From nobody Sat Jul 1 08:07:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72685120454 for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 08:07:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-2.8, RCVD_IN_SORBS_SPAM=0.5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (768-bit key) header.d=labn.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mK_C4lVgSsnA for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 08:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gproxy9.mail.unifiedlayer.com (gproxy9-pub.mail.unifiedlayer.com [69.89.20.122]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 721881242F5 for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 08:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from CMOut01 (unknown [10.0.90.82]) by gproxy9.mail.unifiedlayer.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E99B1E09A8 for ; Sat, 1 Jul 2017 09:07:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from box313.bluehost.com ([69.89.31.113]) by CMOut01 with id fT7k1v0042SSUrH01T7nZF; Sat, 01 Jul 2017 09:07:47 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=FvB1xyjq c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:117 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=xqWC_Br6kY4A:10 a=G3gG6ho9WtcA:10 a=NEAV23lmAAAA:8 a=48vgC7mUAAAA:8 a=zUFlJRoVwiak2uiOrTEA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=w1C3t2QeGrPiZgrLijVG:22 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=labn.net; s=default; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version :Date:Message-ID:From:References:Cc:To:Subject:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=4YyU1hwbCcPwxaRioVEZ0hnUskuz5W+/Va0nL6qUWog=; b=0bnDW0vXbde2gIQUtRmY1poLCa yrYyh9WRJNi5YLQnBb7/4wl4lfE4Ly2te8as7GBLVpWlJBfaXwcHACC47xOwNAg1AU9/FXbe0oCWE Pj/u72lA1nPuwpjbFFQLHvF4D; Received: from pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([100.15.84.20]:42508 helo=[IPv6:::1]) by box313.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1dRJzr-000K9h-Un; Sat, 01 Jul 2017 09:07:44 -0600 Subject: Re: YANG doctor review of draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-02 To: Martin Bjorklund , rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: yang-doctors@ietf.org References: <20170423.114706.2035453647296311737.mbj@tail-f.com> From: Lou Berger Message-ID: <284387ce-6e5b-557f-8a39-12b05d9004cb@labn.net> Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2017 11:07:39 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20170423.114706.2035453647296311737.mbj@tail-f.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - box313.bluehost.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - labn.net X-BWhitelist: no X-Source-IP: 100.15.84.20 X-Exim-ID: 1dRJzr-000K9h-Un X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Source-Sender: pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([IPv6:::1]) [100.15.84.20]:42508 X-Source-Auth: lberger@labn.net X-Email-Count: 2 X-Source-Cap: bGFibm1vYmk7bGFibm1vYmk7Ym94MzEzLmJsdWVob3N0LmNvbQ== Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2017 15:07:49 -0000 Martin, Sorry about the slow response, but as you know we've been waiting to update this document until schema-mount was updated/finalized. I think it's close enough now and certainly we have an update for this upcoming meeting, links to formatted text can be found in the repo https://github.com/ietf-rtg-area-yang-arch-dt/meta-model . See below for specific responses: On 4/23/2017 5:47 AM, Martin Bjorklund wrote: > Hi, > > I am the assigned YANG doctor for draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model, and > here are my review comments, based on -02: > > > 1) Add reference to import statements. > > import ietf-interfaces { > prefix if; > reference > "RFC 7223: A YANG Data Model for Interface Management"; > } > okay > 2) IETF boilerplate > > Use IETF boilerplate with contact, description w/ copyright etc. Done > > 3) feature bind-lne-name > > feature bind-lne-name { > description > "Logical network element to which an interface is bound"; > } > > This description doesn't make much sense. > > Also, this feature is not used in the model. Should the feature be > removed or used? > this is vestigial and can be deleted > 4) leaf managed > > leaf managed { > type boolean; > description > "True if the host can manage the LNE using the root mount > point"; > } > > This description needs to be expanded. This is a config leaf, so > what happens if a client sets this to 'true' for a certain LNE? > > The text in the document says: > > In addition to standard management interfaces, a host device > implementation may support accessing LNE configuration and > operational YANG models directly from the host system. When > supported, such access is accomplished through a yang-schema-mount > mount point > > So are there three cases involved? > > 1. The host device does NOT support accessing LNE data from the > host system => in this case no modules will be mounted. > > 2. The host device supports reading LNE data from the host > system => in this case the modules are mounted read-only. > > 3. The host device supports reading/writing LNE data from > the host system => in this case the modules are mounted > read-write. > > I _think_ the idea is that if the server supports 2 or 3, a client > can choose to set 'managed' to "false", in which case it turns into > case 1. Is this correct? If so, would it be useful to allow a > client to turn case 3 into 2? > > The text in the document in section 3 has more details on the > "managed" leaf. I suggest you add text from the document to the > YANG module. > > > 5) leaf bind-lne-name > > This leaf is a string. Shouldn't it be a leafref? > > leaf bind-lne-name { > type leafref { > path "/logical-network-elements/logical-network-element/name"; > } > ... > } agreed. Thanks! > > 6) inconsistent formatting > > I suggest you run pyang -f yang [--keep-comments] and possibly edit > the result add/remove comments. > > The following comment doesn't add much and should be removed: > > // namespace > namespace "urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:yang:ietf-logical-network-element"; > > Also remove the comments about rpcs and notifications. > > Also add period ('.') at the end of all sentences in the > descriptions. done. > > 7) YANG tree > > The document should explain the tree diagram syntax. > > > Section 2 has this tree diagram: > > +--rw interfaces > | +--rw interface* [name] > | +--rw name string > | +--rw lne:bind-lne-name? string > | +--rw ethernet > | | +--rw ni:bind-network-instance-name? string > | | +--rw aggregates > | | +--rw rstp > | | +--rw lldp > | | +--rw ptp > | +--rw vlans > | +--rw tunnels > | +--rw ipv4 > | | +--rw ni:bind-network-instance-name? string > | | +--rw arp > | | +--rw icmp > | | +--rw vrrp > | | +--rw dhcp-client > | +--rw ipv6 > | +--rw ni:bind-network-instance-name? string > | +--rw vrrp > | +--rw icmpv6 > | +--rw nd > | +--rw dhcpv6-client > > > This diagram is not correct; it seems to indicate that there are > nodes 'ethernet', 'vlans', 'ipv4', etc in the ietf-interfaces > module. I suggest you remove the nodes that do not exist, and > change 'ipv4' to 'ip:ipv4' (and add a reference to RFC 7277). this is fully replaced by an examples appendix in the forthcoming version. > > 8) YANG tree (2) > > Section 3 has this diagram: > > module: ietf-logical-network-element > +--rw logical-network-inventory > +--rw logical-network-element* [name] > +--rw name? string > +--rw description? string > +--rw managed? boolean > +--rw root? yang-schema-mount > augment /if:interfaces/if:interface: > +--rw bind-lne-name? string > > > It needs to be updated to match the YANG model (rename > logical-network-inventory), and the 'root' should not be shown as a > leaf. (Yes I know that there currently is no syntax defined for a > mount point in a tree) The document is now aligned with draft-ietf-netmod-yang-tree-diagrams-01 > > 9) YANG tree (3) > > Section 3.1 uses a tree diagram to show instance data. I think this > is confusing, and you should use XML or JSON instead. > Same comment as NI:The next rev will use JSON representation for example instance data. > 10) typo > > s/The interface management model [RFC7223] is and existing model/ > The interface management model [RFC7223] is an existing model/ > Thanks. Lou PS I failed to hit send at the same time as the NI response, so this sat around in my drafts folder for a while. But this allowed me to update the above based on the forthcoming rev, so all the better. > > /martin > > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg > From nobody Sun Jul 2 16:58:21 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietf.org Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075BA126E3A; Sun, 2 Jul 2017 16:58:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01.txt X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.55.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <149903989898.4990.12262378859973000006@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 02 Jul 2017 16:58:19 -0700 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 02 Jul 2017 23:58:19 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. Title : Enterprise Multihoming using Provider-Assigned Addresses without Network Prefix Translation: Requirements and Solution Authors : Fred Baker Chris Bowers Jen Linkova Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01.txt Pages : 47 Date : 2017-07-02 Abstract: Connecting an enterprise site to multiple ISPs using provider- assigned addresses is difficult without the use of some form of Network Address Translation (NAT). Much has been written on this topic over the last 10 to 15 years, but it still remains a problem without a clearly defined or widely implemented solution. Any multihoming solution without NAT requires hosts at the site to have addresses from each ISP and to select the egress ISP by selecting a source address for outgoing packets. It also requires routers at the site to take into account those source addresses when forwarding packets out towards the ISPs. This document attempts to define a complete solution to this problem. It covers the behavior of routers to forward traffic taking into account source address, and it covers the behavior of host to select appropriate source addresses. It also covers any possible role that routers might play in providing information to hosts to help them select appropriate source addresses. In the process of exploring potential solutions, this documents also makes explicit requirements for how the solution would be expected to behave from the perspective of an enterprise site network administrator . The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Jul 3 07:11:17 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietf.org Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5620812EB78; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:11:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03.txt X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.55.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <149909107632.4101.57527214727679055@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 07:11:16 -0700 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 14:11:16 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. Title : YANG Logical Network Elements Authors : Lou Berger Christan Hopps Acee Lindem Dean Bogdanovic Xufeng Liu Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03.txt Pages : 48 Date : 2017-07-03 Abstract: This document defines a logical network element module. This module can be used to manage the logical resource partitioning that may be present on a network device. Examples of common industry terms for logical resource partitioning are Logical Systems or Logical Routers. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Jul 3 07:38:42 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietf.org Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE51B131661; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:38:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03.txt X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.55.2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <149909271586.22782.17199197373369920165@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 07:38:35 -0700 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 14:38:36 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. Title : YANG Network Instances Authors : Lou Berger Christan Hopps Acee Lindem Dean Bogdanovic Xufeng Liu Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03.txt Pages : 31 Date : 2017-07-03 Abstract: This document defines a network instance module. This module can be used to manage the virtual resource partitioning that may be present on a network device. Examples of common industry terms for virtual resource partitioning are Virtual Routing and Forwarding (VRF) instances and Virtual Switch Instances (VSIs). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Jul 3 07:57:30 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A501412EBF7 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:57:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-2.8, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (768-bit key) header.d=labn.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IDJnTo2FNaGL for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:57:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gproxy2.mail.unifiedlayer.com (gproxy2-pub.mail.unifiedlayer.com [69.89.18.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5E001270A0 for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:57:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmgw3 (unknown [10.0.90.84]) by gproxy2.mail.unifiedlayer.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 968531E0A4F for ; Mon, 3 Jul 2017 08:57:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from box313.bluehost.com ([69.89.31.113]) by cmgw3 with id gExL1v00J2SSUrH01ExPm6; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:57:23 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=UM2tJGXy c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:117 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=xqWC_Br6kY4A:10 a=G3gG6ho9WtcA:10 a=48vgC7mUAAAA:8 a=0ZgzDHaQzhVBHrr1te0A:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=w1C3t2QeGrPiZgrLijVG:22 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=labn.net; s=default; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version :Date:Message-ID:From:References:Cc:To:Subject:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=9xaQcuPmGntTB+a8rZRqcOiODvuvG0L+ICj3v9n83+U=; b=uaGSCXrci3TnOBi3F0OWczSXTp hnfvg50IsaLyWy4Jyi8VPeu9ITmqsWHBbzZRtJ2Hmyhenn8UDYP8zkCQw9YnePg0ZiwqlovKsSQKs myporZoIQgyD1yBkR5OtOJzGD; Received: from pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([100.15.84.20]:54534 helo=[IPv6:::1]) by box313.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1dS2mu-0008Rj-CM; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 08:57:20 -0600 Subject: Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03.txt To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: "draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model@ietf.org" References: <149909107632.4101.57527214727679055@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Lou Berger Message-ID: <45d4b92b-835f-4ecc-54fb-2f34836e1cd1@labn.net> Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 10:57:12 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <149909107632.4101.57527214727679055@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - box313.bluehost.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - labn.net X-BWhitelist: no X-Source-IP: 100.15.84.20 X-Exim-ID: 1dS2mu-0008Rj-CM X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Source-Sender: pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([IPv6:::1]) [100.15.84.20]:54534 X-Source-Auth: lberger@labn.net X-Email-Count: 4 X-Source-Cap: bGFibm1vYmk7bGFibm1vYmk7Ym94MzEzLmJsdWVob3N0LmNvbQ== Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 14:57:29 -0000 Hello, This version has been updated to: - Align the text with the current (and hopefully final) definition of schema mount per draft-ietf-netmod-schema-mount - Cleanup intro an other editorial issues identified in rtg dir review (sent on NI draft, but equally applicable to this one) - Cleanup yang layout per YANG DR review - Add/fill in missing sections (e.g., Terminology and Security Consideration) - Use tree representation for schema mount per draft-ietf-netmod-yang-tree-diagrams - Tried to improve narrative based on comments and questions - Consolidated and expanded examples in new Appendix B. We plan to review these changes Prague and hopefully move to last call shortly thereafter. Lou (and co-authors) On 7/3/2017 10:11 AM, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : YANG Logical Network Elements > Authors : Lou Berger > Christan Hopps > Acee Lindem > Dean Bogdanovic > Xufeng Liu > Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03.txt > Pages : 48 > Date : 2017-07-03 > > Abstract: > This document defines a logical network element module. This module > can be used to manage the logical resource partitioning that may be > present on a network device. Examples of common industry terms for > logical resource partitioning are Logical Systems or Logical Routers. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-lne-model-03 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg > From nobody Mon Jul 3 08:05:34 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DEC813165E for ; 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Received: from pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([100.15.84.20]:54790 helo=[IPv6:::1]) by box313.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1dS2um-000AUf-2X; Mon, 03 Jul 2017 09:05:28 -0600 Subject: Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03.txt To: rtgwg@ietf.org References: <149909271586.22782.17199197373369920165@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Lou Berger Cc: "draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model@ietf.org" Message-ID: Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2017 11:05:18 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <149909271586.22782.17199197373369920165@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - box313.bluehost.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - labn.net X-BWhitelist: no X-Source-IP: 100.15.84.20 X-Exim-ID: 1dS2um-000AUf-2X X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Source-Sender: pool-100-15-84-20.washdc.fios.verizon.net ([IPv6:::1]) [100.15.84.20]:54790 X-Source-Auth: lberger@labn.net X-Email-Count: 1 X-Source-Cap: bGFibm1vYmk7bGFibm1vYmk7Ym94MzEzLmJsdWVob3N0LmNvbQ== Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2017 15:05:34 -0000 Hello, This version has been updated to: - Align the text with the current (and hopefully final) definition of schema mount per draft-ietf-netmod-schema-mount. Notably this has lead to the introduction of 3 "Well Known Mount Points". - Resolved open policy question by providing a structure for LxVPN-specific augmentations, e.g. as found in draft-ietf-bess-l3vpn-yang - Cleanup intro an other editorial issues identified in rtg dir review (sent on NI draft, but equally applicable to this one) - Cleanup yang layout per YANG DR review - Add/fill in missing sections (e.g., Terminology and Security Consideration) - Use tree representation for schema mount per draft-ietf-netmod-yang-tree-diagrams - Tried to improve narrative based on comments and questions - Consolidated and expanded examples in new Appendix B. There is one open issue flagged in the text: 1. Schema mount currently doesn't allow parent-reference filtering on the instance of the mount point, but rather just the schema. This means it is not possible to filter based on actual data, e.g., bind-network-instance-name="green". In the schema mount definition, the text and examples should be updated to cover this case. In the interest of getting the overall work progressed, we propose to accept this limitation in the definition of schema mount. We plan to review these changes Prague and hopefully move to last call shortly thereafter. Of course, any comments/questions/discussions would be appreciated (on-list, preferred). Lou (and co-authors) On 7/3/2017 10:38 AM, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : YANG Network Instances > Authors : Lou Berger > Christan Hopps > Acee Lindem > Dean Bogdanovic > Xufeng Liu > Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03.txt > Pages : 31 > Date : 2017-07-03 > > Abstract: > This document defines a network instance module. This module can be > used to manage the virtual resource partitioning that may be present > on a network device. Examples of common industry terms for virtual > resource partitioning are Virtual Routing and Forwarding (VRF) > instances and Virtual Switch Instances (VSIs). > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-ni-model-03 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg > From nobody Thu Jul 6 05:03:34 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D184B12EB2B; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 05:03:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.523 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.523 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9JNZr3VHSFJr; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 05:03:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rcdn-iport-8.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-8.cisco.com [173.37.86.79]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BADDB129B30; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 05:03:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3783; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1499342610; x=1500552210; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HEBlvpxo8w5mLw70h3Oxc60KxyTSZiDCwqRHNdnJGfA=; b=NM6dOPWBlgQ0Pyzugbp6fgPCbF8IdJngmYF9aVDVq+eWmE36McyvRex0 IN6/ZHTL+A4uTtOJQ0KFp75nT93djTD1STUMgsiEjWIqidgxlkJjY8Ouh 2wzD7YQGKO3Q26TtfHouxSssUGzuAm/WpHOMQZ2qOkaEMSzkmmvjR3YXo Q=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.40,317,1496102400"; d="scan'208";a="264682901" Received: from alln-core-3.cisco.com ([173.36.13.136]) by rcdn-iport-8.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 06 Jul 2017 12:03:30 +0000 Received: from [10.24.42.249] ([10.24.42.249]) by alln-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v66C3Rlt009964; Thu, 6 Jul 2017 12:03:28 GMT Message-ID: <595E270D.70209@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 05:03:25 -0700 From: "Ahmed Bashandy (bashandy)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" , draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop@ietf.org, Stewart Bryant , Jeff Tantsura , rtgwg-chairs Subject: Response to Early review for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop References: <59430E82.4000708@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <59430E82.4000708@cisco.com> X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <59430E82.4000708@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 12:03:33 -0000 Hi, The comments from Stewart where placed in the link https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/review-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-00-rtgdir-early-bryant-2017-05-30/ instead of being sent to the maling list. I have cut-and-pasted the review comments from the link above and put my reply inline. See "#Ahmed" Ahmed -------- This is the review for this draft and replaces the one I incorrectly submitted a few days ago. I have submitted a third party IPR disclosure relative to this draft, there is clearly an overlap with the IPR disclosed against RFC5715, and SR. There may of course now be other IPR. #Ahmed IPR disclosure will be made Subject to resolving the above, we should adopt the draft since SR can clearly be used to provide two stage loop-free convergence. ====== This document provides a mechanism leveraging Segment Routing to ensure loop-freeness during the IGP reconvergence process following a link-state change event. SB> Whilst technically that is a completely correct statement many readers SB> will interpret that statement as the provision of link protection SB> when you provide this service for link and node failure and SB> presumable for metric change. #Ahmed I do not understand what is the concern here? We use Figure 1 to illustrate the mechanism. In this scenario, all the IGP link metrics are 1, excepted R3-R4 whose metric is 100. We consider the traffic from S to D. SB> There needs to be a note of the symmetry properties of the links. #Ahmed Agreed ========= Stage 2: After C elapses, R installs the normal post-convergence FIB entry for D, i.e. without any additional segments inserted that ensure the loop-free property. SB> The timers can usefully be advertised rather than configured SB> (draft-bryant-rtgwg-param-sync) #Ahmed We will change the text to indicate that "C" can be determined in a way that is out of scope of the draft ========== 5. Security Considerations The behavior described in this document is internal functionality to a router that result in the ability to explicitly steer traffic over the post convergence path after a remote topology change in a manner that guarantees loop freeness. As such no additional security risk is introduced by using the mechanisms proposed in this document. SB> I don't think that there are zero increased risks. For example SB> the extended convergence delay and the presence SB> of routers without this feature magnifies the impact SB> of a link flap attack #Ahmed Actually I think the comment is not accurate. The mechanisms proposed in this draft moves the traffic to the post convergence path faster, or worst case, at the same speed without using these mechanisms. So if the proposed mechanisms do not enhance security, they are not adding any more risk On 6/14/2017 1:56 AM, Jeff Tantsura wrote: > Guys, > > Please work on resolving Early review RTGDIR comments. > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/review-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-00-rtgdir-early-bryant-2017-05-30/ > > Thanks! > > Cheers, > Jeff > > > On 6/13/17, 13:36, "IETF Secretariat" wrote: > > > Hello, > > This is a notification from the ID list for Routing Area Working Group. > > Document: draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop, > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop/ > > Change: > Request for Early review by RTGDIR Completed: Not Ready. Reviewer: Stewart Bryant. > > Best regards, > > The Datatracker draft tracking service > (for the IETF Secretariat) > > > > From nobody Fri Jul 7 05:39:25 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DA7B12EAF9; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 05:39:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fB8uns9sCWtJ; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 05:39:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf0-x242.google.com (mail-lf0-x242.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::242]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7AC0612EC22; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 05:39:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x242.google.com with SMTP id t72so3765090lff.0; Fri, 07 Jul 2017 05:39:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=uYz8jF//r8kviwBuWxMJld3puuVeRIjtmcnbLCmmpqM=; b=MKbqrEhzVkACFkNvQKUpg3Oe4c7WoRZKsFazEjcdOW/taxjTDPxwYJ9sLn8+CjwCwT QXSPnsR45IRkGiGQSb201fuzexJOx0ei4iBN8Gr0J2bBzyeohEfo+uSlUi5nK+49AtH1 YzoqqKWL0b0ES5DDmppO/4ivtB3xAwSE0WRSL9pAW2p0RMrfyod0uRYez7LrTitlM1o/ 1a2UaDvlAHQ9VHzG2nWypeswfT2BFtLdSHPe2WhbWT3kXSJhlNcczpBYR64mdfUyHE2l PrJ0/rtm/pYZOqXa0jdsxi32bcB47UJRyNBexX6DMTFavUZRLrrKSfOLzx47S9+Jq8nC sF2A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=uYz8jF//r8kviwBuWxMJld3puuVeRIjtmcnbLCmmpqM=; b=HWohy1PLB+zagItjAyGd3TCsdMtAs8+2JjDbybqgYmB+uh21nDquKuQhWP01Ts7000 XyOjymBc/JF1uHpZHD//MjBxT+86s4DAp4D2d40luJiRPrVVos7E47oO+vS0REblATJS BkKRHgzjxKZ/pGUzvhQ2xCOAsKgcpQYoqRZznu4P1+FNp6MqmbppCHbZAJ0Xz5iDW64t ABFT7itHhJpnx0ZCFnfbfhHBREcvJf3+vJc4Eyr7cMfhwnyVE7Dp7uPahOECmtxZtMQG vNt7CXgFx2pR/CB1SCYVbLH+PO1h2gD88qn1BZrtALnFdYk3dh2IiLV39SENbNbGFJBv 7lgg== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw110MAWVr11rKzvinIomYanhAF+BfQ2F4Hu1oqvADNHM1cD7cD4pQ vWxBqGUoqWNUfg== X-Received: by 10.28.169.207 with SMTP id s198mr2219877wme.8.1499431159632; Fri, 07 Jul 2017 05:39:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.126] (host213-123-124-182.in-addr.btopenworld.com. [213.123.124.182]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 142sm3636299wmi.1.2017.07.07.05.39.18 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 07 Jul 2017 05:39:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Response to Early review for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop To: "Ahmed Bashandy (bashandy)" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop@ietf.org, Stewart Bryant , Jeff Tantsura , rtgwg-chairs References: <59430E82.4000708@cisco.com> <595E270D.70209@cisco.com> From: Stewart Bryant Message-ID: <2cf7a8f4-be30-fd73-9df2-9345cb28fb85@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2017 13:39:16 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <595E270D.70209@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-GB Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2017 12:39:23 -0000 Hi Ahmed Trimming this to the issues we need to discuss. > ====== > > This document provides a mechanism leveraging Segment Routing to > ensure loop-freeness during the IGP reconvergence process following > a link-state change event. > > SB> Whilst technically that is a completely correct statement many > readers > SB> will interpret that statement as the provision of link protection > SB> when you provide this service for link and node failure and > SB> presumable for metric change. > > #Ahmed > I do not understand what is the concern here? Those that know the detail will understand that "link-state change event" covers (multiple)link failure, node failure, and both increase and decrease of link metrics. A lot of readers will not appreciate the range of events that "link-state change event" encompasses, nor will they realize that you can get looks when you get good news as well as bad news. My suggestion is that you spell this out for the reader so the appreciate the applicability of the RFC. > > Stage 2: After C elapses, R installs the normal post-convergence FIB > entry for D, i.e. without any additional segments inserted that > ensure the loop-free property. > > SB> The timers can usefully be advertised rather than configured > SB> (draft-bryant-rtgwg-param-sync) > > #Ahmed > We will change the text to indicate that "C" can be determined in a > way that is out of scope of the draft OK > ========== > > 5. Security Considerations > > The behavior described in this document is internal functionality > to a router that result in the ability to explicitly steer traffic > over the post convergence path after a remote topology change in a > manner that guarantees loop freeness. As such no additional > security risk is introduced by using the mechanisms proposed in > this document. > > SB> I don't think that there are zero increased risks. For example > SB> the extended convergence delay and the presence > SB> of routers without this feature magnifies the impact > SB> of a link flap attack > > #Ahmed > Actually I think the comment is not accurate. The mechanisms proposed > in this draft moves the traffic to the post convergence path faster, > or worst case, at the same speed without using these mechanisms. So > if the proposed mechanisms do not enhance security, they are not > adding any more risk You may be correct, I need to think about the interactions between nodes that do and do not support this mechanism which is where the problem normally arises. Something that I did not see was any comment on the need to abandon this if the failure was worse than expected. Best Regards Stewart From nobody Fri Jul 7 06:29:26 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77A6B12EACC; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 06:29:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.02 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.02 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wWLJEZZEPlwV; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 06:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM03-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-by2nam03on0115.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.42.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A29F129AF1; 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boundary="_000_MWHPR05MB2829287CD47D9D5796AFF594A9AA0MWHPR05MB2829namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 07 Jul 2017 13:29:19.5766 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR05MB3357 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2017 13:29:24 -0000 --_000_MWHPR05MB2829287CD47D9D5796AFF594A9AA0MWHPR05MB2829namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RTGWG, The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague has been posted: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/99/agenda/rtgwg/ We requested, and were given, two sessions based on demand from previous meetings. However, we are currently able to schedule all of the presentations and discussions in the first RTGWG session on Mond= ay morning. At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday RTGWG session, since we somet= imes have late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time slots. We will decide later= whether to cancel it or not. If you requested a session, please check the agenda to make sure it is ther= e, and contact us if it isn't. Thanks, Chris and Jeff --_000_MWHPR05MB2829287CD47D9D5796AFF594A9AA0MWHPR05MB2829namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
RTGWG,
 
