the "RPL Packet Information" (RPI), "RPL Instance" (inde= xed by 203 =C2=A0 a RPLInstanceID) are defined in "RPL: IPv6 Routing Protocol for 204 =C2=A0 Low-Power and Lossy Networks" [RFC6550]. =C2=A0The RPI is the a= bstract 205 =C2=A0 information that RPL defines to be placed in data packets, e.g.= , as 206 =C2=A0 the RPL Option [RFC6553] within the IPv6 Hop-By-Hop Header. =C2= =A0By 207 =C2=A0 extension the term "RPI" is often used to refer to the RPL Opti= on 208 =C2=A0 itself. =C2=A0The DODAG Information solicitation (DIS), Destina= tion 209 =C2=A0 Advertisement Object (DAO) and DODAG Information Object (DIO) 210 =C2=A0 messages are also specified in [RFC6550]. =C2=A0The Destination= Cleanup 211 =C2=A0 Object (DCO) message is defined in [EFFICIENT-NPDAO]. [nit] s/By extension/By extension, 213 =C2=A0 This document uses the terms RPL-Unaware Leaf (RUL) and RPL Awa= re 214 =C2=A0 Leaf (RAL) consistently with [USEofRPLinfo]. =C2=A0The term RPL= -Aware Node 215 =C2=A0 (RAN) is introduced to refer to a node that is either an RAL or= a RPL 216 =C2=A0 Router. =C2=A0As opposed to a RUL, a RAN manages the reachabili= ty of its 217 =C2=A0 addresses and prefixes by injecting them in RPL by itself. [a comment for USEofRPLinfo] "consistently with [USEofRPLinfo]" =C2=A0It would be nice if USEofRPLinfo referenced this document on the definition of a RUL, instead of defining it there too. =C2=A0Yes, that would mean a Normative dependency. ... 231 =C2=A0 6LoWPAN ND: =C2=A0Neighbor Discovery Optimization for Low-Power= and Lossy 232 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Networks [RFC6775], "Registration Extensions for 6= LoWPAN Neighbor 233 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Discovery" [RFC8505], and "Address Protected Neigh= bor Discovery 234 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0for Low-power and Lossy Networks" [AP-ND] . [nit] s/[AP-ND] ./[AP-ND]. ... 337 3.2.1. =C2=A0R Flag ... 347 =C2=A0 This document specifies how the "R" flag is used in the context= of 348 =C2=A0 RPL. =C2=A0A 6LN is a RUL that requires reachability services f= or an IPv6 349 =C2=A0 address if and only if it sets the "R" flag in the NS(EARO) use= d to 350 =C2=A0 register the address to a RPL border router acting as 6LR. =C2= =A0Upon 351 =C2=A0 receiving the NS(EARO), the RPL router generates a DAO message = for 352 =C2=A0 the Registered Address if and only if the "R" flag is set. [nit] "This document specifies..." =C2=A0Please add a forward reference to where it is done. 354 3.2.2. =C2=A0TID, I Field and Opaque Fields 356 =C2=A0 When the "T" flag is set, the EARO includes a sequence counter = called 357 =C2=A0 Transaction ID (TID), which maps to the Path Sequence Field fou= nd in 358 =C2=A0 the RPL Transit Option. =C2=A0This is the reason why the suppor= t of 359 =C2=A0 [RFC8505] by the RUL as opposed to only [RFC6775] is a prerequi= site 360 =C2=A0 for this specification (more in Section 7.1). =C2=A0The EARO al= so 361 =C2=A0 transports an Opaque field and an associated "I" field that des= cribes 362 =C2=A0 what the Opaque field transports and how to use it. =C2=A0Secti= on 10.2.1 363 =C2=A0 specifies the use of the "I" field and of the Opaque field by a= RUL. [nit] "This is the reason..." =C2=A0What is the reason? =C2=A0A counter? = =C2=A0It may not be clear to other readers what you're referring to. [nit] s/RUL as opposed to only [RFC6775]/RUL, as opposed to only [RFC6775], [nit] s/and of the/and the 365 3.2.3. =C2=A0ROVR ... 380 =C2=A0 This specification does not address how the protection by [AP-N= D] 381 =C2=A0 could be extended to RPL. =C2=A0On the other hand, it adds the = ROVR to the 382 =C2=A0 DAO to build the proxied EDAR at the Root (see Section 9), whic= h 383 =C2=A0 means that nodes that are aware of the Host route to the 6LN ar= e made 384 =C2=A0 aware of the associated ROVR as well. [minor] s/extended to RPL/extended (for|to the use of) RPL =C2=A0 ? 386 3.3. =C2=A0RFC 8505 Extended DAR/DAC 388 =C2=A0 [RFC8505] updates the DAR/DAC messages into the Extended DAR/DA= C to 389 =C2=A0 carry the ROVR field. =C2=A0The EDAR/EDAC exchange takes place = between the 390 =C2=A0 6LR and the 6LBR. =C2=A0It is triggered by an NS(EARO) message = from a 6LN 391 =C2=A0 to create, refresh and delete the corresponding state in the 6L= BR. 392 =C2=A0 The exchange is protected by the ARQ mechanism specified in 8.2= .6 of 393 =C2=A0 [RFC6775], though in an LLN, a duration longer than the RETRANS= _TIMER 394 =C2=A0 [RFC4861] of 1 second may be necessary to cover the Turn Around= Trip 395 =C2=A0 delay between the 6LR and the 6LBR. [nit] s/refresh and delete/refresh, and delete [minor] Expand ARQ on first use, or add it to the Glossary. ... 411 3.3.1. =C2=A0RFC 7400 Capability Indication Option ... 435 =C2=A0 A 6LR that can provide reachability services for a RUL in a RPL 436 =C2=A0 network as specified in this document SHOULD include a 6CIO in = its RA 437 =C2=A0 messages and set the L, P and E flags as prescribed by [RFC8505= ], see 438 =C2=A0 Section 7.1 for the corresponding behavior of the RUL. [major] "SHOULD include a 6CIO" =C2=A0What are the cases where it is ok to not include the 6CIO? =C2=A0IOW, why is this behavior not a requirement? 440 4. =C2=A0Updating RFC 6550 [major] To me, Updating an RFC means that the implementations of that RFC should also implement this one. =C2=A0In this case, there would be an expectation that all RPL nodes would support everything mentioned here. =C2=A0Is that what is intended? =C2=A0Should all the changes in this section be part of the Update? Note that Updating is different than simply expecting the nodes that implement this specification to comply. [Personal opinion: it seems to me that some of the enhancements make sense on some nodes, but it is not necessary for all the nodes to support this specification for it to work. =C2=A0For example, Figure 5 shows the flow with participation from the 6LR, Root, and 6LBR -- the other nodes in the LLN don't need to be aware of the changes.] 442 =C2=A0 This document specifies a new behavior whereby a 6LR injects DA= O 443 =C2=A0 messages for unicast addresses (see Section 10) and multicast 444 =C2=A0 addresses (see Section 11) on behalf of leaves that are not awa= re of 445 =C2=A0 RPL. =C2=A0The RUL addresses are exposed as external targets [R= FC6550]. 446 =C2=A0 Conforming [USEofRPLinfo], an IP-in-IP encapsulation between th= e 6LR 447 =C2=A0 and the RPL Root is used to carry the RPL artifacts and remove = them 448 =C2=A0 when forwarding outside the RPL domain, e.g., to a RUL. [minor] s/Conforming [USEofRPLinfo]/Conforming to [USEofRPLinfo] [] Is there anything in rfc6550 that limits the source of the routing information in the DAOs? =C2=A0It seems to me that rfc6550 already allows external information to be injected in the network...so getting it from a RUL doesn't sound like an Update to me. 450 =C2=A0 This document also synchronizes the liveness monitoring at the = Root 451 =C2=A0 and the 6LBR. =C2=A0The same value of lifetime is used for both= , and a 452 =C2=A0 single keep-alive message, the RPL DAO, traverses the RPL netwo= rk. =C2=A0A 453 =C2=A0 new behavior is introduced whereby the RPL Root proxies the EDA= R 454 =C2=A0 message to the 6LBR on behalf of the 6LR (more in Section 6), f= or any 455 =C2=A0 6LN, RUL or RAN. [] Yes, there's a proxy behavior...but I would see that more as a change to ND than an Update to rfc6550. 457 =C2=A0 Section 6.7.7 of [RFC6550] introduces RPL Target Option, which = can be 458 =C2=A0 used in RPL Control messages such as the DAO message to signal = a 459 =C2=A0 destination prefix. =C2=A0Section 9 adds the capabilities to tr= ansport the 460 =C2=A0 ROVR field (see Section 3.2.3) and the IPv6 Address of the pref= ix 461 =C2=A0 advertiser when the Target is a shorter prefix, signaled by a n= ew "F" 462 =C2=A0 flag. =C2=A0The position of the "F" flag is indicated in Sectio= n 15. [] =C2=A79 says that this change is backward compatible; do we need all RPL nodes to support it? =C2=A0See my comment there about requiring (vs recommending) the use...and about the potential forward compatibility need to Update... [] I put a note in =C2=A715 about Updading rfc6550 because of the changes in the registry (which is different than the functionality described here)...take a look. [nit] s/introduces RPL Target Option/introduces the RPL Target Option [minor] "the IPv6 Address of the prefix advertiser when the Target is a shorter prefix" =C2=A0 I'm confused about this because then the F flag is set the Target is a full 128 bit address, not a shorter one. =C2=A0What did I miss? 464 =C2=A0 Section 6.7.6 of [RFC6550] defines the DODAG Configuration opti= on 465 =C2=A0 with reserved flags. =C2=A0This specification defines the new "= Root 466 =C2=A0 Proxies EDAR/EDAC" (P) flag and encodes it in one of these rese= rved 467 =C2=A0 flags. =C2=A0The "P" flag is set to indicate that the Root perf= orms the 468 =C2=A0 proxy operation, which implies that it supports the Updated RPL 469 =C2=A0 Target Option (see Section 9). =C2=A0The position of the "P" fl= ag is 470 =C2=A0 indicated in Section 14. [major] The P flag is not defined in =C2=A79...or anywhere else. [] Hard to say if this change is an Update without a specification of the P flag. 472 =C2=A0 Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (M= OP) in 473 =C2=A0 the DIO Base Object. =C2=A0The new "P" flag is defined only for= MOP value 474 =C2=A0 between 0 to 6. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7 or above, the flag M= AY be 475 =C2=A0 redefined and MUST NOT be interpreted as "Root Proxies EDAR/EDA= C" 476 =C2=A0 unless the specification of the MOP indicates to do so. [] We have an ongoing discussion about MOPs elsewhere. =C2=A0For now, I think that the Update should happen elsewhere. ...but here's a suggestion anyway... [] NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 6.3.1 of [RFC6550] defines a 3-bit Mode of Operation (= MOP) in the =C2=A0 =C2=A0DIO Base Object. =C2=A0This specification of the new "P" flag = applies to MOP =C2=A0 =C2=A0values 0 to 6. 478 =C2=A0 The RPL Status defined in section 6.5.1 of [RFC6550] for use in= the 479 =C2=A0 DAO-ACK message is extended to be placed in DCO messages 480 =C2=A0 [EFFICIENT-NPDAO] as well. =C2=A0Furthermore, this specificatio= n enables 481 =C2=A0 to carry the EARO Status defined for 6LoWPAN ND in RPL DAO and = DCO 482 =C2=A0 messages, embedded in a RPL Status, more in Section 8. [major] Besides enabling the EARO status to be carried, =C2=A78 also reduces the size of the status from 8 to 6 bits, with the new encoding... =C2=A0This *is* a necessary Update to rfc6550. [] Note that even though the same RPL Status is used in the DCO message, a formal Update is not required for EFFICIENT-NPDAO for the reduction of the size since that document is already inheriting the Update from rfc6500: "RPL Status: As defined in [RFC6550] and updated in [I-D.ietf-roll-unaware-leaves]." 484 5. =C2=A0Updating draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao [major] To me, Updating an RFC means that the implementations of that RFC should also implement this one. =C2=A0In this case, there would be an expectation that all nodes that support the DCO would support the Non-Storing MOP as well. =C2=A0Is that what is intended? Note that Updating is different than simply expecting the nodes that implement this specification to comply. [Personal opinion: I don't think a formal Update of draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao is needed. =C2=A0As mentioned below, this document "extends"...] 486 =C2=A0 [EFFICIENT-NPDAO] defines the DCO for RPL Storing Mode only, wi= th a 487 =C2=A0 link-local scope. =C2=A0This specification extends its use to t= he Non- 488 =C2=A0 Storing MOP, whereby the DCO is sent unicast by the Root direct= ly to 489 =C2=A0 the RAN that injected the DAO message for the considered target= . 491 =C2=A0 This specification leverages the DCO between the Root and the 6= LR 492 =C2=A0 that serves as attachment router for a RUL. [] Just another piece of information: draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao already "assumes that all the 6LRs in the network support this specification". =C2=A0draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao did not Update rfc6550, so it is not expected that "basic" RPL nodes would know what the DCO is... [major] Regardless of whether this document Updates NPDAO or not, some text should be added related to the possibility that not all nodes may know what the DCO is. =C2=A0See =C2=A710.2.3. 494 6. =C2=A0Updating RFC 8505 [major] To me, Updating an RFC means that the implementations of that RFC should also implement this one. =C2=A0In this case, there would be an expectation that all 6LRs would support the change. =C2=A0Is that what is intended? Note that Updating is different than simply expecting the nodes that implement this specification to comply...in this case, *if* "the RPL Root advertise[s] the capability...". [Personal opinion: rfc8505 applies to 6LRs in general, not just RPL routers in particular...so I think that Updating it is not the right choice.] 496 =C2=A0 This document updates [RFC8505] to change the behavior of a RPL 497 =C2=A0 Router acting as 6LR in the 6LoWPAN ND Address Registration of = a RUL 498 =C2=A0 acting as 6LN. =C2=A0If the RPL Root advertise the capability t= o proxy the 499 =C2=A0 EDAR/EDAC exchange to the 6LBR, the 6LR refrains from sending t= he 500 =C2=A0 keep-alive EDAR message. =C2=A0Instead, if it is separated from= the 6LBR, 501 =C2=A0 the Root regenerates the EDAR message to the 6LBR periodically,= upon 502 =C2=A0 a DAO message that signals the liveliness of the Address. [nit] s/Root advertise/Root advertises [] See the comment in =C2=A78 about a separate reason to Update rfc8505 and= rfc6775. ... 510 7.1. =C2=A0Support of 6LoWPAN ND 512 =C2=A0 In order to obtain routing services from a 6LR, a RUL MUST impl= ement 513 =C2=A0 [RFC8505] and set the "R" and "T" flags in the EARO. =C2=A0The = RUL SHOULD 514 =C2=A0 support [AP-ND] to protect the ownership of its addresses. =C2= =A0The RUL 515 =C2=A0 MUST NOT request routing services from a 6LR that does not orig= inate 516 =C2=A0 RA messages with a CIO that has the L, P, and E flags all set a= s 517 =C2=A0 discussed in Section 3.3.1, unless configured to do so. [major] I may be lost already... =C2=A0A RUL is by definition RPL-unaware. It then follows that a RUL can't be assumed to be aware of this specification, right? =C2=A0If so, then all the Normative language used in this section can't be used because we can't specify the behavior of a node that (by definition) is not aware of this document. =C2=A0[See more related comments below.] Note that =C2=A71 defines a RUL this way: "A RUL is an IPv6 Host [RFC8504] that needs a RPL-Aware Router to obtain routing services over the RPL network." [major] "The RUL SHOULD support [AP-ND] to protect the ownership of its addresses." =C2=A0 When it is ok for the RUL not to support AP-ND? IOW, why is the support only recommended and not required? ... 523 =C2=A0 Parallel Address Registrations to several 6LRs SHOULD be perfor= med in 524 =C2=A0 an rapid sequence, using the exact same EARO for the same Addre= ss. 525 =C2=A0 Gaps between the Address Registrations will invalidate some of = the 526 =C2=A0 routes till the Address Registration finally shows on those rou= tes. [nit] s/an rapid sequence/rapid sequence [nit] s/the exact same EARO/the same EARO [major] How fast is in "rapid sequence"...how big can "gaps" be? =C2=A0If using Normative language, then the text needs to be specific. 528 =C2=A0 [RFC8505] introduces error Status values in the NA(EARO) which = can be 529 =C2=A0 received synchronously upon an NS(EARO) or asynchronously. =C2= =A0The RUL 530 =C2=A0 MUST support both cases and MUST refrain from using the address= when 531 =C2=A0 the Status Value indicates a rejection. [major] "MUST support both cases and MUST refrain" =C2=A0Isn't this behavior already specified in rfc8505? =C2=A0We shouldn't use normative language in that case (unless you are quoting directly). [major] I didn't find a "rejection" Status Value. =C2=A0I'm assuming you're referring to a group of values: Duplicate Address, Moved, etc.. Please be explicit. 533 7.2. =C2=A0External Routes and RPL Artifacts 535 =C2=A0 Section 4.1 of [USEofRPLinfo] provides a set of rules detailed = below 536 =C2=A0 that MUST be followed for routing packets from and to a RUL. [major] Because the specification is in USEofRPLinfo already, then there's no need to normatively require it here as well. =C2=A0Also, not all the actions in =C2=A74.1/USEofRPLinfo are required, some are just recommended, so there would be a Normative conflict. =C2=A0 s/MUST/must ... 554 =C2=A0 The RPL data packets always carry a Hop-by-Hop Header to transp= ort a 555 =C2=A0 RPL Packet Information (RPI) [RFC6550]. =C2=A0So unless the RUL= originates 556 =C2=A0 its packets with an RPI, the 6LR needs to tunnel them to the Ro= ot to 557 =C2=A0 add the RPI. =C2=A0As a rule of a thumb and except for the very= special 558 =C2=A0 case above, the packets from and to a RUL are always encapsulat= ed 559 =C2=A0 using an IP-in-IP tunnel between the Root and the 6LR that serv= es the 560 =C2=A0 RUL (see sections 7.1.4, 7.2.3, 7.2.4, 7.3.3, 7.3.4, 8.1.3, 8.1= .4, 561 =C2=A0 8.2.3, 8.2.4, 8.3.3 and 8.3.4 of [USEofRPLinfo] for details). [minor] Listing all these sections may be prone to errors or inconsistency. =C2=A0What about =C2=A77.1.3/=C2=A78.3.2? =C2=A0 Maybe simpl= y "see [USEofRPLinfo] for details" is better. 563 =C2=A0 In Non-Storing Mode, packets going down carry a Source Routing = Header 564 =C2=A0 (SRH). =C2=A0The IP-in-IP encapsulation, the RPI and the SRH ar= e 565 =C2=A0 collectively called the "RPL artifacts" and can be compressed u= sing 566 =C2=A0 [RFC8138]. =C2=A0Figure 10 presents an example compressed forma= t for a 567 =C2=A0 packet forwarded by the Root to a RUL in a Storing Mode DODAG. [minor] s/Figure 10/Appendix A ... 576 =C2=A0 A RUL is not expected to support the compression method defined= in 577 =C2=A0 [RFC8138]. =C2=A0Unless configured otherwise, the border router= MUST 578 =C2=A0 restore the outgoing packet before forwarding over an external = route, 579 =C2=A0 even if it is not the destination of the incoming packet, and e= ven 580 =C2=A0 when delivering to a RUL. [minor] s/restore/uncompress [major] "the border router MUST restore the outgoing packet before forwarding over an external route, even if it is not the destination of the incoming packet" USEofRPLinfo already specifies this behavior, so please don't specify it again. =C2=A0Also, the language of "even if it is not the destination" made me think twice about complying with rfc8200. =C2=A0Maybe better to describe the behavior in the same way that USEofRPLinfo does. Suggestion> =C2=A0 =C2=A0A RUL is not expected to support the compression method define= d in =C2=A0 =C2=A0[RFC8138]. =C2=A0The border router uncompresses the packet bef= ore forwarding =C2=A0 =C2=A0over an external route to a RUL [USEofRPLinfo]. ... 608 8. =C2=A0Updated RPL Status ... 623 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = Table 1: RPL Status per RFC 6550 [minor] Please add a table (later in this section) showing the updated RPL Status...along with a forward reference to the IANA Considerations sub-section where the new registry is created. [] BTW, this change should formally Update rfc6500. 625 =C2=A0 The 6LoWPAN ND Status was defined for use in the EARO and the 626 =C2=A0 currently defined values are listed in table 1 of [RFC8505]. = =C2=A0This 627 =C2=A0 specification enables to carry the 6LoWPAN ND Status values in = RPL 628 =C2=A0 DAO and DCO messages, embedded in the RPL Status field. [minor] "the currently defined values are listed in table 1 of [RFC8505]" Given that the registry is being modified, and that other values may be added...it doesn't seem like a good idea to point at "currently defined values". =C2=A0Please take out that part of the sentence. 630 =C2=A0 To achieve this, Section 13.2 reduces the range of the EARO Sta= tus 631 =C2=A0 values to 0-63 to ensure that they fit within a RPL Status as s= hown 632 =C2=A0 in Figure 3. [major] "Section 13.2 reduces the range" =C2=A713.2 is part of the IANA Considerations, which reflects what is specified elsewhere. =C2=A0IOW, specify the reduced range elsewhere (here?). Suggestion> =C2=A0 =C2=A0To achieve this, the range of the EARO Status values is reduce= d to 0-63. =C2=A0 =C2=A0This reduction ensures that the values fit within a RPL Status= as shown in =C2=A0 =C2=A0Figure 3. [major] What about the ARO? =C2=A0The Status values are shared between the EARO and the ARO. [major] Changing the range of values is not as easy as updating the registry...the behavior of the EARO and ARO have to be updated. =C2=A0This means that this document should Update both rfc6775 and rfc8505 where it relates to the redefined Status field. The E/A flags (below) don't seem to apply to the ARO/EARO, so a specification of the behavior is needed; something like "ignore the first two bits". 634 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 635 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 636 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|E|A| =C2=A0Value =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 637 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ ... 643 =C2=A0 E: =C2=A01-bit flag. =C2=A0Set to indicate a rejection. =C2=A0W= hen not set, a value 644 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0of 0 indicates Success/Unqualified acceptance and = other values 645 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0indicate "not an outright rejection" as per RFC 65= 50. [minor] "When not set, a value of 0...and other values..." =C2=A0This is just one bit, so there are only two values, not "other values". ;-) You obviously mean "a value of 0...and other values of the RPL Status". s/a value of 0/an RPL Status value of 0 [major] ""not an outright rejection" as per RFC 6550" =C2=A0rfc6550 differentiated between a "rejection" and "not an outright rejection". Is the intent for the rejection codes to reflect that difference (at some point), or is the ability to signal the difference lost? ... 649 =C2=A0 Status Value: =C2=A06-bit unsigned integer. =C2=A0If the 'A' fl= ag is set this 650 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0field transports a Status Value defined for IPv6 N= D EARO. =C2=A0When 651 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0the 'A' flag is not set, the Status Value is defin= ed for RPL. [major] This change in the RPL Status format should be a formal Update of rfc6550. 653 =C2=A0 When building a DCO or a DAO-ACK message upon an IPv6 ND NA or = a EDAC 654 =C2=A0 message, the RPL Root MUST copy the 6LoWPAN ND Status unchanged= in 655 =C2=A0 the RPL Status and set the 'A' bit. =C2=A0The RPL Root MUST set= the 'E' 656 =C2=A0 flag for Values in range 1-10 which are all considered rejectio= ns. [nit] s/'A' bit/'A' flag [major] What should the receiver do if the corresponding 6LoWPAN ND Status is unknown? =C2=A0Or does it matter? =C2=A0I'm wondering if "MUST" i= s the right requirement, or if should be "SHOULD"... [major] What should a receiver do if the E flag is not set for "Values in range 1-10"? [major] For future rejection-related values, the E flag has to also be set, right? =C2=A0How can we word the specification so that we don't depend on future specification saying that the E flag has to be set? =C2=A0I worry that not all the status codes use the work "rejection", even if their description (rfc8505) can be interpreted as such. =C2=A0Maybe something like this: =C2=A0 =C2=A0The RPL Root MUST set the 'E' flag for all rejection Values. = =C2=A0The Status =C2=A0 =C2=A0Codes in range 1-10 [rfc8505] are all considered rejections. 658 =C2=A0 Reciprocally, upon a DCO or a DAO-ACK message from the RPL Root= with 659 =C2=A0 a RPL Status that has the 'A' bit set, the 6LR MUST copy the RP= L 660 =C2=A0 Status Value unchanged in the Status field of the EARO when 661 =C2=A0 generating an NA to the RUL. [major] "MUST copy the RPL Status Value unchanged" =C2=A0 Even if the value is unknown? 663 9. =C2=A0Updated RPL Target Option ... 679 =C2=A0 With this specification the ROVR is the remainder of the RPL Ta= rget 680 =C2=A0 Option. =C2=A0The size of the ROVR is indicated in a new ROVR S= ize field 681 =C2=A0 that is encoded to map one-to-one with the Code Suffix in the E= DAR 682 =C2=A0 message (see table 4 of [RFC8505]). [nit] "ROVR Size field" =C2=A0 The field is called ROVRsz. =C2=A0To be consistent, perhaps describe the field (below) as "ROVRsz (ROVR Size):" [?] Why is the size of the ROVR needed? =C2=A0It can be figured out from the setting of the F flag and the Option and Prefix Lengths. =C2=A0Just curious. 684 =C2=A0 The modified format is illustrated in Figure 4. =C2=A0It is bac= kward 685 =C2=A0 compatible with the Target Option in [RFC6550] and SHOULD be us= ed as 686 =C2=A0 a replacement in new implementations even for Storing Mode oper= ations 687 =C2=A0 in preparation for upcoming security mechanisms based in the RO= VR. [nit] s/modified format/updated format [nit] s/based in/based on [major] "It is backward compatible..." True, but what about "forward" compatible? =C2=A0If the F flag is not set, how does a receiver know that this is the updated Option? =C2=A0Is there a chance of spurious information (in either the flag or the ROVRsz) to be present and cause the receiver to misinterpret the information? =C2=A0I know that rfc6550 specifies that the "field MUST be initialized to zero by the sender and MUST be ignored by the receiver"...but I just want to test the edges. This forward compatibility may be a reason to formally Update rfc6550. [major] "SHOULD be used as a replacement in new implementations" Referring to =C2=A74 (Updating RFC 6550) and my comments there about Updating... If this change is an Update -- meaning that all RPL nodes must support it --, when would it be ok to not use it? =C2=A0IOW, why is it a recommendation and not a requirement. OTOH, the modification is backwards compatible...so only the nodes that need to understand the change need to implement it. [major] "...in preparation for upcoming security mechanisms" What it that? =C2=A0If support is required for a different specification, what is it? =C2=A0 It seems to me that recommending the use in preparation for something in the future is not appropriate in a specification without an explicit reference. 689 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 2 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 3 690 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 = 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 691 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 692 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 Type =3D 0x05 | Option Length |ROVRsz |F|= Flags| Prefix Length | 693 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 694 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 695 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0Target Prefix (Variable Length) =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 696 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 . 697 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 698 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 699 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ... =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Registratio= n Ownership Verifier (ROVR) =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 ... 700 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 701 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ 703 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0Figure 4: Updated Target Option [nit] Align the bit numbers: =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= 2 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 3 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 = 7 8 9 0 1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+= -+-+-+-+-+ 705 =C2=A0 New fields: 707 =C2=A0 ROVRsz: =C2=A0Indicates the Size of the ROVR. =C2=A0It MAY be 1= , 2, 3, or 4, 708 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0denoting a ROVR size of 64, 128, 192, or 256 bits,= respectively. [major] s/MAY be 1, 2, 3, or 4/MUST be 1, 2, 3, or 4 It is not optional to use those values, they are the only ones. [?] Why are 4 bits needed if there are only 4 values? =C2=A0Why not just us= e 3? [major] What should the receiver do if a different value is used? 710 =C2=A0 F: =C2=A01-bit flag. =C2=A0Set to indicate that Target Prefix f= ield contains an 711 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Address of prefix advertiser in full. [minor] To be in sync with the Registry in =C2=A715: s/F:/F (Advertiser Address in Full): ... 716 10. =C2=A0Protocol Operations for Unicast Addresses 718 =C2=A0 The description below assumes that the Root sets the "P" flag i= n the 719 =C2=A0 DODAG Configuration Option and performs the EDAR proxy operatio= n. [major] Where is the "P" flag defined? =C2=A0I didn't find it in this draft= . ... 726 10.1. =C2=A0General Flow [minor] It would be very nice if at the start of this sub-section a note mentioned the fact that =C2=A710.2 contains the detailed operation. That would help the linear reader (like me!) time in trying to figure out the details. ;-) [minor] Also, it would be great if this overview had forward references to where the detail is provided. ... 775 =C2=A0 On the first Address Registration, illustrated in Figure 5 for = RPL 776 =C2=A0 Non-Storing Mode, the Extended Duplicate Address exchange takes= place 777 =C2=A0 as prescribed by [RFC8505]. =C2=A0If the exchange fails, the 6L= R returns 778 =C2=A0 an NA message with a negative status to the 6LN, the NCE is not 779 =C2=A0 created and the address is not injected in RPL. =C2=A0If it is = successful, 780 =C2=A0 the 6LR creates an NCE and injects the Registered Address in th= e RPL 781 =C2=A0 routing using a DAO/DAO-ACK exchange with the RPL DODAG Root. [major] "the Extended Duplicate Address exchange takes place as prescribed by [RFC8505]" =C2=A0 Yes, except that NA is delayed until after the RPL registration is completed. =C2=A0(See related comments in =C2=A710.= 2.2 below.) [nit] s/created and/created, and 783 =C2=A0 An issue may be detected later, e.g., the address moves within = the 784 =C2=A0 LLN or to a different Root on a backbone [6BBR]. =C2=A0In that = case the 785 =C2=A0 value of the status that indicates the issue can be passed from 786 =C2=A0 6LoWPAN ND to RPL and back as illustrated in Figure 6. [minor] "backbone router" is not used anywhere else. =C2=A0Do we need to introduce this term and reference here? =C2=A0It seems like an unnecessary reference to me. [nit] s/In that case/In that case, [nit] s/back as/back, as ... 800 =C2=A0 An Address re-Registration is performed by the 6LN to maintain = the 801 =C2=A0 NCE in the 6LR alive before lifetime expires. =C2=A0Upon the re= fresh of an 802 =C2=A0 Address re-Registration, as illustrated in Figure 7, the 6LR in= jects 803 =C2=A0 the Registered Address in RPL. [nit] s/before lifetime/before the lifetime [major] Under what circumstances does the process in Figure 7 apply? I'm assuming that only if the registration hasn't expired, is that true? =C2=A0If the registration already expired, should the whole process (Figure 5) be repeated? =C2=A0I see mention of (re)registration in =C2=A710= .2.1, but none in =C2=A710.2.2. 805 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A06LN/RUL =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A06LR =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Root =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 6LBR 806 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 807 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 NS(EARO) =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 808 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |--------------->| =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 809 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0DAO =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 810 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|------------->| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 811 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 EDAR =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 812 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0|------------------>| 813 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 EDAC =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 814 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0|<------------------| 815 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0DAO-ACK =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 816 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<-------------| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 817 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 NA(EARO) =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | 818 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |<---------------| =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | [nit] A "|" is missing under the Root. ... 828 =C2=A0 The 6LR may receive a requested DAO-ACK after it received an 829 =C2=A0 asynchronous DCO, but the negative Status in the DCO supersedes= a 830 =C2=A0 positive Status in the DAO-ACK regardless of the order in which= they 831 =C2=A0 are received. =C2=A0Upon the DAO-ACK - or the DCO if one arrive= s first - 832 =C2=A0 the 6LR responds to the RUL with an NA(EARO). [major] "the negative Status in the DCO supersedes a positive Status in the DAO-ACK regardless of the order in which they are received" I don't remember anything like this in draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao. =C2=A0Should something be mentioned? =C2= =A0The ability of a parent to send an unsolicited DCO seems to fall in the same category: the DAO-ACK doesn't matter if the DCO was received first... I'm assuming the DCO negative status in this case has some type of expiration time, right? =C2=A0I'm thinking of the case where a problem did occur, but on a retry there is success...?? This property of the DCO allows a rogue node to invalidate a registration. =C2=A0Something similar to this text from draft-ietf-roll-efficient-npdao should be included in the Security Considerations section: =C2=A0 =C2=A0This document introduces the ability for a common ancestor nod= e to =C2=A0 =C2=A0invalidate a route on behalf of the target node. =C2=A0The com= mon ancestor =C2=A0 =C2=A0node could be directed to do so by the target node using the '= I' flag =C2=A0 =C2=A0in DCO's Transit Information Option. =C2=A0However, the common= ancestor =C2=A0 =C2=A0node is in a position to unilaterally initiate the route inval= idation =C2=A0 =C2=A0since it possesses all the required state information, namely,= the =C2=A0 =C2=A0Target address and the corresponding Path Sequence. =C2=A0Thus= a rogue =C2=A0 =C2=A0common ancestor node could initiate such an invalidation and i= mpact =C2=A0 =C2=A0the traffic to the target node. 834 =C2=A0 The RUL MAY terminate the registration at any time by using a 835 =C2=A0 Registration Lifetime of 0. =C2=A0This specification requires t= hat the RPL 836 =C2=A0 Target Option transports the ROVR. =C2=A0This way, the same flo= w as the 837 =C2=A0 heartbeat flow is sufficient to inform the 6LBR using the Root = as 838 =C2=A0 proxy as illustrated in Figure 7. [major] s/MAY/may =C2=A0 In this case, the sentence is just pointing at a fact, not making a normative statement. [nit] s/proxy as/proxy, as 840 =C2=A0 Any combination of the logical functions of 6LR, Root and 6LBR = might 841 =C2=A0 be collapsed in a single node. [nit] s/Root and/Root, and 843 10.2. =C2=A0Detailed Operation 845 10.2.1. =C2=A0Perspective of the RUL Acting as 6LN 847 =C2=A0 This specification does not alter the operation of a 6LoWPAN ND= - 848 =C2=A0 compliant 6LN, and a RUL is expected to operate as follows: [minor] s/6LN, and a RUL /6LN/RUL, which 850 =C2=A0 1. =C2=A0The 6LN obtains an IPv6 global address, either using S= tateless 851 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Address Autoconfiguration (SLAAC) [RFC4862] based= on a Prefix 852 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Information Option (PIO) [RFC4861] found in an RA= message, or 853 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 some other means such as DHCPv6 [RFC3315]. [nit] s/means such/means, such [major] s/RFC3315/RFC8415 855 =C2=A0 2. =C2=A0Once it has formed an address, the 6LN (re)registers i= ts address 856 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 periodically, within the Lifetime of the previous= Address 857 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Registration, as prescribed by [RFC6775], to refr= esh the NCE 858 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 before the lifetime indicated in the EARO expires= . =C2=A0It MUST set 859 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the "T" flag and the TID is incremented each time= and wraps in a 860 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 lollipop fashion (see section 5.2.1 of [RFC8505] = which is fully 861 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 compatible with section 7.2 of [RFC6550]). [minor] s/It MUST set the "T" flag and the TID is incremented/It MUST set the "T" flag. =C2=A0The TID is incremented [nit] s/[RFC8505] which/[RFC8505], which 863 =C2=A0 3. =C2=A0As stated in section 5.2 of [RFC8505], the 6LN can reg= ister to 864 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 more than one 6LR at the same time. =C2=A0In that= case, it uses the 865 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 same EARO for all of the parallel Address Registr= ations. =C2=A0The 6LN 866 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 SHOULD send the registration(s) that have a non-z= ero Registration 867 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Lifetime and ensure that one succeeds before it t= erminates other 868 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 registrations, to maintain the state in the netwo= rk and at the 869 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 6LBR and minimize the churn. [major] "The 6LN SHOULD send the registration(s) that have a non-zero Registration Lifetime..." It sounds as if you're trying to specify what the value of the Registration Lifetime should be. =C2=A0If so: s/that have a non-zero/with a non-zero What are the cases when it is ok to not use a non-zero value? =C2=A0IOW, why is it recommended and not required? =C2=A0rfc8505 talks about setting the Registration Lifetime to 0, which brings me to: it seems to me that the Normative language may be out of place since the specification is already made in rfc8505. =C2=A0?? 871 =C2=A0 4. =C2=A0Following section 5.1 of [RFC8505], a 6LN acting as a = RUL sets 872 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the "R" flag in the EARO of at least one registra= tion, whereas 873 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 acting as a RAN it never does. =C2=A0If the "R" f= lag is not echoed in 874 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the NA, the RUL SHOULD attempt to use another 6LR= . =C2=A0The RUL 875 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 SHOULD send the registration(s) with the "R" flag= set and ensure 876 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 that one succeeds before it sends the registratio= ns with the flag 877 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 reset. =C2=A0In case of a conflict with the prece= eding rule on 878 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 lifetime, the rule on lifetime has precedence. [nit] "6LN acting as a RUL" =C2=A0The title of this section is "Perspective of the RUL Acting as 6LN", which one is it? ;-) [minor] "whereas acting as a RAN it never does" =C2=A0 rfc8505 says this: "A 6LR that manages its reachability SHOULD NOT set the R flag". "SHOULD NOT" doesn't imply never. [minor] "If the "R" flag is not echoed in the NA..." =C2=A0I didn't find in rfc8505 where echoing the R flag is discussed. =C2=A0But =C2=A710.2.2 requi= res the R flag set...is that where the specification is? [major] "SHOULD send the registration(s) with the "R" flag set and ensure that one succeeds before it sends the registrations with the flag reset." This text is in conflict with =C2=A75.1/rfc8505: "MUST set the R flag to indicate that it is not a router and that it will not handle its own reachability". =C2=A0There isn't a provision for a RUL to not set the R flag. [nit] s/preceeding/preceding 880 =C2=A0 5. =C2=A0The 6LN may use any of the 6LRs to which it registered= as default 881 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 gateway. =C2=A0Using a 6LR to which the 6LN is no= t registered may 882 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 result in packets dropped at the 6LR by a Source = Address 883 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Validation function (SAVI) so it is NOT RECOMMEND= ED. [nit] s/as default/as the default [minor] Please add an Informative reference to SAVI. [major] s/NOT RECOMMENDED/not recommended This text is not specifying normative behavior related to interoperability. 885 =C2=A0 Even without support for RPL, a RUL may be aware of opaque valu= es to 886 =C2=A0 be provided to the routing protocol. =C2=A0If the RUL has a kno= wledge of 887 =C2=A0 the RPL Instance the packet should be injected into, then it SH= OULD 888 =C2=A0 set the Opaque field in the EARO to the RPLInstanceID, else it = MUST 889 =C2=A0 leave the Opaque field to zero. [nit] s/has a knowledge/has knowledge [major] If a RUL is *unaware* by definition, I don't see how this paragraph can fit in this specification...especially because it seems to be speculating about potential knowledge ("may be aware of opaque values")... =C2=A0What do we call a RUL that has partial knowledge? 891 =C2=A0 Regardless of the setting of the Opaque field, the 6LN MUST set= the 892 =C2=A0 "I" field to zero to signal "topological information to be pass= ed to 893 =C2=A0 a routing process" as specified in section 5.1 of [RFC8505]. [nit] s/process" as/process", as 895 =C2=A0 A RUL is not expected to produce RPL artifacts in the data pack= ets, 896 =C2=A0 but it MAY do so. =C2=A0For instance, if the RUL has a minimal = awareness 897 =C2=A0 of the RPL Instance then it can build an RPI. =C2=A0A RUL that = places an 898 =C2=A0 RPI in a data packet MUST indicate the RPLInstanceID of the RPL 899 =C2=A0 Instance where the packet should be forwarded. =C2=A0All the fl= ags and the 900 =C2=A0 Rank field are set to zero as specified by section 11.2 of [RFC= 6550]. [major] s/MAY/may =C2=A0 In this case, the text is just expressing a fact, not a Normative action. [nit] s/has a minimal/has minimal [major] The Normative text in this paragraph is equivalent to the one above (two paragraphs up)...please avoid duplication/redundancy. [major] "A RUL that places an RPI in a data packet MUST indicate the RPLInstanceID of the RPL Instance where the packet should be forwarded." So...even if we leave the *unaware* nature of a RUL out...this text means that any leaf can inject traffic onto an RPL Instance, just by knowing the ID (or even guessing it). =C2=A0Please add some text in the Security Considerations about how the rfc6553 considerations apply here too. 902 10.2.2. =C2=A0Perspective of the Border Router Acting as 6LR [nit] How else would a Border Router act as? [] This terminology of "acting as" is confusing... 904 =C2=A0 Also as prescribed by [RFC8505], the 6LR generates an EDAR mess= age 905 =C2=A0 upon reception of a valid NS(EARO) message for the registration= of a 906 =C2=A0 new IPv6 Address by a 6LN. =C2=A0If the initial EDAR/EDAC excha= nge 907 =C2=A0 succeeds, then the 6LR installs an NCE for the Registration Lif= etime. 908 =C2=A0 For the registration refreshes, if the RPL Root has indicated t= hat it 909 =C2=A0 proxies the keep-alive EDAR/EDAC exchange with the 6LBR (see 910 =C2=A0 Section 4), the 6LR MUST refrain from sending the keep-alive ED= AR. [nit] s/Also as prescribed/As prescribed 912 =C2=A0 If the "R" flag is set in the NS(EARO), the 6LR MUST inject the= Host 913 =C2=A0 route in RPL, unless this is barred for other reasons, such as = the 914 =C2=A0 saturation of the RPL parents. =C2=A0The 6LR MUST use a RPL Non= -Storing 915 =C2=A0 Mode signaling and the updated Target Option (see Section 9). = =C2=A0The 916 =C2=A0 6LR MUST request a DAO-ACK by setting the 'K' flag in the DAO 917 =C2=A0 message. =C2=A0Success injecting the route to the RUL is indica= ted by the 918 =C2=A0 'E' flag set to 0 in the RPL status of the DAO-ACK message. [major] What is "the Host route"? =C2=A0I guess you mean a "host route to the Registered Address contained in the EDAC". =C2=A0Or, as you mention later, "router to the RUL". [major] "MUST...unless" =C2=A0 The use of MUST implies no exceptions. =C2= =A0 s/MUST/SHOULD 920 =C2=A0 The Opaque field in the EARO hints the 6LR on the RPL Instance = that 921 =C2=A0 SHOULD be used for the DAO advertisements, and for the forwardi= ng of 922 =C2=A0 packets sourced at the registered address when there is no RPI = in the 923 =C2=A0 packet, in which case the 6LR MUST encapsulate the packet to th= e Root 924 =C2=A0 adding an RPI in the outer header. =C2=A0If the Opaque field is= zero, the 925 =C2=A0 6LR is free to use the default RPL Instance (zero) for the regi= stered 926 =C2=A0 address or to select an Instance of its choice. [major] "hints" =C2=A0 It is really a hint, or the RPL Instance? =C2=A0If o= nly a hint, where would the Instance that "SHOULD be used" come from? =C2=A0The text in =C2=A710.2.1 implies that the 6LN knows what the Instance is. [major] "the RPL Instance that SHOULD be used for the DAO advertisements" When would the 6LR not use the Instance signaled by the 6LN? =C2=A0IOW, why is this a recommendation and not a requirement? [nit] s/and for the/and the [major] "SHOULD be used for...forwarding...in which case the 6LR MUST encapsulate the packet to the Root adding an RPI in the outer header" There's a Normative conflict between recommending the use of the RPLInstanceID and requiring the use of the RPI (which contains the RPLInstanceID). [minor] How is the 6LR to "select an Instance of its choice"? =C2=A711.2/rfc6550 talks specifically about the need for guidance for external packets: =C2=A0 =C2=A0The definition and provisioning of RPL Instances are out of sc= ope for =C2=A0 =C2=A0this specification. =C2=A0Guidelines may be application and im= plementation =C2=A0 =C2=A0specific, and they are expected to be elaborated in future com= panion =C2=A0 =C2=A0specifications. =C2=A0Those operations are expected to be such= that data =C2=A0 =C2=A0packets coming from the outside of the RPL network can unambig= uously =C2=A0 =C2=A0be associated to at least one RPL Instance and be safely route= d over =C2=A0 =C2=A0any instance that would match the packet. 928 =C2=A0 If the "I" field is not zero, then the 6LR MUST consider that t= he 929 =C2=A0 Opaque field is zero. =C2=A0If the Opaque field is not zero, th= en it is 930 =C2=A0 expected to carry a RPLInstanceID for the RPL Instance suggeste= d by 931 =C2=A0 the 6LN. =C2=A0If the 6LR does not participate to the associate= d Instance, 932 =C2=A0 then the 6LR MUST consider that the Opaque field is zero; else,= that 933 =C2=A0 is if the 6LR participates to the suggested RPL Instance, then = the 934 =C2=A0 6LR SHOULD use that Instance for the Registered Address. [nit] There is some redundancy/repetition between this paragraph and the last one. [major] "If the "I" field is not zero, then the 6LR MUST consider that the Opaque field is zero." rfc8505 already specifies pretty much the same thing. OLD> =C2=A0 =C2=A0If the "I" field is not zero, then the 6LR MUST consider that = the =C2=A0 =C2=A0Opaque field is zero. =C2=A0If the Opaque field is not zero, t= hen it is =C2=A0 =C2=A0expected to carry a RPLInstanceID for the RPL Instance suggest= ed by =C2=A0 =C2=A0the 6LN. NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0As described in rfc8505, if the "I" field is zero, then the Op= aque field =C2=A0 =C2=A0is expected to carry the RPLInstanceID suggested by the 6LN. = =C2=A0Otherwise, =C2=A0 =C2=A0the Opaque field is ignored. [nit] s/participate to the/participate in the ... 939 =C2=A0 1. =C2=A0The Registered Address is signaled as Target Prefix in= the 940 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 updated Target Option in the DAO message; the Pre= fix Length is 941 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 set to 128. =C2=A0The ROVR field is copied unchan= ged from the EARO 942 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (see Section 9). [nit] s/as Target Prefix/as the Target Prefix [minor] "Prefix Length is set to 128" ...and the F flag is set. ... 948 =C2=A0 3. =C2=A0The 6LR sets the External 'E' flag in the TIO to indic= ate that it 949 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 redistributes an external target into the RPL net= work [nit] s/it redistributes/it is redistributing 951 =C2=A0 4. =C2=A0the Path Lifetime in the TIO is computed from the Life= time in the 952 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 EARO Option. =C2=A0This adapts it to the Lifetime= Units used in the 953 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 RPL operation; note that if the lifetime is 0, th= en the DAO 954 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 message is a No-Path DAO that cleans up the the r= outes down to 955 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the RUL; this also causes the Root as a proxy to = send an EDAR 956 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 message to the 6LBR with a Lifetime of 0. [minor] s/Lifetime/Registration Lifetime [minor] "Path Lifetime in the TIO is computed" =C2=A0How? =C2=A0Given that = the Registration Lifetime is in seconds, but the Lifetime Unit can be in days, there may be cases where the result is close to 0. =C2=A0Would that result in an NPDAO? [nit] s/the the/the ... 961 =C2=A0 Upon receiving the DAO-ACK or an asynchronous DCO message, the = 6LR 962 =C2=A0 MUST send the NA(EARO) to the RUL. [major] "Upon receiving the DAO-ACK ...the 6LR MUST send the NA(EARO)". My interpretation is that the 6LR will wait for the DAO-ACK before sending the NA(EARO), is that correct? =C2=A79.3/rfc6550: =C2=A0 =C2=A04. =C2=A0A node receiving a unicast DAO message with the 'K' f= lag set =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SHOULD respond with a DAO-ACK. =C2=A0A node rece= iving a DAO message =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0without the 'K' flag set MAY respond with a DAO-= ACK, especially =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0to report an error condition. =C2=A0 =C2=A05. =C2=A0A node that sets the 'K' flag in a unicast DAO messag= e but does =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0not receive a DAO-ACK in response MAY reschedule= the DAO message =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0transmission for another attempt, up until an im= plementation- =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0specific number of retries. This text says that the 6LR may never receive a DAO-ACK. =C2=A0If that happens (even after trying again), what should the 6LR do? =C2=A0 During this time the RUL is waiting for the NS(EARO)... 964 =C2=A0 The 6LR MUST set "R" flag in the NA(EARO) back if and only if t= he 'E' 965 =C2=A0 flag is reset, indicating that the 6LR injected the Registered 966 =C2=A0 Address in the RPL routing successfully and that the EDAR proxy 967 =C2=A0 operation succeeded. [nit] s/set "R"/set the "R" 969 =C2=A0 If the 'A' flag in the RPL Status is set, the embedded Status V= alue 970 =C2=A0 is passed back to the RUL in the EARO Status. =C2=A0If the 'E' = flags is 971 =C2=A0 also set, the registration failed for 6LoWPAN ND related reason= s, and 972 =C2=A0 the NCE is removed. [nit] s/'E' flags/'E' flag 974 =C2=A0 If the 'A' flag is not set in the RPL Status of the DAO-ACK, th= en the 975 =C2=A0 6LoWPAN ND operation succeeded and an EARO Status of 0 (Success= ) MUST 976 =C2=A0 be returned to the RUL, even if the 'E' flag is set in the RPL 977 =C2=A0 Status. =C2=A0The EARO Status of 0 MUST also be used if the 6LR= could not 978 =C2=A0 even try to inject the route. [major] "If the 'A' flag is not set in the RPL Status of the DAO-ACK, then the 6LoWPAN ND operation succeeded..." =C2=A78 says this: "the RPL Root MUST copy the 6LoWPAN ND Status unchanged in the RPL Status and set the 'A' bit" =C2=A0 This means that if the A flag is not set then the Root didn't comply with the MUST in =C2=A78...or that it did not copy result from the EDAC...which then means that the DAO-ACK is not valid. =C2=A0What am I missing? [nit] s/succeeded and/succeeded, and [major] "even if the 'E' flag is set" =C2=A0 Sorry, what? =C2=A0The E flag indicates a rejection... =C2=A0I thought I understood the logic (in =C2=A78= ) of setting the A/E flags...but it seems that I didn't. =C2=A0It would be ideal to then be explicit about the different combinations and how we can get to them. 980 =C2=A0 This means that, in case of an error injecting the route that i= s not 981 =C2=A0 related to ND, the registration succeeds but the RPL route is n= ot 982 =C2=A0 installed, which is signaled by the "R" flag reset. =C2=A0It is= up to the 983 =C2=A0 6LN to keep the binding with the 6LR or destroy it. [nit] s/succeeds but/succeeds, but [major] Figure 5 seems to indicate that the DAO-ACK is generated when the EDAC is received, which is inline with the specification in =C2=A78 ("the RPL Root MUST copy the 6LoWPAN ND Status unchanged in the RPL Status and set the 'A' bit")...but from the last few paragraphs it seems that there are other reasons for generating the DAO-ACK. =C2=A0While not clear from the Figure, =C2=A710.2.3 does hint by saying "if a DAO is pending"... =C2=A0Again, I think that this part of the operation has to be much more explicit. rfc6550 has no information about "pending" DAOs, or how fast the DAO-ACK is to be sent. =C2=A0In fact, there is no firm requirement for the DAO-ACK to exist, just hope that it does: - =C2=A76.4/rfc6550: "The DAO message may optionally, upon explicit request= or =C2=A0 error, be acknowledged by its destination with a Destination Adverti= sement =C2=A0 Acknowledgement (DAO-ACK) message back to the sender of the DAO." This sentence suggests that the DAO-ACK is optional, even if requested, and =C2=A79.3/rfc6550 supports that: " =C2=A03. =C2=A0A node MAY set the 'K' flag in a unicast DAO message to so= licit a =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0unicast DAO-ACK in response in order to confirm = the attempt. =C2=A0 =C2=A04. =C2=A0A node receiving a unicast DAO message with the 'K' f= lag set =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0SHOULD respond with a DAO-ACK. =C2=A0A node rece= iving a DAO message =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0without the 'K' flag set MAY respond with a DAO-= ACK, especially =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0to report an error condition. " Note that "SHOULD respond with a DAO-ACK" leaves the door open to not doing it. =C2=A0Unfortunately rfc6550 didn't explicitly mention what may be the reasons to not send a DAO-ACK (or not using MUST instead). In summary, there doesn't seem to be a guarantee that a DAO-ACK will be received...which means that the 6LN may be left waiting for a response to the registration (the same issues appears to be present for a re-registration). 985 =C2=A0 In a network where Address Protected Neighbor Discovery (AP-ND)= is 986 =C2=A0 enabled, in case of a DAO-ACK or a DCO indicating transporting = an 987 =C2=A0 EARO Status Value of 5 (Validation Requested), the 6LR MUST cha= llenge 988 =C2=A0 the 6LN for ownership of the address, as described in section 6= .1 of 989 =C2=A0 [AP-ND], before the Registration is complete. =C2=A0This ensure= s that the 990 =C2=A0 address is validated before it is injected in the RPL routing. [major maybe] "network where...(AP-ND) is enabled" =C2=A0Just to make sure I'm understanding: the network itself is not enabled for AP-ND, but the important nodes (6LN, 6LR, Root and 6LBR) are. =C2=A0IOW, RPL only carries the EARO status values that result from the AP-ND operation. If this true? Also, the only reason the EARO Status Value would be 5 is if the 6LN already supports AP-ND, right? =C2=A0I'm asking this because of the "MUST challenge" above, and =C2=A77.1 saying that the "RUL SHOULD support [AP-ND]" (recommended, not required). If my understanding is correct, then the text as is looks fine. :-) 992 =C2=A0 If the challenge succeeds then the operations continue as norma= l. =C2=A0In 993 =C2=A0 particular a DAO message is generated upon the NS(EARO) that pr= oves 994 =C2=A0 the ownership of the address. =C2=A0If the challenge failed, th= e 6LR 995 =C2=A0 rejects the registration as prescribed by AP-ND and may take ac= tions 996 =C2=A0 to protect itself against DoS attacks by a rogue 6LN, see Secti= on 12. [nit] s/succeeds then the operations continue/succeeds, then the operation continues [nit] s/particular/particular, [minor] "a DAO message is generated upon the NS(EARO) that proves the ownership of the address" It would be very nice is a new figure was included (either here or in =C2=A710.1) to show this updated flow. 998 =C2=A0 The 6LR may at any time send a unicast asynchronous NA(EARO) wi= th the 999 =C2=A0 "R" flag reset to signal that it stops providing routing servic= es, 1000 =C2=A0 and/or with the EARO Status 2 "Neighbor Cache full" to signal = that it 1001 =C2=A0 removes the NCE. =C2=A0It may also send a final RA, unicast or= multicast, 1002 =C2=A0 with a Router Lifetime field of zero, to signal that it stops = serving 1003 =C2=A0 as router, as specified in section 6.2.5 of [RFC4861]. [minor] What are the RPL actions that should take place? =C2=A0For example, if the 6LR "stops providing routing services" to a specific 6LN, but still acts as a router for others...should it also send an NPDAO/DCO to remove the routing state? =C2=A0Is there a reference somewhere about how a RPL router gracefully "stops serving as router"? 1005 =C2=A0 If a 6LR receives a valid NS(EARO) message with the "R" flag r= eset 1006 =C2=A0 and a Registration Lifetime that is not 0, and the 6LR was inj= ecting 1007 =C2=A0 the Registered Address due to previous NS(EARO) messages with = the "R" 1008 =C2=A0 flag set, then the 6LR MUST stop injecting the address. =C2=A0= It is up to 1009 =C2=A0 the Registering 6LN to maintain the corresponding route from t= hen on, 1010 =C2=A0 either keeping it active via a different 6LR or by acting as a= RAN 1011 =C2=A0 and managing its own reachability. [major] "MUST stop injecting the address" =C2=A0Can you be more specific? What does this mean in RPL terms? =C2=A0Send an NPDAO/DCO? 1013 10.2.3. =C2=A0Perspective of the RPL Root 1015 =C2=A0 A RPL Root SHOULD set the "P" flag in the RPL DODAG Configurat= ion 1016 =C2=A0 Option of the DIO messages that it generates (see Section 4) t= o 1017 =C2=A0 signal that it proxies the EDAR/EDAC exchange and supports the 1018 =C2=A0 Updated RPL Target option. =C2=A0The remainder of this section= assumes 1019 =C2=A0 that it does. [major] If the Root supports the functionality, when would it be ok for it to not set the P flag? =C2=A0IOW, why is it recommended and not required? =C2=A0[Note that I may be missing context because there is no specification for that flag.] 1021 =C2=A0 Upon reception of a DAO message, for each updated RPL Target O= ption 1022 =C2=A0 (see Section 9) that creates or updates an existing RPL state,= the 1023 =C2=A0 Root MUST notify the 6LBR. =C2=A0This can be done using an int= ernal API if 1024 =C2=A0 they are integrated, or using a proxied EDAR/EDAC exchange if = they 1025 =C2=A0 are separate entities. [major nit] "MUST notify the 6LBR. =C2=A0This can be done..." =C2=A0 I'm no= t too happy with the wording as it seems to provide options to a requirement... Suggestion> =C2=A0 =C2=A0The Root MUST notify the 6LBR by using a proxied EDAR/EDAC exc= hange if =C2=A0 =C2=A0they are separate entities. =C2=A0If the RPL Root and 6LBR are= integrated, =C2=A0 =C2=A0then an internal API can be used. ... 1043 =C2=A0 Upon receiving an EDAC message from the 6LBR, if a DAO is pend= ing, 1044 =C2=A0 then the Root MUST send a DAO-ACK back to the 6LR. =C2=A0Else,= if the 1045 =C2=A0 Status in the EDAC message is not "Success", then it MUST send= an 1046 =C2=A0 asynchronous DCO to the 6LR. [?] "if a DAO is pending" =C2=A0Even though rfc6550 doesn't talk about "pending", I take this to mean that the DAO hasn't been ack'd. =C2=A0Just wondering (because I couldn't find it in rfc6550), is there a timer that defines the time between receiving the DAO and sending a DAO-ACK. I'm also wondering about it since sending a DAO-ACK is only recommended. [major] What if the EDAC message is not received? =C2=A0Should the Root signal a failure? =C2=A0What if the EDAC message comes in after a failure is signaled? =C2=A0This should presumably not happen, especially since the 6LN already registered...but I'm worried about the timing. [major] Some text should be added related to the possibility that not all nodes may know what the DCO is. Suggestion (borrowing from =C2=A74.6.2/EFFICIENT-NPDAO)> =C2=A0 =C2=A0This document assumes that all the 6LRs in the network support= this =C2=A0 =C2=A0specification. =C2=A0If there are 6LRs in the DCO message path= which do not =C2=A0 =C2=A0support this document, then the issue indication may not reach= the 6LR. =C2=A0 =C2=A0Alternatively, the Root could... I stopped there because the text above says that the Root "MUST send an asynchronous DCO". ... 1059 11. =C2=A0Protocol Operations for Multicast Addresses ... 1068 =C2=A0 "Multicast Listener Discovery (MLD) for IPv6" [RFC2710] and it= s 1069 =C2=A0 updated version "Multicast Listener Discovery Version 2 (MLDv2= ) for 1070 =C2=A0 IPv6" [RFC3810] provide an interface for a listener to registe= r to 1071 =C2=A0 multicast flows. =C2=A0MLDv2 is backwards compatible with MLD,= and adds in 1072 =C2=A0 particular the capability to filter the sources via black list= s and 1073 =C2=A0 white lists. =C2=A0In the MLD model, the Router is a "querier"= and the 1074 =C2=A0 Host is a multicast listener that registers to the querier to = obtain 1075 =C2=A0 copies of the particular flows it is interested in. [nit] s/backwards/backward [nit] s/"querier" and/"querier", and [major] In general, the text talks about an "MLD listener/querier" -- are you using "MLD" to indicate support for both rfc2710/rfc3810, or are you assuming MLDv1 support only? =C2=A0The phrase "MLDv2 is backwards compatible with MLD" is what is confusing me. I also ask because the pim WG has an ongoing discussion about deprecating MLDv1. =C2=A0I am assuming MLDv2, which is what rfc8504 requires. =C2=A0If so, let's focus on rfc3810. [-] s/capability to filter the sources via black lists and white lists/support for source filtering That is the language used in rfc3810. 1077 =C2=A0 On the first Address Registration, as illustrated in Figure 8,= the 1078 =C2=A0 6LN, as an MLD listener, sends an unsolicited Report to the 6L= R in 1079 =C2=A0 order to start receiving the flow immediately. [minor] "On the first Address Registration..." =C2=A0Do you mean when the 6LN registers its own address (Figure 5)? =C2=A0 I would assume you're talking about when the 6LN decides to listen to multicast; maybe reword... 1081 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A06LN/RUL =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A06LR =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Root =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A06LBR 1082 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0| 1083 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | unsolicited Report | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1084 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |------------------->| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1085 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| [] See the comment below about the L2 ack. =C2=A0This same phrase shows up in Figure 9 later on... 1086 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| DAO =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1087 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|-------------->| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1088 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0DAO-ACK =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1089 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<--------------| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1090 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 | | [minor] "if not listening" =C2=A0Even if the 6LBR is listening, the Report should be unsolicited, right? =C2=A0I'm not sure what this phrase means... ... 1097 =C2=A0 Since multicast Layer-2 messages are avoided, it is important = that 1098 =C2=A0 the asynchronous messages for unsolicited Report and Done are = sent 1099 =C2=A0 reliably, for instance using a Layer-2 acknowledgment, or atte= mpted 1100 =C2=A0 multiple times. [major] The lack of reliable transmission is already addressed in rfc3810. =C2=A0What concerns me about the text is the suggestion that a different (L2 ack) mechanism can be used for MLD without any specifics. 1102 =C2=A0 The 6LR acts as a generic MLD querier and generates a DAO for = the 1103 =C2=A0 multicast target. =C2=A0The lifetime of the DAO is set to be i= n the order 1104 =C2=A0 of the Query Interval, yet larger to account for variable prop= agation 1105 =C2=A0 delays. [minor] s/multicast target/Multicast Address in the Report message [major] "generates a DAO for the multicast target" =C2=A0 This document is a standards track specification...we need to be more explicit. =C2=A0I'm assuming that the Multicast Address is included as the Target Prefix in the Target Option... [major] One Multicast Address per DAO? =C2=A0I think I saw a related discussion on the list recently. [major] "lifetime of the DAO" =C2=A0The Path Lifetime? [major] "lifetime...is set to be in the order of the Query Interval, yet larger..." =C2=A0How much is that? =C2=A0Double? =C2=A0Just a few secon= ds more? ms? ... 1111 =C2=A0 Upon a DAO with a multicast target, the RPL Root checks if it = is 1112 =C2=A0 already registered as a listener for that address, and if not,= it 1113 =C2=A0 performs its own unsolicited Report for the multicast target. [major] As above, please be specific. =C2=A0How is the DAO information used to build a Query? 1115 =C2=A0 An Address re-Registration is pulled periodically by 6LR actin= g as 1116 =C2=A0 querier. =C2=A0Note that the message may be sent unicast to al= l the known 1117 =C2=A0 individual listeners. [major] In MLDv2 that is called a Query... [nit] s/by 6LR/by the 6LR [major] "message may be sent unicast to all the known individual listeners" =C2=A0The first paragraph in this section says that "the multicast packet is passed as a Layer-2 unicast to each of the interested children", so there is no other option, right? ... 1144 =C2=A0 Note that any of the functions 6LR, Root and 6LBR might be col= lapsed 1145 =C2=A0 in a single node, in which case the flow above happens interna= lly, 1146 =C2=A0 and possibly through internal API calls as opposed to messagin= g. [nit] s/Root and/Root, and 1148 12. =C2=A0Security Considerations 1150 =C2=A0 First of all, it is worth noting that with [RFC6550], every no= de in 1151 =C2=A0 the LLN is RPL-aware and can inject any RPL-based attack in th= e 1152 =C2=A0 network. =C2=A0This specification isolates edge nodes that can= only 1153 =C2=A0 interact with the RPL routers using 6LoWPAN ND, meaning that t= hey 1154 =C2=A0 cannot perform RPL insider attacks. [nit] s/First of all, it/I [major] Because 6LoWPAN ND is used, please add text about the Security Considerations from rfc6775, rfc8505 apply. [major] Also, let's work in a general pointer to rfc7416 somewhere (instead of the very specific one below). [major ?] Are there attacks that can be injected into the RPL network through ND? =C2=A0I'm wondering if a RUL can request and inject a significant number of addresses so that it could hinder the operation of the LLN. =C2=A0I don't know if that's even an issue...just thinking out loud. 1156 =C2=A0 6LoWPAN ND can optionally provide SAVI features with [AP-ND], = which 1157 =C2=A0 reduces even more the attack perimeter that is available to th= e edge 1158 =C2=A0 nodes. [minor] I think there's some discussion of this in rfc8505...maybe point to that. =C2=A0Otherwise, this paragraph feels orphan... 1160 =C2=A0 The LLN nodes depend on the 6LBR and the RPL participants for = their 1161 =C2=A0 operation. =C2=A0A trust model must be put in place to ensure = that the 1162 =C2=A0 right devices are acting in these roles, so as to avoid threat= s such 1163 =C2=A0 as black-holing, (see [RFC7416] section 7) or bombing attack w= hereby 1164 =C2=A0 an impersonated 6LBR would destroy state in the network by usi= ng the 1165 =C2=A0 "Removed" Status code. 1167 =C2=A0 This trust model could be at a minimum based on a Layer-2 Secu= re 1168 =C2=A0 joining and the Link-Layer security. =C2=A0This is a generic 6= LoWPAN 1169 =C2=A0 requirement, see Req5.1 in Appendix of [RFC8505]. 1171 =C2=A0 Additionally, the trust model could include a role validation = to 1172 =C2=A0 ensure that the node that claims to be a 6LBR or a RPL Root is 1173 =C2=A0 entitled to do so. [major] There was some trust model-related text in draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138 that we ended up replacing. =C2=A0Please do the same here. 1175 =C2=A0 At the time of this writing RPL does not have a zerotrust mode= l 1176 =C2=A0 whereby it is possible to validate the origin of an address th= at is 1177 =C2=A0 injected in a DAO. =C2=A0This specification makes a first step= in that 1178 =C2=A0 direction by allowing the Root to challenge the RUL via the 6L= R that 1179 =C2=A0 serves it. [nit] s/writing RPL/writing, RPL [nit] s/zerotrust/zero-trust [minor] The challenge really comes from the 6LBR (not the Root)...but only if AP-ND is present. =C2=A0IOW, the use of AP-ND is what adds the protection, not the specification itself. =C2=A0Is that what we're talking about here? If so, then I have a couple more things to point at: - =C2=A73.2.3: "This specification does not address how the protection by [= AP-ND] =C2=A0 could be extended to RPL." =C2=A0But that is what seems to be claime= d above. - =C2=A77.1: "The RUL SHOULD support [AP-ND] to protect the ownership of it= s =C2=A0 addresses." =C2=A0If the RUL doesn't, then whatever benefit is claim= ed/expected =C2=A0 is lost. 1181 13. =C2=A0IANA Considerations [major] =C2=A714-17 should be sub-sections of this one. ... 1191 13.2. =C2=A0Resizing the ARO Status values 1193 =C2=A0 Section 12 of [RFC6775] creates the Address Registration Optio= n 1194 =C2=A0 Status Values Registry with a range 0-255. 1196 =C2=A0 This specification reduces that range to 0-63. [minor] NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0This specification reduces that range to 0-63 (Section 8). 1198 =C2=A0 IANA is requested to reduce the upper bound of the unassigned = values 1199 =C2=A0 in the Address Registration Option Status Values Registry from= -255 1200 =C2=A0 to -63. [major] NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0IANA is requested modify the Address Registration Option Statu= s Values =C2=A0 =C2=A0Registry so that the upper bound of the unassigned values is 6= 3. =C2=A0This =C2=A0 =C2=A0document should be added as a reference. =C2=A0The registratio= n procedure does =C2=A0 =C2=A0not change. [major] Because of this change in the registry defined by rfc6775, that RFC should be formally Updated. 1202 14. =C2=A0New DODAG Configuration Option Flag 1204 =C2=A0 This specification updates the Registry for the "DODAG Configu= ration 1205 =C2=A0 Option Flags" that was created for [RFC6550] as follows: [major] NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0IANA is requested to assign a flag from the "DODAG Configurati= on Option =C2=A0 =C2=A0Flags" registry as follows: 1207 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+------------+---------------------= -------+-----------+ 1208 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| Bit Number | Capability Descripti= on =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Reference | 1209 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+ 1210 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 1 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0| Root Proxies EDAR/EDAC (P) | THIS RFC =C2=A0| 1211 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+------------+---------------------= -------+-----------+ [major] Please mark the value (1) as suggested. ... 1215 15. =C2=A0New RPL Target Option Flag 1217 =C2=A0 Section 20.15 of [RFC6550] creates a Registry for the 8-bit "R= PL 1218 =C2=A0 Target Option Flags" field. =C2=A0IANA is requested to reduce = the size of 1219 =C2=A0 the field in the Registry to 4 bits. =C2=A0This specification = also defines 1220 =C2=A0 a new entry in the Registry as follows: [] Suggestion> =C2=A0 =C2=A0This document modifies the "RPL Target Option Flags" registry = initially =C2=A0 =C2=A0created in Section 20.15 of [RFC6550]. =C2=A0The registry now = includes only =C2=A0 =C2=A04-bits (Section 9) and should point to this document as an add= itional =C2=A0 =C2=A0reference. =C2=A0The registration procedure doesn't change. =C2=A0 =C2=A0The following table shows the initial assignment. [major] This change in the registry should be flagged as an Update to rfc65= 50. ... 1228 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= Table 3: New RPL Target Option Flag [minor] s/New RPL Target Option Flag/RPL Target Option Registry 1230 16. =C2=A0New Subregistry for the RPL Non-Rejection Status values 1232 =C2=A0 This specification creates a new Subregistry for the RPL Non- 1233 =C2=A0 Rejection Status values for use in RPL DAO-ACK and DCO message= s with 1234 =C2=A0 the 'A' flag reset, under the ICMPv6 parameters registry. [nit] s/in RPL/in the RPL [major] The DCO-ACK Status registry is under the RPL registry. =C2=A0Why isn't this one there too? =C2=A0It is RPL-related. ... 1238 =C2=A0 * =C2=A0Registration procedure is "Standards Action" [RFC8126]= . [major ?] All the other RPL registries have an "IETF Review" registration procedure. =C2=A0Why is this one different? ... 1242 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-------+------------= ------------+-----------+ 1243 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| Value | Meaning =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| Reference | 1244 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D+=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D+ 1245 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| 0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | U= nqualified acceptance | RFC 6550 =C2=A0| 1246 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0+-------+------------= ------------+-----------+ [major] Let's also add this document as a reference for this initial alloca= tion. ... 1250 17. =C2=A0New Subregistry for the RPL Rejection Status values 1252 =C2=A0 This specification creates a new Subregistry for the RPL Rejec= tion 1253 =C2=A0 Status values for use in RPL DAO-ACK and RCO messages with the= 'A' 1254 =C2=A0 flag reset, under the ICMPv6 parameters registry. [nit] s/in RPL/in the RPL [minor] s/RCO/DCO [major] The DCO-ACK Status registry is under the RPL registry. =C2=A0Why isn't this one there too? =C2=A0It is RPL-related. ... 1258 =C2=A0 * =C2=A0Registration procedure is "Standards Action" [RFC8126]= . [major ?] All the other RPL registries have an "IETF Review" registration procedure. =C2=A0Why is this one different? ... 1276 19. =C2=A0Normative References [minor] The following references can be Informative: ... 1293 =C2=A0 [RFC4919] =C2=A0Kushalnagar, N., Montenegro, G., and C. Schuma= cher, "IPv6 1294 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0over Low-Power Wirele= ss Personal Area Networks (6LoWPANs): 1295 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Overview, Assumptions= , Problem Statement, and Goals", 1296 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0RFC 4919, DOI 10.1748= 7/RFC4919, August 2007, 1297 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. ... 1304 =C2=A0 [RFC4862] =C2=A0Thomson, S., Narten, T., and T. Jinmei, "IPv6 = Stateless 1305 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Address Autoconfigura= tion", RFC 4862, 1306 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0DOI 10.17487/RFC4862,= September 2007, 1307 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. ... 1316 =C2=A0 [RFC6553] =C2=A0Hui, J. and JP. Vasseur, "The Routing Protocol= for Low- 1317 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Power and Lossy Netwo= rks (RPL) Option for Carrying RPL 1318 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Information in Data-P= lane Datagrams", RFC 6553, 1319 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0DOI 10.17487/RFC6553,= March 2012, 1320 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. ... 1322 =C2=A0 [RFC6554] =C2=A0Hui, J., Vasseur, JP., Culler, D., and V. Manr= al, "An IPv6 1323 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Routing Header for So= urce Routes with the Routing Protocol 1324 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0for Low-Power and Los= sy Networks (RPL)", RFC 6554, 1325 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0DOI 10.17487/RFC6554,= March 2012, 1326 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. ... 1338 =C2=A0 [RFC7228] =C2=A0Bormann, C., Ersue, M., and A. Keranen, "Termi= nology for 1339 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Constrained-Node Netw= orks", RFC 7228, 1340 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0DOI 10.17487/RFC7228,= May 2014, 1341 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0. ... 1353 =C2=A0 [RFC8138] =C2=A0Thubert, P., Ed., Bormann, C., Toutain, L., an= d R. Cragie, 1354 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0"IPv6 over Low-Power = Wireless Personal Area Network 1355 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0(6LoWPAN) Routing Hea= der", RFC 8138, DOI 10.17487/RFC8138, 1356 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0April 2017, . ... 1394 20. =C2=A0Informative References ... 1429 =C2=A0 [RFC8504] =C2=A0Chown, T., Loughney, J., and T. Winters, "IPv6= Node 1430 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Requirements", BCP 22= 0, RFC 8504, DOI 10.17487/RFC8504, 1431 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0January 2019, . [major] This reference should be Normative. ... 1439 Appendix A. =C2=A0Example Compression ... 1455 =C2=A0 The difference with the example presented in Figure 19 of [RFC= 8138] 1456 =C2=A0 is the addition of a SRH-6LoRH before the RPI-6LoRH to transpo= rt the 1457 =C2=A0 compressed address of the 6LR as the destination address of th= e outer 1458 =C2=A0 IPv6 header. =C2=A0In the original example the destination IP = of the outer 1459 =C2=A0 header was elided and was implicitly the same address as the 1460 =C2=A0 destination of the inner header. =C2=A0Type 1 was arbitrarily = chosen, and 1461 =C2=A0 the size of 0 denotes a single address in the SRH. [minor] Which one is the "original example", this one, or the one in rfc813= 8? From nobody Thu Sep 17 01:15:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 433C43A07BD; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:15:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160033053119.4976.2142049694795843195@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:15:31 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 08:15:31 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : RPL Capabilities Authors : Rahul Arvind Jadhav Pascal Thubert Michael Richardson Rabi Narayan Sahoo Filename : draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt Pages : 16 Date : 2020-09-17 Abstract: This draft enables the discovery, advertisement and query of capabilities for RPL nodes. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Sep 17 01:26:23 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1A373A093A for ; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:26:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ti6jwCGis4N0 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:26:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ej1-x633.google.com (mail-ej1-x633.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::633]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4DDC33A09CD for ; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:26:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ej1-x633.google.com with SMTP id i26so2003268ejb.12 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:26:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gmNDJgm2iC++MdKGDzugcd7uKw8p6aCjSTbv8ln2DsI=; b=AwFgFrnsJqzalyKrj5VKG8Le0yqGFDX/zUn+7Dyiwl3MuPiE0vIbpB7tVOKxyCPiux 4Xqzzp7a127gAPCrrCIfKfIhvrk9oeqwmBbt/oKD3hTdVQqlQa5aOezwAgQYY2+mSYJx KsJp+uod14OyzhiE2sSPad6HfFUciV14zy9fDFis6cWcPtNb8ZUSel2HICfWfbeZmWFE dCQSIX1EAYOB2kKNHQEsgvktcHNEGReN4FvkijBdFmyLcfKeuf1cP5MMvGBbW8j3jGG4 PQ3K2+9OLwHZ/2xLsGafvgaMvkL6eXCl/hvc7gqDN39LhWpeqWahPqYR1/GlySevLk7W noDg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=gmNDJgm2iC++MdKGDzugcd7uKw8p6aCjSTbv8ln2DsI=; b=LE4dRNGf9DW+m33rWysQRlVaRkYNxFdb9tq+rnQPGEz1UKsl66+wORrA6YeIPBqydt XxXMF5ezR9fHLbRh+tPvAqhyjFgk5Yc2m9BA8Rq3yE790ch+e3M1hHyeJddiFa0wI0VS SRi54pI26VXsd8lNxfbuNkw2/dxpRzUNd4ERvpCnD8SN8hoj/PziJ5t7JJxEWUb958hw OxKDtTScBsrcJCh8K6rU3c74ZkfhM7WoMiWIuWRFWF1bABNTia+LstVipSgqcZysdkKm +/kl2sNB8kTw925Kb031dwHNtbihEvj68ZGCJmB/koXtZep/vWZq62GeFZrHmLdZcYFQ vEBA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM53257LcUJK/o2HsQu/PZ8CWWB5laIVhKYeyazNK6YOYCoaVhLBEt qiiNo9UuKnOhKMRkdUcAEcl6BnXUNlBPBFQ7550f95Koz0k= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxoXnWgchE894ERUWWdy6WgtT7iGD2NXwRHoBu0eciFfmBQEzXSZf4cYWqh663uumq64F7z6BZSG/cnWn2lczI= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:c411:: with SMTP id u17mr28957413ejz.319.1600331178576; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 01:26:18 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <160033053139.4976.5541692853127796260@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <160033053139.4976.5541692853127796260@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Rahul Jadhav Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 13:56:07 +0530 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006c106e05af7e2329" Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 08:26:22 -0000 --0000000000006c106e05af7e2329 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hello All, PFA the updates based on Dominique's review. Thanks Dominique. I was very late with handling the comments. Apologies. There is a topic wrt support for capabilities in RPLv2 in the interim topics and I can update on the status in that context. Thanks, Rahul ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 at 13:45 Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt To: Michael Richardson , Rahul Arvind Jadhav < rahul.ietf@gmail.com>, Pascal Thubert , Rabi Narayan Sahoo A new version of I-D, draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt has been successfully submitted by Rahul Arvind Jadhav and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-ietf-roll-capabilities Revision: 07 Title: RPL Capabilities Document date: 2020-09-17 Group: roll Pages: 16 URL: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities/ Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07 Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07 Abstract: This draft enables the discovery, advertisement and query of capabilities for RPL nodes. Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat --0000000000006c106e05af7e2329 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello All,