The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague has been posted:
 
 
We requested, and were given, two sessions based on demand from
previous meetings.  However, we are currently able to schedule
all of the presentations and discussions in the first RTGWG session on= Monday
morning. 
 
At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday RTGWG session, since we = sometimes have
late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time slots.  We will de= cide later whether
to cancel it or not. 
 
If you requested a session, please check the agenda to make sure it is= there, and contact
us if it isn’t.
 
Thanks,
Chris and Jeff
 
--_000_MWHPR05MB2829287CD47D9D5796AFF594A9AA0MWHPR05MB2829namp_-- From nobody Fri Jul 7 10:48:44 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D8DB12EC30; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 10:48:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.522 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.522 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wStS5WhLL3Ig; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 10:48:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-5.cisco.com (alln-iport-5.cisco.com [173.37.142.92]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 127C0124217; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 10:48:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=9958; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1499449720; x=1500659320; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to; bh=KP9PFEmO8f+5Bshk5o3Ud9op5DnEfpekpYwzZ9+1Q+o=; b=M51IhmgE5g/uu0q+joi7ssHFvR2ubOd42WzpJDXqkrCP1NIPlJkvkFCi jzVst5jZ3oRGLpj6FRVvlXR2CPKFbluNYJ3BBVol8xk8z0o+az+hClACf hdHt0XV6T1YKTiSYuukQZpf9vfl3uICzaXqoIT516aChvnN5uXdGcRWuV c=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.40,324,1496102400"; d="scan'208,217";a="450015453" Received: from alln-core-2.cisco.com ([173.36.13.135]) by alln-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 07 Jul 2017 17:48:39 +0000 Received: from [10.24.42.249] ([10.24.42.249]) by alln-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v67HmVGu014048; Fri, 7 Jul 2017 17:48:33 GMT Message-ID: <595FC96C.9080601@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2017 10:48:28 -0700 From: "Ahmed Bashandy (bashandy)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Stewart Bryant , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop@ietf.org, Stewart Bryant , Jeff Tantsura , rtgwg-chairs Subject: Re: Response to Early review for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop References: <59430E82.4000708@cisco.com> <595E270D.70209@cisco.com> <2cf7a8f4-be30-fd73-9df2-9345cb28fb85@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <2cf7a8f4-be30-fd73-9df2-9345cb28fb85@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010607070509070804060802" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2017 17:48:42 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010607070509070804060802 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks a lot for the quick response. See inline "#Ahmed2" On 7/7/2017 5:39 AM, Stewart Bryant wrote: > > Hi Ahmed > > Trimming this to the issues we need to discuss. >> ====== >> >> This document provides a mechanism leveraging Segment Routing to >> ensure loop-freeness during the IGP reconvergence process following >> a link-state change event. >> >> SB> Whilst technically that is a completely correct statement many >> readers >> SB> will interpret that statement as the provision of link protection >> SB> when you provide this service for link and node failure and >> SB> presumable for metric change. >> >> #Ahmed >> I do not understand what is the concern here? > > Those that know the detail will understand that "link-state change event" > covers (multiple)link failure, node failure, and both increase and > decrease > of link metrics. A lot of readers will not appreciate the range of events > that "link-state change event" encompasses, nor will they realize that > you can get looks when you get good news as well as bad news. My > suggestion is that you spell this out for the reader so the appreciate > the > applicability of the RFC. #Ahmed2: At this point in time, the mechanisms in this draft intend to cover all remote topology changes that may risk microloops. Hence there is no need to spell each one out. As we progress, we may decide to limit this draft to particular types of topology changes. At that time we will explicitly spell out such types. > >> >> Stage 2: After C elapses, R installs the normal post-convergence FIB >> entry for D, i.e. without any additional segments inserted that >> ensure the loop-free property. >> >> SB> The timers can usefully be advertised rather than configured >> SB> (draft-bryant-rtgwg-param-sync) >> >> #Ahmed >> We will change the text to indicate that "C" can be determined in a >> way that is out of scope of the draft > > OK > >> ========== >> >> 5. Security Considerations >> >> The behavior described in this document is internal functionality >> to a router that result in the ability to explicitly steer traffic >> over the post convergence path after a remote topology change in a >> manner that guarantees loop freeness. As such no additional >> security risk is introduced by using the mechanisms proposed in >> this document. >> >> SB> I don't think that there are zero increased risks. For example >> SB> the extended convergence delay and the presence >> SB> of routers without this feature magnifies the impact >> SB> of a link flap attack >> >> #Ahmed >> Actually I think the comment is not accurate. The mechanisms proposed >> in this draft moves the traffic to the post convergence path faster, >> or worst case, at the same speed without using these mechanisms. So >> if the proposed mechanisms do not enhance security, they are not >> adding any more risk > > You may be correct, I need to think about the interactions between > nodes that do and do not support this mechanism which is where the > problem normally arises. > > Something that I did not see was any comment on the need to abandon > this if the failure was worse than expected. #Ahmed2 The last statement is not related to security. It is an intuitive implementation detail that any reasonably skilled engineer will take care of. As with any feature, if an implementation chooses to implement some but not all of the mechanisms of the feature, then it is the responsibility of the implementer to make sure that the implementation gets applied as intended. > > Best Regards > > Stewart > --------------010607070509070804060802 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Thanks a lot for the quick response.