PFA the updates based on Dom= inique's review. Thanks Dominique. I was very late with handling the co= mments. Apologies.

There is a topic wrt support fo= r capabilities in RPLv2 in the interim topics and I can update on the statu= s in that context.

Thanks,
Rahul


---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.or= g>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 at 13:45
Subject: New Version= Notification for draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt
To: Michael Richar= dson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>, Rahul Arvind Jadhav <rah= ul.ietf@gmail.com>, Pascal Thubert <pthubert@cisco.com>, Rabi Narayan Sahoo <rabinarayans0828@gmail.com>
=


A new version of I-D, draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt
has been successfully submitted by Rahul Arvind Jadhav and posted to the IETF repository.

Name:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft-ietf-roll-capabilities<= br> Revision:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A007
Title:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 RPL Capabilities
Document date:=C2=A0 2020-09-17
Group:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 roll
Pages:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 16
URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07.txt
Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities/
Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https= ://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-capabilities-07
Diff:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-capabiliti= es-07

Abstract:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0This draft enables the discovery, advertisement and query of =C2=A0 =C2=A0capabilities for RPL nodes.




Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat


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15.20.3370.019; Thu, 17 Sep 2020 17:13:01 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Alvaro Retana , "draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves@ietf.org" CC: Rahul Jadhav , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-18 Thread-Index: AQHWjDnYalhvjJ/sXE2H4yIAHvyldqlrgR9A Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 17:12:33 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 17:12:13 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: gmail.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gmail.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2001:420:c0c0:1005::209] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: c15257e0-c63e-4991-bc86-08d85b2ceebc x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3885: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 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Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160043707162.12307.4505895165842380519@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 06:51:11 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-19.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 13:51:12 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Routing for RPL Leaves Authors : Pascal Thubert Michael C. Richardson Filename : draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-19.txt Pages : 33 Date : 2020-09-18 Abstract: This specification extends RFC6550 and RFC8505 to provide routing services to Hosts called RPL Unaware Leaves that implement 6LoWPAN ND but do not participate in RPL. This specification also enables the RPL Root to proxy the 6LoWPAN keep-alive flows in its DODAG. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-19.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-19 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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ICAgICAgICAgaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaWQvZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1yb2xsLXVuYXdhcmUt bGVhdmVzLTE5Lmh0bWwNCkh0bWxpemVkOiAgICAgICBodHRwczovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0 bWwvZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1yb2xsLXVuYXdhcmUtbGVhdmVzLTE5DQpEaWZmOiAgICAgICAgICAgaHR0 cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvcmZjZGlmZj91cmwyPWRyYWZ0LWlldGYtcm9sbC11bmF3YXJlLWxl YXZlcy0xOQ0KDQoNClBsZWFzZSBsZXQgbWUga25vdyA6ICkNCk1hbnkgdGhhbmtzIEFsdmFybyEN Cg0KVGFrZSBjYXJlLA0KDQpQYXNjYWwNCg0KDQoNCg== From nobody Fri Sep 18 07:07:42 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25C853A0991; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 07:07:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160043805511.18120.8945998637209320960@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 07:07:35 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-15.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 14:07:35 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-15.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2020-09-18 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and unset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-15.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-15 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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15.20.3370.019; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 14:15:21 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Benjamin Kaduk , Alvaro Retana CC: Michael Richardson , "Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks" , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Alvaro Retana , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyACqqkkA== Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 14:15:21 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 14:14:45 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost>,<20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: 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X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzDccf1gymnZjq+hBOYZLeQOFLEwWvtyyrS6GwVCGIZUP4mZml+MqsRSxViXTIsTsK3ax4g2CB2TIMRqsHWMmc= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:ca46:: with SMTP id j6mr38792418edt.155.1600444034765; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 08:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 08:47:14 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana In-Reply-To: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 08:47:14 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , Benjamin Kaduk , Ines Robles , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002cdaa205af986a23" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 15:47:19 -0000 --0000000000002cdaa205af986a23 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable [Cutting the list a little.] Pascal: Hi! I think we should talk live about this =E2=80=94 if there=E2=80=99s time on= the Interim (In=C3=A9s?), then maybe we can do it there since the RPLv2 topic seems to = be on the agenda. Or we could do it before =E2=80=94 give me a couple of options= for next week. It would be ideal to have you, Michael and one of the Chairs, at least, on the call =E2=80=94 we can of course open the call to anyone on= ce we figure out a time that works. Thanks! Alvaro. On September 18, 2020 at 10:15:24 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) ( pthubert@cisco.com) wrote: Hello Benjamin and Alvaro I published the latest to have a fresh reference point. There seems to be an agreement that 1) we need to tell the implementer what to do when MOP =3D=3D7 2) The changes are updating RFC 6550 formally. This is reflected in draft 15 as published. Please let me know if I mossed something! Take care, Pascal Pascal > -----Original Message----- > From: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > Sent: vendredi 11 septembre 2020 21:17 > To: Benjamin Kaduk > Cc: Michael Richardson ; Routing Over Low power > and Lossy networks ; roll-chairs@ietf.org; Alvaro Retana > ; Ines Robles ; > draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org; The IESG > Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138- > 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) > > Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore. > > What will today=E2=80=99s developer code? > > We ask him to test if mop is < 7 > > What value will the developer place in his code if the test returns false? > > If there is no code the Boolean will be uninitialized and the result will depend > on the type of variable and the compiler. > > Whatever the developer does the code will end up having a behavior, > compression or not. > > Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose true and > others false. This is not what we want. > > We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the future and > build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge. > > Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally since initially > it did not exist. > > Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUST support > the compression. > > In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide to use the > compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it? > > I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it! > > Take care, > > Pascal > > > Le 11 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 18:26, Benjamin Kaduk a =C3=A9c= rit : > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Richardson w= rote: > >> > >> Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > >>> to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. > >>> If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that > >>> situation, that is probably also something that we can do in a > >>> normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" document without need for > Updates. > >> > >> Up to here, we agree. > >> > >>> But that's not > >>> all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, then y= ou > >>> have to use the 8138 > >>> header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are > >>> *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. > >> > >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > >> > >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7. > >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > > > > That's not how I read: > > > > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > > > >> What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, and how > >> it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be up to a > >> document that specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex) > > > > What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expected. > > > > -Ben > > > >> As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-became-ECN > >> change, we did this for IP_version=3D=3D4 and IP_version=3D=3D6. > >> We specifically did not change it for IP_version=3D=3D7 or 8. > >> > >> -- > >> Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consu= lting ) > >> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > >> > > > > --0000000000002cdaa205af986a23 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =
[Cutting the list a little.]

Pascal:

Hi!

I think we should talk live about this =E2=80=94 if there=E2=80= =99s time on the Interim (In=C3=A9s?), then maybe we can do it there since = the RPLv2 topic seems to be on the agenda.=C2=A0 Or we could do it before = =E2=80=94 give me a couple of options for next week.=C2=A0 It would be idea= l to have you, Michael and one of the Chairs, at least, on the call =E2=80= =94 we can of course open the call to anyone once we figure out a time that= works.

=
Thanks!

Alvaro.

On September 18, 2020 at 10:15:24 AM, Pascal Thubert (p= thubert) (pthubert@cisco.com) wro= te:

=
Hello Benjamin and Alvaro

I published the latest to have a fresh reference point.

There seems to be an agreement that =20
1) we need to tell the implementer what to do when MOP =3D=3D7
2) The changes are updating RFC 6550 formally.

This is reflected in draft 15 as published.

Please let me know if I mossed something!

Take care,

Pascal

Pascal

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
> Sent: vendredi 11 septembre 2020 21:17
> To: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.= edu>
> Cc: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>; Routing Over Low power
> and Lossy networks <roll@ietf.= org>; roll-chairs@ietf.org; Alvaro Retana
> <aretana.ietf@yahoo.c= om>; Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com>;
> draft-i= etf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org; The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-rol= l-turnon-rfc8138-
> 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
> =20
> Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore.
> =20
> What will today=E2=80=99s developer code?
> =20
> We ask him to test if mop is < 7
> =20
> What value will the developer place in his code if the test return= s false?
> =20
> If there is no code the Boolean will be uninitialized and the resu= lt will depend
> on the type of variable and the compiler.
> =20
> Whatever the developer does the code will end up having a behavior= ,
> compression or not.
> =20
> Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose tru= e and
> others false. This is not what we want.
> =20
> We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the f= uture and
> build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge.
> =20
> Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally s= ince initially
> it did not exist.
> =20
> Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUS= T support
> the compression.
> =20
> In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide t= o use the
> compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it?
> =20
> I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it!
> =20
> Take care,
> =20
> Pascal
> =20
> > Le 11 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 18:26, Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> a =C3=A9crit :
> >
> > =EF=BB=BFOn Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Ri= chardson wrote:
> >>
> >> Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk= @mit.edu> wrote:
> >>> to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems sligh= tly different.
> >>> If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for = reuse in that
> >>> situation, that is probably also something that we ca= n do in a
> >>> normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry&quo= t; document without need for
> Updates.
> >>
> >> Up to here, we agree.
> >>
> >>> But that's not
> >>> all we're doing; we're also saying that if yo= u see MOP=3D=3D7, then you
> >>> have to use the 8138
> >>> header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Ye= t we are
> >>> *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7.
> >>
> >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do.
> >>
> >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7.
> >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't e= xist).
> >
> > That's not how I read:
> >
> > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by d= efault
> > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.
> >
> >
> >> What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiate= d, and how
> >> it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, woul= d be up to a
> >> document that specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex)
> >
> > What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expe= cted.
> >
> > -Ben
> >
> >> As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-b= ecame-ECN
> >> change, we did this for IP_version=3D=3D4 and IP_version= =3D=3D6.
> >> We specifically did not change it for IP_version=3D=3D7 o= r 8.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca> . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulting )
> >> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldw= ide
> >>
> >
> >
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15.20.3370.019; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 16:57:35 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Alvaro Retana CC: "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , "Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks" , Benjamin Kaduk , Ines Robles , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyACqqkkIAAGzAAgAATqMM= Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 16:57:35 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> , In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; 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URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AYWJysVSoOpM for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 13:06:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (relay.cooperix.net [176.58.120.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1ECAF3A084A for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 13:06:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (CPE788a207f397a-CMbc4dfb96bb50.sdns.net.rogers.com [174.116.121.43]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7632A1F4A4; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 20:06:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id 94D4E1A022D; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 16:06:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-reply-to: References: Comments: In-reply-to "Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\)" message dated "Thu, 17 Sep 2020 17:12:33 -0000." X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 16:06:09 -0400 Message-ID: <103056.1600459569@dooku> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-18 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 20:06:15 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\) wrote: >> (1) What is a RUL? >>=20 >> =C2=A0I assumed that a RUL would be a "plain" IPv6 node that is not = aware >> of RPL =C2=A0at all. =C2=A0That definition would include, of course,= not being >> aware of this =C2=A0document... > Yes. I believe that is how we defined it. The RUL is an IPv6 host > connected to RPL that does not speak RPL. Alvero, we struggled with this a lot. As Carsten said repeatedly, and I think worth repeating, a plain IPv6 node which is not aware of any RPL stuff at all would be... a *host* I tried at the time of RFC8504 (not, RFC8505!) to get our requirements in= to 6man, but I didn't have the energy, and the reception was rather cold at the time. I think people were exhausted from SRH debate on 8200. So our definition of a RUL is any node that does not send a DAO on it's own. Instead, it speaks RS/NS/ND, and yes, RFC8505 specifically. >> =C2=A0The definition of a RUL starts in the Introduction with a simp= le >> =C2=A0description: "RUL is an IPv6 Host [RFC8504]". > This was not meant to be a definition of a RUL but just one of its > characteristics. =2D> IPv6 host is not necessarily a RUL. =2D-=20 ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh network= s [=20 ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | network architect= [=20 ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails = [=20 =09 --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEERK+9HEcJHTJ9UqTMlUzhVv38QpAFAl9lEzEACgkQlUzhVv38 QpDnEAf/c7gPhLx5qSfBO09j0Vw7AodosZtROpVJIrF22YdPjubYkVaoVJOGXiVJ mDk8nbuQKQRPrTt9XvWIancO5BFehgqtvjW+Xe7RzPiOJysDUAMtayaFt8Fawz5a YBfeZ/zZf1Sxo20g01sYOOjxyBYw3ge9ThgulXNi22VQ+PiZ1tQSNqCEL4zyiFYJ JKpfH2lfshBaNKnBiLcek01jRcoGdjrjel+3UyrNaxY31m1u+wMwwdJaAajUvnjc UVoRVZc5hYhXLdCfw4JcAZm47ZRWjgXlTJZAEJ9cQA/RSBYCrkf1aWSjyUqgGArx R4Gpv4o6yaHe3da2cLrGkmBEozTbGw== =3O4a -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Fri Sep 18 22:32:27 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DDBB3A1219; 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Fri, 18 Sep 2020 10:44:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: From: Martin Duke Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 10:43:52 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Benjamin Kaduk , Alvaro Retana , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , Ines Robles , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG , Alvaro Retana Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f089f305af9a0bc7" Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 22:32:26 -0700 Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2020 17:44:07 -0000 --000000000000f089f305af9a0bc7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable So I think this update somewhat clarifies the meaning of the original text, but I am still somewhat concerned about that meaning. Perhaps I just don't understand how DIO versioning works. Are the MOP codepoints meant to represent different ways of parsing the DIO base object? It seems very odd to me that this document is describing behavior in any way for MOP 5 and up, as there is no IETF consensus on what these codepoints are going to represent. Is the intent of this language to avoid having to write in every future specification "nodes using this MOP MUST use RFC 8138 and the T bit is reserved."? On Fri, Sep 18, 2020 at 7:15 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Benjamin and Alvaro > > I published the latest to have a fresh reference point. > > There seems to be an agreement that > 1) we need to tell the implementer what to do when MOP =3D=3D7 > 2) The changes are updating RFC 6550 formally. > > This is reflected in draft 15 as published. > > Please let me know if I mossed something! > > Take care, > > Pascal > > Pascal > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > > Sent: vendredi 11 septembre 2020 21:17 > > To: Benjamin Kaduk > > Cc: Michael Richardson ; Routing Over Low power > > and Lossy networks ; roll-chairs@ietf.org; Alvaro Retana > > ; Ines Robles ; > > draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org; The IESG > > Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on > draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138- > > 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) > > > > Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore. > > > > What will today=E2=80=99s developer code? > > > > We ask him to test if mop is < 7 > > > > What value will the developer place in his code if the test returns > false? > > > > If there is no code the Boolean will be uninitialized and the result > will depend > > on the type of variable and the compiler. > > > > Whatever the developer does the code will end up having a behavior, > > compression or not. > > > > Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose true and > > others false. This is not what we want. > > > > We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the future > and > > build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge. > > > > Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally since > initially > > it did not exist. > > > > Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUST > support > > the compression. > > > > In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide to use > the > > compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it? > > > > I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it! > > > > Take care, > > > > Pascal > > > > > Le 11 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 18:26, Benjamin Kaduk a =C3= =A9crit : > > > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Richardson= wrote: > > >> > > >> Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > > >>> to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different. > > >>> If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that > > >>> situation, that is probably also something that we can do in a > > >>> normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" document without need > for > > Updates. > > >> > > >> Up to here, we agree. > > >> > > >>> But that's not > > >>> all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, then= you > > >>> have to use the 8138 > > >>> header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it. Yet we are > > >>> *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. > > >> > > >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > > >> > > >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7. > > >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > > > > > > That's not how I read: > > > > > > For a MOP value of 7, the compression MUST be used by default > > > regardless of the setting of the "T" flag. > > > > > > > > >> What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, and how > > >> it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be up to = a > > >> document that specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex) > > > > > > What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expected. > > > > > > -Ben > > > > > >> As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-became-ECN > > >> change, we did this for IP_version=3D=3D4 and IP_version=3D=3D6. > > >> We specifically did not change it for IP_version=3D=3D7 or 8. > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T > consulting ) > > >> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > >> > > > > > > > --000000000000f089f305af9a0bc7 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
So I think this update somewhat clarifies the meaning of t= he original text, but I am still somewhat concerned about that meaning. Per= haps I just don't understand how DIO versioning works.

Are the MOP codepoints meant to represent=C2=A0different ways of parsing= the DIO base object? It seems very odd to me that this document is describ= ing behavior in any way for MOP 5 and up, as there is no IETF consensus on = what these codepoints are going to represent. Is the intent of this languag= e to avoid having to write in every future=C2=A0specification=C2=A0"no= des using this MOP MUST use RFC 8138 and the T bit is reserved."?

On Fri, Sep 18, 2020 at 7:15 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D<= a href=3D"mailto:40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org">40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org= > wrote:
Hell= o Benjamin and Alvaro

I published the latest to have a fresh reference point.

There seems to be an agreement that
1) we need to tell the implementer what to do when MOP =3D=3D7
2) The changes are updating RFC 6550 formally.

This is reflected in draft 15 as published.

Please let me know if I mossed something!

Take care,

Pascal

Pascal

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
> Sent: vendredi 11 septembre 2020 21:17
> To: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
> Cc: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>; Routing Over Low power
> and Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>; roll-chairs@ietf.org; Alvaro Retana
> <aretan= a.ietf@yahoo.com>; Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com>;<= br> > draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org; The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-tu= rnon-rfc8138-
> 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
>
> Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore.
>
> What will today=E2=80=99s developer code?
>
> We ask him to test if mop is < 7
>
> What value will the developer place in his code if the test returns fa= lse?
>
> If there is no code the Boolean will be uninitialized and the result w= ill depend
> on the type of variable and the compiler.
>
> Whatever the developer does the code will end up having a behavior, > compression or not.
>
>=C2=A0 Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose tr= ue and
> others false. This is not what we want.
>
> We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the futur= e and
> build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge.
>
> Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally since= initially
> it did not exist.
>
> Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUST su= pport
> the compression.
>
> In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide to us= e the
> compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it?
>
> I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it!
>
> Take care,
>
> Pascal
>
> > Le 11 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 18:26, Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> a =C3=A9crit : > >
> > =EF=BB=BFOn Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Richar= dson wrote:
> >>
> >> Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> wrote:
> >>> to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly = different.
> >>> If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reus= e in that
> >>> situation, that is probably also something that we can do= in a
> >>> normal "allocate a bit from an IANA registry" d= ocument without need for
> Updates.
> >>
> >> Up to here, we agree.
> >>
> >>> But that's not
> >>> all we're doing; we're also saying that if you se= e MOP=3D=3D7, then you
> >>> have to use the 8138
> >>> header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it.=C2=A0 Y= et we are
> >>> *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7.
> >>
> >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do.
> >>
> >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7.
> >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist= ).
> >
> > That's not how I read:
> >
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the compression M= UST be used by default
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0regardless of the setting of the "T" flag.<= br> > >
> >
> >> What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, a= nd how
> >> it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be= up to a
> >> document that specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex)
> >
> > What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expected= .
> >
> > -Ben
> >
> >> As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-becam= e-ECN
> >> change, we did this for IP_version=3D=3D4 and IP_version=3D= =3D6.
> >> We specifically did not change it for IP_version=3D=3D7 or 8.=
> >>
> >> --
> >> Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>=C2=A0 =C2=A0. o O ( IP= v6 I=C3=B8T consulting )
> >>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Sandelman Software Wo= rks Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide
> >>
> >
> >
--000000000000f089f305af9a0bc7-- From nobody Fri Sep 18 22:32:31 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 177243A09C9 for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 11:46:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=yahoo.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nh4cGiVho6yB for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 11:46:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonic305-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic305-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.185.147]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B27D3A0A21 for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2020 11:46:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1600454761; bh=k/AOeQkE4giHMFEYdkeoohzIx1HNsoHRIDeng8txjoo=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject; b=Lea7oXNydhH1QNZez5Yqtj1Y493gHAG4jeXICYkWWvg1PRRBtESxwGYCceYGYdQ2wsjKRm6RO5YGLHa3QHHj5HaN9NIPtDaY3zLJcEfuDFyVCUJfKCeLW7QHb1GGmW26ceEq6dxesFY2tuypfedNYrvNVHPTDb+ULxEFpOnebLgozwsxWPeUlVVkYRc/mVMmHnbRWlWQh5vOu/7gj560tTG4XmRZ/p1Z5ItVIn/qkJUsFVJKLUb6S09QE9xfv2kQXFHgQoYQnahBm9dm1XzL281wjq/UOM3DcTEspGmGw8zK6ZtemqTMmqgX34B0FAfRs51a0bz40w5qp2vn1E49AA== X-YMail-OSG: 2Gc.Qy0VM1mSxos.7uepFXzZ_69RA5blAd0JVFUlp7M53QKkIZI1QggUH3YyFjM kIFEY5kpy_8T9sU7rY5ICerKIlmuxQFNjcgf7hLPuURq7dfCiPvYIMEeOgXirnRaYc8UPhqn3HBb YK9WCCSc2mF4avH3vtIkJ_O9YqzmF9B1H8wbON.avP2HDhvrlUftDxlgCxRDSkjnuy4N3kiveU9. 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The WG has an interim programmed for Sep/30, where we may discuss the ove= rall direction as well. Thanks=21 Alvaro. On September 18, 2020 at 1:44:04 PM, Martin Duke (martin.h.duke=40gmail.c= om) wrote: So I think this update somewhat clarifies the meaning of the original tex= t, but I am still somewhat concerned about that meaning. Perhaps I just d= on't understand how DIO versioning works. Are the MOP codepoints meant to represent=C2=A0different ways of parsing = the DIO base object=3F It seems very odd to me that this document is desc= ribing behavior in any way for MOP 5 and up, as there is no IET=46 consen= sus on what these codepoints are going to represent. Is the intent of thi= s language to avoid having to write in every future=C2=A0specification=C2= =A0=22nodes using this MOP MUST use R=46C 8138 and the T bit is reserved.= =22=3F On =46ri, Sep 18, 2020 at 7:15 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: Hello Benjamin and Alvaro I published the latest to have a fresh reference point. There seems to be an agreement that =20 1) we need to tell the implementer what to do when MOP =3D=3D7 2) The changes are updating R=46C 6550 formally. This is reflected in draft 15 as published. Please let me know if I mossed something=21 Take care, Pascal Pascal > -----Original Message----- > =46rom: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > Sent: vendredi 11 septembre 2020 21:17 > To: Benjamin Kaduk > Cc: Michael Richardson ; Routing Over Low powe= r > and Lossy networks ; roll-chairs=40ietf.org; Alvaro Re= tana > ; Ines Robles ; > draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138=40ietf.org; The IESG > Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-tur= non-rfc8138- > 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) > =20 > Now I=E2=80=99m unsure Michael and I agree anymore. > =20 > What will today=E2=80=99s developer code=3F > =20 > We ask him to test if mop is < 7 > =20 > What value will the developer place in his code if the test returns fal= se=3F > =20 > If there is no code the Boolean will be uninitialized and the result wi= ll depend > on the type of variable and the compiler. > =20 > Whatever the developer does the code will end up having a behavior, > compression or not. > =20 >=C2=A0 Leaving it to the implementation will have some people choose tru= e and > others false. This is not what we want. > =20 > We want to control what the code does so we can expect it in the future= and > build our backward compatibility based on that sure knowledge. > =20 > Before the draft the default was no compression. Quite naturally since = initially > it did not exist. > =20 > Also we discussed on the ML that for RPLv2 all implementations MUST sup= port > the compression. > =20 > In which case it is a better default for a coder today to decide to use= the > compression for mop 7, isn=E2=80=99t it=3F > =20 > I hope I make the case right. Just think you=E2=80=99re coding it=21 > =20 > Take care, > =20 > Pascal > =20 > > Le 11 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 18:26, Benjamin Kaduk a =C3= =A9crit : > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn =46ri, Sep 11, 2020 at 12:23:50PM -0400, Michael Richards= on wrote: > >> > >> Benjamin Kaduk wrote: > >>> to MOPs 0..6; but the situation for MOP 7 seems slightly different.= > >>> If we were *just* leaving the bit undefined/free for reuse in that > >>> situation, that is probably also something that we can do in a > >>> normal =22allocate a bit from an IANA registry=22 document without = need for > Updates. > >> > >> Up to here, we agree. > >> > >>> But that's not > >>> all we're doing; we're also saying that if you see MOP=3D=3D7, then= you > >>> have to use the 8138 > >>> header/compression/whatever-we-end-up-calling-it.=C2=A0 Yet we are > >>> *not* allocating MOP=3D=3D7. > >> > >> Tthat's exactly what we don't want to do. > >> > >> We are saying NOTHING about rfc8138 when MOP=3D=3D7. > >> Nor are we saying that the T-bit exists (or doesn't exist). > > > > That's not how I read: > > > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=46or a MOP value of 7, the compression MUS= T be used by default > >=C2=A0 =C2=A0regardless of the setting of the =22T=22 flag. > > > > > >> What behaviour is default and what behaviour is negotiated, and how > >> it it negotiated, and how the results are turned on, would be up to = a > >> document that specifies MOP=3D7 (or larger mopex) > > > > What you describe here is more along the lines of what I expected. > > > > -Ben > > > >> As an analogy, when we did the ToS->DSCP + bits-that-became-ECN > >> change, we did this for IP=5Fversion=3D=3D4 and IP=5Fversion=3D=3D6.= > >> We specifically did not change it for IP=5Fversion=3D=3D7 or 8. > >> > >> -- > >> Michael Richardson =C2=A0 =C2=A0. o O ( I= Pv6 I=C3=B8T consulting ) > >>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Sandelman Software Works Inc= , Ottawa and Worldwide > >> > > > > --5f650064_548a17cc_faf8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline =
Hi!

I can=E2=80=99t stay the whole 2 hours=E2=80=A6so I want to bas= h the agenda to add another question at the top.

() Should the MOP 7 Updates to rfc6550 be par= t of the turnon, unaware-leaves, useofrplinfo drafts?=C2=A0 I believe the a= nswer is no, and I would like to make the case on the call.=C2=A0


BTW, on (3), unaware-leaves says t= hat the RUL is not expected to support rfc8138. =C2=A0 Not expected is not = the same as saying that they never will send compressed data=E2=80=A6
=

Thanks!

Alvaro.

On September 21, 2020 at 7:22:26 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) (pthubert@cisco.com) wrote:

All very= good questions, Michael, =20

And it seems that we are converging. =20

I read the quasi-suggestion that we align the default for MOP 7 to whet= her 6LoWPAN HC is running on the medium? Looks good.

I have one last question, how does this discussion impact useofrpl and = unaware-leaves, since they both define flags in the RPL DODAG config option= . Should we converge the language? Do they all update RPL?

Talk to you all in a few hours,

Pascal

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
> Sent: lundi 21 septembre 2020 02:31
> To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.com>; roll@iet= f.org; Ines
> Robles <maria= inesrobles@googlemail.com>; Alvaro Retana
> <aretana.ietf@gmail.c= om>
> Subject: Agenda for Monday (Re: MOP=3D=3D7 live discussion )
> =20
> =20
> okay, here is my summary of the issues that are outstanding for ro= ll-turnon-
> rfc8138.
> I am writing this in the hope that I've captured everything.
> =20
> 1) Will RFC8138 be enabled for MOP=3D=3D7? For what media?
> I see that my notion that it should be undefined is not reasona= ble, and I
> step back from this.
> =20
> 2) In what way does the format of the DIO Base Object depend upon = the MOP
> value? It seems that we need to update 6550 to say something.
> =20
> 3) While RUL document mandates that RULs must support 8138, it is = not
> clear to me if RULs can operate in a pre-8138 network. What if = they
> send 8138 compression?
> It may be that none of the compressions that 8138 creates
> will ever be emitted by a RUL, since they are all about IPIP co= mpression
> and RH3 compression, but I haven't checked.
> =20
> 4) we seem to be fine for 802.15.4 networks of all sorts.
> I suspect that we are okay for all the other layers (BTLE, DECT= , BACnet)
> that leverage rfc4944 through the various upgrades. But, we ar= e sure?
> What happens on devices with multiple interfaces of different t= ypes?
> Maybe this is an RFC8138 issue really.
> =20
> =20
> =20
> --
> Michael Richardson <= mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca> . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulting )
> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide
> =20
> =20
> =20

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SMTP id l25mr46197uak.56.1600695632321; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 06:40:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> <117301.1600480771@dooku> <9778D10D-91FE-496B-B679-8A3E8B7B5300@cisco.com> <15752.1600553316@localhost> <5049.1600648267@localhost> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 16:39:56 +0300 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Alvaro Retana , "roll@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008edfad05afd2fe39" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Agenda for Monday (Re: MOP==7 live discussion ) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 13:40:43 -0000 --0000000000008edfad05afd2fe39 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Questions tracked here: https://codimd.ietf.org/roll_MOP_20200921?both The 2 hours are reserved just in case, I hope everything is solved before the 2 hours :) br, Ines On Mon, Sep 21, 2020 at 4:34 PM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) < pthubert@cisco.com> wrote: > Hello Alvaro, > > > > I cannot believe we=E2=80=99ll need 2 hours. But certainly we can start w= ith the > high level discussions on how this impacts the 3 drafts, before we dive i= n > how to treat RFC 8138 with MOP 7. > > > > Take care, > > > > Pascal > > > > *From:* Alvaro Retana > *Sent:* lundi 21 septembre 2020 14:51 > *To:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert) ; roll@ietf.org; > Michael Richardson ; Ines Robles < > mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> > *Subject:* RE: Agenda for Monday (Re: MOP=3D=3D7 live discussion ) > > > > Hi! > > > > I can=E2=80=99t stay the whole 2 hours=E2=80=A6so I want to bash the agen= da to add another > question at the top. > > > > () Should the MOP 7 Updates to rfc6550 be part of the turnon, > unaware-leaves, useofrplinfo drafts? I believe the answer is no, and I > would like to make the case on the call. > > > > > > BTW, on (3), unaware-leaves says that the RUL is not expected to support > rfc8138. Not expected is not the same as saying that they never will se= nd > compressed data=E2=80=A6 > > > > Thanks! > > > > Alvaro. > > > > On September 21, 2020 at 7:22:26 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) ( > pthubert@cisco.com) wrote: > > All very good questions, Michael, > > And it seems that we are converging. > > I read the quasi-suggestion that we align the default for MOP 7 to whethe= r > 6LoWPAN HC is running on the medium? Looks good. > > I have one last question, how does this discussion impact useofrpl and > unaware-leaves, since they both define flags in the RPL DODAG config > option. Should we converge the language? Do they all update RPL? > > Talk to you all in a few hours, > > Pascal > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Michael Richardson > > Sent: lundi 21 septembre 2020 02:31 > > To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) ; roll@ietf.org; Ines > > Robles ; Alvaro Retana > > > > Subject: Agenda for Monday (Re: MOP=3D=3D7 live discussion ) > > > > > > okay, here is my summary of the issues that are outstanding for > roll-turnon- > > rfc8138. > > I am writing this in the hope that I've captured everything. > > > > 1) Will RFC8138 be enabled for MOP=3D=3D7? For what media? > > I see that my notion that it should be undefined is not reasonable, and > I > > step back from this. > > > > 2) In what way does the format of the DIO Base Object depend upon the > MOP > > value? It seems that we need to update 6550 to say something. > > > > 3) While RUL document mandates that RULs must support 8138, it is not > > clear to me if RULs can operate in a pre-8138 network. What if they > > send 8138 compression? > > It may be that none of the compressions that 8138 creates > > will ever be emitted by a RUL, since they are all about IPIP compressio= n > > and RH3 compression, but I haven't checked. > > > > 4) we seem to be fine for 802.15.4 networks of all sorts. > > I suspect that we are okay for all the other layers (BTLE, DECT, BACnet= ) > > that leverage rfc4944 through the various upgrades. But, we are sure? > > What happens on devices with multiple interfaces of different types? > > Maybe this is an RFC8138 issue really. > > > > > > > > -- > > Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consul= ting > ) > > Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide > > > > > > > > --0000000000008edfad05afd2fe39 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

Questions tracked here:=C2=A0https://codimd.ietf.or= g/roll_MOP_20200921?both=C2=A0

The 2 hours are= reserved just in case, I hope everything is solved before the 2 hours :)= =C2=A0

br, Ines


<= /div>


On Mon, Sep 21, 2020 at 4:34 PM Pascal Thubert (pthuber= t) <pthubert@cisco.com> wro= te:

Hello Alvaro,

=C2=A0

I cannot believe we=E2=80=99ll need 2 hours. But certainly we = can start with the high level discussions on how this impacts the 3 drafts,= before we dive in how to treat RFC 8138 with MOP 7.

=C2=A0

Take care,

=C2=A0

Pascal

=C2=A0

From: Alvaro Retana <= aretana.ietf@gm= ail.com>
Sent: lundi 21 septembre 202= 0 14:51
To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert= ) <pthubert@cisc= o.com>; roll@ietf= .org; Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>; Ines Robles <mariainesroble= s@googlemail.com>
Subject: RE: Agenda for Mond= ay (Re: MOP=3D=3D7 live discussion )

=C2=A0

Hi!

=C2=A0=

I can=E2=80=99t stay the wh= ole 2 hours=E2=80=A6so I want to bash the agenda to add another question at= the top.

=C2=A0=

() Should the MOP 7 Updates= to rfc6550 be part of the turnon, unaware-leaves, useofrplinfo drafts?=C2= =A0 I believe the answer is no, and I would like to make the case on the call.=C2=A0

=C2=A0=

=C2=A0=

BTW, on (3), unaware-leaves= says that the RUL is not expected to support rfc8138. =C2=A0 Not expected = is not the same as saying that they never will send compressed data=E2=80=A6

=C2=A0=

Thanks!

=C2=A0=

Alvaro.

=C2=A0=

On September 21, 2020 at 7:22:26 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) (pthubert@cisco.com) wrote= :

All very good questions, Michael,

And it seems that we are converging.

I read the quasi-suggestion that we align the default for MOP 7 to whether = 6LoWPAN HC is running on the medium? Looks good.

I have one last question, how does this discussion impact useofrpl and unaw= are-leaves, since they both define flags in the RPL DODAG config option. Sh= ould we converge the language? Do they all update RPL?