See inline "#Ahmed2"

On 7/7/2017 5:39 AM, Stewart Bryant wrote:

Hi Ahmed

Trimming this to the issues we need to discuss.
======

   This document provides a mechanism leveraging Segment Routing to
   ensure loop-freeness during the IGP reconvergence process following
   a link-state change event.

SB> Whilst technically that is a completely correct statement many readers
SB> will interpret that statement as the provision of link protection
SB> when you provide this service for link and node failure and
SB> presumable for metric change.

#Ahmed
I do not understand what is the concern here?

Those that know the detail will understand that "link-state change event"
covers (multiple)link failure, node failure, and both increase and decrease
of link metrics. A lot of readers will not appreciate the range of events
that "link-state change event" encompasses, nor will they realize that
you can get looks when you get good news as well as bad news. My
suggestion is that you spell this out for the reader so the appreciate the
applicability of the RFC.
#Ahmed2:
At this point in time, the mechanisms in this draft intend to cover all remote topology changes that may risk microloops. Hence there is no need to spell  each one out. As we progress, we may decide to limit this draft to particular types of topology changes. At that time we will explicitly spell out such types.


   Stage 2: After C elapses, R installs the normal post-convergence FIB
   entry for D, i.e. without any additional segments inserted that
   ensure the loop-free property.

SB> The timers can usefully be advertised rather than configured
SB> (draft-bryant-rtgwg-param-sync)

#Ahmed
We will change the text to indicate that "C" can be determined in a way that is out of scope of the draft

OK

 ==========

5. Security Considerations

   The behavior described in this document is internal functionality
   to a router that result in the ability to explicitly steer traffic
   over the post convergence path after a remote topology change in a
   manner that guarantees loop freeness. As such no additional
   security risk is introduced by using the mechanisms proposed in
   this document.

SB> I don't think that there are zero increased risks. For example
SB> the extended convergence delay and the presence
SB> of routers without this feature magnifies the impact
SB> of a link flap attack

#Ahmed
Actually I think the comment is not accurate. The mechanisms proposed in this draft moves the traffic to the post convergence path faster, or worst case, at the same speed without using these mechanisms. So  if the proposed mechanisms do not enhance security, they are not adding any more risk

You may be correct, I need to think about the interactions between nodes that do and do not support this mechanism which is where the problem normally arises.

Something that I did not see was any comment on the need to abandon this if the failure was worse than expected.
#Ahmed2
The last statement is not related to security. It is an intuitive implementation detail that any reasonably skilled engineer will take care of. As with any feature, if an implementation chooses to implement some but not all of the mechanisms of the feature, then it is the responsibility of the implementer to make sure that the implementation gets applied as intended.

Best Regards

Stewart


--------------010607070509070804060802-- From nobody Mon Jul 10 13:11:58 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7185A12ECB5; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:11:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.903 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.903 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HD3vrX79TKPY; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:11:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F37831318BD; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:11:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 378DA1E34A; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:21:02 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:21:02 -0400 From: Jeffrey Haas To: Xufeng Liu Cc: Greg Mirsky , "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Message-ID: <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 20:11:51 -0000 Xufeng, I see that draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang-04 was issued. My comment is against that version now. On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 03:44:28PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: > > I'm not conversant with common Yang tool suites, but it seems if the ordered-by > > user rather than the default of system, then the tooling might present the > > bottom of stack entry as the first or last node of the list rather than requiring the > > consumer to have to run a sort of the nodes based on the id number and then > > select the first node. > > [Xufeng] Are you suggesting to use the position to order instead of the ID > value? If so, what would be the semantics of the ID value? If we cannot > get rid of the ID key, I don't know if using a separate ordering mechanism > will make the usability better. I see that you changed things to use a constrained index range with id 0 being special for top of stack. So, if you have labels with indexes 0, 5, 10, 15, then 15 would be the bottom of stack? -- Jeff From nobody Mon Jul 10 13:23:32 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1745A12F26C for ; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:23:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.903 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.903 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YSLMx_EOJ41X for ; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:23:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F01E12F258 for ; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 13:23:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id C92311E34A; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:32:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:32:51 -0400 From: Jeffrey Haas To: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: Extended community types, e.g. route-targets (was Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt) Message-ID: <20170710203251.GD12373@pfrc.org> References: <149877252152.27831.15805773003993763195@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <149877252152.27831.15805773003993763195@ietfa.amsl.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 20:23:30 -0000 Acee (and other authors), On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 02:42:01PM -0700, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Routing Area Common YANG Data Types > Authors : Xufeng Liu > Yingzhen Qu > Acee Lindem > Christian Hopps > Lou Berger > Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt > Pages : 40 > Date : 2017-06-29 > > Abstract: > This document defines a collection of common data types using the > YANG data modeling language. These derived common types are designed > to be imported by other modules defined in the routing area. Thanks for the updates for the various route-target,origin and site of origin extended community types. I'll try to take some some to read the regex in detail. My lingering issue with the route-target types is that IETF work on VPNs will continue to add extended communities to have route-target semantics outside of the types originally defined in RFC 4360. The current example of this is the ES-Import community. I believe we either need to: 1. Provide a generic format for types other than 0,1,2. Or, 2. Document how the relevant type is intended to be maintained. For example, the module that route-targets is part of is not IANA maintained. If this issue is still unclear, let's plan on spending a small amount of hallway time discussing this in Prague. -- Jeff From nobody Mon Jul 10 14:44:38 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0376130019 for ; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 14:44:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.523 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.523 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UheXf5SIdDD7 for ; 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d="scan'208";a="453367510" Received: from rcdn-core-6.cisco.com ([173.37.93.157]) by alln-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 10 Jul 2017 21:44:34 +0000 Received: from XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (xch-rtp-014.cisco.com [64.101.220.154]) by rcdn-core-6.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6ALiXKR002354 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 10 Jul 2017 21:44:34 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (64.101.220.154) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1210.3; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 17:44:33 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1210.000; Mon, 10 Jul 2017 17:44:33 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Jeffrey Haas , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: Extended community types, e.g. route-targets (was Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt) Thread-Topic: Extended community types, e.g. route-targets (was Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt) Thread-Index: AQHS+bpqyumXgcAUD0KQn+Ccslr0tKJNl/WA Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 21:44:33 +0000 Message-ID: References: <149877252152.27831.15805773003993763195@ietfa.amsl.com> <20170710203251.GD12373@pfrc.org> In-Reply-To: <20170710203251.GD12373@pfrc.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <6F95216685068D47907C7B2871FB76EC@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 21:44:37 -0000 SGkgSmVmZiwgDQoNCk9uIDcvMTAvMTcsIDQ6MzIgUE0sICJydGd3ZyBvbiBiZWhhbGYgb2YgSmVm ZnJleSBIYWFzIg0KPHJ0Z3dnLWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgb24gYmVoYWxmIG9mIGpoYWFzQHBm cmMub3JnPiB3cm90ZToNCg0KPkFjZWUgKGFuZCBvdGhlciBhdXRob3JzKSwNCj4NCj5PbiBUaHUs IEp1biAyOSwgMjAxNyBhdCAwMjo0MjowMVBNIC0wNzAwLCBpbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHNAaWV0Zi5v cmcgd3JvdGU6DQo+PiBBIE5ldyBJbnRlcm5ldC1EcmFmdCBpcyBhdmFpbGFibGUgZnJvbSB0aGUg b24tbGluZSBJbnRlcm5ldC1EcmFmdHMNCj4+ZGlyZWN0b3JpZXMuDQo+PiBUaGlzIGRyYWZ0IGlz IGEgd29yayBpdGVtIG9mIHRoZSBSb3V0aW5nIEFyZWEgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cCBvZiB0aGUgSUVU Ri4NCj4+IA0KPj4gICAgICAgICBUaXRsZSAgICAgICAgICAgOiBSb3V0aW5nIEFyZWEgQ29tbW9u IFlBTkcgRGF0YSBUeXBlcw0KPj4gICAgICAgICBBdXRob3JzICAgICAgICAgOiBYdWZlbmcgTGl1 DQo+PiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIFlpbmd6aGVuIFF1DQo+PiAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIEFjZWUgTGluZGVtDQo+PiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg IENocmlzdGlhbiBIb3Bwcw0KPj4gICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICBMb3UgQmVyZ2Vy DQo+PiAJRmlsZW5hbWUgICAgICAgIDogZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1ydGd3Zy1yb3V0aW5nLXR5cGVzLTA4 LnR4dA0KPj4gCVBhZ2VzICAgICAgICAgICA6IDQwDQo+PiAJRGF0ZSAgICAgICAgICAgIDogMjAx Ny0wNi0yOQ0KPj4gDQo+PiBBYnN0cmFjdDoNCj4+ICAgIFRoaXMgZG9jdW1lbnQgZGVmaW5lcyBh IGNvbGxlY3Rpb24gb2YgY29tbW9uIGRhdGEgdHlwZXMgdXNpbmcgdGhlDQo+PiAgICBZQU5HIGRh dGEgbW9kZWxpbmcgbGFuZ3VhZ2UuICBUaGVzZSBkZXJpdmVkIGNvbW1vbiB0eXBlcyBhcmUgZGVz aWduZWQNCj4+ICAgIHRvIGJlIGltcG9ydGVkIGJ5IG90aGVyIG1vZHVsZXMgZGVmaW5lZCBpbiB0 aGUgcm91dGluZyBhcmVhLg0KPg0KPlRoYW5rcyBmb3IgdGhlIHVwZGF0ZXMgZm9yIHRoZSB2YXJp b3VzIHJvdXRlLXRhcmdldCxvcmlnaW4gYW5kIHNpdGUgb2YNCj5vcmlnaW4gZXh0ZW5kZWQgY29t bXVuaXR5IHR5cGVzLiAgSSdsbCB0cnkgdG8gdGFrZSBzb21lIHNvbWUgdG8gcmVhZCB0aGUNCj5y ZWdleCBpbiBkZXRhaWwuDQo+DQo+TXkgbGluZ2VyaW5nIGlzc3VlIHdpdGggdGhlIHJvdXRlLXRh cmdldCB0eXBlcyBpcyB0aGF0IElFVEYgd29yayBvbiBWUE5zDQo+d2lsbCBjb250aW51ZSB0byBh ZGQgZXh0ZW5kZWQgY29tbXVuaXRpZXMgdG8gaGF2ZSByb3V0ZS10YXJnZXQgc2VtYW50aWNzDQo+ b3V0c2lkZSBvZiB0aGUgdHlwZXMgb3JpZ2luYWxseSBkZWZpbmVkIGluIFJGQyA0MzYwLiAgVGhl IGN1cnJlbnQgZXhhbXBsZQ0KPm9mDQo+dGhpcyBpcyB0aGUgRVMtSW1wb3J0IGNvbW11bml0eS4N Cg0KSSB0aGluayB0aGlzIGlzIGEgdHlwZSB0aGF0IHdvdWxkIGJlIHNoYXJlZCBhY3Jvc3MgTDJW UE4gYW5kIEJHUCBtb2R1bGVzLg0KV2UgaGF2ZSB0aGlzIGZvcm1hdCBmb3Igcm91dGUtb3JpZ2lu LCB3ZSBjYW4gYWRkIGl0IGZvciByb3V0ZS10YXJnZXQNCnByZWNlZGVkIGJ5IOKAnDY64oCdLiAN Cj4NCj5JIGJlbGlldmUgd2UgZWl0aGVyIG5lZWQgdG86DQo+MS4gUHJvdmlkZSBhIGdlbmVyaWMg Zm9ybWF0IGZvciB0eXBlcyBvdGhlciB0aGFuIDAsMSwyLiBPciwNCj4yLiBEb2N1bWVudCBob3cg dGhlIHJlbGV2YW50IHR5cGUgaXMgaW50ZW5kZWQgdG8gYmUgbWFpbnRhaW5lZC4NCg0KVGhlcmUg aXMgYSB0cmFkZS1vZmYgaGVyZSBpbiBwcm92aWRpbmcgc3Ryb25nIHR5cGluZyBhbmQgZmxleGli aWxpdHkuIEkNCmRvbuKAmXQgc2VlIGhvdyB3ZSBjYW4gYW50aWNpcGF0ZSB0aGUgdGV4dHVhbCBj b252ZW50aW9ucyBmb3IgYWxsIGZ1dHVyZQ0Kcm91dGUgdGFyZ2V0IHR5cGVzIGluIGFkdmFuY2Uu IElmIHlvdSB3YW50IGZsZXhpYmlsaXR5LCB3ZSBjb3VsZCBqdXN0IG1ha2UNCml0IGEgc3RyaW5n IDteKSANCg0KPg0KPkZvciBleGFtcGxlLCB0aGUgbW9kdWxlIHRoYXQgcm91dGUtdGFyZ2V0cyBp cyBwYXJ0IG9mIGlzIG5vdCBJQU5BDQo+bWFpbnRhaW5lZC4NCj4NCj5JZiB0aGlzIGlzc3VlIGlz IHN0aWxsIHVuY2xlYXIsIGxldCdzIHBsYW4gb24gc3BlbmRpbmcgYSBzbWFsbCBhbW91bnQgb2YN Cj5oYWxsd2F5IHRpbWUgZGlzY3Vzc2luZyB0aGlzIGluIFByYWd1ZS4NCg0KU291bmRzIGdvb2Qu DQoNClRoYW5rcywNCkFjZWUgDQoNCj4NCj4tLSBKZWZmDQo+DQo+X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj5ydGd3ZyBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj5ydGd3 Z0BpZXRmLm9yZw0KPmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcnRnd2cN Cg0K From nobody Mon Jul 10 16:12:23 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8661713194D for ; 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[107.1.141.74]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g184sm27061793pfb.3.2017.07.10.16.12.13 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:12:14 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/f.23.0.170610 Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 16:12:12 -0700 Subject: Re: Extended community types, e.g. route-targets (was Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt) From: Jeff Tantsura To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Jeffrey Haas , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: Extended community types, e.g. route-targets (was Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt) References: <149877252152.27831.15805773003993763195@ietfa.amsl.com> <20170710203251.GD12373@pfrc.org> In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2017 23:12:21 -0000 +1 on f2f meeting in Prague (if needed) I=E2=80=99d really like the draft to progress ASAP, so if there are any unaddress= ed issues, please bring them up. =20 Cheers, Jeff =20 On 7/10/17, 14:44, "rtgwg on behalf of Acee Lindem (acee)" wrote: Hi Jeff,=20 =20 On 7/10/17, 4:32 PM, "rtgwg on behalf of Jeffrey Haas" wrote: =20 >Acee (and other authors), > >On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 02:42:01PM -0700, internet-drafts@ietf.org wro= te: >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >>directories. >> This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group of the I= ETF. >>=20 >> Title : Routing Area Common YANG Data Types >> Authors : Xufeng Liu >> Yingzhen Qu >> Acee Lindem >> Christian Hopps >> Lou Berger >> Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types-08.txt >> Pages : 40 >> Date : 2017-06-29 >>=20 >> Abstract: >> This document defines a collection of common data types using the >> YANG data modeling language. These derived common types are desi= gned >> to be imported by other modules defined in the routing area. > >Thanks for the updates for the various route-target,origin and site of >origin extended community types. I'll try to take some some to read t= he >regex in detail. > >My lingering issue with the route-target types is that IETF work on VP= Ns >will continue to add extended communities to have route-target semanti= cs >outside of the types originally defined in RFC 4360. The current exam= ple >of >this is the ES-Import community. =20 I think this is a type that would be shared across L2VPN and BGP module= s. We have this format for route-origin, we can add it for route-target preceded by =E2=80=9C6:=E2=80=9D.=20 > >I believe we either need to: >1. Provide a generic format for types other than 0,1,2. Or, >2. Document how the relevant type is intended to be maintained. =20 There is a trade-off here in providing strong typing and flexibility. I don=E2=80=99t see how we can anticipate the textual conventions for all futur= e route target types in advance. If you want flexibility, we could just m= ake it a string ;^)=20 =20 > >For example, the module that route-targets is part of is not IANA >maintained. > >If this issue is still unclear, let's plan on spending a small amount = of >hallway time discussing this in Prague. =20 Sounds good. =20 Thanks, Acee=20 =20 > >-- Jeff > >_______________________________________________ >rtgwg mailing list >rtgwg@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg =20 _______________________________________________ rtgwg mailing list rtgwg@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg =20 From nobody Thu Jul 13 05:38:35 2017 Return-Path: <7riw77@gmail.com> X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 102E3131A5F; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.448 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.448 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id e5YfqeUYFS0C; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-x241.google.com (mail-yw0-x241.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c05::241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D8EC512EC13; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-yw0-x241.google.com with SMTP id a12so3002570ywh.1; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version:thread-index :content-language; bh=YVMSixaADwn/W0fXsEYn3q5ZiRR6wHqlC8VlaTHXocM=; b=J6Qa6KtK4yiUBxnJU4G4U4IDCrvBI+14cP7T+xUjAYLeXxxKjeHA3LeUupIh4CW4sW IXDVyEwCfMIw8OoYsxj87b956gTKUEVSZi3wZUYHf7eg3UD3I5EnWaVaQmkHXuzLmczR ErFUWzTk1Csm7yOUUmBkoV9Wu/uP7kFDtUj9u1fp/b0CtAh2BW6H0cWCoQ8DKQb8/P6B mxBZAuoUWWyMi6WjluZ0YgqYi5+5tfpPjmyUb80n6c/VpEtzKe4NzEpmvaBd2+t0uZi+ TRfxfG6QHFz0TJu9n/E33IEHnu7g1wOBGlw6t8dvNM3P08N0UVLhagECrvOOThGJxyC3 VIbA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version :thread-index:content-language; bh=YVMSixaADwn/W0fXsEYn3q5ZiRR6wHqlC8VlaTHXocM=; b=QEcOsng/9c/G1AwzGj81g3fbl0iwGCTdPLui8Q/cvoSVsh1WtL84tdjjJ6rhiEb3zi humw6eUKLBQKFQuzAW0ePDRwxia5XSEcQ+F92lxL5uq4KUdOHOw1b5Rjqp6SQASIF7G/ s/vKhjHutFOYtHYnfYX/GKi/nz8WQi8yg6PREo9BdLbel9YzFisq2pqCXdij4fUGjM4T qSHfTv0IYiX78Z67QITBKnJpQUeX4SHOPX4sgGjXvGTlVxHlTXv0JxRj6lMrymZqtCqp 2dP6dx0laNlRpT2NfUBsrhF7okChQfcvBhNb3h+4EryeX8U+6Wgo2l5+p4rGPgLZsZFR QNrQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw111DTEXXSvkXED+j7jMO47yg8KMbxYIlDCtOtM5AgAxocHhZBeh0 RXLmhYAVVZ4tLi1s X-Received: by 10.129.74.7 with SMTP id x7mr1743324ywa.193.1499949504912; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Russ ([2602:30a:2e5b:44d0:dcc:bf12:d6b8:7669]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z10sm2028518ywg.11.2017.07.13.05.38.23 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:38:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "Russ White" <7riw77@gmail.com> To: , Subject: IS-IS Support for OpenFabric -- Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 08:38:21 -0400 Message-ID: <003c01d2fbd4$ea026630$be073290$@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003D_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AdL71HxnViI6ux8XRweKvfuzTi+DAQ== Content-Language: en-us Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 12:38:29 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_003E_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0" ------=_NextPart_001_003E_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Y=E2=80=99all =E2=80=93 =20 We are presenting this in both places; not many changes from the last = version (other than probable new errors I=E2=80=99ve introduced!), and = the use of Les and Naiming=E2=80=99s new encoding (thanks!) for the = tier, and cleaning up some bits and pieces from various comments. The = one large thing still missing off my comment list is MT =E2=80=93 this = is a discussion the authors need to have, or perhaps should be a = separate draft. There should be a separate use case draft; I will try to = get that started this coming week=E2=80=99ish. =20 I missed the deadline for various reasons, so I=E2=80=99m just attaching = it here, will post when the tool becomes available again. =20 =F0=9F=98=8A /r ------=_NextPart_001_003E_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Y=E2=80=99all =E2=80=93