Talk to you all in a few hours,

Pascal

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
> Sent: lundi 21 septembre 2020 02:31
> To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.com>; roll@ietf.org; Ines =
> Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com>; Alvaro Retana
> <aretan= a.ietf@gmail.com>
> Subject: Agenda for Monday (Re: MOP=3D=3D7 live discussion )
>
>
> okay, here is my summary of the issues that are outstanding for roll-t= urnon-
> rfc8138.
> I am writing this in the hope that I've captured everything.
>
> 1) Will RFC8138 be enabled for MOP=3D=3D7? For what media?
> I see that my notion that it should be undefined is not reasonable, an= d I
> step back from this.
>
> 2) In what way does the format of the DIO Base Object depend upon the = MOP
> value? It seems that we need to update 6550 to say something.
>
> 3) While RUL document mandates that RULs must support 8138, it is not =
> clear to me if RULs can operate in a pre-8138 network. What if they > send 8138 compression?
> It may be that none of the compressions that 8138 creates
> will ever be emitted by a RUL, since they are all about IPIP compressi= on
> and RH3 compression, but I haven't checked.
>
> 4) we seem to be fine for 802.15.4 networks of all sorts.
> I suspect that we are okay for all the other layers (BTLE, DECT, BACne= t)
> that leverage rfc4944 through the various upgrades. But, we are sure? =
> What happens on devices with multiple interfaces of different types? <= br> > Maybe this is an RFC8138 issue really.
>
>
>
> --
> Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca> . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consultin= g )
> Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide
>
>
>

--0000000000008edfad05afd2fe39-- From nobody Mon Sep 21 09:59:34 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9924E3A0783; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 09:59:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160070757358.32585.7941100090114021179@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 09:59:33 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-12.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 16:59:34 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Root initiated routing state in RPL Authors : Pascal Thubert Rahul Arvind Jadhav Matthew Gillmore Filename : draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-12.txt Pages : 34 Date : 2020-09-21 Abstract: This document enables a RPL Root to install and maintain Projected Routes within its DODAG, along a selected set of nodes that may or may not include self, for a chosen duration. This potentially enables routes that are more optimized or resilient than those obtained with the classical distributed operation of RPL, either in terms of the size of a source-route header or in terms of path length, which impacts both the latency and the packet delivery ratio. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-12.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-12 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:45:54 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160071395471.20401.6949662287254386726@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:45:54 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:45:55 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Using RPI Option Type, Routing Header for Source Routes and IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation in the RPL Data Plane Authors : Maria Ines Robles Michael C. Richardson Pascal Thubert Filename : draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt Pages : 63 Date : 2020-09-21 Abstract: This document looks at different data flows through LLN (Low-Power and Lossy Networks) where RPL (IPv6 Routing Protocol for Low-Power and Lossy Networks) is used to establish routing. The document enumerates the cases where RFC6553 (RPI Option Type), RFC6554 (Routing Header for Source Routes) and IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is required in data plane. This analysis provides the basis on which to design efficient compression of these headers. This document updates RFC6553 adding a change to the RPI Option Type. Additionally, this document updates RFC6550 defining a flag in the DIO Configuration option to indicate about this change and updates [RFC8138] as well to consider the new Option Type when the RPL Option is decompressed. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Sep 21 11:59:55 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D14163A0BE4 for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:59:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.835 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.835 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.398, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wfxWS0dpHrZi for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:59:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (minerva.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2a01:7e00::3d:b000]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E6CC03A0BDF for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:59:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (desktop4.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.16]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2FB9E1F450 for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:59:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id F227D1A01AF; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 14:59:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: roll@ietf.org In-reply-to: <160071395471.20401.6949662287254386726@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <160071395471.20401.6949662287254386726@ietfa.amsl.com> Comments: In-reply-to internet-drafts@ietf.org message dated "Mon, 21 Sep 2020 11:45:54 -0700." X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 14:59:46 -0400 Message-ID: <195789.1600714786@dooku> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:59:54 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 Hi, based upon a conversation this morning among the authors and useofrplin= fo and turnon-rfc8138, we arrived at the diffs above. The point is that the changes to MOP and the rename of the DODAG Configuration Options Flags registry would get done in the first document that uses them, which is useofrplinfo. I agreed to make the diffs required, and I hope that I got it right. Some bits of the diff: 4.3. Updates to RFC6550: Configuration Options and Mode of Operation=20 =20=20=20 RFC6550 section 6.7.6 describes the DODAG Configuration Option. In=20 this option are a series of Flags in the first octet of the payload.=20 These flags are described by the DODAG Configuration Option Flags=20 registry [dodagcfg], in section 20.14 of RFC6550.=20 =20=20=20 Anticipating future work to revise RPL relating to how the LLN and=20 DODAG is configured, this document changes the interpretation of the=20 [dodagcfg] Registry to be limited to Mode-of-Operation (MOP)=20 specific. The MOP is described in [RFC6550] section 6.3.1. The=20 Options Flags Registry is renamed, and applies to MOP values zero (0)= =20 to six (6) only, leaving the flags reserved for MOP value seven (7).=20 =20=20=20 In addition, this document reserves MOP value 7 for future expansion. ... 11.2. Changes to DODAG Configuration Options Flags=20 =20=20=20 This document changes the name of the "DODAG Configuration Option=20 Flags" [dodagcfg] to "DODAG Configuration Option Flags for MOP 0..6".= =20 =20=20=20 11.3. Change MOP value 7 to Reserved=20 =20=20=20 This document changes the allocation status of the Mode of Operation=20 (MOP) [ianamop] from Unassigned to Reserved. This change is in=20 support of future work related to capabilities. The MOPEX document would then allocate the value, but nobody else can use it before then. =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20= =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20= =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =2D-=20 ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh network= s [=20 ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | network architect= [=20 ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails = [=20 =09 --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEERK+9HEcJHTJ9UqTMlUzhVv38QpAFAl9o+CIACgkQlUzhVv38 QpDehQgAq4FpQtk1rk746Q7lzOjYj5LhpTMiMdqDWBqaVghHbJIF1LKobrM6ykga 5s5YkmDHdnrXtaE2ZB9HTCD1JH8HZ6v0LXF8kH37FhfohZH26l89m1Cqw7Wehclb x/R3bSjsojwEL/gGrByRdLT67mSFyOda1jXrmOKGq+EsWIiGHIV9GvTpFBRiakqY yRGhnma6NeouDbsgNIPJbrkvM/43QnZBcxBDuV9/iGdIc9G4erXIP5Km9DVTwaHH 73mNvG4kbr3XF4+KGQnpedoo1xFhpdKllHt2BFWqYw1B4Nh4tyPRt1CYOoc49iZF 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charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 20:46:32 -0000 On September 21, 2020 at 3:00:00 PM, Michael Richardson wrote: > internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 Michael: At first glance the diffs look good to me too. But I have a question: =C2=A74.3 now reads: "For a MOP value of 7, a node SHOULD assume that the RPI 0x23 option is enabled." =C2=A0When is it ok for a node to assume that the RPI 0x23 option is not enabled? =C2=A0IOW, why is the behavior recommended but not required? =C2=A0It seems to me that the behavior may not be consistent. Also, please reword so that the normative action is not to "assume"; maybe something like "use 0x23"... Thanks! Alvaro. From nobody Mon Sep 21 18:13:02 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E084F3A0F9E for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:13:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.835 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.835 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.398, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id axLWnGxSbkaN for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.sandelman.ca (minerva.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2a01:7e00::3d:b000]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 862533A0F9D for ; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 18:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dooku.sandelman.ca (CPE788a207f397a-CMbc4dfb96bb50.sdns.net.rogers.com [174.116.121.43]) by relay.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1ED4C1F450 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 01:12:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: by dooku.sandelman.ca (Postfix, from userid 179) id ECCC11A01AF; Mon, 21 Sep 2020 21:12:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-reply-to: References: <160071395471.20401.6949662287254386726@ietfa.amsl.com> <195789.1600714786@dooku> Comments: In-reply-to Alvaro Retana message dated "Mon, 21 Sep 2020 13:46:28 -0700." X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2020 21:12:55 -0400 Message-ID: <205580.1600737175@dooku> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2020 01:13:01 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alvaro Retana wrote: >> internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: >> > A diff from the previous version is available at: >> > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-useofrplinfo-41 > Michael: > At first glance the diffs look good to me too. > But I have a question: =C2=A74.3 now reads: "For a MOP value of 7, a = node > SHOULD assume that the RPI 0x23 option is enabled." =C2=A0When is it = ok for > a node to assume that the RPI 0x23 option is not enabled? =C2=A0IOW, = why is > the behavior recommended but not required? =C2=A0It seems to me that = the > behavior may not be consistent. I always like to hedge my bet with SHOULD rather than MUST :-) I can imagine: 1) local configuration says use 0x63. 2) some heuristic that says, if you receive 0x63, you send 0x63. But, I am okay with changing that to MUST. =2D- Michael Richardson , Sandelman Software Works -=3D IPv6 IoT consulting =3D- --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEERK+9HEcJHTJ9UqTMlUzhVv38QpAFAl9pT5cACgkQlUzhVv38 QpBFFwf+KlOHAm1PGhof08yqgWKm+GcJM8rc+lb2WoICgedF4HAiwAWmjN0RsciO D5wvvaL3R+dhrnEySU3C/90fBLsFOmsRnjRXvihUbjaucqESx2g4A44i1t+jHK6t MAEh+GLT08diGqzXJA5Ccsp/hgDj50s/bE67eBgmvpf7UtrEVdU3fbiXtLGTvdZ0 t8GZY+DqvtTYzXmfdp2s4ClzwN55JYdDxionWWRmZ2c6BZetO9nheEOOpSebfMkC OJ8IxjAJ/0oL/MLWiO1lxfgHv6mU92b4o8UFTLXcJYTkquRc/KNF50RDy2EtMKN/ N5zed3T4poPc8ZM6Qm0ml46ZvVbcZg== =5dmS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Tue Sep 22 04:05:30 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E1853A0BE6 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 04:05:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.619 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.619 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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boundary="_000_MN2PR11MB356579DFCCC250A2BAFCF206D83B0MN2PR11MB3565namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 2f74f380-0c62-4129-06a5-08d85ee76675 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 22 Sep 2020 11:05:22.1597 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: jWM9qjzfD5JckZuIJeypj9RETIBvXvwXiinfAT1jvAXlDym1cifQHTwDikVuOgdEslcfmNR+FXinBEGpBH4zpw== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3678 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.11, xch-rcd-001.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-7.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:05:28 -0000 --_000_MN2PR11MB356579DFCCC250A2BAFCF206D83B0MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear all ; Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case, we are buildi= ng a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress, where the Track is = signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and the destin= ation IPv6 address. The outer header may also have a SRH in case of non sto= ring P DAO. In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Option (RTO) = to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indicate the h= ops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of its child= ren or siblings. How can we signal that these guys are reachable over the t= unnel? Proposal A) If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consistent with RPL = to use: - one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can be any of the = children and siblings - Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the tunnel egres= s - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) The result would be that the Track terminates at the "Parent" indicated in = the TIO but can be used to reach any of the children and siblings indicates= as targets Proposal B) Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet Flows should be placed in = the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we'd need the 6tuple= . If we take that path, we'd need to create a new Flow option that is a Flo= w descriptor, in which case we'd get - one or more Flow Options to indicate which flows are encapsulated in the= Track - Exactly one RTO (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Proposal = A) to indicate the tunnel egress - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) What do you guys think? Pascal --_000_MN2PR11MB356579DFCCC250A2BAFCF206D83B0MN2PR11MB3565namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear all ;

 

Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case,=   we are building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress,= where the Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and the destination IPv6 address. The o= uter header may also have a SRH in case of non storing P DAO.

 

In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Targe= t Option (RTO) to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to= indicate the hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of its children or siblings. How can we= signal that these guys are reachable over the tunnel?

 

Proposal A)

 

If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consi= stent with RPL to use:

- one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can= be any of the children and siblings

- Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate t= he tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do)

 

The result would be that the Track terminates at the “= Parent” indicated in the TIO but can be used to reach any of the chil= dren and siblings indicates as targets

 

Proposal B)

 

Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet Flows shoul= d be placed in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we= 217;d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we’d need to create a new Flow option that is a Flow descriptor, in which case = we’d get

- one or more Flow Options to indicate which flows  are= encapsulated in the Track

- Exactly one RTO  (as we currently do) OR Exactly one = TIO (as in Proposal A) to indicate the tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do)

 

 

What do you guys think?

 

Pascal

 

--_000_MN2PR11MB356579DFCCC250A2BAFCF206D83B0MN2PR11MB3565namp_-- From nobody Tue Sep 22 08:28:20 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFCD33A16E6 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 08:28:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TGWGCXXK1dV2 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 08:28:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9924A3A16E5 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 08:28:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10341389A1 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:06:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 0IywTHCiYaPQ for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:06:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (unknown [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2:103c:9eff:fecb:2eac]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610B33899F for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:06:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 614494F5 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 11:28:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2020 15:28:19 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\) wrote: > Proposal B) > Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet Flows should be placed > in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we'd need the > 6tuple. If we take that path, we'd need to create a new Flow option > that is a Flow descriptor, in which case we'd get This seems to pull in requirements that maybe are not well understood by everyone. It sounds like it is a more general solution which can be reduced somehow to proposal (A)? > - one or more Flow Options to indicate which flows are encapsulated in the Track > - Exactly one RTO (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Proposal A) to indicate the tunnel egress > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > What do you guys think? I don't know. -- ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh networks [ ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | IoT architect [ ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails [ --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9qGA4ACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUuSQgAoq0ZPFmEfLdkurNh4B7xXfrSlCTUST3g09RkBoDABcboKav7Xov8n158 y8jng5tHrbjeszLR2Yw/ioRycpGo8mJS6U4pwA8iNOONcGCID3ZRlugU3YWTvFsv NBdRSJHmbfjH1FNobnH6J5JM7osmHmkYRwhK/MxkAYFe4f45mB5fM5rG9b88UOzK cfcZJH1uaEnt8s28FEU1U9gxO4lO0TZWd9nx0zHrorNVrr1+6g3A5QDIhVSY0lc9 lqSP3223K5dENFhlPWHTMtS1MhBH24iRTTAOk9/sKLcNWFFUnMvwW/55L1dIeW95 W0ohp4uhZAqSm7Mu9x7gHPo7GagJUw== =ocgX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Tue Sep 22 08:40:56 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 637DE3A0766 for ; Tue, 22 Sep 2020 08:40:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Wed, 23 Sep 2020 08:16:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rahul Jadhav Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 20:46:21 +0530 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000097240b05affc91de" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 15:16:58 -0000 --00000000000097240b05affc91de Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pascal, I have a few questions in the context (with respect to the problem statement, not proposals): Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which could contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblings. The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install these target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you mentioned? Using this the root can install routers not only to the egress but also to its immediate children, isn't it? Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only for the egress's children/siblings? Is this the objective to achieve? It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discussion on. One another point: The draft talks about "serial Track" .. is that synonymous to the "serial path" you mentioned in your mail. Does serial Track indicate a track with a single projected segment? Would be better to have this term described in the terminology section in the doc. Thanks. Best, Rahul On Tue, 22 Sep 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Dear all ; > > > > Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case, we are > building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress, where the > Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and > the destination IPv6 address. The outer header may also have a SRH in cas= e > of non storing P DAO. > > > > In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Option (RTO= ) > to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indicate the > hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of its > children or siblings. How can we signal that these guys are reachable ove= r > the tunnel? > > > > Proposal A) > > > > If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consistent with RP= L > to use: > > - one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can be any of th= e > children and siblings > > - Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the tunnel > egress > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > The result would be that the Track terminates at the =E2=80=9CParent=E2= =80=9D indicated in > the TIO but can be used to reach any of the children and siblings indicat= es > as targets > > > > Proposal B) > > > > Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet Flows should be placed i= n > the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we=E2=80=99d need = the > 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80=99d need to create a new Flow opti= on that is > a Flow descriptor, in which case we=E2=80=99d get > > - one or more Flow Options to indicate which flows are encapsulated in > the Track > > - Exactly one RTO (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Proposa= l > A) to indicate the tunnel egress > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > > > What do you guys think? > > > > Pascal > > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --00000000000097240b05affc91de Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Pascal,

I have a few questions in the context (w= ith respect to the problem statement, not proposals):

Currently, the= draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which could contain the egress= target and all the (immediate) children and siblings. The VIO option list = would contain all the hops on which to install these target routes. Doesn&#= 39;t this already handle the problem statement you mentioned? Using this th= e root can install routers not only to the egress but also to its immediate= children, isn't it?

Is the point to not install the route on be= half of egress but only for the egress's children/siblings? Is this the= objective to achieve?
It would be great to have a sample topology to ba= se this discussion on.

One another point: The draft talks about &quo= t;serial Track" .. is that synonymous to the "serial path" y= ou mentioned in your mail. Does serial Track indicate a track with a single= projected segment? Would be better to have this term described in the term= inology section in the doc. Thanks.

Best,
Rahul

On Tue, 22 Sep= 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

Dear all=C2=A0;

=C2=A0

Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case,= =C2=A0 we are building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress,= where the Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and the destination IPv6 address. The o= uter header may also have a SRH in case of non storing P DAO.

=C2=A0

In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target = Option (RTO) to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to i= ndicate the hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of its children or siblings. How can we= signal that these guys are reachable over the tunnel?=

=C2=A0

Proposal A)

=C2=A0

If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consist= ent with RPL to use:

- one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can b= e any of the children and siblings

- Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the= tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do)

=C2=A0

The result would be that the Track terminates at the =E2=80=9C= Parent=E2=80=9D indicated in the TIO but can be used to reach any of the ch= ildren and siblings indicates as targets

=C2=A0

Proposal B)

=C2=A0

Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet Flows should = be placed in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we=E2= =80=99d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80=99d need to create a new Flow option that is a Flow descriptor, in which case = we=E2=80=99d get

- one or more Flow Options to indicate which flows=C2=A0 are e= ncapsulated in the Track

- Exactly one RTO =C2=A0(as we currently do) OR Exactly one TI= O (as in Proposal A) to indicate the tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do)

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

What do you guys think?

=C2=A0

Pascal

=C2=A0

_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
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15.20.3391.026; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 16:39:22 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO Thread-Index: AdaQxACW+9AEP58UTgCAyyDLmy9JbwA+H2KAAAAgcuA= Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 16:39:12 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 16:39:09 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:bd76:14d7:8760:e99b] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: da7fc9db-4e91-49ae-e9ab-08d85fdf39c5 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB4725: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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Message-ID: <160094906518.27163.16109670240262409616@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 05:04:25 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:04:25 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2020-09-24 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and unset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:12:52 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Michael Richardson , Martin Duke , Benjamin Kaduk , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks" , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , The IESG , "Alvaro Retana" Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyACqqkkIAAO8YAgAAzb6aAAAQpAIAAVGSAgAiD2EA= Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:12:32 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:12:08 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> <117497.1600481093@dooku> In-Reply-To: <117497.1600481093@dooku> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: sandelman.ca; 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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: MN2PR11MB3565.namprd11.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: a6b1f607-d8d7-442c-ade6-08d860832971 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 24 Sep 2020 12:12:52.3894 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: ajEyRAHTb6OZOP8C96Qp1FusCn1yLzBnAQZyI6wl+NPkMmEpD1LNDWFPwqs3s1+MrreElwtqpWxwxeS7rEN6sg== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3808 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.12, xch-rcd-002.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: alln-core-1.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:13:01 -0000 Dear all Following the meeting last Monday and subsequent the update of useofrplinfo= by Michael (thanks Michael!) I published a new version of the turnon RFC 8= 138 draft. The major changes are - removed the formal update to RFC 6550=20 - refer to useofrplinfo as the justification why the flag is not defined fo= r MOP 7 - defined the operation in MOP 7 as compression on iff the Link uses 6LoPWA= N HC. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-16 Please let me know if there is some issue left with this! Keep safe, Pascal > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Richardson > Sent: samedi 19 septembre 2020 04:05 > To: Martin Duke ; Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > ; Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > ; Benjamin Kaduk ; > Alvaro Retana ; roll-chairs@ietf.org; Routing Ove= r > Low power and Lossy networks ; Ines Robles > ; draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org= ; > The IESG ; Alvaro Retana > Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rf= c8138- > 14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) >=20 >=20 > Martin Duke wrote: > > Again, I don't understand the protocol evolution model here, but is= n't the > > coder *already* in a fix if she encounters an unknown MOP? >=20 > YES, but, for an unknown MOP, they can become an RPL-aware leaf. > However, they can't if they don't know if they are allowed to turn on 813= 8 or > not. (or maybe forbidden from having it off!) For almost any other contro= l > plane option, it wouldn't matter, but this is actually a dataplane contro= l option. >=20 > ** Perhaps I'm being too anal about saying that MOP=3D=3D7 that 8138 acti= on > should not be > ** defined here, but by a future document. >=20 > I'm actually now convinced I am. > I think it's fine to say that for MOP=3D=3D7, one should assume 8138 is t= urned on, > for media on which it makes sense. >=20 > 8138 is afterall, a 6lowpan thing, and RPL can run on other media! >=20 > Part of the issue is that the *mopex* document assumes that MOP=3D=3D7 wi= ll > mean that there is a mopex. (as I recall). >=20 >=20 >=20 > -- > ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh netwo= rks [ > ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | network archite= ct [ > ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails= [ >=20 From nobody Thu Sep 24 05:35:26 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DD153A0A1C; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 05:35:20 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160095092001.18257.7401232374298087787@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 05:35:20 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-20.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 12:35:20 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Routing for RPL Leaves Authors : Pascal Thubert Michael C. Richardson Filename : draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-20.txt Pages : 33 Date : 2020-09-24 Abstract: This specification extends RFC6550 and RFC8505 to provide routing services to Hosts called RPL Unaware Leaves that implement 6LoWPAN ND but do not participate in RPL. This specification also enables the RPL Root to proxy the 6LoWPAN keep-alive flows in its DODAG. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-20.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-20 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Sep 24 05:43:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D3BB3A0A2B; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 05:43:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.621 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.621 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com header.b=eSfNl8Pc; dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=cisco.onmicrosoft.com header.b=bu8V8mlS 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DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xd1JsFVdJNVFm5LRVREUqQawn9MjC1YMAf4djnhbNqY=; b=LqaG4PgeuDIygtRpTKz0ASsR/pWm9K/CDXGMnB3NETVBaKYYwaj54MBh/8qVg8AdcG k9QVE5MdvKsPrDwPnZe9H99mbM8QqLkkFnrqGVtrzRrVCtfMSx2eSIAqxh0du1JyVzwf +sAEwYrg4R1EbhhrNm4Av/GjM7iSx25D+HQCQ3pFnSch86Gpl+tAzbS8LsM59yHm/cwU fMovHUC/nzJR8uTqsmExO9rfOdVw9PSM0qOqAUFIWH11gUVeGtJnrO/qjcq4O4j0wT8N 6YV1mh/LlsFFGJBczEiHAE+EwJ7IH/HT8tHpMDqgPdUOBg8Xq2yYHRpwgHuBKafV3+Mi +dVA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xd1JsFVdJNVFm5LRVREUqQawn9MjC1YMAf4djnhbNqY=; b=DhYRB1UaCQBXL9XSB7h5wXNJh2QzqXe7Y2sPf5gRi4GFdZQCYDRS/MceqfKo+fKa/A WcDb456gmQpqQAEBEw8rRwyg6xIt5jp631x1g/O7vurGAK1IpoRmejTpvTop+ODvbCAj 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2020 11:48:31 -0400 Message-ID: To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" Cc: Benjamin Kaduk , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Martin Duke , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , Michael Richardson Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 15:48:39 -0000 On September 24, 2020 at 8:13:09 AM, Pascal Thubert wrote: Pascal: Hi! > Following the meeting last Monday and subsequent the update of useofrplin= fo > by Michael (thanks Michael!) I published a new version of the turnon RFC > 8138 draft. > > The major changes are > - removed the formal update to RFC 6550 > - refer to useofrplinfo as the justification why the flag is not defined = for > MOP 7 > - defined the operation in MOP 7 as compression on iff the Link uses 6LoP= WAN > HC. Thanks for these changes. Because we have to cycle useofrplinfo back through (when the WG is done with it), I asked Ben/Martin to wait for that before coming back to this document. =C2=A0It'll make it easier than tracking multiple changes. :-) OTOH, I do have comments on the recent change: OLD> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 4.3 of [USEofRPLinfo] updates [RFC6550] to indicate th= at the =C2=A0 =C2=A0definition of the Flags applies to Mode of Operation (MOP) val= ues =C2=A0 =C2=A0zero (0) to six (6) only, leaving the flags reserved for MOP v= alue =C2=A0 =C2=A0seven (7). =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, the bit in position 2 i= s considered =C2=A0 =C2=A0unallocated and [RFC8138] MUST be used on Links where 6LoWPAN = Header =C2=A0 =C2=A0Compression [RFC6282] applies and MUST NOT be used otherwise. NEW> =C2=A0 =C2=A0Section 4.3 of [USEofRPLinfo] updates [RFC6550] to indicate th= at the =C2=A0 =C2=A0definition of the Flags applies to Mode of Operation (MOP) val= ues zero (0) =C2=A0 =C2=A0to six (6) only. =C2=A0For a MOP value of 7, [RFC8138] MUST be= used on Links =C2=A0 =C2=A0where 6LoWPAN Header Compression [RFC6282] applies and MUST NO= T be used =C2=A0 =C2=A0otherwise. Thanks! Alvaro. 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15.20.3391.026; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 15:55:22 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Alvaro Retana CC: Benjamin Kaduk , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Martin Duke , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "Michael Richardson" Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyACqqkkIAAO8YAgAAzb6aAAAQpAIAAVGSAgAiD2ECAAD3vgIAAAQhg Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 15:54:52 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 15:54:11 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> <117497.1600481093@dooku> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 83735abd-2869-40ef-ac2d-08d860a23eb4 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 24 Sep 2020 15:55:22.4042 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: ybHijeYrDqUZySHtNV+WoEWeeJbj/Okx4zhhaZk0XKJGWJ84dDy+deBgBVlN67yz4SNsNlixeBJYn98A/wRB7Q== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB3870 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.14, xch-rcd-004.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-6.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 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with ESMTP id E_HvscTItOiD for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:14:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CB57C3A11ED for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:14:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF347389C3; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 13:53:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id SgL1TgEK3a7z; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 13:53:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B73C389BD; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 13:53:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 294B64DB; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 14:14:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: "Pascal Thubert \(pthubert\)" , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] AD Review of draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-18 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 18:14:58 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Following up on the call on Monday and Michael's changes in > useofrplinfo I published a version 20 of this draft. > You'll find that it still updates RFC 6550 and RFC 8505. The reasons > are in eth second mail. ... > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-20 All looks good to me. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9s4goACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWDAAgAumllt55kXhUZM0L3apnz/HiwMivKY6xyGKTxP4M53g3UDrtAIxLdAQQ3 qQ/TEzCymnXYqawZExSyTymTYPPWSGYetltlP+jT3hPM6GulgymyjmDIL5+KqCwA BY/p8rzbPU0wRgNSODKzrNNT3o0e+Lp8PWsbS0KvrBwm2tWCjhhQuvHQ57Z0TFUX cp8cibeVTTmjkj7j1XaeH+ZpOBeApHZmsSQM9Ffmi20W+xvjIZBV6FSg3dNdjCzt +ILz4WlNVV2Fw9+qACQ9e4nTxqwgZl03LXSs10eo91nADeFHa6WI11ZNDj4/AutW zcswpUMFpY/nEpFWzMqArOUnQvEZXA== =RZd4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Thu Sep 24 11:38:01 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ECD53A1221 for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:38:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KUkTRes_hlPD for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:37:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pj1-x102e.google.com (mail-pj1-x102e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::102e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D8AFB3A121C for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:37:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pj1-x102e.google.com with SMTP id md22so158936pjb.0 for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:37:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version; bh=sFARipYoebzNjh1bc8IuFncSww3LAif+DTAMFUd+GQI=; b=kXUGDVKRkNmO/vJUmejsAlnihHwtvxYhWOIRKzY3F7b3BzxWgiHoMn/mcCPCof9bIG LHCNf/OXc4FT7l/elcKNQaGuarxwTu7u9U+s0KOFwQ3HJ4e1kRQ7Ekbb51smW3xMswS8 vVNeQkl0vZGYSo/aelYEvJjzMVMUCnUimsFdeD8qEQeDNhMN9KQicSRo3gzROXtknPuj oAVxXEsYj8S2Lx9S172/WikRThhZmxqsQLOMojKUDw6IpBhEC/K0csbBFJHpNZmaQ3/+ toRercbWT6y9VDg4Yh3Och81XtlK7T5acCLrucfEjBPR7p4J95qOezRvAjTboTwvx+8d /EFA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to :references:subject:mime-version; bh=sFARipYoebzNjh1bc8IuFncSww3LAif+DTAMFUd+GQI=; b=Kdfp1hnMybO2rE6gi14F7pyR2mpMw8uMQ9mCCGJ1CA/I0rQ5FkUxW+f3nxNnhdoXG2 EWtQuHNJcDwOt6uqnsnpCYSBgOVjmR0oElSqTM2gEG8N7ET6fMhaO2uoIyd1/pjbEXxH FUdqe3bX0ESgRbR2g/IsokbxpEf28ICj69W4iK5q+Hg/iwelYGxmfA9REI5ELvqt90JM VBM4wceTrpOOAgJmn+fhuHIVXbIvqsmAx/WDjRE5MsajEolgN4t0Aw6FkjPW47FoUGea Pmegc2xkqc3V2sptDoo/W7qYnvnYsrNw3Pum+uUS/FCUan4Y8Zrb1MFJkrh4mcn94vMf +hgA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Sp1TxKlooPbY7jYKKmc5DgsQ1l97CYgxY1SthETh9krYr1zk1 OeDDJmmlwccqatxeHdbb5fxNjEBm23h0Qw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxRv4Dryhlsn+tIhaUGuCaVtpBl3E56B+YOcD6z3I5AYNKUixrnzPRDbgBs3g84M1NsbHqlgQ== X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:d789:: with SMTP id z9mr281225pju.226.1600972676654; Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:37:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora ([223.226.27.61]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 187sm177300pfx.174.2020.09.24.11.37.54 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Thu, 24 Sep 2020 11:37:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 00:07:53 +0530 From: Rahul Jadhav To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mailspring MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="5f6ce781_5704ff9_de8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2020 18:38:00 -0000 --5f6ce781_5704ff9_de8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Thanks Pascal for the detailed example. The problem stmt is now clear to = me and the need for TIO with parent address of egress node. =46ew comments inline. Best, Rahul On Sep 23 2020, at 10:09 pm, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > > Hello Rahul > > > > Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which coul= d contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblings= . The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install thes= e target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you me= ntioned=3F Using this the root can install routers not only to the egress= but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F > > I thought so, but I felt there was something wring and digging I found = it. > > > Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only fo= r the egress's children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F > It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discussion on.= > > > > Ye, we=E2=80=99d like to be able to use the Track to reach siblings wou= ldn=E2=80=99t we=3F If so let=E2=80=99s look at signaling and encapsulati= on: > > The =E2=80=9CTrack=E2=80=9D that P DAO sets up is a path between a pair= of nodes, call them I and E like ingress and egress. Currently E is indi= cated in an RTO and the Hops in an RPO (VIO or SRVIO). > > If I talks to E, it can do like we do in useofrplinfo for Root to RAN, = that is create a packet with destination (that is E), an RPI with the loc= al RPL instance of the Track (rooted at E), and an SRH if this is a SR VI= O. No encaps. > > Now say that we want node I to send its packets to one of E=E2=80=99s s= ibling, S over the Track to E. Still following useofrplinfo, node I needs= to encaps the packet I-> S in a packet I->E to add the RPI with the loca= l RPL instance ID that is taken from E=E2=80=99s name space, and possibly= an SRH. > > We also see that signaling that we build a Track I->E (which comes as a= aside effect with a route to E) is not the same thing as signaling a rou= te to S via the Track before. =5BRJ=5D This was my assumption which went wrong. I not get that, to send a packet to destination S via E, an encapsulation= is needed. The outer destination is E and inner is S. =46or node I to cr= eate this encapsulation it needs to know that node E is the egress for S.= The proposed TIO(E) option identifies this. There could be many S nodes reachable via the Track to E. Thus my proposal to encode S in RTO, E in TIO, and then the SRVIO. There = could be multiple RTOs as usual, for all the siblings and children of E t= hat we want to reach through the tunnel, but only one TIO since the track= (tunnel) has only one egress. > > > So we=E2=80=99d get RTO*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO*) . Whether E is implicit= ly a destination or we need an RTO for E as well is to be debated, see be= low. > > It can get worse: say that a child of I sends a packet to E. =46ollowin= g the default route, that packet reaches I. I needs to decide whether to = use the default topology (via the Root) or the Track. We have not really = defined how that is programmed in I, but the current text says that the P= DAO routes have a better admin distance, so current text says we use the= Track. With DetNet and RAW, it=E2=80=99s flows that get routed over the = Track, signaled by a 6tuple (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-= ietf-detnet-ip-07=23section-3). So really we=E2=80=99d need another optio= n that carries the 6tuple (say a flow info option, =46IO) and use it as w= e use the RTOs to signal which flows are routed in the Track. > > In that case the P DAO would have (=46IO=7CRTO)*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO*)= > > Did I make the problem more clear=3F =5BRJ=5D Yep. After reading through detnet draft, I now understand the ne= ed for =46low Info Option. Need to re-read the draft considering this. > One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is that = synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does seri= al Track indicate a track with a single projected segment=3F Would be bet= ter to have this term described in the terminology section in the doc. Th= anks. Yes, I should use only one of the two. 6TiSCH defines serial and complex = Tracks (see https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6tisch-archi= tecture-29=23section-4.5.2). OK that I align=3F =E2=80=9C A Projected Route is a serial path that may represent the end-to-end route or only a Segment in a complex Track, in which case multiple Projected Routes are installed with the same tuple (Target address, TrackID) and a different Segment ID each. =E2=80=A6 An RPO indicates a Projected Route that can be a serial Track in full or a Segment of a more complex Track. In Non-Storing Mode, multiple RPO may be placed after a same Target Option to reflect different Segments originated at this node. The Track is identified by a TrackID that is a Local RPLInstanceID to the Target of the Track. =E2=80=9C =5BRJ=5D Yes, we can align to this. > > Keep safe; > > Pascal > > =46rom: Roll On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav > Sent: mercredi 23 septembre 2020 17:16 > To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO > > > > > > Hi Pascal, > I have a few questions in the context (with respect to the problem stat= ement, not proposals): > Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which could = contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblings. = The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install these = target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you ment= ioned=3F Using this the root can install routers not only to the egress b= ut also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F > Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only for = the egress's children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F > It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discussion on.= > > One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is that = synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does seri= al Track indicate a track with a single projected segment=3F Would be bet= ter to have this term described in the terminology section in the doc. Th= anks. > Best, > Rahul > > > > > On Tue, 22 Sep 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > > Dear all ; > > > > > > Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case, we are b= uilding a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress, where the Tr= ack is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and t= he destination IPv6 address. The outer header may also have a SRH in case= of non storing P DAO. > > > > In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Option = (RTO) to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indica= te the hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of= its children or siblings. How can we signal that these guys are reachabl= e over the tunnel=3F > > > > Proposal A) > > > > If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consistent wit= h RPL to use: > > - one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can be any o= f the children and siblings > > - Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the tunnel= egress > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > The result would be that the Track terminates at the =E2=80=9CParent=E2= =80=9D indicated in the TIO but can be used to reach any of the children = and siblings indicates as targets > > > > Proposal B) > > > > Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet =46lows should be pl= aced in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we=E2=80=99= d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80=99d need to create a ne= w =46low option that is a =46low descriptor, in which case we=E2=80=99d g= et > > - one or more =46low Options to indicate which flows are encapsulated= in the Track > > - Exactly one RTO (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Prop= osal A) to indicate the tunnel egress > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > > > What do you guys think=3F > > > > Pascal > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > > Roll mailing list > > Roll=40ietf.org (mailto:Roll=40ietf.org) > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > Roll mailing list > Roll=40ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll --5f6ce781_5704ff9_de8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Thanks Pascal for the detailed example. The problem stmt is now clea= r to me and the need for TIO with parent address of egress node.
=46ew comments inline.

Best,
Rahul

On Sep 23 2020, at 10:09 pm, = Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D40cisco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org>= wrote:
  
Hello Rahul
 

> Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which coul= d contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblings= . The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install thes= e target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you me= ntioned=3F Using this the root can install routers not only to the egress= but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F

 

I thought so, but I felt there was something wring and digging I= found it.

 

> Is the poi= nt to not install the route on behalf of egress but only for the egress's= children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F
It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discu= ssion on.

&nb= sp;

Ye, we=E2=80=99= d like to be able to use the Track to reach siblings wouldn=E2=80=99t we=3F= If so let=E2=80=99s look at signaling and encapsulation:
 

The =E2=80=9CTrack=E2=80=9D that P DAO sets up= is a path between a pair of nodes, call them I and E like ingress and eg= ress. Currently E is indicated in an RTO and the Hops in an RPO (VIO or S= RVIO).

 

If I talks to E, it can = do like we do in useofrplinfo for Root to RAN, that is create a packet wi= th destination (that is E), an RPI with the local RPL instance of the Tra= ck (rooted at E), and an SRH if this is a SR VIO. No encaps.

 

<= div class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>Now say that we want node I to send its pac= kets to one of E=E2=80=99s sibling, S over the Track to E. Still followin= g useofrplinfo, node I needs to encaps the packet I-> S in a packet I-= >E to add the RPI with the local RPL instance ID that is taken from E=E2= =80=99s name space, and possibly an SRH.

 

We also see that signaling that we build a Track I->E (which = comes as a aside effect with a route to E) is not the same thing as signa= ling a route to S via the Track before.

=5B= RJ=5D This was my assumption which went wrong.
I not get that, to send a packet to destination S= via E, an encapsulation is needed. The outer destination is E and inner = is S. =46or node I to create this encapsulation it needs to know that nod= e E is the egress for S. The proposed TIO(E) option identifies this.


There could be many= S nodes reachable via the Track to E.

 

Thus my proposal to encode S in RTO, E in TIO, and then the SRVIO. = There could be multiple RTOs as usual, for all the siblings and children = of E that we want to reach through the tunnel, but only one TIO since the= track (tunnel) has only one egress.  

=  

So we=E2=80=99= d get RTO*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO*) . Whether E is implicitly a destination= or we need an RTO for E as well is to be debated, see below.

 

=
It can get worse: say that a child of I se= nds a packet to E. =46ollowing the default route, that packet reaches I. = I needs to decide whether to use the default topology (via the Root) or t= he Track. We have not really defined how that is programmed in I, but the= current text says that the P DAO routes have a better admin distance, so= current text says we use the Track. With DetNet and RAW, it=E2=80=99s fl= ows that get routed over the Track, signaled by a 6tuple (<= font style=3D=22font-family:Calibri=22>https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/dr= aft-ietf-detnet-ip-07=23section-3). So really we=E2=80= =99d need another option that carries the 6tuple (say  a flow info o= ption, =46IO) and use it as we use the RTOs to signal which flows are rou= ted in the Track.

&= nbsp;

In that case th= e P DAO would have (=46IO=7CRTO)*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO*)
 

Did I make the problem more clear=3F
=5BRJ=5D Yep. After reading through detnet draft, I now unde= rstand the need for =46low Info Option. Need to re-read the draft conside= ring this.

 
> One another point: The draft = talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is that synonymous to the =22serial pat= h=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does serial Track indicate a track with = a single projected segment=3F Would be better to have this term described= in the terminology section in the doc. Thanks.

 

Yes, I should use only one of the two. 6TiSCH defines seri= al and complex Tracks (see https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft= -ietf-6tisch-architecture-29=23section-4.5.2). OK tha= t I align=3F

=E2=80= =9C

 <= /div>
 

   A Projected Route is a serial path that may represe= nt the end-to-end

 &= nbsp; route or only a Segment in a complex Track, in which case multiple<= /font>

   Projected Ro= utes are installed with the same tuple (Target address,

   TrackID) and a different Segm= ent ID each.

<= font style=3D=22font-family:Calibri=22> 

=E2=80=A6

 <= /div>
   An RPO indicates a Projected Route that can be a serial Tra=
ck in full
   or a Segment of a more c=
omplex Track.  In Non-Storing Mode, multiple
   RPO may be placed after a same Target Option to reflect dif=
ferent
   Segments originated at this=
 node.  The Track is identified by a
 =
;  TrackID that is a Local RPLInstanceID to the Target of the Track.=

 

=E2=80=9C

=5BRJ=5D Yes, we can al= ign to this.


Keep safe;
<= br>
<= font style=3D=22font-size:11pt=22> 

Pascal

 

=46rom: Roll <rol= l-bounces=40ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav
=
Sent: mercredi 23 septembre 2020 17:16
To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks &l= t;roll=40ietf.org>
Subject: Re: =5BRol= l=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO
 

Hi Pascal,

I have a few questio= ns in the context (with respect to the problem statement, not proposals):=

Currently, the draft allows the Root to se= nd multiple RTOs which could contain the egress target and all the (immed= iate) children and siblings. The VIO option list would contain all the ho= ps on which to install these target routes. Doesn't this already handle t= he problem statement you mentioned=3F Using this the root can install rou= ters not only to the egress but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F=

Is the point to not install the route on b= ehalf of egress but only for the egress's children/siblings=3F Is this th= e objective to achieve=3F
It would be great to = have a sample topology to base this discussion on.
One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is= that synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Doe= s serial Track indicate a track with a single projected segment=3F Would = be better to have this term described in the terminology section in the d= oc. Thanks.

Best,
<= font style=3D=22font-family:Calibri=22>Rahul
&nbs= p;

On Tue= , 22 Sep 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D<= /font>40cisco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Dear all ;

 

Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case= ,  we are building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egre= ss, where the Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID = in the RPI and the destination IPv6 address. The outer header may also ha= ve a SRH in case of non storing P DAO.

 

In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Optio= n (RTO) to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indi= cate the hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one = of its children or siblings. How can we signal that these guys are reacha= ble over the tunnel=3F

 

Proposal A)<= /font>

 

If we want to be able to signal= that, it could be more consistent with RPL to use:
- one or more RTOs to indicate the targe= ts of the route, can be any of the children and siblings
- Exactly one Transit Information Opt= ion (TIO) to indicate the tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currentl= y do)

 

The result would be that th= e Track terminates at the =E2=80=9CParent=E2=80=9D indicated in the TIO b= ut can be used to reach any of the children and siblings indicates as tar= gets

 

Proposal B)
 

Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetN= et =46lows should be placed in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not su= fficient and we=E2=80=99d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80= =99d need to create a new =46low option that is a =46low descriptor, in w= hich case we=E2=80=99d get

- one or more =46low Options to indicate which flows  are en= capsulated in the Track

- Exactly one RTO  (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in P= roposal A) to indicate the tunnel egress

- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currentl= y do)

 

 
<= br>
<= font style=3D=22font-size:11pt=22>What do you guys think=3F=

 

Pascal

 
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2002:a1f:dec7:: with SMTP id v190mr755469vkg.24.1601040282571; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 06:24:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 16:24:06 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000050557805b0233dfa" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] ROLL Meeting at the IETF 109 - Request for comments X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 13:24:45 -0000 --00000000000050557805b0233dfa Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, We kindly remind you to fill the following survey in order to know if we should have a ROLL meeting as part of the IETF 109. https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH Thank you very much for your input. Ines and Dominique. On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 11:43 AM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > We kindly request to fill the following survey in order to know if we > should have a ROLL meeting as part of the IETF 109. > > https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH > > Please fill the survey by *25th September.* > > Thank you very much for your input. > > Ines and Dominique. > --00000000000050557805b0233dfa Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

We kindly remind you to fill = the following survey in order to know if we should have a ROLL meeting as p= art of the IETF 109.


Thank you very much for your input.

Ines and Dominique.

On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at= 11:43 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

<= div>We kindly request to fill the following survey in order to know if we s= hould have a ROLL meeting as part of the IETF 109.

https= ://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH

Please f= ill the survey by 25th September.

Thank you= very much for your input.

Ines and Dominique.
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Rahul Jadhav To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Message-ID: <51EFCCF8-A6AA-4E39-8DCE-B264CCDCD039@getmailspring.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mailspring MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="5f6e33ee_2d7def68_e0c" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:16:22 -0000 --5f6e33ee_2d7def68_e0c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Very interesting=21 But, wouldn't this mandate that only Global DODAG roots can initiate a P-= DAO request=3F Isn't it currently possible for a local DODAG (with local RPLInstanceID) = root to initiate a P-DAO request=3F If yes, then the DAO base object cann= ot be used as mentioned by you. I didn't find any mandate in DAO projection draft that local DODAG roots = cannot initiate a P-DAO. Regards, Rahul On Sep 25 2020, at 9:29 pm, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > > Hello again Rahul and all > > > The Track Egress is the Root of DODAG that we build and we call it a Tr= ack. > =46or a Track, the RPLInstanceID is a local one, that is associated to = the Track Egress, and we call it a TrackID. > > Now, trying to make work the below, it seems better that instead of usi= ng a TIO, we could signal the Egress and TrackID in the DAO itself as fol= lows: > > 0 1 2 3 > 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > =7C TrackID =7CK=7CD=7C =46lags =7C Reserved =7C DAOSequence =7C > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > =7C =7C > + + > =7C =7C > + Track Egress + > =7C =7C > + + > =7C =7C > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > =7C Option(s)... > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > > =46igure 16: The DAO Base Object > > > This seems to make more sense than using a TIO. > > Works=3F > > Pascal > > > > =46rom: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) > Sent: vendredi 25 septembre 2020 09:56 > To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Subject: RE: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO > > > > > > Hello Rahul, > > Yes, this gets quite a lot of things to put together but in the end it = is not so complicated if you have a picture to look at. > I=E2=80=99ll make some for the interim. > > My to do=E2=80=99s on this draft for the next version: > > - Align the =E2=80=9Cserial=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9CComplex=E2=80=9D Trac= k terminology between 6TiSCH, RAW n=E2=80=99 ROLL. > > - Create an initial format for =46IO based in DetNet. > -> Do you see any more field we=E2=80=99d like to see in there, e.g., t= he capability to inject a Track in another=3F > > - Describe that the TIO points on the tunnel egress, and that routes vi= a the tunnel are signaled as targets in RTOs > -> a side effect is that the sequence and lifetimes are now taken from = the TIO so they are not needed in the (SR)VIO. This makes good sense IMHO= . > -> should the route to the egress be automatically added=3F There could= be times where only some flows should go there. Maybe we could use a fla= g in the TIO to signal it=3F > > Many thanks for your help=21 > > Pascal > > > > =46rom: Roll = On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav > Sent: jeudi 24 septembre 2020 20:38 > To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Cc: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO > > > > > > Thanks Pascal for the detailed example. The problem stmt is now clear t= o me and the need for TIO with parent address of egress node. > =46ew comments inline. > > > > Best, > Rahul > > > > On Sep 23 2020, at 10:09 pm, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > > > > > > Hello Rahul > > > > > > > > > > > Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which co= uld contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblin= gs. The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install th= ese target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you = mentioned=3F Using this the root can install routers not only to the egre= ss but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F > > > > > > > > I thought so, but I felt there was something wring and digging I foun= d it. > > > > > > > > > Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only = for the egress's children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F= > > It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discussion o= n. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ye, we=E2=80=99d like to be able to use the Track to reach siblings w= ouldn=E2=80=99t we=3F If so let=E2=80=99s look at signaling and encapsula= tion: > > > > > > > > The =E2=80=9CTrack=E2=80=9D that P DAO sets up is a path between a pa= ir of nodes, call them I and E like ingress and egress. Currently E is in= dicated in an RTO and the Hops in an RPO (VIO or SRVIO). > > > > > > > > If I talks to E, it can do like we do in useofrplinfo for Root to RAN= , that is create a packet with destination (that is E), an RPI with the l= ocal RPL instance of the Track (rooted at E), and an SRH if this is a SR = VIO. No encaps. > > > > > > > > Now say that we want node I to send its packets to one of E=E2=80=99s= sibling, S over the Track to E. Still following useofrplinfo, node I nee= ds to encaps the packet I-> S in a packet I->E to add the RPI with the lo= cal RPL instance ID that is taken from E=E2=80=99s name space, and possib= ly an SRH. > > > > > > > > We also see that signaling that we build a Track I->E (which comes as= a aside effect with a route to E) is not the same thing as signaling a r= oute to S via the Track before. > > > =5BRJ=5D This was my assumption which went wrong. > I not get that, to send a packet to destination S via E, an encapsulati= on is needed. The outer destination is E and inner is S. =46or node I to = create this encapsulation it needs to know that node E is the egress for = S. The proposed TIO(E) option identifies this. > > > > There could be many S nodes reachable via the Track to E. > > > > Thus my proposal to encode S in RTO, E in TIO, and then the SRVIO. Ther= e could be multiple RTOs as usual, for all the siblings and children of E= that we want to reach through the tunnel, but only one TIO since the tra= ck (tunnel) has only one egress. > > > > > > > > So we=E2=80=99d get RTO*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO*) . Whether E is implic= itly a destination or we need an RTO for E as well is to be debated, see = below. > > > > > > > > It can get worse: say that a child of I sends a packet to E. =46ollow= ing the default route, that packet reaches I. I needs to decide whether t= o use the default topology (via the Root) or the Track. We have not reall= y defined how that is programmed in I, but the current text says that the= P DAO routes have a better admin distance, so current text says we use t= he Track. With DetNet and RAW, it=E2=80=99s flows that get routed over th= e Track, signaled by a 6tuple (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draf= t-ietf-detnet-ip-07=23section-3). So really we=E2=80=99d need another opt= ion that carries the 6tuple (say a flow info option, =46IO) and use it as= we use the RTOs to signal which flows are routed in the Track. > > > > > > > > In that case the P DAO would have (=46IO=7CRTO)*, TIO, (VIO =7C SRVIO= *) > > > > > > > > Did I make the problem more clear=3F > =5BRJ=5D Yep. After reading through detnet draft, I now understand the = need for =46low Info Option. Need to re-read the draft considering this. > > > > > > One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is tha= t synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does se= rial Track indicate a track with a single projected segment=3F Would be b= etter to have this term described in the terminology section in the doc. = Thanks. > > > > Yes, I should use only one of the two. 6TiSCH defines serial and comple= x Tracks (see https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6tisch-arc= hitecture-29=23section-4.5.2). OK that I align=3F > > > =E2=80=9C > > > > > A Projected Route is a serial path that may represent the end-to-end > > > route or only a Segment in a complex Track, in which case multiple > > > Projected Routes are installed with the same tuple (Target address, > > > TrackID) and a different Segment ID each. > > > > =E2=80=A6 > > > > An RPO indicates a Projected Route that can be a serial Track in full > or a Segment of a more complex Track. In Non-Storing Mode, multiple > RPO may be placed after a same Target Option to reflect different > Segments originated at this node. The Track is identified by a > TrackID that is a Local RPLInstanceID to the Target of the Track. > > > > > =E2=80=9C > > > =5BRJ=5D Yes, we can align to this. > > > > > > Keep safe; > > > > > > > > Pascal > > > > > > > > =46rom: Roll On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav > > Sent: mercredi 23 septembre 2020 17:16 > > > > To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks > > > > Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Pascal, > > > > > > I have a few questions in the context (with respect to the problem st= atement, not proposals): > > > > > > Currently, the draft allows the Root to send multiple RTOs which coul= d contain the egress target and all the (immediate) children and siblings= . The VIO option list would contain all the hops on which to install thes= e target routes. Doesn't this already handle the problem statement you me= ntioned=3F Using this the root can install routers not only to the egress= but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F > > > > > > Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only fo= r the egress's children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F > > It would be great to have a sample topology to base this discussion o= n. > > > > > > > > One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is tha= t synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does se= rial Track indicate a track with a single projected segment=3F Would be b= etter to have this term described in the terminology section in the doc. = Thanks. > > > > > > Best, > > Rahul > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, 22 Sep 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote:= > > > Dear all ; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case, we are= building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress, where the = Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI and= the destination IPv6 address. The outer header may also have a SRH in ca= se of non storing P DAO. > > > > > > > > > > > > In the current version of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Optio= n (RTO) to signal the Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indi= cate the hops. But say we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one = of its children or siblings. How can we signal that these guys are reacha= ble over the tunnel=3F > > > > > > > > > > > > Proposal A) > > > > > > > > > > > > If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consistent w= ith RPL to use: > > > > > > > > > - one or more RTOs to indicate the targets of the route, can be any= of the children and siblings > > > > > > > > > - Exactly one Transit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the tunn= el egress > > > > > > > > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > > > > > > > > > The result would be that the Track terminates at the =E2=80=9CParen= t=E2=80=9D indicated in the TIO but can be used to reach any of the child= ren and siblings indicates as targets > > > > > > > > > > > > Proposal B) > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet =46lows should be = placed in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we=E2=80= =99d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80=99d need to create a= new =46low option that is a =46low descriptor, in which case we=E2=80=99= d get > > > > > > > > > - one or more =46low Options to indicate which flows are encapsulat= ed in the Track > > > > > > > > > - Exactly one RTO (as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Pr= oposal A) to indicate the tunnel egress > > > > > > > > > - then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you guys think=3F > > > > > > > > > > > > Pascal > > > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > > > Roll mailing list > > > > > > Roll=40ietf.org (mailto:Roll=40ietf.org) > > > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > > > > Roll mailing list > > > > Roll=40ietf.org (mailto:Roll=40ietf.org) > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > > > > > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F > Roll mailing list > Roll=40ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll --5f6e33ee_2d7def68_e0c Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Very interesting=21

But, wouldn't this mandate that on= ly Global DODAG roots can initiate a P-DAO request=3F

Isn't= it currently possible for a local DODAG (with local RPLInstanceID) root = to initiate a P-DAO request=3F If yes, then the DAO base object cannot be= used as mentioned by you.

I didn't find any mandate in DAO= projection draft that local DODAG roots cannot initiate a P-DAO.
Regards,
Rahul
On Sep 25 2020, at 9:29 pm, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthu= bert=3D40cisco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
&nbs= p; 
Hello again Rahul and all

 

The = Track Egress is the Root of DODAG that we build and we call  it a Tr= ack.

=46or a Track, = the RPLInstanceID is a local one, that is associated to the Track Egress,= and we call it a TrackID.

 

Now,= trying to make work the below, it seems better that instead of using a T= IO, we could signal the Egress and TrackID in the DAO itself as follows:<= /font>

 

        0=             &= nbsp;      1      =              = 2            =        3

        0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 = 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
       +-+-+-+-+-+-+= -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+=

       =7C &nbs= p;  TrackID    =7CK=7CD=7C   =46lags&n= bsp;  =7C   Reserved    =7C DAOSequence&nbs= p;  =7C

<= font style=3D=22font-family:Courier New=22>  =      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

 &= nbsp;     =7C      &nbs= p;            = ;            =              =             &= nbsp;      =7C
       +  &nbs= p;            = ;            =             &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;           +=

     &= nbsp; =7C          &nbs= p;            = ;            =             &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;   =7C

&nbs= p;      +      &nb= sp;            &nb= sp;    Track Egress     &nbs= p;            = ;         +<= /div>
       =7C =             &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;           &nb= sp;           &nbs= p;            = ; =7C

   &= nbsp;   +         =             &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;           &nb= sp;           &nbs= p;     +

       =7C     &n= bsp;           &nb= sp;           &nbs= p;            = ;            =          =7C=

       +-+-+-+-= +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

       =7C=    Option(s)...

       +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

 

          =             =46igu= re 16: The DAO Base Object

 

 

This seems t= o make more sense than using a TIO.

 

Works=3F

 

Pascal<= /div>
 

 

 

=46rom: Pascal= Thubert (pthubert)
Sent: vendredi 25 sep= tembre 2020 09:56
To: Routing Over Low po= wer and Lossy networks <roll=40ietf.org>
Subject:=  RE: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO
 

Hello Rahul,

 

Yes, this gets quite a lot of things to put together but in the = end it is not so complicated if you have a picture to look at.

I=E2=80=99ll make some for th= e interim.

 

My to do=E2=80=99s o= n this draft for the next version:

 

- Align the =E2=80=9Cserial=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9CComplex=E2=80=9D Track= terminology between 6TiSCH, RAW n=E2=80=99 ROLL.

=
 

- Create an initial format for =46IO based in DetNet.

  -> Do= you see any more field we=E2=80=99d like to see in there, e.g., the capa= bility to inject a Track in another=3F

 

- Describe that the TIO points on the tunnel egress, and that route= s via the tunnel are signaled as targets in RTOs

<= div class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>  -> a side effect is that the sequ= ence and lifetimes are now taken from the TIO so they are not needed in t= he (SR)VIO. This makes good sense IMHO.

  -> should the route to the egress be autom= atically added=3F There could be times where only some flows should go th= ere. Maybe we could use a flag in the TIO to signal it=3F
 

Many thanks for your help=21
 

Pascal

 

=  

 

=46rom: Roll <roll-= bounces=40ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav
Sent: jeudi 24 septembre 2020 20:38
To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks <= ;roll=40ietf.org>
Cc: Routing O= ver Low power and Lossy networks <roll=40ietf.org>
<= strong>Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO<= /div>
 

Thanks Pascal for the deta= iled example. The problem stmt is now clear to me and the need for TIO wi= th parent address of egress node.
=46ew comments inline.
 

Best,
Rahul
<= font style=3D=22font-family:Calibri=22> 

On Sep= 23 2020, at 10:09 pm, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D40cisco.com=40d= marc.ietf.org> wrote:
  
Hello Rahul
 
<= br>
 
 

> Currently, the draft allows the Root to send mu= ltiple RTOs which could contain the egress target and all the (immediate)= children and siblings. The VIO option list would contain all the hops on= which to install these target routes. Doesn't this already handle the pr= oblem statement you mentioned=3F Using this the root can install routers = not only to the egress but also to its immediate children, isn't it=3F
 

 
=
 

I thought so, but I felt there was something= wring and digging I found it.
 

 
&nb= sp;

> = Is the point to not install the route on behalf of egress but only for th= e egress's children/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F
It would be great= to have a sample topology to base this discussion on.
 
 
 

Ye, we=E2=80=99d like to be able to use the Track to re= ach siblings wouldn=E2=80=99t we=3F If so let=E2=80=99s look at signaling= and encapsulation:
 

 =
 

The =E2=80=9CTrack=E2=80= =9D that P DAO sets up is a path between a pair of nodes, call them I and= E like ingress and egress. Currently E is indicated in an RTO and the Ho= ps in an RPO (VIO or SRVIO).
 

 
 

If I talks to E,= it can do like we do in useofrplinfo for Root to RAN, that is create a p= acket with destination (that is E), an RPI with the local RPL instance of= the Track (rooted at E), and an SRH if this is a SR VIO. No encaps.
 <= /div>
 
=  

Now say that we want node I to send its packe= ts to one of E=E2=80=99s sibling, S over the Track to E. Still following = useofrplinfo, node I needs to encaps the packet I-> S in a packet I-&g= t;E to add the RPI with the local RPL instance ID that is taken from E=E2= =80=99s name space, and possibly an SRH.
 

 
 

We als= o see that signaling that we build a Track I->E (which comes as a asid= e effect with a route to E) is not the same thing as signaling a route to= S via the Track before.
 

=5BRJ=5D This was my assumption which went wrong= .
I not get th= at, to send a packet to destination S via E, an encapsulation is needed. = The outer destination is E and inner is S. =46or node I to create this en= capsulation it needs to know that node E is the egress for S. The propose= d TIO(E) option identifies this.
 

There could be many S nodes reachable via the Track to E.<= /font>
 
 
 

Thus my proposal to encode S in RTO, E in TIO, a= nd then the SRVIO. There could be multiple RTOs as usual, for all the sib= lings and children of E that we want to reach through the tunnel, but onl= y one TIO since the track (tunnel) has only one egress.  
&nbs= p;

 
 
So we=E2=80=99d get RTO*, TIO= , (VIO =7C SRVIO*) . Whether E is implicitly a destination or we need an = RTO for E as well is to be debated, see below.
<= div class=3D=22MsoNormal=22> 

 
 

It can get worse: say that a child of I sends a packet to E. =46ollowing= the default route, that packet reaches I. I needs to decide whether to u= se the default topology (via the Root) or the Track. We have not really d= efined how that is programmed in I, but the current text says that the P = DAO routes have a better admin distance, so current text says we use the = Track. With DetNet and RAW, it=E2=80=99s flows that get routed over the T= rack, signaled by a 6tuple (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-detnet-ip-07=23section-= 3). So really we=E2=80=99d need another option that c= arries the 6tuple (say  a flow info option, =46IO) and use it as we = use the RTOs to signal which flows are routed in the Track.=
 

=
 
 

In that case the P DAO would have (=46IO=7CRTO)*, TIO, = (VIO =7C SRVIO*)
=  

 <= /font>
 

Did I make the problem m= ore clear=3F
=5BRJ=5D Yep. After reading through detnet draft= , I now understand the need for =46low Info Option. Need to re-read the d= raft considering this.
 

&= nbsp;
 

> One another po= int: The draft talks about =22serial Track=22 .. is that synonymous to th= e =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your mail. Does serial Track indicat= e a track with a single projected segment=3F Would be better to have this= term described in the terminology section in the doc. Thanks.
 
<= br>
 
 

Yes, I should use only one of the two. 6TiSCH define= s serial and complex Tracks (see https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html= /draft-ietf-6tisch-architecture-29=23section-4.5.2). = OK that I align=3F
=  

=E2=80= =9C
 

 
=  

 
 

 &nbs= p; A Projected Route is a serial path that may represent the end-to-end
 

   route or only a Segme= nt in a complex Track, in which case multiple
<= /div>
 

   Projected Routes are installed with the same= tuple (Target address,
 

 =   TrackID) and a different Segment ID each.
 

 
 

=E2=80=A6
 

=  
=  

   An RPO indicates a Projected R=
oute that can be a serial Track in full
= 
 &n=
bsp; or a Segment of a more complex Track.  In Non-Storing Mode, mul=
tiple
   RPO may be placed after a sa=
me Target Option to reflect different
  =
; Segments originated at this node.  The Track is identified by a
   TrackID that is a Local RPLInstanceI=
D to the Target of the Track.
 
 

=E2=80=9C
 

= =5BRJ=5D Yes, we can align to this.
 