 

We are = presenting this in both places; not many changes from the last version = (other than probable new errors I=E2=80=99ve introduced!), and the use = of Les and Naiming=E2=80=99s new encoding (thanks!) for the tier, and = cleaning up some bits and pieces from various comments. The one large = thing still missing off my comment list is MT =E2=80=93 this is a = discussion the authors need to have, or perhaps should be a separate = draft. There should be a separate use case draft; I will try to get that = started this coming week=E2=80=99ish.

 

I missed the = deadline for various reasons, so I=E2=80=99m just attaching it here, = will post when the tool becomes available again.

 

=F0=9F=98=8A = /r

------=_NextPart_001_003E_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0-- ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0 Content-Type: text/plain; name="draft-white-openfabric-03.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="draft-white-openfabric-03.txt" =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= Network Working Group R. White, Ed.=0A= Internet-Draft S. Zandi, Ed.=0A= Intended status: Informational LinkedIn=0A= Expires: January 14, 2018 July 13, 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= IS-IS Support for Openfabric=0A= draft-white-openfabric-03=0A= =0A= Abstract=0A= =0A= Spine and leaf topologies are widely used in hyperscale and cloud=0A= scale networks. In most of these networks, configuration is=0A= automated, but difficult, and topology information is extracted=0A= through broad based connections. Policy is often integrated into the=0A= control plane, as well, making configuration, management, and=0A= troubleshooting difficult. Openfabric is an adaptation of an=0A= existing, widely deployed link state protocol, Intermediate System to=0A= Intermediate System (IS-IS) that is designed to:=0A= =0A= o Provide a full view of the topology from a single point in the=0A= network to simplify operations=0A= =0A= o Minimize configuration of each Intermediate System (IS) (also=0A= called a router or switch) in the network=0A= =0A= o Optimize the operation of IS-IS within a spine and leaf fabric to=0A= enable scaling=0A= =0A= This document begins with an overview of openfabric, including a=0A= description of what may be removed from IS-IS to enable scaling. The=0A= document then describes an optimized adjacency formation process; an=0A= optimized flooding scheme; some thoughts on the operation of=0A= openfabric, metrics, and aggregation; and finally a description of=0A= the changes to the IS-IS protocol required for openfabric.=0A= =0A= Status of This Memo=0A= =0A= This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance with the=0A= provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79.=0A= =0A= Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering=0A= Task Force (IETF). Note that other groups may also distribute=0A= working documents as Internet-Drafts. The list of current Internet-=0A= Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/.=0A= =0A= Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months=0A= and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 1]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference=0A= material or to cite them other than as "work in progress."=0A= =0A= This Internet-Draft will expire on January 14, 2018.=0A= =0A= Copyright Notice=0A= =0A= Copyright (c) 2017 IETF Trust and the persons identified as the=0A= document authors. All rights reserved.=0A= =0A= This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust's Legal=0A= Provisions Relating to IETF Documents=0A= (http://trustee.ietf.org/license-info) in effect on the date of=0A= publication of this document. Please review these documents=0A= carefully, as they describe your rights and restrictions with respect=0A= to this document. Code Components extracted from this document must=0A= include Simplified BSD License text as described in Section 4.e of=0A= the Trust Legal Provisions and are provided without warranty as=0A= described in the Simplified BSD License.=0A= =0A= Table of Contents=0A= =0A= 1. Introduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3=0A= 1.1. Goals . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3=0A= 1.2. Contributors . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3=0A= 1.3. Simplification . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3=0A= 1.4. Additions and Requirements . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4=0A= 1.5. Sample Network . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5=0A= 2. Modified Adjacency Formation . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6=0A= 3. Determining and Advertising Location on the Fabric . . . . . 7=0A= 3.1. Determining T0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7=0A= 3.2. Determining T1 and above . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8=0A= 4. Flooding Optimization . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 9=0A= 4.1. Flooding Failures . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 10=0A= 5. Other Optimizations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 11=0A= 5.1. Transit Link Reachability . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 11=0A= 5.2. Transiting T0 Intermediate Systems . . . . . . . . . . . 11=0A= 6. Openfabric and Route Aggregation . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 11=0A= 7. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12=0A= 8. References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12=0A= 8.1. Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12=0A= 8.2. Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 13=0A= Authors' Addresses . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 14=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 2]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= 1. Introduction=0A= =0A= 1.1. Goals=0A= =0A= Spine and leaf fabrics are often used in large scale data centers; in=0A= this application, they are commonly called a fabric because of their=0A= regular structure and predictable forwarding and convergence=0A= properties. This document describes modifications to the IS-IS=0A= protocol to enable it to run efficiently on a large scale spine and=0A= leaf fabric, openfabric. The goals of this control plane are:=0A= =0A= o Provide a full view of the topology from a single point in the=0A= network to simplify operations=0A= =0A= o Minimize configuration of each IS in the network=0A= =0A= o Optimize the operation of IS-IS within a spine and leaf fabric to=0A= enable scaling=0A= =0A= 1.2. Contributors=0A= =0A= The following people have contributed to this draft: Nikos=0A= Triantafillis (reflected flooding optimization), Ivan Pepelnjak=0A= (three stage fabric modifications), Hannes Gredler (do not reflood=0A= optimizations), Les Ginsberg (capabilities encoding, circuit local=0A= reflooding), Naiming Shen (capabilities encoding, circuit local=0A= reflooding), Uma Chunduri (failure mode suggestions, flooding), Nick=0A= Russo, and Rodny Molina.=0A= =0A= See [RFC5449], [RFC5614], and [RFC7182] for similar solutions in the=0A= Mobile Ad Hoc Networking (MANET) solution space.=0A= =0A= 1.3. Simplification=0A= =0A= In building any scalable system, it is often best to begin by=0A= removing what is not needed. In this spirit, openfabric=0A= implementations MAY remove the following from IS-IS:=0A= =0A= o Multilevel flooding domain support. The modifications described=0A= in this document will not work across multiple flooding domains.=0A= It is assumed that multiple fabrics will be connected through an=0A= Exterior Gateway Protocol (EGP), specifically BGP [RFC4271].=0A= =0A= o All mutliaccess link processing, including Designated Intermediate=0A= Systems (DIS). Spine and leaf fabrics are normally built using=0A= only point-to-point links, so multiaccess link processing is not=0A= required in openfabric.=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 3]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= o External metrics. There is no need for external metrics in large=0A= scale spine and leaf fabrics; it is assumed that metrics will be=0A= properly configured by the operator to account for the correct=0A= order of route preference at any route redistribution point.=0A= =0A= o Tags and traffic engineering processing. Openfabric is only=0A= designed to provide topology and reachability information. It is=0A= not designed to provide for traffic engineering, route preference=0A= through tags, or other policy mechanisms. It is assumed that all=0A= routing policy will be provided through an overlay system which=0A= communicates directly with each IS in the fabric, such as PCEP=0A= [RFC5440] or I2RS [RFC7921]. Traffic engineering is assumed to be=0A= provided through Segment Routing (SR)=0A= [I-D.ietf-spring-segment-routing].=0A= =0A= 1.4. Additions and Requirements=0A= =0A= To create a scalable link state fabric, openfabric includes the=0A= following:=0A= =0A= o A slightly modified adjacency formation process. This is largely=0A= a matter of forming adjacencies in a specific order, rather than=0A= forming an adjacency with every discovered neighbor at the same=0A= time.=0A= =0A= o A mechanism for determining which tier within a spine and leaf=0A= fabric in which the IS is located.=0A= =0A= o A mechanism that reduces flooding to the minimum possible, while=0A= still ensuring complete database synchronization among the=0A= intermediate systems within the fabric.=0A= =0A= Openfabric implementations:=0A= =0A= o MUST support [RFC5301] and enable hostname advertisement by=0A= default if a hostname is configured on the intermediate system.=0A= =0A= o MUST support [RFC5311], simplified extension of the link state PDU=0A= space for IS-IS.=0A= =0A= o MUST support [RFC5303] and enable three-way handshakes by default.=0A= =0A= o MUST use Type Length Value (TLV) type 135 for carrying IPv4=0A= reachability information, as defined in [RFC5305].=0A= =0A= o MUST use TLV type 236 for carrying IPv6 reachability information,=0A= as defined in [RFC5308].=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 4]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= o MUST use TLV type 22 for carrying IS reachability information, as=0A= defined in [RFC5305].=0A= =0A= o SHOULD support [RFC6232], purge originator identification for IS-=0A= IS.=0A= =0A= o SHOULD support Segment Routing (SR).=0A= [I-D.ietf-spring-segment-routing]=0A= =0A= o SHOULD support [I-D.ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions].=0A= =0A= o SHOULD support [RFC3719], section 4, hello padding for IS-IS.=0A= Variable hello padding SHOULD NOT be used, as data center fabrics=0A= are built using high speed links on which padded hellos will have=0A= little performance impact.=0A= =0A= Openfabric implementations MUST NOT be mixed with standard IS-IS=0A= implementations in operational deployments. Openfabric and standard=0A= IS-IS implementations SHOULD be treated as two separate protocols.=0A= =0A= 1.5. Sample Network=0A= =0A= The following spine and leaf fabric will be used to describe these=0A= modifications.=0A= =0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= | 1A | | 1B | | 1C | | 1D | | 1E | | 1F | (T0)=0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= =0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= | 2A | | 2B | | 2C | | 2D | | 2E | | 2F | (T1)=0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= =0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= | 3A | | 3B | | 3C | | 3D | | 3E | | 3F | (T2)=0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= =0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= | 4A | | 4B | | 4C | | 4D | | 4E | | 4F | (T1)=0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= =0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= | 5A | | 5B | | 5C | | 5D | | 5E | | 5F | (T0)=0A= +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+ +----+=0A= =0A= Figure 1=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 5]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= To reduce confusion (spine and leaf fabrics are difficult to draw in=0A= plain text art), this diagram does not contain the connections=0A= between devices. The reader should assume that each device in a=0A= given layer is connected to every device in the layer above it. For=0A= instance:=0A= =0A= o 5A is connected to 4A, 4B, 4C, 4D, 4E, and 4F=0A= =0A= o 5B is connected to 4A, 4B, 4C, 4D, 4E, and 4F=0A= =0A= o 4A is connected to 3A, 3B, 3C, 3D, 3E, 3F, 5A, 5B, 5C, 5D, 5E, and=0A= 5F=0A= =0A= o 4B is connected to 3A, 3B, 3C, 3D, 3E, 3F, 5A, 5B, 5C, 5D, 5E, and=0A= 5F=0A= =0A= o etc.=0A= =0A= The tiers or stages of the fabric are also marked for easier=0A= reference. T0 is assumed to be connected to application servers, or=0A= rather they are Top of Rack (ToR) intermediate systems. The=0A= remaining tiers, T1 and T2, are connected only to the fabric itself.=0A= Note there are no "cross links," or "east west" links in the=0A= illustrated fabric. The fabric locality detection mechanism=0A= described here will not work if there are cross links running east/=0A= west through the fabric. Locality detection may be possible in such=0A= a fabric; this is an area for further study.=0A= =0A= 2. Modified Adjacency Formation=0A= =0A= While adjacency formation is not considered particularly burdensome=0A= in IS-IS, it is still useful to reduce the amount of state=0A= transferred across the network when connecting a new IS to the=0A= fabric. Any such optimization is bound to present a tradeoff between=0A= several factors; the mechanism described here increases the amount of=0A= time required to form adjacencies slightly in order to reduce the=0A= total state carried across the network. The process is:=0A= =0A= o An IS connected to the fabric will send hellos on all links.=0A= =0A= o The IS will only complete the three-way handshake with one newly=0A= discovered neighbor; this would normally be the first neighbor=0A= which sends the newly connected intermediate system's ID back in=0A= the three-way handshake process.=0A= =0A= o The IS will complete its database exchange with this one newly=0A= adjacent neighbor.=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 6]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= o Once this process is completed, the IS will continue processing=0A= the remaining neighbors as normal.=0A= =0A= This process allows each IS newly added to the fabric to exchange a=0A= full table once; a very minimal amount of information will be=0A= transferred with the remaining neighbors to reach full=0A= synchronization.=0A= =0A= 3. Determining and Advertising Location on the Fabric=0A= =0A= The tier to which a IS is connected is useful to enable=0A= autoconfiguration of intermediate systems connected to the fabric and=0A= to reduce flooding. Once the tier of an intermediate system within=0A= the fabric has been determined, it MUST be advertised using the 4 bit=0A= Tier field described in section 3.3 of=0A= [I-D.shen-isis-spine-leaf-ext].=0A= =0A= This section describes mechanisms for determining the tier at which a=0A= IS is connected in the fabric in several steps. The first step is to=0A= find the Farthest Distance (FD) and the Total Distance (TD), which=0A= are useful in this process. To find the FD and TD:=0A= =0A= o Calculate a Shortest Path Tree (SPT) for the entire network with=0A= all link metrics set to 1; this has the effect of calculating a=0A= tree based only on hop count=0A= =0A= o Find one node that is the farthest from the local node in the=0A= resulting tree; call this node F, and the distance to this node FD=0A= =0A= o Calculate an SPT for the entire network with all link metrics set=0A= to 1 from the perspective of F; call this TD=0A= =0A= 3.1. Determining T0=0A= =0A= If FD =3D=3D TD =3D=3D 2, this is a three stage fabric; it is not = possible to=0A= determine the tier at which the local node is located based on any=0A= calculation, because the topology is perfectly symmetric. In this=0A= case:=0A= =0A= o The T0 intermediate systems MAY be manually configured to=0A= advertise 0x00 in their IS reachability tier sub-TLV, indicating=0A= they are at the edge of the fabric (a ToR IS).=0A= =0A= o The T0 intermediate systems MAY detect that they are T0 through=0A= the presence connected hosts (i.e. through a request for address=0A= assignment or some other means). This means of detection may not=0A= be reliable in all operational environments, and SHOULD be used=0A= with care. If such detection is used, and the IS determines it is=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 7]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= located at T0, it should advertise 0x00 in its IS reachability=0A= tier sub-TLV.=0A= =0A= o The IS MAY examine the IS reachability tier sub-TLV of directly=0A= connected neighbors and determine one or more is advertising 0x1=0A= in its IS reachability tier sub-TLVs. This would be the case if=0A= the spine intermediate systems in a three stage spine and leaf=0A= fabric are manually configured to advertise their tier as 0x1.=0A= =0A= o If there is no way to determine whether or not the local device is=0A= in T0 or T1, it MUST advertise 0xFF in its IS reachability tier=0A= sub-TLV.=0A= =0A= If FD =3D=3D TD, and TD >=3D 4, this is a greater than three stage = fabric;=0A= the local device SHOULD advertise 0x00 in its IS reachability tier=0A= sub-TLV.=0A= =0A= For instance, in the diagram above, 1A would:=0A= =0A= o Calculate an SPT with all link metrics set to 1; on this SPT, 5A=0A= through 5F would all have a distance of 4=0A= =0A= o Select one of these nodes as F; assume 5F is chosen as F=0A= =0A= o Set FD to 4, the distance to 5F=0A= =0A= o Run SPF from the perspective of 5F with all link metrics set to 1=0A= =0A= o Set TD to 4, the cost from 5F to 1A=0A= =0A= o TD - FD =3D=3D 0, so 1A is at T0, and is a ToR=0A= =0A= 3.2. Determining T1 and above=0A= =0A= If FD =3D=3D TD =3D=3D 2, this is a three stage fabric; it is not = possible to=0A= determine the tier at which the local node is located based on any=0A= calculation, because the topology is perfectly symmetric. In this=0A= case:=0A= =0A= o The T1 intermediate systems MAY be manually configured to=0A= advertise 0x01 in their IS reachability tier sub-TLV.=0A= =0A= o The IS MAY examine the IS reachability tier sub-TLV of directly=0A= connected neighbors and determine that one or more is advertising=0A= 0x00 in its IS reachability tier sub-TLVs. This would be the case=0A= if the ToR intermediate systems in a three stage spine and leaf=0A= fabric are manually configured to advertise their tier as 0x00.=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 8]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= o If there is no way to determine whether or not the local device is=0A= in T0 or T1, it should advertise 0xFF in its IS reachability tier=0A= sub-TLV.=0A= =0A= If TD !=3D FD, this is a greater than three stage fabric; the local=0A= device SHOULD advertise (TD - FD) in its IS reachability tier sub-=0A= TLV.