 

Keep safe;
 

<= font style=3D=22font-family:Calibri=22> 
 

Pascal
 
=
 
<= div class=3D=22MsoNormal=22> 

=46rom: = Roll <roll-bounces=40ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rahul Jadhav
Sent: mercredi= 23 septembre 2020 17:16
To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks <roll=40ietf.org>
Subject: Re: =5BRoll=5D Transit vs. Target in P DAO<= /div>
 
 

Hi Pascal,
 <= /div>
I have a few questions in th= e context (with respect to the problem statement, not proposals):<= /font>
 
Currently, the draft allows the= Root to send multiple RTOs which could contain the egress target and all= the (immediate) children and siblings. The VIO option list would contain= all the hops on which to install these target routes. Doesn't this alrea= dy handle the problem statement you mentioned=3F Using this the root can = install routers not only to the egress but also to its immediate children= , isn't it=3F
&nb= sp;

Is the point= to not install the route on behalf of egress but only for the egress's c= hildren/siblings=3F Is this the objective to achieve=3F
It would be great to have a s= ample topology to base this discussion on.
 

One another point: The draft talks about =22serial Trac= k=22 .. is that synonymous to the =22serial path=22 you mentioned in your= mail. Does serial Track indicate a track with a single projected segment= =3F Would be better to have this term described in the terminology sectio= n in the doc. Thanks.
 

Best,<= /font>
Rahul=
 =
 

On Tue, 22 Sep = 2020 at 16:35, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D<= a href=3D=22mailto:40cisco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org=22 title=3D=22mailto:40ci= sco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org=22>40cisco.com=40dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Dear all ;
 

 
 

Say we are building a serial path using P DAO: in that case,  we ar= e building a tunnel from the Track Ingress to the Track Egress, where the= Track is signaled in the packet by the local RPLInstanceID in the RPI an= d the destination IPv6 address. The outer header may also have a SRH in c= ase of non storing P DAO.
 

=  
 

In the current v= ersion of the P DAO draft we use a RPL Target Option (RTO) to signal the = Track Egress and the new Via options (CMOs) to indicate the hops. But say= we do not want to reach the Tunnel egress but one of its children or sib= lings. How can we signal that these guys are reachable over the tunnel=3F=
 

 
 

Proposal A)
 

 
 

If we want to be able to signal that, it could be more consistent with R= PL to use:
 =

- one or more R= TOs to indicate the targets of the route, can be any of the children and = siblings
 

- Exactly one T= ransit Information Option (TIO) to indicate the tunnel egress
 
- then one VIO or one or more SRVIOs = (as we currently do)
 

 =
 

The result would be tha= t the Track terminates at the =E2=80=9CParent=E2=80=9D indicated in the T= IO but can be used to reach any of the children and siblings indicates as= targets
 

 
 
Proposal B)
<= /div>
 

 
 

Maybe we want to signal that only certain DetNet =46lows shoul= d be placed in the Track. In that case, The RTO is not sufficient and we=E2= =80=99d need the 6tuple. If we take that path, we=E2=80=99d need to creat= e a new =46low option that is a =46low descriptor, in which case we=E2=80= =99d get
 

- one or more =46= low Options to indicate which flows  are encapsulated in the Track
 

- Exactly one RTO  (= as we currently do) OR Exactly one TIO (as in Proposal A) to indicate the= tunnel egress
&n= bsp;

- then on= e VIO or one or more SRVIOs (as we currently do)
 

 
 

 
&n= bsp;

What do y= ou guys think=3F
=  

 <= /font>
 

Pascal
 

 
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
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mail-ua1-x932.google.com with SMTP id j12so108673ual.7 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 14:09:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=FoOsJddjWRSj9wj/nr6k2+kwPcwgciRQm+bzSueuDeo=; b=OyzoH2LrkPecny4aDWvZx2NTEqX/f305xWx09qVIDFJPbPKO2T7sVUmZIBBwIfAQ80 XoY3rx0OH9DaI9Z185BxlsMUYkn0rhK0J14EoQ8EZM9TAwmjEOr4m6r9acqKjhEKQ/j2 YYW2g5FNo3hh/iAg6d7Bg7mKWAraoazxjgQR6CpCSqnQXGxJARjn58N4Kphtrk8kdK3E /6z+5mcP4mr5JYMuwLngVARKZf9r7b2Ki3MlKXSvY1qA1pMQ360EY7cZZPsqOvTIFzOG PQYBRz6UIw11pDEBmoWymc8+QYmBgZkO/o/3g+7jDLrYKMA4iQ31F9e3ijztTcSKS2RD JEjA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=FoOsJddjWRSj9wj/nr6k2+kwPcwgciRQm+bzSueuDeo=; b=Ik+q8LXQW80tJTdQelJR+94baaeysUhAw9MNq8+PBRYHKgChumjfoBIDj+tjYHj0Im 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X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 21:09:59 -0000 --0000000000000fa0fc05b029bd3c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting on 30th September. https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/roll or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September. Thank you and best regards, Ines and Dominique. On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > So far we have in the agenda: > > - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status > - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: > https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) > - RPLv2 Topics > > Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your > request by 18t Sept. > > Thank you, > > Ines and Dominique. > > On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles < > mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: > >> Dear all, >> >> Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim >> meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. >> >> Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic >> during the next roll interim meeting indicating: >> >> - Topic to Present. >> - Presenter >> - Time needed. >> >> Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kMr6RM_ao4]: >> >> Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control >> option (12:00min-14:00min) >> Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of >> capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying for >> available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) >> DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:15 >> hs - 1:17hs ) >> Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? >> >> Material: >> Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll >> icalendar (UTC): >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.ics >> jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join >> Webex: >> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >> >> Please note that we aim to record the meeting. >> >> Material of the previous interim meetings: >> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >> >> Thank you very much, >> >> Ines and Dominique >> >> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >> From: IESG Secretary >> Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM >> Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG >> Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 >> To: IETF-Announce >> Cc: >> >> >> The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold >> a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. >> >> Agenda: >> To Be Determined >> >> Information about remote participation: >> ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, >> 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) >> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >> Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial >> 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 >> Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 >> >> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Roll mailing list >> Roll@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll >> > --0000000000000fa0fc05b029bd3c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

<= /div>
Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting = on 30th September.=C2=A0

<= a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agen= da-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt">https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/in= terim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt

Dear Presenters, please upload your = slides in:=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-r= oll-05/session/roll=C2=A0 or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September.

Thank you and best regards,

<= div>Ines and Dominique.=C2=A0


On Wed, Sep 16, 202= 0 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

<= /div>
So far we have in the agenda:

- WG Statu= s: wg documents and related-ID status=C2=A0
- ROLL in IETF 109? (= Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some additional topics=C2=A0 wou= ld you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18t Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

Ines and Dominique= .

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemai= l.com> wrote:
Dear all,

Thank you very= much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim meeting on 30th = September with a duration of two hours.

P= lease let us know by 18th September if you want to present a topic d= uring the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- = Topic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time needed.=C2=A0

Some discussions points from last interim meeting [<= a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4" target=3D"_blank">= https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]:

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended contr= ol option (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Signaling, bits to sa= y which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min),=C2=A0 roll = querying all nodes, querying for available memory on nodes (23:00 min=20 -31:00 min=20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:= =C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID= =3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 1= 02 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we = aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materia= l of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL= -Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,
<= /div>

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded messag= e ---------
From: IESG S= ecretary <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Date: = Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and = Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce &= lt;ietf-announc= e@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power an= d Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
--0000000000000fa0fc05b029bd3c-- From nobody Fri Sep 25 15:00:13 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C6FF3A0A1C; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:00:11 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160107121138.14047.12614034484994885935@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:00:11 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 22:00:11 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Controlling Secure Network Enrollment in RPL networks Authors : Michael Richardson Rahul Arvind Jadhav Filename : draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03.txt Pages : 8 Date : 2020-09-25 Abstract: [I-D.ietf-6tisch-enrollment-enhanced-beacon] defines a method by which a potential [I-D.ietf-6tisch-minimal-security] enrollment proxy can announce itself as a available for new Pledges to enroll on a network. The announcement includes a priority for enrollment. This document provides a mechanism by which a RPL DODAG root can disable enrollment announcements, or adjust the base priority for enrollment operation. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Sep 25 15:29:41 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 561333A09FA for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:29:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cEVhvnQjQDvk for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:29:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3DA753A0407 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:29:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A72A13899E; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:08:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id tvzr2GQuKiY1; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:08:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10BB03899D; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:08:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB7E9B20; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:29:28 -0400 (EDT) To: roll@ietf.org, Malisa.Vucinic@inria.fr, rahul.ietf@gmail.com References: <8722.1586555051@localhost> <16252.1588164045@localhost> From: Michael Richardson Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:29:28 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <16252.1588164045@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] enrollment priority X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 22:29:39 -0000 I am resuming a thread that got lost back in April. My todo list included adding Rahul as a co-author . I have confirmed that the github contains permissions. Let me clip down to what was the critical points: On 2020-04-29 8:40 a.m., Michael Richardson wrote: > mcr> First, I think that if node C had a MP of 127, then it would *NOT* advertise > mcr> itself as a Join Proxy. > > RJ> Consider non-6tisch case, where the 6LR's resources are full and does > RJ> not want any new nodes to connect to it. In this case, it still needs > RJ> to advertise its DIO for all the existing nodes which have already > RJ> joined through it. The new nodes will see MP=127 and hence won't > RJ> join. But the gist is, Node C has to keep advertising for all its > RJ> existing nodes. It cannot stop sending DIOs. > > Okay, so I think that we have further confusion of Join (DODAG thing) vs > Enroll (onboarding thing) :-) > I have taken another pass through the document to make sure that all uses of > join, other than "Join Proxy" now say Enroll. In the process I was reminded that I-D.ietf-6tisch-minimal-security is stuck waiting on unaware-leaves and core-stateless. I wonder if we could s/Join Proxy/Enrollment Proxy/ on that document as an AUTH48. > mcr> If node C *does* change to node A, then it would change it's priority. > mcr> But it has to do that, and maybe there are reasons why A won't accept it. > > RJ> Sure node A might have its own reasons to not accept it, but the MP > RJ> suggests that it is willing to accept node C. The problem is when > RJ> node C switches to Node A, the whole sub-DODAG rooted at C switches > RJ> and this may result in node A's MP to reach 127. Since node B is now > RJ> free, it's MP value will decrease. This can result in oscillations in > RJ> the network. > > Agreed. > The fundamental problem is that the sub-DODAG needs to be split. > I don't think that we can do that in this option or in EBs. > It has to be done in DIOs and DAO-ACKs and... > I think that we have had proposals to deal with this before (what happened to > them?) I glanced at draft-ietf-lwig-nbr-mgmt-policy-03. I would guess it expired due to lack of time. It seems like good work. I'm not convinced we shouldn't be doing this in ROLL instead. I know that we had presentations some year ago where there was stampeding elephants... I'm not sure what happened to those documents. I am concerned about boiling ocean here: I don't think that I have enough clue to solve balancing the DODAG after enrollment. > > 6LRs that support this option, but whose parent does not send it SHOULD > > assume a value of 0x40 as their base value. > > The nodes adjust this base value based upon their observed congestion, > > emitting their adjusted DIO value to their children. > > > (0x40 is my wet-finger-in-the-air, seat-of-the-pants guess) > > RJ> Consider that a 6LR who does not support MP gets a DIO with > RJ> MP=127. The 6LR will ignore the MP field and sends it DIO without MP > RJ> and the downstream nodes will assume an MP of 0x40! This may be a > RJ> problem. > > I added some analysis to my slides today to deal with this. > I am open to other values, but I think we need to pick some value. Maybe 0, > but I think not. Maybe rank * VALUE. I am open to other suggestions rather than 0x40 (64) as a default value when there is a failure in the middle of the dodag to support this option. I think that it's a rather small edge case, but if we can solve it better, great. > > >> We tried working on a problem-statement in the past in LWIG [1] which > >> talked about how to handle the case where some upstream nodes cache > >> (routing/neighbor) is full and how would it stop the new downstream > >> nodes to attach in that path. Enrollment priority was referenced as a > >> possible solution. > > > Good. Would more informative cross-references help? > > Do you want to co-author? > > RJ> Yes, I would love to work on this problem statement. > > https://github.com/roll-wg/draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority > I will unicast to get permissions right. I have posted -03. Rahul, you should have full permissions on the above repo. I'm not sure if the problem you want to work on is the restricted enrollment problem, or the wider DODAG tree balancing. From nobody Fri Sep 25 15:46:55 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81BE73A0A6F for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:46:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NUuqYrH-7TG8 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:46:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [209.87.249.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20F333A0A6E for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 15:46:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1A353899E for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:25:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id llj2DTTJqA4y for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:25:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDA4A3899D for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:25:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A03ADB20 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 18:46:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks In-Reply-To: <51EFCCF8-A6AA-4E39-8DCE-B264CCDCD039@getmailspring.com> References: <51EFCCF8-A6AA-4E39-8DCE-B264CCDCD039@getmailspring.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2020 22:46:54 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rahul Jadhav wrote: > But, wouldn't this mandate that only Global DODAG roots can initiate a > P-DAO request? > Isn't it currently possible for a local DODAG (with local > RPLInstanceID) root to initiate a P-DAO request? If yes, then the DAO > base object cannot be used as mentioned by you. And what about p2p-rpl (RFC6997)? Is there a place for P-DAO there? Or maybe I should ask this differently: doesn't P-DAO allow for cross-DODAG routing, as arranged by the root? A sort of PCE? Does this essentially eclipse the utility of p2p RPL? Does this local/global issue affect this? =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9uc1kACgkQgItw+93Q 3WUCwQgApWmuohmKG2V+8Gz0TKorvayGtmXiyOvaT+xSsyKpAgayoRC4VhMkRrYT hviS9GbjNxu96woqF/ksUR8lex8HJTTvk0mplFIHzgoze14Jj+XoitFP4VM1L2jx 9mGmj1BM7oNPT/+2crpxQ0EKd5iXMI/Llvh05lMUBRCQjTFvkveCGWg4ar8frLbV +Fmz4SHaLVBtkxgHJ4SHzjRQhcDFOhoU4qwPB91iQMVVPItFGOh5RuGoF1gBKSv1 PaYq8lxGjJWSqkr/KGdnpmB8NQwB+FLL1YSJdap31xYpuz20GJcOzE1Xy778B1H8 hAMBP867iefyN4A9DOzzVLnL8Cz13Q== =voos -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Sat Sep 26 01:04:31 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69F6D3A1053 for ; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 01:04:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.62 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.62 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Sat, 26 Sep 2020 14:06:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160115437947.22653.151238550791570753@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 14:06:19 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-nsa-extension-09.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 21:06:20 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Common Ancestor Objective Function and Parent Set DAG Metric Container Extension Authors : Remous-Aris Koutsiamanis Georgios Papadopoulos Nicolas Montavont Pascal Thubert Filename : draft-ietf-roll-nsa-extension-09.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2020-09-26 Abstract: Packet Replication and Elimination is a method in which several copies of a data packet are sent in the network in order to achieve high reliability and low jitter. This document details how to apply Packet Replication and Elimination in RPL, especially how to exchange information within RPL control packets to let a node better select the different parents that will be used to forward the multiple copies of a packet. This document also describes the Objective Function which takes advantage of this information to implement multi-path routing. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-nsa-extension/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-nsa-extension-09.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-nsa-extension-09 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Sep 28 00:34:16 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 571CE3A086E; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:34:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com header.b=L6NldWOX; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.onmicrosoft.com header.b=ofADI1QZ Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z9od_81s7bxg; 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Mon, 28 Sep 2020 07:34:09 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: IESG Secretary , IETF-Announce CC: "roll@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 CHANGED Thread-Index: AQHWk2i42aYTu8JoC02wGGvTct+Ipal9q+Vw Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 07:33:49 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 07:32:55 +0000 Message-ID: References: <160105802968.2998.11744194922151148574@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <160105802968.2998.11744194922151148574@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:18e4:d663:6963:6f22] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 26c20ea5-b9d7-4ad2-c6ba-08d86380e340 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB3824: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:1850; 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Almost 3 hours is a very long time fo= r an IETF meeting... Keep safe Pascal > -----Original Message----- > From: IETF-Announce On Behalf Of IESG > Secretary > Sent: vendredi 25 septembre 2020 20:20 > To: IETF-Announce > Cc: roll@ietf.org > Subject: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual > Meeting: 2020-09-30 CHANGED >=20 > MEETING DETAILS HAVE CHANGED. SEE LATEST DETAILS BELOW. >=20 > The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold a virtu= al > interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 Atlantic/Reykjavik (10:= 45 > to 12:45 UTC). >=20 > Agenda: > To Be Determined >=20 > Information about remote participation: > ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, > 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & > Canada) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f > 12 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial > 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 > Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 >=20 > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >=20 > _______________________________________________ > IETF-Announce mailing list > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce From nobody Mon Sep 28 00:44:59 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9DD63A0EC0; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:44:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VcCEmvq0_PxG; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe36.google.com (mail-vs1-xe36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e36]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 893403A0EBE; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe36.google.com with SMTP id 7so186570vsp.6; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:44:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=vB0Zgnq5VRLl1y7AbPvjirRVKVamP+y+zSQVZ41tSpU=; b=gJJYkLLF9VsbUpzDUOf0Njo6Z74kZq1ZiEUOMH7mbHow6YiqyFb3af6JaP1B7y0RSB hgmrZRKKrHRN4X5CB9MFilMuX3UMpZBPYs+//Tm6ET6AdO+H2Yy4RjFVtrd+h0/YWlmE zBiu4TeIYOFz2b4l+S4FgjhttiF9MR/ZmwrfCdJAXGhhhga4Qro0/IxUkoVxkZsDH3SX lSe3Q4A6+eifJsgErn13ZgRqlFSZd3TPdyi0j8+oijX78RaRoh5J1o8RneoDL/M1Xinm GM/u0+6SogtcdGBNh5IA4mBH02XJTxAgT4eBAtk+m3C5K1yJylDFRE1B3IuA81n8FuDE mV1g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=vB0Zgnq5VRLl1y7AbPvjirRVKVamP+y+zSQVZ41tSpU=; b=EHQvw3SHyzxAF0/YyfyTcBHb34KdhLfPYP+DyCS9PxeU9GPQ1ub5w12gWUihmnli8f WPbqyESm2gqSyiIciEBabS7QArfPBm13dWW/uQ7nvJZYOOJ8YJJgqeiM/dCo+InmA5Xm Hb4cTUbLfo5RwDLgGZQwNSHPsCwaNJl2Olk+rNCLDRqgk4JBCASyyquvQA5tShL++97J jIPP60XbSGcFdxRc6DytU0wjiH00UHySjGqCWlxdUkUencreESq5DpKteD4aOCmllG7+ oFGsNQZAseZDfC78glDPv4sBIqmmUqGcUWl9gmvxnitxZaoOobYg5vNvwT4EmnbNa71F peAA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533lSvn2q15zS85ZWf6J0I1/wUbWQnye4BDsoGUWMuCDC6pR+Nq3 p0yEhr/oTjRS+dl+FZWgEI0VBWBuryZ2CPpIdMZGYLySPHcraw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxn/SgZwAVeOYv02+n6Ko/zWO91xnoJqUenBXHgyk72hMOeLD0Ngid4TOpBY8pCJJIYOSJK/+0UJTV5xuZS1G8= X-Received: by 2002:a67:ec9a:: with SMTP id h26mr4753089vsp.34.1601279094038; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 00:44:54 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <160105802968.2998.11744194922151148574@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 10:44:18 +0300 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Cc: DraftTracker Mail System , dominique barthel Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000096253905b05ad711" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 CHANGED X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 07:44:58 -0000 --00000000000096253905b05ad711 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Pascal, Thank you for your concern. Please note that the meeting is scheduled for two hours: 10:45 to 12:45 Atlantic/Reykjavik (10:45 to 12:45 UTC), the agenda topics are also aimed for two hours. agenda: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt The webex opens before (10:20) just in case that presenters desire to test the microphone, sound, etc. The webex closes 30 minutes after the two hours in case that participants want to talk with the chairs after the meeting. We aim to have the meeting in two hours. Hope that this clarifies your concern Best regards, Ines. On Mon, Sep 28, 2020 at 10:34 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Dear chairs > > Is this really what you wanted to do? Almost 3 hours is a very long time > for an IETF meeting... > > Keep safe > > Pascal > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: IETF-Announce On Behalf Of IESG > > Secretary > > Sent: vendredi 25 septembre 2020 20:20 > > To: IETF-Announce > > Cc: roll@ietf.org > > Subject: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual > > Meeting: 2020-09-30 CHANGED > > > > MEETING DETAILS HAVE CHANGED. SEE LATEST DETAILS BELOW. > > > > The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold a > virtual > > interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 Atlantic/Reykjavik > (10:45 > > to 12:45 UTC). > > > > Agenda: > > To Be Determined > > > > Information about remote participation: > > ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, > > 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & > > Canada) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f > > 12 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also > dial > > 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 > > Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 > > > > https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting > > > > _______________________________________________ > > IETF-Announce mailing list > > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --00000000000096253905b05ad711 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Pascal,

Thank you f= or your concern. Please note that the meeting is scheduled for two hours:= =C2=A010:45 to 12:45 Atlantic/Reykjavik = (10:45=C2=A0=C2=A0to 12:45 UTC), = the agenda=C2=A0 topics are also aimed for two hours.




On = Mon, Sep 28, 2020 at 10:34 AM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert=3D40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org>= ; wrote:
Dear ch= airs

Is this really what you wanted to do? Almost 3 hours is a very long time fo= r an IETF meeting...

Keep safe

Pascal



> -----Original Message-----
> From: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of I= ESG
> Secretary
> Sent: vendredi 25 septembre 2020 20:20
> To: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce@ietf.org>
> Cc: roll@ietf.org
> Subject: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual > Meeting: 2020-09-30 CHANGED
>
> MEETING DETAILS HAVE CHANGED.=C2=A0 SEE LATEST DETAILS BELOW.
>
> The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold a vi= rtual
> interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 Atlantic/Reykjavik (= 10:45
> to 12:45 UTC).
>
> Agenda:
> To Be Determined
>
> Information about remote participation:
> ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep= 30,
> 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US &= amp;
> Canada) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345
> https://ietf.webex.com/= ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f
> 12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial=
> 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0 Join by phone 1-650-= 479-3208
> Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381
>
> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting<= /a>
>
> _______________________________________________
> IETF-Announce mailing list
> IETF-Annou= nce@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-a= nnounce

_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
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with ESMTP id 857C1570; Mon, 28 Sep 2020 14:59:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Richardson To: roll@ietf.org, Rahul Arvind Jadhav In-Reply-To: <160107121138.14047.12614034484994885935@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <160107121138.14047.12614034484994885935@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1 X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] updates to draft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:59:14 -0000 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Title : Controlling Secure Network Enrollment in RPL net= works > Authors : Michael Richardson > Rahul Arvind Jadhav >... > >A diff from the previous version is available at: >https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-roll-enrollment-priority-03 I followed up on https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/roll/hX5nKvkdLF4Ygw_= qniPJ4Kg0zI8/ on the thread from April. I have added Rahul to the author list as agreed last April. I have made sure that all cases of "join" -> enroll, except for *Join Proxy= *, which is defined in 6tisch-minimal-security. =2D- Michael Richardson . o O ( IPv6 I=C3=B8T consulti= ng ) Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCgAdFiEEbsyLEzg/qUTA43uogItw+93Q3WUFAl9yMn0ACgkQgItw+93Q 3WWe3wf/aGCcmFGwpCm1R7BkvlXVnfciRWEZgP/EH+39A/INMOAI4pdB9jnPXO2J PjIp7TqAWFuajx653P7Fr9rIhLIBgIDuDF+R179JOX9NgvPCVRnA1RbMVontrge8 Pmx2yHmIoM2ndbNhqham4shLK9B7koAtud7v4nWADUGLBuKj992M0liRUHDW9hbv dpousCmyrk7K4VyV0XF+UeEQCa1n5r/EAYPVKpDVDzPtICNMIchaU0D3V2xsatIS VUX0xJ+3Fzt9DwyoLOTyA1wUWltI4WVFfUFRUAVjUD4Z202sEJd00GonZA1aWVD3 SsC/grUBTtuAgGM2QUmmzYo/LjkRvg== =1umR -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=-- From nobody Mon Sep 28 22:06:18 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99CD23A1509 for ; 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Tue, 29 Sep 2020 09:55:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160139853311.30294.4763351523347152257@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 09:55:33 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-13.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 16:55:33 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Root initiated routing state in RPL Authors : Pascal Thubert Rahul Arvind Jadhav Matthew Gillmore Filename : draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-13.txt Pages : 35 Date : 2020-09-29 Abstract: This document updates RFC 6550 to enable a RPL Root to install and maintain Projected Routes within its DODAG, along a selected set of nodes that may or may not include self, for a chosen duration. This potentially enables routes that are more optimized or resilient than those obtained with the classical distributed operation of RPL, either in terms of the size of a source-route header or in terms of path length, which impacts both the latency and the packet delivery ratio. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-13.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-dao-projection-13 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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15.20.3433.032; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 17:01:11 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Thread-Topic: [Roll] Transit vs. Target in P DAO Thread-Index: AdaQxACW+9AEP58UTgCAyyDLmy9JbwA+H2KAAAAgcuAAOTQCgAAa/vSgABGID8AAy2QvIA== Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 17:00:47 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 17:00:46 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=cisco.com; x-originating-ip: [2a01:cb1d:4ec:2200:4552:5eff:26b5:df41] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3ab786cd-e6ce-483e-12be-08d864994457 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MN2PR11MB4728: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160140595798.20491.8290659568335175128@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 11:59:18 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 18:59:18 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Mode of Operation extension Authors : Rahul Arvind Jadhav Pascal Thubert Michael Richardson Filename : draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2020-09-29 Abstract: RPL allows different mode of operations which allows nodes to have a consensus on the basic primitives that must be supported to join the network. The MOP field in [RFC6550] is of 3 bits and is fast depleting. This document extends the MOP for future use. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-mopex/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Sep 29 12:05:09 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5505F3A11CF for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:05:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E9OM7heS7v0e for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf1-x431.google.com (mail-pf1-x431.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::431]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 249853A1224 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf1-x431.google.com with SMTP id o20so5507295pfp.11 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:04:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=date:from:to:message-id:references:subject:mime-version; bh=eN84eI5lXdvqjUE/wg9KbujxTVLEK5PETCHB00bOM6E=; b=WPdE5ndNcsBcv+7br1y2E8rlOSIit+7V+TRr06qySn5eQ9Iz4n+Ha8Yyj8LhPD94wz zcPlhAw9sI0EVdt58Xs3bHHL50Qfh6fq1b9pveYaCMNSNyG/R4gcWRC5/kNGheeRaA6+ +SWG+meWu5T1gtmXEoR5lE0tDCaL2yMFDV654YZZGNPGY3Hgfj6WDb7YNx0HeJQAAWLb 1t6+vtNOEBJ/iANsW5XDIGAKQ0n/DZSJj36vHFjC9Awm5nZvr2CIhdwDiiyqcL0u2lsl 7DE0j4meWJ17dV7cst8wxk8N0xXcrs9O7skcOGdgwJTvX3+25hV1W0grmAW5djtY1vV/ KqFQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:message-id:references:subject :mime-version; bh=eN84eI5lXdvqjUE/wg9KbujxTVLEK5PETCHB00bOM6E=; b=DNJixAFMvTv6V5zaI1CRY9PMlZFhUhnr2YRzAOZsthIGhgM27BSQpZAhWeAkDV16ob uoD7x/9E6Wxn3VQP0I/wsqCsaglzikqwN+KVpBxVtmkvS3h22NlfoQBJqkp924jnhdiG hv4arPfp3gQrdjYKIfczKu9CzPz6NridVEmwhMQV8F/dih8nzCLS52blxxSQzph402K8 +Z07KcFwFOZ3VCHMu9kGz8rKZdJUMxV1im96nKtkWemzsNyX0/6SeproNw6f0b46/eBF 3MmSZrPLqNWLC4pB/ul9agUW2hzpR40b+x27S94mUpvIQ1NDFfD93KU9e1kknVQnb/KX jgcA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531PJUHt+frV8PZR098kbrDLgtjgLl+JMzy4aU7Hda0CppbcXEnq Hey/9U4K3uRzXUrlgyfTjlkUtgpK5mM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJySaePYsamviSfiFVIqa08UwDKXbQJBMt33xrWoxS669ZzOmyIyhD/5hjeRLg73cd4dmdeIIg== X-Received: by 2002:a62:1bc7:0:b029:13e:d13d:a0f6 with SMTP id b190-20020a621bc70000b029013ed13da0f6mr5427010pfb.18.1601406283175; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:04:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pandora ([223.226.77.8]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id gk14sm5667514pjb.41.2020.09.29.12.04.41 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:04:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 00:34:40 +0530 From: Rahul Jadhav To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Message-ID: References: <160140595798.20491.8290659568335175128@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Mailer: Mailspring MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="5f738548_75bbdf34_1d73" Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 19:05:08 -0000 --5f738548_75bbdf34_1d73 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hello All, The primary and the only change is in the "Extending RPL Control Options" section. The eXtension bit location in the OptionType was changed as discussed in previous interim. PFA the details below. I will present this update tomorrow in the interim. Thanks, Rahul ---------- Forwarded Message --------- From: internet-drafts@ietf.org Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt Date: Sep 30 2020, at 12:29 am To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: roll@ietf.org A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Mode of Operation extension Authors : Rahul Arvind Jadhav Pascal Thubert Michael Richardson Filename : draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2020-09-29 Abstract: RPL allows different mode of operations which allows nodes to have a consensus on the basic primitives that must be supported to join the network. The MOP field in [RFC6550] is of 3 bits and is fast depleting. This document extends the MOP for future use. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-mopex/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ Roll mailing list Roll@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll --5f738548_75bbdf34_1d73 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Hello All,

The primary and the only change is in the =22= Extending RPL Control Options=22 section.
The eXtension bit loc= ation in the OptionType was changed as discussed in previous interim.
P=46A the details below.
I will present this update = tomorrow in the interim.