=0A= =0A= For example, in the above five stage fabric, 3B would:=0A= =0A= o Calculate an SPT with all link metrics set to 1; on this SPT, 5A=0A= through 5F and 1A through 1F would all have a cost of 2=0A= =0A= o Select one of these nodes as F; assume 5F is chosen as F=0A= =0A= o Set FD to 2, the distance to 5F=0A= =0A= o Run SPF from the perspective of 5F with all link metrics set to 1=0A= =0A= o Set TD to 4, the cost from 5F to 1A=0A= =0A= o TD - FD =3D=3D 2, so 1A is at T2, and is a spine switch=0A= =0A= 4. Flooding Optimization=0A= =0A= Flooding is perhaps the most challenging scaling issue for a link=0A= state protocol running on a dense, large scale fabric. To reduce the=0A= flooding of link state information in the form of Link State Protocol=0A= Data Units (LSPs), Openfabric takes advantage of information already=0A= available in the link state protocol, the list of the local=0A= intermediate system's neighbor's neighbors, and the fabric locality=0A= computed above. The following tables are required to compute a set=0A= of reflooders:=0A= =0A= o Neighbor List (NL) list: The set of neighbors=0A= =0A= o Neighbor's Neighbors (NN) list: The set of neighbor's neighbors;=0A= this can be calculated by running SPF truncated to two hops=0A= =0A= o Do Not Reflood (DNR) list: The set of neighbors who should have=0A= LSPs (or fragments) who should not reflood LSPs=0A= =0A= o Reflood (RF) list: The set of neighbors who should flood LSPs (or=0A= fragments) to their adjacent neighbors to ensure synchronization=0A= =0A= NL is set to contain all neighbors, and sorted deterministically (for=0A= instance, from the highest IS identifier to the lowest). All=0A= intermediate systems within a single fabric SHOULD use the same=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 9]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= mechanism for sorting the NL list. NN is set to contain all=0A= neighbor's neighbors, or all intermediate systems that are two hops=0A= away, as determined by performing a truncated SPF. The DNR and RF=0A= tables are initially empty. To begin, the following steps are taken=0A= to reduce the size of NN and NL:=0A= =0A= o Move any IS in NL with its tier (or fabric location) set to T0 to=0A= DNR=0A= =0A= o Remove all intermediate systems from NL and NN that in the=0A= shortest path to the IS that originated the LSP=0A= =0A= Then, for every IS in NL:=0A= =0A= o If the current entry in NL is connected to any entries in NN:=0A= =0A= * Move the IS to RF=0A= =0A= * Remove the intermediate systems connected to the IS from NN=0A= =0A= o Else move the IS to DNR=0A= =0A= When flooding, LSPs transmitted to adjacent neighbors on the RF list=0A= will be transmitted normally. Adjacent intermediate systems on this=0A= list will reflood received LSPs into the next stage of the topology,=0A= ensuring database synchronization. LSPs transmitted to adjacent=0A= neighbors on the DNR list, however, MUST be transmitted using a=0A= circuit scope PDU as described in [RFC7356].=0A= =0A= 4.1. Flooding Failures=0A= =0A= It is possible in some failure modes for flooding to be incomplete=0A= because of the flooding optimizations outlined. Specifically, if a=0A= reflooder fails, or is somehow disconnected from all the links across=0A= which it should be reflooding, it is possible an LSP is only=0A= partially flooded through the fabric. To prevent such situations,=0A= any IS receiving an LSP transmitted using DNR SHOULD:=0A= =0A= o Set a short timer; the default should be less than one second=0A= =0A= o When the timer expires, send a Complete Sequence Number Packet=0A= (CSNP) to all neighbors=0A= =0A= o Process any Partial Sequence Number Packets (PSNPs) as required to=0A= resynchronize=0A= =0A= o If a resynchronization is required, notify the network operator=0A= through a network management system=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 10]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= 5. Other Optimizations=0A= =0A= 5.1. Transit Link Reachability=0A= =0A= In order to reduce the amount of control plane state carried on large=0A= scale spine and leaf fabrics, openfabric implementations SHOULD NOT=0A= advertise reachability for transit links. These links MAY remain=0A= unnumbered, as IS-IS does not require layer 3 IP addresses to=0A= operate. Each IS SHOULD be configured with a single loopback=0A= address, which is assigned an IPv6 address, to provide reachability=0A= to intermediate systems which make up the fabric.=0A= =0A= 5.2. Transiting T0 Intermediate Systems=0A= =0A= In data center fabrics, ToR intermediate systems SHOULD NOT be used=0A= to transit between two T1 (or above) spine intermediate systems. The=0A= simplest way to prevent this is to set the overload bit [RFC3277] for=0A= all the LSPs originated from T0 intermediate systems. However, this=0A= solution would have the unfortunate side effect of causing all=0A= reachability beyond any T0 IS to have the same metric, and many=0A= implementations treat a set overload bit as a metric of 0xFFFF in=0A= calculating the Shortest Path Tree (SPT). This document proposes an=0A= alternate solution which preserves the leaf node metric, while still=0A= avoiding transiting T0 intermediate systems.=0A= =0A= Specifically, all T0 intermediate systems SHOULD advertise their=0A= metric to reach any T1 adjacent neighbor with a cost of 0XFFE. T1=0A= intermediate systems, on the other hand, will advertise T0=0A= intermediate systems with the actual interface cost used to reach the=0A= T0 IS. Hence, links connecting T0 and T1 intermediate systems will=0A= be advertised with an asymmetric cost that discourages transiting T0=0A= intermediate systems, while leaving reachability to the destinations=0A= attached to T0 devices the same.=0A= =0A= 6. Openfabric and Route Aggregation=0A= =0A= While aggregation is not recommended in openfabric deployments,=0A= aggregation MAY take place when routing information is being=0A= transmitted from higher level tiers to lower level tiers. For=0A= instance, in the example network, 2A through 2F could advertise a=0A= single default route to 1A through 1F. 2A through 2F would simply=0A= advertise the default as if it were an attached to each IS locally=0A= using either a type 135 or 236 TLV, and then block TLVs that contain=0A= reachability information (such as types 135 and 236). Type 22 TLVs,=0A= however, MUST be flooded through this boundary, so that every IS in=0A= the network shares a common view of the topology.=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 11]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= Note that aggregation in a DC fabric can result in routing black=0A= holes in some cases, and also possibly reduce the efficiency of=0A= traffic engineering in the network.=0A= =0A= 7. Security Considerations=0A= =0A= This document outlines modifications to the IS-IS protocol for=0A= operation on large scale data center fabrics. While it does add new=0A= TLVs, and some local processing changes, it does not add any new=0A= security vulnerabilities to the operation of IS-IS. However,=0A= openfabric implementations SHOULD implement IS-IS cryptographic=0A= authentication, as described in [RFC5304], and should enable other=0A= security measures in accordance with best common practices for the=0A= IS-IS protocol.=0A= =0A= 8. References=0A= =0A= 8.1. Normative References=0A= =0A= [I-D.shen-isis-spine-leaf-ext]=0A= Shen, N., Ginsberg, L., and S. Thyamagundalu, "IS-IS=0A= Routing for Spine-Leaf Topology", draft-shen-isis-spine-=0A= leaf-ext-04 (work in progress), June 2017.=0A= =0A= [RFC2119] Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate=0A= Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC2119, March 1997,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC2629] Rose, M., "Writing I-Ds and RFCs using XML", RFC 2629,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC2629, June 1999,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5301] McPherson, D. and N. Shen, "Dynamic Hostname Exchange=0A= Mechanism for IS-IS", RFC 5301, DOI 10.17487/RFC5301,=0A= October 2008, .=0A= =0A= [RFC5303] Katz, D., Saluja, R., and D. Eastlake 3rd, "Three-Way=0A= Handshake for IS-IS Point-to-Point Adjacencies", RFC 5303,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC5303, October 2008,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5305] Li, T. and H. Smit, "IS-IS Extensions for Traffic=0A= Engineering", RFC 5305, DOI 10.17487/RFC5305, October=0A= 2008, .=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 12]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= [RFC5308] Hopps, C., "Routing IPv6 with IS-IS", RFC 5308,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC5308, October 2008,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5311] McPherson, D., Ed., Ginsberg, L., Previdi, S., and M.=0A= Shand, "Simplified Extension of Link State PDU (LSP) Space=0A= for IS-IS", RFC 5311, DOI 10.17487/RFC5311, February 2009,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5316] Chen, M., Zhang, R., and X. Duan, "ISIS Extensions in=0A= Support of Inter-Autonomous System (AS) MPLS and GMPLS=0A= Traffic Engineering", RFC 5316, DOI 10.17487/RFC5316,=0A= December 2008, .=0A= =0A= [RFC7356] Ginsberg, L., Previdi, S., and Y. Yang, "IS-IS Flooding=0A= Scope Link State PDUs (LSPs)", RFC 7356,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC7356, September 2014,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC7981] Ginsberg, L., Previdi, S., and M. Chen, "IS-IS Extensions=0A= for Advertising Router Information", RFC 7981,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC7981, October 2016,=0A= .=0A= =0A= 8.2. Informative References=0A= =0A= [I-D.ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions]=0A= Previdi, S., Filsfils, C., Bashandy, A., Gredler, H.,=0A= Litkowski, S., Decraene, B., and j. jefftant@gmail.com,=0A= "IS-IS Extensions for Segment Routing", draft-ietf-isis-=0A= segment-routing-extensions-13 (work in progress), June=0A= 2017.=0A= =0A= [I-D.ietf-spring-segment-routing]=0A= Filsfils, C., Previdi, S., Decraene, B., Litkowski, S.,=0A= and R. Shakir, "Segment Routing Architecture", draft-ietf-=0A= spring-segment-routing-12 (work in progress), June 2017.=0A= =0A= [RFC3277] McPherson, D., "Intermediate System to Intermediate System=0A= (IS-IS) Transient Blackhole Avoidance", RFC 3277,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC3277, April 2002,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC3719] Parker, J., Ed., "Recommendations for Interoperable=0A= Networks using Intermediate System to Intermediate System=0A= (IS-IS)", RFC 3719, DOI 10.17487/RFC3719, February 2004,=0A= .=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 13]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= [RFC4271] Rekhter, Y., Ed., Li, T., Ed., and S. Hares, Ed., "A=0A= Border Gateway Protocol 4 (BGP-4)", RFC 4271,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC4271, January 2006,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5304] Li, T. and R. Atkinson, "IS-IS Cryptographic=0A= Authentication", RFC 5304, DOI 10.17487/RFC5304, October=0A= 2008, .=0A= =0A= [RFC5440] Vasseur, JP., Ed. and JL. Le Roux, Ed., "Path Computation=0A= Element (PCE) Communication Protocol (PCEP)", RFC 5440,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC5440, March 2009,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5449] Baccelli, E., Jacquet, P., Nguyen, D., and T. Clausen,=0A= "OSPF Multipoint Relay (MPR) Extension for Ad Hoc=0A= Networks", RFC 5449, DOI 10.17487/RFC5449, February 2009,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC5614] Ogier, R. and P. Spagnolo, "Mobile Ad Hoc Network (MANET)=0A= Extension of OSPF Using Connected Dominating Set (CDS)=0A= Flooding", RFC 5614, DOI 10.17487/RFC5614, August 2009,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC6232] Wei, F., Qin, Y., Li, Z., Li, T., and J. Dong, "Purge=0A= Originator Identification TLV for IS-IS", RFC 6232,=0A= DOI 10.17487/RFC6232, May 2011,=0A= .=0A= =0A= [RFC7182] Herberg, U., Clausen, T., and C. Dearlove, "Integrity=0A= Check Value and Timestamp TLV Definitions for Mobile Ad=0A= Hoc Networks (MANETs)", RFC 7182, DOI 10.17487/RFC7182,=0A= April 2014, .=0A= =0A= [RFC7921] Atlas, A., Halpern, J., Hares, S., Ward, D., and T.=0A= Nadeau, "An Architecture for the Interface to the Routing=0A= System", RFC 7921, DOI 10.17487/RFC7921, June 2016,=0A= .=0A= =0A= Authors' Addresses=0A= =0A= Russ White (editor)=0A= LinkedIn=0A= =0A= Email: russ@riw.us=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 14]=0A= =0C=0A= Internet-Draft IS-IS Support for Openfabric July 2017=0A= =0A= =0A= Shawn Zandi (editor)=0A= LinkedIn=0A= =0A= Email: szandi@linkedin.com=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= White & Zandi Expires January 14, 2018 [Page 15]=0A= ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D2FBB3.62F24CD0-- From nobody Thu Jul 13 09:14:31 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F359613146A; 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SPF:None; MLV:ovrnspm; PTR:InfoNoRecords; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: jabil.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 13 Jul 2017 16:14:18.2665 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bc876b21-f134-4c12-a265-8ed26b7f0f3b X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BN3PR0201MB0866 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 16:14:23 -0000 Hi Jeff, Thanks for looking at this. You are right, but we are still discussing vari= ous approaches for the static MPLS and the conclusion has not been reached = yet.=20 We'd like to hear what you think and appreciate your comments. Best, - Xufeng > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeffrey Haas [mailto:jhaas@pfrc.org] > Sent: Monday, July 10, 2017 4:21 PM > To: Xufeng Liu > Cc: Greg Mirsky ; draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf= .org; > mpls@ietf.org; draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org; rtgwg@ietf.org > Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models >=20 > Xufeng, >=20 > I see that draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang-04 was issued. My comment is agai= nst that > version now. >=20 > On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 03:44:28PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: > > > I'm not conversant with common Yang tool suites, but it seems if the > > > ordered-by user rather than the default of system, then the tooling > > > might present the bottom of stack entry as the first or last node of > > > the list rather than requiring the consumer to have to run a sort of > > > the nodes based on the id number and then select the first node. > > > > [Xufeng] Are you suggesting to use the position to order instead of > > the ID value? If so, what would be the semantics of the ID value? If > > we cannot get rid of the ID key, I don't know if using a separate > > ordering mechanism will make the usability better. >=20 > I see that you changed things to use a constrained index range with id 0 = being > special for top of stack. >=20 > So, if you have labels with indexes 0, 5, 10, 15, then 15 would be the bo= ttom of > stack? >=20 > -- Jeff From nobody Thu Jul 13 09:42:14 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25D5512F3D6; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 09:42:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.903 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.903 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Gti48smVZvCv; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 09:42:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58A45126C3D; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 09:42:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 76AD41E37F; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 12:51:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 12:51:40 -0400 From: Jeffrey Haas To: Xufeng Liu Cc: Greg Mirsky , "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Message-ID: <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 16:42:13 -0000 Xufeng, On Thu, Jul 13, 2017 at 04:14:18PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: > Thanks for looking at this. You are right, but we are still discussing various approaches for the static MPLS and the conclusion has not been reached yet. > We'd like to hear what you think and appreciate your comments. To offer a suggestion, order the stack from bottom (lowest number) to top (highest). Require that bottom of stack be element index zero. My yang constraints are a bit weak but I believe you can construct an XPath that requires that a node of index 0 must be present. The above two suggestions don't help with the issues of needing to sort the list by index in order to generate the stack, but it does at least remove any possible ambiguity about the critical bottom of stack semantic. -- Jeff From nobody Thu Jul 13 10:12:51 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C5DC1316FF; Thu, 13 Jul 2017 10:12:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com 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"mpls@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Topic: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Index: AQHS3ksFPA4mDDKsXkmMIsSaphDK+qIW8fIAgABQZoCAAO4op4AATWeAgDU3EruABLenAIAACnAAgAAF3YD//9augA== Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 18:44:50 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_D58D3733B7F5Faceeciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , 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b=OCY/A29x/sqb+3z1t+JKsPBequCkyeiPKvEE/I/TeuVmTzqJW5Oz8i5MhzV2clIIWV33qUHx7WQm9s2BCxPdqy0qYILKw0p1PvRTpxTctrT6+fYI5FJo3RdU86BceLeAA/UrOZp9hK3gmL53+KUg2yeVQ551HOjab+aTy93O7ug= Received: from MWHPR05MB2829.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.168.245.11) by MWHPR05MB3630.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.174.251.16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_CBC_SHA256_P256) id 15.1.1261.4; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 16:31:32 +0000 Received: from MWHPR05MB2829.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([10.168.245.11]) by MWHPR05MB2829.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([10.168.245.11]) with mapi id 15.01.1261.018; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 16:31:32 +0000 From: Chris Bowers To: RTGWG CC: rtgwg-chairs Subject: RE: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 Thread-Topic: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 Thread-Index: AdL3JNNJvWxXSaC1SLu7dZ+k7kFf9wFmSPog Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 16:31:32 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR05MB3630 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 16:31:39 -0000 --_000_MWHPR05MB28296E0A72ED64EEB09B56FEA9AD0MWHPR05MB2829namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RTGWG, An updated version of the agenda can be found at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/99/agenda/rtgwg/ Please note that based on the updated agenda, we will be meeting on both Monday and Friday. Thanks, Chris and Jeff _____________________________________________ From: Chris Bowers Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 3:29 PM To: 'RTGWG' Cc: rtgwg-chairs Subject: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 RTGWG, The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague has been posted: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/99/agenda/rtgwg/ We requested, and were given, two sessions based on demand from previous meetings. However, we are currently able to schedule all of the presentations and discussions in the first RTGWG session on Mond= ay morning. At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday RTGWG session, since we somet= imes have late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time slots. We will decide later= whether to cancel it or not. If you requested a session, please check the agenda to make sure it is ther= e, and contact us if it isn't. Thanks, Chris and Jeff --_000_MWHPR05MB28296E0A72ED64EEB09B56FEA9AD0MWHPR05MB2829namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
RTGWG,
 
An updated version of the agenda can be found = at:
 
Please note that based on the updated agenda, = we will
be meeting on both Monday and Friday.
 
Thanks,
Chris and Jeff
 
_____________________________________________ From: Chris Bowers
Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 3:29 PM
To: 'RTGWG' <rtgwg@ietf.org>
Cc: rtgwg-chairs <rtgwg-chairs@ietf.org>
Subject: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99
 
 
RTGWG,
 
The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague= has been posted:
 
 
We requested, and were given, two sessions base= d on demand from
previous meetings.  However, we are curren= tly able to schedule
all of the presentations and discussions in the= first RTGWG session on Monday
morning. 
 
At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday R= TGWG session, since we sometimes have
late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time = slots.  We will decide later whether
to cancel it or not. 
 
If you requested a session, please check the ag= enda to make sure it is there, and contact
us if it isn’t.
 
Thanks,
Chris and Jeff
 
 --_000_MWHPR05MB28296E0A72ED64EEB09B56FEA9AD0MWHPR05MB2829namp_-- From nobody Fri Jul 14 09:37:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49CD1127B57; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id J_L1Xppl6SgL; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-it0-x22c.google.com (mail-it0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58EAD12702E; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-it0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id m84so27999372ita.0; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=9nre7cp5JWyW9lNc9Ur6dAUfA3yarmyuuMelAnNru14=; b=GW5RomlW+Tjn5GaclSyBMeM5hacAtFhjvk59MLh1h7tI3/w5g3mJvZBPTfLSZrgyop 025tAKIkfMIleZng7UV1O0cpm48WIJF/tP6ga5juiOUgunORa09owgN9H1v5e8dufIg/ YT6Y1RNejEMiDAvIGDQBRK7HG5Sx5QRIqCvz+Z1oGJSYR5WMYnEN2xL9tSGRnGIHn9H0 BvUHW99wkxfBAGyyv4osPbCKbO3hckGFMk4Y26zZvHMJDZyVoMFSVRjjKmZm72ym32Yd DVfT/M4YDs07/4SCGWuELNwhKZNNbFVtiOAB2w8imf0rzk4wNCLfej1aFvKYXILKICU6 tLnA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=9nre7cp5JWyW9lNc9Ur6dAUfA3yarmyuuMelAnNru14=; b=V7l+bkH6PPKPUAAtSipSE9/QKVc+IO/XxqLOlFHrAJH41lS7lJcR9iWlXbh6dgFRH3 qk2eOyMi9yiMVQNarGwgsOvMU/v2ZBmHaZfh3idy54748yZdzh+3W3Btpf+Ipl3H1FTh N9qNn2z0P4vi6QUtrjUF25vYd0T3bZWGDSSnDlFpwM3OpWXjGGDlTwGxg2osFCw+Th2h UT3zNocNPRr28Aw2UuwvxVx5VBgw98n+LruOvQCCW3tnes+tVWq6Mk0pJa51raqs8m82 jGVPkoQe0V+yhSq1ey7ovJ6EH5kp51sf72DZgk15mQDono3BIV4CXuJzMQHGk++wVYnj OwKw== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw111NmNk+GEfW5NOBEeM4E2mJigYIs3rYhZVMqgkG/fsF0DbmUQMn YAcfK/ObAIfYnLNEY5COgojBXPCf1Q== X-Received: by 10.36.137.7 with SMTP id s7mr4401996itd.55.1500050259891; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: rraszuk@gmail.com Received: by 10.79.32.15 with HTTP; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:37:39 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Robert Raszuk Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 18:37:39 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: EDOkLiTI7ELBQpRAgkKMji3B9U8 Message-ID: Subject: Re: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 To: Chris Bowers Cc: RTGWG , rtgwg-chairs Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c059418e2ddb5055449aa49" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 16:37:47 -0000 --94eb2c059418e2ddb5055449aa49 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Chris, Is there a draft for the last talk ? VPNplus, and enhanced VPN based on Segment Routing Stewart Bryant 30 minutes Thx, R. On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 6:31 PM, Chris Bowers wrote: > RTGWG, > > An updated version of the agenda can be found at: > *https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/99/agenda/rtgwg/* > > > Please note that based on the updated agenda, we will > be meeting on both Monday and Friday. > > Thanks, > Chris and Jeff > > _____________________________________________ > *From:* Chris Bowers > *Sent:* Friday, July 7, 2017 3:29 PM > *To:* 'RTGWG' > *Cc:* rtgwg-chairs > *Subject:* draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 > > > RTGWG, > > The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague has been posted: > > *https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/99/agenda/rtgwg/* > > > We requested, and were given, two sessions based on demand from > previous meetings. However, we are currently able to schedule > all of the presentations and discussions in the first RTGWG session on > Monday > morning. > > At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday RTGWG session, since we > sometimes have > late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time slots. We will decide > later whether > to cancel it or not. > > If you requested a session, please check the agenda to make sure it is > there, and contact > us if it isn=E2=80=99t. > > Thanks, > Chris and Jeff > > > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg > > --94eb2c059418e2ddb5055449aa49 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Chris,

<= /div>
Is there a draft for the last talk ?=C2=A0

<= /span>
VPNplus, and enhanced VPN based on Segment Routing
Stew= art Bryant 30 minutes

Thx,
R.