Thanks,
Rahul

---------- =46orwarded Message -----= ----

=46rom: internet-drafts=40ietf.org
Subject: = =5BRoll=5D I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt
Date: Sep 3= 0 2020, at 12:29 am
To: i-d-announce=40ietf.org
Cc: r= oll=40ietf.org


A New Internet-Draft is available f= rom the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a wo= rk item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IET=46= .

Title : Mode of Operation extension
Authors : R= ahul Arvind Jadhav
Pascal Thubert
Michael Richardson<= /div>
=46ilename : draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02.txt
Pages : 9
Date : 2020-09-29

Abstract:
RPL allows d= ifferent mode of operations which allows nodes to have a
consen= sus on the basic primitives that must be supported to join the
= network. The MOP field in =5BR=46C6550=5D is of 3 bits and is fast
<= div>depleting. This document extends the MOP for future use.

The IET=46 datatracker status page for this draft is:
htt= ps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-mopex/

There = are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org= /html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc= /html/draft-ietf-roll-mopex-02

A diff from the previous ver= sion is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff=3Furl2=3Ddra= ft-ietf-roll-mopex-02


Please note that it may take a co= uple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized = version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-= Drafts are also available by anonymous =46TP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf= .org/internet-drafts/


=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
Roll mailing list
R= oll=40ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
=
--5f738548_75bbdf34_1d73-- From nobody Tue Sep 29 12:11:04 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D10CF3A1072 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:11:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <160140666284.19099.16148385389893393087@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:11:02 -0700 From: IETF Secretariat Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] Milestones changed for roll WG X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 19:11:03 -0000 Changed milestone "Recharter WG or close", set due date to October 2021 from October 2020. URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/roll/about/ From nobody Tue Sep 29 14:57:25 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D15F93A0C94 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 14:57:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IKLMBYm4gC53 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 14:57:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe2f.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C9D163A0C7A for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 14:57:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe2f.google.com with SMTP id w25so3889810vsk.9 for ; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 14:57:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=uXuhb3B5XwdpY4P4uoZ6r428Z4A33sduigo2fYIbFEk=; b=n79B0DuImIVyDY2CvJWD8J4M5Px7Oemo07CnRn7g8+t5fzYezkARPDL7/pPeb9qBI8 V2wDrdrZs2Twlj/MOiN0QaMgXxSLYYT4UqEGKztCh5KDEWuTp4YgflkKCICu3tWW3Zr3 AyXhrsZc9SSgZbhvoiHPKht1u5HyaYpRzW/roEEJCfd7u4WJcTt99OypsM6O5CeChzvx KOjAoOF95WgRn3IQppmU1ugqrBXSlMNJvK4nuhl7Ot0lbwVtKU+EU53mYwSL3tibfrmK QAph13WLDtMyjl/Agj07EIW3scacM7pAeUyRZhj3f7tbYUZCnO0R9JX3IIV5FvYjVjKt cltw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=uXuhb3B5XwdpY4P4uoZ6r428Z4A33sduigo2fYIbFEk=; b=QVaQ8AEjNnOJVLOrTKI5ip36N8RJe0UECHksIvnnkD4MYvJYf3DpxKjwLPbU3jSzrg tIi5fsgnEG0KhIsdkS5+B8BiYjsFjesmTtqIoaCMFZgDxpNpSmz2k2JsaK9JAWwlJtuA WBkf4bMz6KwjV57bcCdsdz7aLw6tvm+lYtIqQ0uCY58XF9AOHrJXliUec85uK5ieFiL2 MXMjQ42Bk1yQk4t/PuB+EzV+ibLKzmpnvN3rT9XnKBFeQzBFelhdstkXLjfQy/dN1YIg i2QTFgV1ldCHOfLcQRvvvLdxuXbCF1EO+COEl5iW80nAamiLuswPYJJFnF3jWR7rK5zp 7jjg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532xiHd5MfvJ2mw6VDunbUbqdPzupg2/Q7B2AM+hRiVb3prOleoh tl7W0yscv9EPrJd+n7f33GDIMp3BI82Y44L8NjJbunyJK/9UWw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz9A5F1eCKUA70dd7xIXzXym2KmLIQDGao4DY0I+4DcTZpCMRZoljSjZe7hrePES6gYLFx6OHa/sVSGxlnvyxE= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6102:126a:: with SMTP id q10mr2327698vsg.3.1601416640260; Tue, 29 Sep 2020 14:57:20 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 00:56:44 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000faee2505b07add85" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Agenda: roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2020 21:57:24 -0000 --000000000000faee2505b07add85 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, Please find below the link to an updated agenda for today's meeting: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-02.txt Complete set of slides: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-interim-2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-00 Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join Webex: https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 Please note that we aim to record the meeting. Thank you and best regards, Ines and Dominique On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:09 AM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting on 30th > September. > > > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt > > Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/roll > or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September. > > Thank you and best regards, > > Ines and Dominique. > > > On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles < > mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: > >> Dear all, >> >> So far we have in the agenda: >> >> - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status >> - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: >> https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) >> - RPLv2 Topics >> >> Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your >> request by 18t Sept. >> >> Thank you, >> >> Ines and Dominique. >> >> On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles < >> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear all, >>> >>> Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interim >>> meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. >>> >>> Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic >>> during the next roll interim meeting indicating: >>> >>> - Topic to Present. >>> - Presenter >>> - Time needed. >>> >>> Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kMr6RM_ao4]: >>> >>> Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control >>> option (12:00min-14:00min) >>> Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of >>> capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying for >>> available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) >>> DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:15 >>> hs - 1:17hs ) >>> Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? >>> >>> Material: >>> Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll >>> icalendar (UTC): >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.ics >>> jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join >>> Webex: >>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>> >>> Please note that we aim to record the meeting. >>> >>> Material of the previous interim meetings: >>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>> >>> Thank you very much, >>> >>> Ines and Dominique >>> >>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>> From: IESG Secretary >>> Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM >>> Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG >>> Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 >>> To: IETF-Announce >>> Cc: >>> >>> >>> The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold >>> a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. >>> >>> Agenda: >>> To Be Determined >>> >>> Information about remote participation: >>> ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, >>> 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) >>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >>> Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial >>> 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 >>> Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 >>> >>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Roll mailing list >>> Roll@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll >>> >> --000000000000faee2505b07add85 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

Please f= ind below the link to an updated agenda for today's meeting:
=

Complete set of slides:




Webex:=C2=A0https= ://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12= =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345
=
Please note that we aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Thank you and best regards,

Ines and Dominique


On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:0= 9 AM Ines Robles <mar= iainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,
<= /div>

Please find below the link to the agen= da for the interim meeting on 30th September.=C2=A0
<= br>

=
Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in:=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/ses= sion/roll=C2=A0 or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September.

Thank you and best regards,

<= div>Ines and Dominique.=C2=A0


On Wed, Sep 16, 202= 0 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear = all,

So far we have in the agenda:

- WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status=C2=A0
- R= OLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KD= Z8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some additiona= l topics=C2=A0 would you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18= t Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

= Ines and Dominique.

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles <= mariain= esrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

<= div>Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interi= m meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours.
Please let us know by 18th September if you want to= present a topic during the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- Topic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time = needed.=C2=A0

Some discussions points from last in= terim meeting [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]= :

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distingu= ish Extended control option (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Sig= naling, bits to say which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:2= 3min),=C2=A0 roll querying all nodes, querying for available memory on node= s (23:00 min=20 -31:00 min=20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:= =C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID= =3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 1= 02 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we = aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materia= l of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL= -Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,
<= /div>

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded messag= e ---------
From: IESG S= ecretary <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Date: = Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and = Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce &= lt;ietf-announc= e@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power an= d Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
--000000000000faee2505b07add85-- From nobody Wed Sep 30 01:40:36 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D01C93A1300 for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 01:40:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=googlemail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qfSM5ecey2mR for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 01:40:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vk1-xa31.google.com (mail-vk1-xa31.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C2E3D3A12FA for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 01:40:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vk1-xa31.google.com with SMTP id q124so237496vkb.8 for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 01:40:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=HlAZslrucyTqaKZ8Kg5uOn/zFPd3HZf91/i/9vBeY9Q=; b=K9o8fnq4WysW/7S4lh86SaNnqU5OQaMIyH43pNZBZmSTsRLKd8aVbFPQV/RtBVKrLy q0d7KxDKy5054oFIJyjdjAf1K4EJGnVpHWJaHHQIndXrMv4lVieNlFvggJXHhb89XJVo sAPjdlDY1z9kZjYZIekOHrfnwrEbgk/Wdhng5p9JXyIxnUdsYd4SUmm2eAJdEWhg5KZe jOWqkcLCn4/RhdwqWIakZNqtcRbA7ZbEcmGU5k8BjKVAXbp8JyygaTk9DbhGmTupB4aH 0XX0VnK1uOhzCknhBc9KQCnD4zQQXAn0nzuiyQMTr44BZ+iNi5Zwk3VujV8tEoPkuPjW 6GSw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=HlAZslrucyTqaKZ8Kg5uOn/zFPd3HZf91/i/9vBeY9Q=; b=CrhYeusSfx7yeuXcpDz9DTEYQ80YRUPBR2Hv93xLoS3466bxVEt+cZcByCzq8bD8HD OLrhm1dbtQLsrRTz+rvJ5PJJYpppXq39LKmu/THHq6XDtAxesz6x53yr1QQtOUsoMtR0 PPyoYiOWF2qVibWEd+ba3kvFWiyukhtC2cYGFOXG/WlralkPlVzgWTjxPVpr2DspoYw9 ieTgfGkkgDrsvezRnuCdC0ba55oeg1u9pb7WFaIH8bAsoKEWaugCjykMDM5Z28GMYABK F7y7L1mO2BxWalm18VPEEHyHOLYPFf9bqn4JIwaq0FlVZIPzPWok+bhGH9FrOuxrBmMz lzGQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530IC1GsXzyNZG8zpyV8GWtpDE6BzSyyHWm8ulMBOkxUjTfDj3H/ STgSpVTkpt6bZy9zmh4PbiIdF35UpzhI9cpDWtgmiJd3M1V+Sg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJx9JRbpQjDBJhtLDgRn/CVKbvh505mRBA9gQoylEWV6ZDincg30iL8CtMaB22OFc8A6w6FkszZrOjXevEPZS1w= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:6e07:: with SMTP id j7mr667307vkc.18.1601455229563; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 01:40:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 11:39:53 +0300 Message-ID: To: roll Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000014f7c005b083da47" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Agenda: roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 08:40:35 -0000 --00000000000014f7c005b083da47 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear all, Please find an updated version of the complete slide set for the today meeting: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-interim-2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-02 Thank you, Ines and Dominique. On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:56 AM Ines Robles wrote: > Dear all, > > Please find below the link to an updated agenda for today's meeting: > > > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-02.txt > > Complete set of slides: > > > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-interim-2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-00 > > Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll > > jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join > > Webex: > https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 > Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 > > Please note that we aim to record the meeting. > > Thank you and best regards, > > Ines and Dominique > > > On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:09 AM Ines Robles < > mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: > >> Dear all, >> >> Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting on 30th >> September. >> >> >> https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-interim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt >> >> Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/roll >> or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September. >> >> Thank you and best regards, >> >> Ines and Dominique. >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles < >> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear all, >>> >>> So far we have in the agenda: >>> >>> - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status >>> - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: >>> https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) >>> - RPLv2 Topics >>> >>> Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your >>> request by 18t Sept. >>> >>> Thank you, >>> >>> Ines and Dominique. >>> >>> On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles < >>> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear all, >>>> >>>> Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll >>>> interim meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. >>>> >>>> Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic >>>> during the next roll interim meeting indicating: >>>> >>>> - Topic to Present. >>>> - Presenter >>>> - Time needed. >>>> >>>> Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ >>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kMr6RM_ao4]: >>>> >>>> Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control >>>> option (12:00min-14:00min) >>>> Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of >>>> capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, querying for >>>> available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) >>>> DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case >>>> (1:15 hs - 1:17hs ) >>>> Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? >>>> >>>> Material: >>>> Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll >>>> icalendar (UTC): >>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/28351.ics >>>> jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join >>>> Webex: >>>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >>>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>>> >>>> Please note that we aim to record the meeting. >>>> >>>> Material of the previous interim meetings: >>>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>>> >>>> Thank you very much, >>>> >>>> Ines and Dominique >>>> >>>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>>> From: IESG Secretary >>>> Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM >>>> Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG >>>> Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 >>>> To: IETF-Announce >>>> Cc: >>>> >>>> >>>> The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold >>>> a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. >>>> >>>> Agenda: >>>> To Be Determined >>>> >>>> Information about remote participation: >>>> ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, >>>> 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada) >>>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12 >>>> Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial >>>> 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 >>>> Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 >>>> >>>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Roll mailing list >>>> Roll@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll >>>> >>> --00000000000014f7c005b083da47 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear all,

Please find an updated ve= rsion of the complete slide set for the today meeting:

=
<= br>
Thank you,

Ines and Dominique.
=

= On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:56 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
<= /div>
Dear all,

Please find below the link t= o an updated agenda for today's meeting:


Complete set of slides:
=



Webex:=C2=A0= https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266= a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 102 5381= Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we aim to = record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Thank you an= d best regards,

Ines and Dominique

<= /div>

On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:09 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.= com> wrote:
Dear all,
Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeti= ng on 30th September.=C2=A0


Dear Presenters= , please upload your slides in:=C2=A0https://data= tracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/roll=C2=A0 or sen= d it to us by Tuesday 29th September.

Thank you and best regards,

<= div>Ines and Dominique.=C2=A0


On Wed, Sep 16, 202= 0 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear = all,

So far we have in the agenda:

- WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status=C2=A0
- R= OLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KD= Z8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some additiona= l topics=C2=A0 would you like to discuss? Please send us your request by 18= t Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

= Ines and Dominique.

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles <= mariain= esrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

<= div>Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll interi= m meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours.
Please let us know by 18th September if you want to= present a topic during the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- Topic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time = needed.=C2=A0

Some discussions points from last in= terim meeting [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]= :

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distingu= ish Extended control option (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Sig= naling, bits to say which the total number of capabilities (15:40 min -16:2= 3min),=C2=A0 roll querying all nodes, querying for available memory on node= s (23:00 min=20 -31:00 min=20 )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot= use case (1:15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for W= G Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:= =C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID= =3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting number: 171 1= 02 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we = aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Materia= l of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL= -Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,
<= /div>

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded messag= e ---------
From: IESG S= ecretary <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Date: = Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and = Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce &= lt;ietf-announc= e@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power an= d Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a= 5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.= com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.=C2=A0= Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: = 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
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X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX188L3NwYW4+PGJyPg0KPHNwYW4+Um9s bCBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3Q8L3NwYW4+PGJyPg0KPHNwYW4+Um9sbEBpZXRmLm9yZzwvc3Bhbj48YnI+ DQo8c3Bhbj5odHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL3JvbGw8L3NwYW4+ PGJyPg0KPC9kaXY+DQo8L2Jsb2NrcXVvdGU+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvYm9keT4NCjwvaHRtbD4NCg== --_000_B0121D0CE4774B0AB83A6F6791AE01B5ciscocom_-- From nobody Wed Sep 30 02:37:22 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3737C3A084A for ; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 02:37:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham 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tb/LU0yeN4iyAlo3bcQTvkUTq796abzfZT66zWt3vx4Ri16kFeGMhWVykoPBGDQWs72K QmiM4AMU3Eeep4brm4fEGh+fxlQo8HQaNAxXObNxIdvtkFFxkHvcQPlqmWlzSkWG6B2S tX4cJeNWdnZXWhF+rvn8ZshnjybqEgqis7LKdstJf8RumLMQik9PSTJn69v5VJNiRr6A TR43FO+rKJoqi0yzT/a740viSHLyJvsvEayev+VRgyF7cZ2zCjrzUvqf4tW29TJUW3Z9 yueQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=yRJbbs08bWw1Gjhjf4QwzfyxBRwBmn++1dUsMZJ6pwo=; b=o/2PhcU+odUWJCryGqn3dGoGj2bsXYJYavsMhNfz4gl0j11t/OWz2FWT2Z1tEmMwd0 gtYejPJMRFFBkmkxt9jIQ/4tiF5SXn+vnZTe/mY9pZcwaWb9HNKvky2JXU4yRVbXC7Xu FM7UDMLhoza6gL4YDJr3WrUibXtk/4CR1/DPo193N0p3ZTKc59VsOfNAJfRHPGMdmhlg VBa9bzveIKkOzYmrbowmWdFA3qFr6mET/LyEcSJL96Runkjx5GPLs93y+//Sr5FPmuyz ZpByf0TMVhzhdhmqKC3MnNcnU1MDkv11fOmZmhvFzNvCR6vaWb1Wfa1lLlD1bnZU1Wac 0qYw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5333sx0vC3xRnsasivfeiB0o75mEIrS+Z9lBgmHIsT2GNCn/NyCT kfVfkpnxC6JJYeJIuQEgxsYxYllyW609Sd4qoTQKZUqxCLeBzg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJymTbt7cDbu+TdnTnAS6rdhQPpgNOtwQ4YnChx8ECRBNTDSI/MVb2B2Aya3dmrz/pcxUIMoMY5M8qLYg/+YVbY= X-Received: by 2002:a92:c5ac:: with SMTP id r12mr1243163ilt.7.1601458637821; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 02:37:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <159984089344.15227.1314921743554511219@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Ines Robles Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 12:36:42 +0300 Message-ID: To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003adbfc05b084a5d9" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Agenda: roll WG Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:37:21 -0000 --0000000000003adbfc05b084a5d9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Pascal, The issue is fixed now, please find the new slide set: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-interim= -2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-03 Thank you and best regards, Ines On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:15 PM Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: > Hello Ines > > For some reason the slide with the pdao was scrambled when going pdf. > Could you please check ? > > Pascal > > Le 30 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 10:41, Ines Robles 40googlemail.com@dmarc.ietf.org> a =C3=A9crit : > > =EF=BB=BF > Dear all, > > Please find an updated version of the complete slide set for the today > meeting: > > > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-inter= im-2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-02 > > Thank you, > > Ines and Dominique. > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:56 AM Ines Robles < > mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: > >> Dear all, >> >> Please find below the link to an updated agenda for today's meeting: >> >> >> https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-inte= rim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-02.txt >> >> Complete set of slides: >> >> >> https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/slides/slides-inte= rim-2020-roll-05-sessa-completeset-roll-interim-20200930-00 >> >> Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-roll >> >> jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join >> >> Webex: >> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f= 12 >> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >> >> Please note that we aim to record the meeting. >> >> Thank you and best regards, >> >> Ines and Dominique >> >> >> On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:09 AM Ines Robles < >> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear all, >>> >>> Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting on 30t= h >>> September. >>> >>> >>> https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim-2020-roll-05/agenda/agenda-int= erim-2020-roll-05-roll-01-01.txt >>> >>> Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in: >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/roll >>> or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September. >>> >>> Thank you and best regards, >>> >>> Ines and Dominique. >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 8:45 AM Ines Robles < >>> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear all, >>>> >>>> So far we have in the agenda: >>>> >>>> - WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status >>>> - ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey: >>>> https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/5KDZ8HH ) >>>> - RPLv2 Topics >>>> >>>> Some additional topics would you like to discuss? Please send us your >>>> request by 18t Sept. >>>> >>>> Thank you, >>>> >>>> Ines and Dominique. >>>> >>>> On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines Robles < >>>> mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear all, >>>>> >>>>> Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll >>>>> interim meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours. >>>>> >>>>> Please let us know by *18th September* if you want to present a topic >>>>> during the next roll interim meeting indicating: >>>>> >>>>> - Topic to Present. >>>>> - Presenter >>>>> - Time needed. >>>>> >>>>> Some discussions points from last interim meeting [ >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]: >>>>> >>>>> Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control >>>>> option (12:00min-14:00min) >>>>> Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of >>>>> capabilities (15:40 min -16:23min), roll querying all nodes, queryin= g for >>>>> available memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min ) >>>>> DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case >>>>> (1:15 hs - 1:17hs ) >>>>> Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call? >>>>> >>>>> Material: >>>>> Etherpad: https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-interim-2020-roll-05-rol= l >>>>> icalendar (UTC): >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/283= 51.ics >>>>> jabber: xmpp:roll@jabber.ietf.org?join >>>>> Webex: >>>>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac64= 16f12 >>>>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>>>> >>>>> Please note that we aim to record the meeting. >>>>> >>>>> Material of the previous interim meetings: >>>>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>>>> >>>>> Thank you very much, >>>>> >>>>> Ines and Dominique >>>>> >>>>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>>>> From: IESG Secretary >>>>> Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM >>>>> Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG >>>>> Virtual Meeting: 2020-09-30 >>>>> To: IETF-Announce >>>>> Cc: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold >>>>> a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC. >>>>> >>>>> Agenda: >>>>> To Be Determined >>>>> >>>>> Information about remote participation: >>>>> ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG Wednesday, Sep 30, >>>>> 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Ca= nada) >>>>> Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 >>>>> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac64= 16f12 >>>>> Join by video system Dial 1711025381@ietf.webex.com You can also dial >>>>> 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number. Join by phone 1-650-479-= 3208 >>>>> Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 171 102 5381 >>>>> >>>>> https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Roll mailing list >>>>> Roll@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > > _______________________________________________ > Roll mailing list > Roll@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll > --0000000000003adbfc05b084a5d9 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Pascal,


Thank you and best regards,
=
Ines

On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:15 PM Pascal Thubert (p= thubert) <pthubert=3D40cis= co.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Hello Ines=C2=A0

For some reason the slide with the pdao was scrambled when going pdf.<= /div>
Could you please check ?

Pascal

Le 30 sept. 2020 =C3=A0 10:41, Ines Robles <ma= riainesrobles=3D40googlemail.com@dmarc.ietf.org> a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0:

=EF=BB=BF
On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:56 AM Ines= Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

Please find below the link to an updated agenda for today's meetin= g:


Complete set of slides:


Webex:=C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/= j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting num= ber: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Thank you and best regards,

Ines and Dominique


On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 12:09 AM Ines= Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

Please find below the link to the agenda for the interim meeting on 30= th September.=C2=A0


Dear Presenters, please upload your slides in:=C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2020-roll-05/session/r= oll=C2=A0 or send it to us by Tuesday 29th September.

Thank you and best regards,

Ines and Dominique.=C2=A0


On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 8:45 AM Ines = Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

So far we have in the agenda:

- WG Status: wg documents and related-ID status=C2=A0
- ROLL in IETF 109? (Please fill the survey:=C2=A0https://www.surveymonkey.c= om/r/5KDZ8HH )
- RPLv2 Topics

Some additional topics=C2=A0 would you like to discuss? Please send us= your request by 18t Sept.=C2=A0

Thank you,

Ines and Dominique.

On Sun, Sep 13, 2020 at 11:37 PM Ines= Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com> wrote:
Dear all,

Thank you very much for filling the doodle. We got the next roll inter= im meeting on 30th September with a duration of two hours.

Please let us know by 18th September if you want to present a t= opic during the next roll interim meeting indicating:

- Topic to Present.
- Presenter
- Time needed.=C2=A0

Some discussions points from last interim meeting [https://www.yout= ube.com/watch?v=3D_kMr6RM_ao4]:

Mopex: Discussion on 1 bit or 2 bits to distinguish Extended control o= ption (12:00min-14:00min)
Capabilities: Signaling, bits to say which the total number of capabil= ities (15:40 min -16:23min),=C2=A0 roll querying all nodes, querying for av= ailable memory on nodes (23:00 min -31:00 min )=C2=A0
DIS modification/use cases draft: Electrical meter reboot use case (1:= 15 hs - 1:17hs )
Eliding-dio-information: review needed, ready for WG Adoption Call?

Material:=C2=A0
Webex:=C2=A0https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/= j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Meeting num= ber: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345

Please note that we aim to record the meeting.=C2=A0=C2=A0

Material of the previous interim meetings:=C2=A0https://github.com/= roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting

Thank you very much,

Ines and Dominique

---------- Forwarded message --------= -
From: IESG Secretary <iesg-secre= tary@ietf.org>
Date: Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 7:17 PM
Subject: [Roll] Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG Virtual= Meeting: 2020-09-30
To: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce@ietf.org>
Cc: <roll@ietf.org>


The Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks (roll) WG will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2020-09-30 from 10:45 to 12:45 UTC.

Agenda:
To Be Determined

Information about remote participation:
ROLL Interim Meeting 30-09-2020 Hosted by ROLL WG=C2=A0 Wednesday, Sep 30, = 2020 6:20 am | 2 hours 50 minutes | (UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Cana= da) Meeting number: 171 102 5381 Password: ypMdeMeC345 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=3Dm266a5c57822f8ca4275e1f4ac6416f12<= /a>=C2=A0 Join by video system Dial 1711025381@i= etf.webex.com You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting num= ber.=C2=A0 Join by phone 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Acc= ess code: 171 102 5381

https://github.com/roll-wg/ROLL-Interim-Meeting
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org<= /span>
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
_______________________________________________
Roll mailing list
Roll@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/roll
--0000000000003adbfc05b084a5d9-- From nobody Wed Sep 30 08:04:19 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C14C03A0A16; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 08:04:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool To: Cc: aretana.ietf@gmail.com, roll@ietf.org, mariainesrobles@googlemail.com, roll-chairs@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <160147825628.21138.11499437010241874345@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 08:04:16 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] roll - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 109 X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 15:04:17 -0000 A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Ines Robles, a Chair of the roll working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks Area Name: Routing Area Session Requester: Ines Robles Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours Number of Attendees: 40 Conflicts to Avoid: Chair Conflict: anima manet cellar asdf 6tisch core ace Technology Overlap: rtgarea 6lo 6man lwig cbor t2trg Key Participant Conflict: detnet rtgwg intarea lpwan People who must be present: Michael Richardson Dominique Barthel Alvaro Retana Ines Robles Resources Requested: Special Requests: Additional key participant conflict: paw - that could not be added in the previous list --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Wed Sep 30 09:15:43 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA5CB3A0AE3; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:15:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160148253677.21622.13725487430779035370@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:15:36 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-17.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 16:15:37 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : A RPL DODAG Configuration Option for the 6LoWPAN Routing Header Authors : Pascal Thubert Li Zhao Filename : draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-17.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2020-09-30 Abstract: This document updates RFC 8138 by defining a bit in the RPL DODAG Configuration Option to indicate whether compression is used within the RPL Instance, and specify the behavior of RFC 8138-capable nodes when the bit is set and unset. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-17.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-17 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Sep 30 09:16:50 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: roll@ietf.org Delivered-To: roll@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC3823A0ADD; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:16:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: roll@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.17.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: roll@ietf.org Message-ID: <160148260873.30832.6437254368872907497@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:16:48 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Roll] I-D Action: draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-21.txt X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 16:16:49 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks WG of the IETF. Title : Routing for RPL Leaves Authors : Pascal Thubert Michael C. Richardson Filename : draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-21.txt Pages : 33 Date : 2020-09-30 Abstract: This specification extends RFC6550 and RFC8505 to provide routing services to Hosts called RPL Unaware Leaves that implement 6LoWPAN ND but do not participate in RPL. This specification also enables the RPL Root to proxy the 6LoWPAN keep-alive flows in its DODAG. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves/ There is also a HTML versions available at: https://www.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-21.html A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-roll-unaware-leaves-21 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. 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15.20.3433.032; Wed, 30 Sep 2020 16:25:11 +0000 From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" To: Alvaro Retana CC: Benjamin Kaduk , The IESG , "draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138@ietf.org" , Martin Duke , Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks , "roll-chairs@ietf.org" , "Michael Richardson" Thread-Topic: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHWhvbDFnz+ZxCN2kqfSLm4/QQEM6lhafFggADkOACAAVPGAIAAAK+AgAAvlRyACqqkkIAAO8YAgAAzb6aAAAQpAIAAVGSAgAiD2ECAAD3vgIAJd1hA Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 16:25:10 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Wed, 30 Sep 2020 16:24:23 +0000 Message-ID: References: <159968972884.1065.3876077471852624744@ietfa.amsl.com> <20200910200744.GE89563@kduck.mit.edu> <17053.1599841430@localhost> <20200911162617.GQ89563@kduck.mit.edu> <8F19C753-DCA0-4A32-BA3B-A124B2F7F745@cisco.com> <117497.1600481093@dooku> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 1c4a2e4f-7bcc-4b62-af6d-08d8655d6758 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 30 Sep 2020 16:25:11.1365 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: Rg9UF/KxH09dMFGG7vXiDZwa/K/jB5uScMzhn4WS5M4boJdNPr2A4hEU/ocejks95+FYkeflKD0kdMfkwzJNRg== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MN2PR11MB4725 X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.36.7.12, xch-aln-002.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-10.cisco.com Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Roll] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-roll-turnon-rfc8138-14: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: roll@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 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