On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 6:31 PM, Chris Bowers <cbowers@juniper.net= > wrote:
RTGWG,
=C2=A0
An updated version of the agenda can be found = at:
=C2=A0
Please note that based on the updated agenda, = we will
be meeting on both Monday and Friday.
=C2=A0
Thanks,
Chris and Jeff
=C2=A0
__________________________________________= ___
From: Chris Bowers
Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 3:29 PM
To: 'RTGWG' <rtgwg@ietf.org>
Cc: rtgwg-chairs <rtgwg-chairs@ietf.org>
Subject: draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
RTGWG,
=C2=A0
The draft agenda for RTGWG at IETF-99 in Prague= has been posted:
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
We requested, and were given, two sessions base= d on demand from
previous meetings.=C2=A0 However, we are curren= tly able to schedule
all of the presentations and discussions in the= first RTGWG session on Monday
morning.=C2=A0
=C2=A0
At this point we are NOT canceling the Friday R= TGWG session, since we sometimes have
late, but reasonable, requests for agenda time = slots.=C2=A0 We will decide later whether
to cancel it or not.=C2=A0
=C2=A0
If you requested a session, please check the ag= enda to make sure it is there, and contact
us if it isn=E2=80=99t.
=C2=A0
Thanks,
Chris and Jeff
=C2=A0

_______________________________________________
rtgwg mailing list
rtgwg@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg


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16:31:25 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" , Jeffrey Haas , Xufeng Liu CC: Greg Mirsky , "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Topic: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Index: AQHS3ksFPA4mDDKsXkmMIsSaphDK+qIW8fIAgABQZoCAAO4op4AATWeAgDU3EruABLenAIAACnAAgAAF3YCAAYbJgA== Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 20:31:25 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_D58E9EC8B88E8aceeciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 20:31:31 -0000 --_000_D58E9EC8B88E8aceeciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgVGFyZWssIEplZmYsDQoNClR5cGljYWxseSwgWUFORyBpbmRpY2VzIGFyZSBhZGRlZCB0byBZ QU5HIGxpc3RzIHRvIHNpbXBseSBpbXBseSBvcmRlcmluZy4gSSBkb27igJl0IGJlbGlldmUgdGhl cmUgaXMgYWJzb2x1dGVseSBhbnkgdmFsdWUgaW4gdHJ5aW5nIHRvIGVuZm9yY2UgdGhlIHNlbWFu dGljcyBvZiBhIHByZWNpc2UgbGFiZWwgcG9zaXRpb24gb24gdGhpcyBpbmRleC4gSXQgaXMgZmFp cmx5IG9idmlvdXMgdGhhdCB0aGUgZmlyc3QgbGFiZWwgaW4gdGhlIGxpc3QgaXMgdGhlIGZpcnN0 IGxhYmVsIGluIHRoZSBzdGFjaywgdGhlIHNlY29uZCBsYWJlbCBpbiB0aGUgbGlzdCBpcyB0aGUg c2Vjb25kIGxhYmVsIGluIHRoZSBzdGFjaywgYW5kIHNvIG9u4oCmIEhvcGVmdWxseSwgdGhlIG90 aGVyIFlBTkcgbW9kZWwgYXV0aG9ycyB3aWxsIGFncmVlIHdpdGggbWUgb24gdGhpcyBwb2ludCBh 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i="5.40,374,1496102400"; d="scan'208,217"; a="52890068" Received: from alln-core-12.cisco.com ([173.36.13.134]) by rcdn-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 17 Jul 2017 07:26:11 +0000 Received: from [10.24.25.9] ([10.24.25.9]) by alln-core-12.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6H7Q7hr016037; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 07:26:08 GMT Message-ID: <596C668E.9050106@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:26:06 -0700 From: "Ahmed Bashandy (bashandy)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" CC: "Clarence Filsfils (cfilsfil)" , DECRAENE Bruno IMT/OLN , LITKOWSKI Stephane SCE/IBNF , "pfrpfr@gmail.com" , rtgwg-chairs@ietf.org, Stewart Bryant , Stewart Bryant Subject: Fwd: I-D Action: draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01.txt References: <150027597752.32726.7270829130613224040@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <150027597752.32726.7270829130613224040@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <150027597752.32726.7270829130613224040@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010105000400000801070304" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 07:26:14 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010105000400000801070304 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, A new version of the ti-lfa draft has been posted to address Stewart Bryant's comments Thanks Ahmed -------- Original Message -------- Subject: I-D Action: draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01.txt Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:19:37 -0700 From: internet-drafts@ietf.org Reply-To: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : Topology Independent Fast Reroute using Segment Routing Authors : Ahmed Bashandy Clarence Filsfils Bruno Decraene Stephane Litkowski Pierre Francois Filename : draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2017-07-17 Abstract: This document presents Topology Independent Loop-free Alternate Fast Re-route (TI-LFA), aimed at providing protection of node and adjacency segments within the Segment Routing (SR) framework. This Fast Re-route (FRR) behavior builds on proven IP-FRR concepts being LFAs, remote LFAs (RLFA), and remote LFAs with directed forwarding (DLFA). It extends these concepts to provide guaranteed coverage in any IGP network. A key aspect of TI-LFA is the FRR path selection approach establishing protection over post-convergence paths from the point of local repair, dramatically reducing the operational need to control the tie-breaks among various FRR options. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ I-D-Announce mailing list I-D-Announce@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt --------------010105000400000801070304 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi,

A new version of the ti-lfa draft has been posted to address Stewart Bryant's comments

Thanks

Ahmed


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: I-D Action: draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01.txt
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:19:37 -0700
From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
Reply-To: internet-drafts@ietf.org
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org> 


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.


        Title           : Topology Independent Fast Reroute using Segment Routing
        Authors         : Ahmed Bashandy
                          Clarence Filsfils
                          Bruno Decraene
                          Stephane Litkowski
                          Pierre Francois
	Filename        : draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01.txt
	Pages           : 12
	Date            : 2017-07-17

Abstract:
   This document presents Topology Independent Loop-free Alternate Fast
   Re-route (TI-LFA), aimed at providing protection of node and
   adjacency segments within the Segment Routing (SR) framework.  This
   Fast Re-route (FRR) behavior builds on proven IP-FRR concepts being
   LFAs, remote LFAs (RLFA), and remote LFAs with directed forwarding
   (DLFA).  It extends these concepts to provide guaranteed coverage in
   any IGP network.  A key aspect of TI-LFA is the FRR path selection
   approach establishing protection over post-convergence paths from
   the point of local repair, dramatically reducing the operational
   need to control the tie-breaks among various FRR options.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-ti-lfa-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
I-D-Announce mailing list
I-D-Announce@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce
Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt


--------------010105000400000801070304-- From nobody Mon Jul 17 00:40:22 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF894131A7D for ; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:40:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AUQdjCguS1e0 for ; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:40:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-8.cisco.com (alln-iport-8.cisco.com [173.37.142.95]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D49A6131A63 for ; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:40:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=6247; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1500277218; x=1501486818; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to; bh=rQoFhT/7OtNUw68LP/w+sfNAYAq7TrUkaSUISrDl1pg=; b=cMrHbZuX/BcYHso5GdgyI5TAp9kdCoBrwPKs+VSAIpu1ji5wJ2I/nG1r ykiAuLsksFjjvyEe9jVVmm/hVBO9qbJueJ04z+MpSrPWCebcqyJsu8bDx d200rnpNm77TYlU/2lmYQtBmwuDAVvB5kwGltqgQkcECmo+Ie1PK9Xhik g=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.40,374,1496102400"; d="scan'208,217";a="456463196" Received: from alln-core-10.cisco.com ([173.36.13.132]) by alln-iport-8.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 17 Jul 2017 07:40:18 +0000 Received: from [10.24.25.9] ([10.24.25.9]) by alln-core-10.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6H7eFos005905; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 07:40:16 GMT Message-ID: <596C69DF.9050200@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:40:15 -0700 From: "Ahmed Bashandy (bashandy)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" CC: "Clarence Filsfils (cfilsfil)" , LITKOWSKI Stephane SCE/IBNF , "pfrpfr@gmail.com" , rtgwg-chairs , Stewart Bryant , Stewart Bryant Subject: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt References: <150027705097.32749.15179159716628969153.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <150027705097.32749.15179159716628969153.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <150027705097.32749.15179159716628969153.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------050604060906030806040607" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 07:40:21 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050604060906030806040607 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, A new version of microloop avoidance draft has been uploaded to address the comments from Stewart Bryant Thanks Ahmed -------- Original Message -------- Subject: New Version Notification for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:37:30 -0700 From: To: Clarence Filsfils , Ahmed Bashandy , Stephane Litkowski , Pierre Francois A new version of I-D, draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt has been successfully submitted by Ahmed Bashandy and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop Revision: 01 Title: Loop avoidance using Segment Routing Document date: 2017-07-17 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 7 URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop/ Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01 Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01 Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01 Abstract: This document presents a mechanism aimed at providing loop avoidance in the case of IGP network convergence event. The solution relies on the temporary use of SR policies ensuring loop-freeness over the post-convergence paths from the converging node to the destination. Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat --------------050604060906030806040607 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi,

A new version of microloop avoidance draft has been uploaded to address the comments from Stewart Bryant

Thanks

Ahmed



-------- Original Message --------
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 00:37:30 -0700
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
To: Clarence Filsfils <cfilsfil@cisco.com>, Ahmed Bashandy <bashandy@cisco.com>, Stephane Litkowski <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, Pierre Francois <pfrpfr@gmail.com> 


A new version of I-D, draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt
has been successfully submitted by Ahmed Bashandy and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:		draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop
Revision:	01
Title:		Loop avoidance using Segment Routing
Document date:	2017-07-17
Group:		Individual Submission
Pages:		7
URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01.txt
Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01
Diff:           https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bashandy-rtgwg-segment-routing-uloop-01

Abstract:
This document presents a mechanism aimed at providing loop avoidance
in the case of IGP network convergence event.  The solution relies on
the temporary use of SR policies ensuring loop-freeness over the
post-convergence paths from the converging node to the destination.

                                                                                  


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat


--------------050604060906030806040607-- From nobody Mon Jul 17 01:33:33 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 320B0131AA9; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 01:33:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.903 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.903 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fxe721502qCD; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B608F131AD9; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 01:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id B82121E377; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 04:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 04:42:50 -0400 From: Jeffrey Haas To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Cc: "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" , Xufeng Liu , Greg Mirsky , "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Message-ID: <20170717084250.GA24942@pfrc.org> References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 08:33:26 -0000 Acee, On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 08:31:25PM +0000, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Typically, YANG indices are added to YANG lists to simply imply ordering. > I don’t believe there is absolutely any value in trying to enforce the > semantics of a precise label position on this index. It is fairly obvious > that the first label in the list is the first label in the stack, the > second label in the list is the second label in the stack, and so on… > Hopefully, the other YANG model authors will agree with me on this point > and the “Index 0 as top” convention should be relaxed. Is there a YANG > doctor in the house??? > > Now, we currently specify the top label as the first label in the list > while Jeff has proposed that the bottom label be the first label. Surely, > there is an existing convention within MPLS RFCs and drafts and we should > be consistent. I’d research myself but I have a ton of other things to do > prior to leaving for Prague tomorrow. When someone refers to the first > label, is the top or bottom label? I have always been referring to the > first label as the top label (with all due respect to C stack > implementations). Generally, people view stacks from top to bottom. I don't think there's any argument about that. As noted in the thread, the issue is that the indexes are there for ordering and to remove ambiguity when the same value is present in the list twice. But since the ordering is implied by indexes and gaps are permitted, a sort operation is still required. The question becomes whether there's any use in letting a well known value, such as 0, can be an expected bottom or top of stack element? I believe the answer is yes, but have a mixed opinion whether bottom or top would be better. I think the arguments for each are: Bottom: This is the only label that has special semantics - it's the last one and gets the bottom of stack bit. Top: This is the label you forward on. I'm ambivalent as to which is most useful, but do suggest we should use one of the two. -- Jeff From nobody Mon Jul 17 05:51:59 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F77C131B5E; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 05:51:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fg_eOQeMpkj7; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 05:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3225B131B6B; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 05:51:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=22924; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1500295887; x=1501505487; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=v8ntfOyLvmD9d8197qGceorMPess2zmAUUj5NJ5vfx8=; b=hkJnkL58q7ptsZELzJ35D/lNR8sO9QIqsijGwludvMFhyiczBREqk7TS 2R2y4P8+uHPYjmXcPSsj2dg7yppb1KG2MTMGz5lHqwZgYU2QUBm2+91b3 4MoWNeUNy6rl5iAMpLVbivWVL2Lj6IW/S8yAUNHtZUMogXt4G8x58a6ir U=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.40,374,1496102400"; d="scan'208,217";a="695867313" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-2.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 17 Jul 2017 12:51:25 +0000 Received: from [10.61.70.137] (ams3-vpn-dhcp1673.cisco.com [10.61.70.137]) by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6HCpOrQ005246; Mon, 17 Jul 2017 12:51:25 GMT Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" , Jeffrey Haas , Xufeng Liu Cc: "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> From: Robert Wilton Message-ID: <5e2fb905-213c-40b3-cbe0-18b41db4871d@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 14:51:24 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------C82E12F50CE5E342CC7492BA" Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2017 12:51:39 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------C82E12F50CE5E342CC7492BA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi, Just as a point of reference, for VLAN tag stacks, the outermost VLAN tag is always first in the list. Regarding relax the ordering or not, I may not be answering exactly the same question, but I would say that you want a have a canonical order (to allow for easy and efficient comparison), and forcing everyone to have to sort the label stack before using it would probably just be regarded as a wart. Thanks, Rob On 14/07/2017 22:31, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Tarek, Jeff, > > Typically, YANG indices are added to YANG lists to simply imply > ordering. I don’t believe there is absolutely any value in trying to > enforce the semantics of a precise label position on this index. It is > fairly obvious that the first label in the list is the first label in > the stack, the second label in the list is the second label in the > stack, and so on… Hopefully, the other YANG model authors will agree > with me on this point and the “Index 0 as top” convention should be > relaxed. Is there a YANG doctor in the house??? > > Now, we currently specify the top label as the first label in the list > while Jeff has proposed that the bottom label be the first label. > Surely, there is an existing convention within MPLS RFCs and drafts > and we should be consistent. I’d research myself but I have a ton of > other things to do prior to leaving for Prague tomorrow. When someone > refers to the first label, is the top or bottom label? I have always > been referring to the first label as the top label (with all due > respect to C stack implementations). > > Thanks, > Acee > > From: "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" > > Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 1:12 PM > To: Jeff Haas >, Xufeng Liu > > > Cc: Greg Mirsky >, "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org > " > >, "mpls@ietf.org > " >, > "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org > " > >, Routing WG > > > Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models > Resent-From: > > Resent-To: >, > Yingzhen Qu >, > Acee Lindem >, Christian Hopps > >, > > Resent-Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 1:12 PM > > Hi Jeff and Xufeng, > > Sorry, catching up on this thread. Yes, we've made a change for > the MPLS label-stack from "leaf-list" to a "list with key index" > to address having multiple labels of same value in the same stack. > > We noted an assumption in the description that index 0 is the top > of the stack followed by the remainder of the labels in the stack. > However, you have a point about enforcing index (n-1) being > present before accepting index n. There is some discussion on > 'preceding-sibling' and 'following-sibling' with some > recommendations in rfc6087.. I'll need to check if enforcing such > "when" check is good idea in YANG. > > Another idea (not so elegant) is relax this "index 0 as top" and > just accept the lowest index of the list as the top followed by > the remainder labels (as sorted in index increasing order). > > Regards, > > Tarek > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jeffrey Haas > > > Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 12:51 PM > > To: Xufeng Liu > > > Cc: Greg Mirsky >, > "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org > " > >, "mpls@ietf.org > " >, > "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org > " > >, "rtgwg@ietf.org > " > > > Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models > > Resent-From: > > > Resent-To: Tarek Saad >, > >, >, >, >, >, >, >, >, > > > Resent-Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 12:42 PM > > Xufeng, > > On Thu, Jul 13, 2017 at 04:14:18PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: > > > Thanks for looking at this. You are right, but we are still > discussing various approaches for the static MPLS and the > conclusion has not been reached yet. > > > We'd like to hear what you think and appreciate your comments. > > To offer a suggestion, order the stack from bottom (lowest > number) to top > > (highest). Require that bottom of stack be element index zero. > > My yang constraints are a bit weak but I believe you can > construct an XPath > > that requires that a node of index 0 must be present. > > The above two suggestions don't help with the issues of > needing to sort the > > list by index in order to generate the stack, but it does at > least remove > > any possible ambiguity about the critical bottom of stack > semantic. > > -- Jeff > > > > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg --------------C82E12F50CE5E342CC7492BA Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Hi,

Just as a point of reference, for VLAN tag stacks, the outermost VLAN tag is always first in the list.

Regarding relax the ordering or not, I may not be answering exactly the same question, but I would say that you want a have a canonical order (to allow for easy and efficient comparison), and forcing everyone to have to sort the label stack before using it would probably just be regarded as a wart.

Thanks,
Rob


On 14/07/2017 22:31, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote:
Hi Tarek, Jeff, 

Typically, YANG indices are added to YANG lists to simply imply ordering. I don’t believe there is absolutely any value in trying to enforce the semantics of a precise label position on this index. It is fairly obvious that the first label in the list is the first label in the stack, the second label in the list is the second label in the stack, and so on… Hopefully, the other YANG model authors will agree with me on this point and the “Index 0 as top” convention should be relaxed. Is there a YANG doctor in the house??? 

Now, we currently specify the top label as the first label in the list while Jeff has proposed that the bottom label be the first label.  Surely, there is an existing convention within MPLS RFCs and drafts and we should be consistent. I’d research myself but I have a ton of other things to do prior to leaving for Prague tomorrow. When someone refers to the first label, is the top or bottom label? I have always been referring to the first label as the top label (with all due respect to C stack implementations). 

Thanks,
Acee 

From: "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" <tsaad@cisco.com>
Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 1:12 PM
To: Jeff Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>, Xufeng Liu <Xufeng_Liu@jabil.com>
Cc: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>, "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org>, "mpls@ietf.org" <mpls@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org>, Routing WG <rtgwg@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models
Resent-From: <alias-bounces@ietf.org>
Resent-To: <xufeng_liu@jabil.com>, Yingzhen Qu <yingzhen.qu@huawei.com>, Acee Lindem <acee@cisco.com>, Christian Hopps <chopps@chopps.org>, <lberger@labn.net>
Resent-Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 1:12 PM

Hi Jeff and Xufeng,

 

Sorry, catching up on this thread. Yes, we've made a change for the MPLS label-stack from "leaf-list" to a "list with key index" to address having multiple labels of same value in the same stack.

We noted an assumption in the description that index 0 is the top of the stack followed by the remainder of the labels in the stack. However, you have a point about enforcing index (n-1) being present before accepting index n. There is some discussion on 'preceding-sibling' and 'following-sibling' with some recommendations in rfc6087.. I'll need to check if enforcing such "when" check is good idea in YANG.

 

Another idea (not so elegant) is relax this "index 0 as top" and just accept the lowest index of the list as the top followed by the remainder labels (as sorted in index increasing order).

 

Regards,

Tarek

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>

Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 12:51 PM

To: Xufeng Liu <Xufeng_Liu@jabil.com>

Cc: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>, "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org>, "mpls@ietf.org" <mpls@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org>, "rtgwg@ietf.org" <rtgwg@ietf.org>

Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models

Resent-From: <alias-bounces@ietf.org>

Resent-To: Tarek Saad <tsaad@cisco.com>, <skraza@cisco.com>, <rgandhi@cisco.com>, <xufeng_liu@jabil.com>, <vbeeram@juniper.net>, <hshah@ciena.com>, <igor.bryskin@huawei.com>, <jescia.chenxia@huawei.com>, <raqib@brocade.com>, <bin_wen@cable.comcast.com>

Resent-Date: Thursday, July 13, 2017 at 12:42 PM

 

    Xufeng,

   

    On Thu, Jul 13, 2017 at 04:14:18PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote:

    > Thanks for looking at this. You are right, but we are still discussing various approaches for the static MPLS and the conclusion has not been reached yet.

    > We'd like to hear what you think and appreciate your comments.

   

    To offer a suggestion, order the stack from bottom (lowest number) to top

    (highest).  Require that bottom of stack be element index zero.

   

    My yang constraints are a bit weak but I believe you can construct an XPath

    that requires that a node of index 0 must be present.

   

    The above two suggestions don't help with the issues of needing to sort the

    list by index in order to generate the stack, but it does at least remove

    any possible ambiguity about the critical bottom of stack semantic.

   

    -- Jeff

    



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--------------C82E12F50CE5E342CC7492BA-- From nobody Wed Jul 19 08:51:25 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietf.org Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3770131A50; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 08:51:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05.txt X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.57.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150047947588.7403.17809842733211400926@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 08:51:15 -0700 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 15:51:16 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group WG of the IETF. Title : Destination/Source Routing Authors : David Lamparter Anton Smirnov Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05.txt Pages : 20 Date : 2017-07-19 Abstract: This note specifies using packets' source addresses in route lookups as additional qualifier to be used in route lookup. This applies to IPv6 [RFC2460] in general with specific considerations for routing protocol left for separate documents. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Jul 19 09:17:57 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD0061287A5 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:17:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GqVwH3f6-Gpa for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:17:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eidolon.nox.tf (eidolon.nox.tf [IPv6:2a07:2ec0:2185::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8FE89124234 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:17:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from equinox by eidolon.nox.tf with local (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1dXrfb-0018Im-Hz; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 18:17:52 +0200 Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 18:17:51 +0200 From: David Lamparter To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: as@cisco.com Subject: Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05.txt Message-ID: <20170719161751.GT773745@eidolon> References: <150047947588.7403.17809842733211400926@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <150047947588.7403.17809842733211400926@ietfa.amsl.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 16:17:56 -0000 Hi rtgwg, TL;DR: new section on "testing for connectivity", says checking "can i route this?" is fine while "what can i route?" probably ain't. as you can see, I've posted an updated version of: On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 08:51:15AM -0700, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > Title : Destination/Source Routing > Authors : David Lamparter > Anton Smirnov > Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing-05.txt Unlike -04, this is not a no-change refresh, though it only extends and elaborates further. Changes are as follows: - moved translation algorithms for policy-based routing implementations and no-backtracking into an appendix; also added a reference to Matthieu's and Juliusz's paper on this topic (which is far more detailed than I'd want to take this in an IETF draft). - janitorial stuff; acknowledgements. If you think it's missing an acknowledgement with your name, please ping me. - added 2 use case sections, from input at this IETF - 2.4. Walled-garden Enterprise services - 2.5. Information Source for Neighbor Management - added section under Applicability To Specific Situations: - 5.4. Testing for Connectivity Availability I think only the last change could be contentious; I'd like to ask if there is dissent on this. Here's the added text: > 5.4. Testing for Connectivity Availability > > There are situations where systems' behaviour depends on the fact > whether "connectivity" is available in a broad sense. These systems > may have previously tested for the existence of a default route in > the routing table. > > Since the default route may now be qualified with a source prefix, > this test can fail. If no additional information is available to > qualify this test, systems SHOULD test for the existence of any > default route instead, e.g. include routes with default destination > but non-default source prefix. > > However, if the test can be associated with a source address or > source prefix, this data SHOULD be used in looking up a default > route. Depending on the application, it MAY also be useful to - > possibly additionally - consider "connectivity" to be available if > any route exists where the route's source prefix covers the prefix or > address under consideration, allowing arbitrary destination prefixes. > > Note though that this approach to routing SHOULD NOT be used to infer > a list of source prefixes in an enumerative manner, or even to guess > domain information. Specifically, if an operator uses more specific > source prefixes to refine their routing, the inferred information > will provide bogus extraneous output. This is distinct from the > connectivity tests mentioned above in that those actually inquire the > routing system, unlike domain information or enumeration, which is > higher-layer application information. This is somewhat motivated by the enterprise PA multihoming & conditional RA drafts. To be clear here, I'm very happy with the use these drafts make of the SADR routing information. (Hence also the addition of section 2.5.) This is explicitly making use of routing information in a routing context, answering "can I route this?". What I'd like to *not* see is using this routing information to guess at things that better had their own information propagation mechanism. This notably includes trying to enumerate available source prefixes. Putting the question as "What can I route?" does not match routing philosophy - there are reasons to aggregate and deaggregate routes for routing purposes. If this breaks the application, that's the point where I'll be arguing, well, you're using it wrong / should be using your own channel. To be even more specific on PA multihoming, I'm saying: someone or something has to decide what prefix(es) you'll be putting on a link anyway. You'd usually have to assign subnets out of a larger prefix. So, something else is telling the router to put prefix X on a link. This is the "own channel", and now the router has the information it needs to ask "can I route this?" and control RAs & PIOs. Same in homenets, with HNCP in the mix. Thanks for any input, -David From nobody Wed Jul 19 09:47:44 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DC7F129482; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 09:47:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NAt_HAxpHLPV; Wed, 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15.00.1210.000; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 12:47:06 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Robert Wilton -X (rwilton - ENSOFT LIMITED at Cisco)" , "Tarek Saad (tsaad)" , Jeffrey Haas , Xufeng Liu CC: "draft-ietf-mpls-static-yang@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-rtgwg-routing-types@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "mpls@ietf.org" Subject: Re: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Topic: MPLS label and LSE data models Thread-Index: AQHS3ksFPA4mDDKsXkmMIsSaphDK+qIW8fIAgABQZoCAAO4op4AATWeAgDU3EruABLenAIAACnAAgAAF3YCAAYbJgIAEeY0AgAMjZoA= Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 16:47:06 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170620205021.GG2289@pfrc.org> <20170710202101.GC12373@pfrc.org> <20170713165140.GI7180@pfrc.org> <48F70EFB-2DAE-4902-9D9D-AD26AC4D49E1@cisco.com> <5e2fb905-213c-40b3-cbe0-18b41db4871d@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5e2fb905-213c-40b3-cbe0-18b41db4871d@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 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X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pU7mvKxszwab for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 10:29:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eidolon.nox.tf (eidolon.nox.tf [IPv6:2a07:2ec0:2185::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B7B57131B80 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 10:29:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from equinox by eidolon.nox.tf with local (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1dXsmf-001Bj6-UH; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 19:29:15 +0200 Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 19:29:13 +0200 From: David Lamparter To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: Anton Smirnov Subject: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Message-ID: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 17:29:21 -0000 Hello again, rtgwg, Unfortunately (and possibly contradicting earlier statements I may have made to the opposite), the routing system behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01#section-3 is not compatible with the behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing and will result in loops in specific cases when mixing implementations. The failure scenario is illustrated by the following setup: Considering 2 connected routers A and B, A implementing dst-src-routing and B implementing enterprise-pa-multihoming. Have: - A advertise D=::/0, S=::/0 - B advertise D=2001:db8::/32, S=2001:db8::/32 - B advertise D=2001:db8:aaaa::/48, S=2001:db8:ffff::/48 B will build the following "scoped tables": - unscoped: ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8::/32 2001:db8::/32 local ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8:ffff::/48 2001:db8:aaaa::/48 local ::/0 via A Note that the last scope has no entry for 2001:db8::/32, since item 3. in the first list in section 3 of the draft only prescribes propagating unscoped entries to the scoped table. This leads to a packet with S=2001:db8:ffff::1, D=2001:db8::1 looping between the routers: - router B performs the lookup as: - longest matching scoped table is S=2001:db8:ffff::/48 - scoped table contains route to ::/0 pointing at A - router A performs the lookup as: - most specific destination match is 2001:db8::/32 - under this destination, route with S=2001:db8::/32 points to B => persistent loop. It is my understanding that this discrepancy in behaviour is accidental and the enterprise-pa-multihoming draft is attempting to describe the same behaviour in local wording. Assuming this is the case, I'm unsure how we've ended up in this situation. I've heard the rtgwg-dst-src-routing draft may be hard to understand. If there are specific concerns, I'd ask for them to be voiced so that I can address them. I've checked for such feedback and found none, if I lost any I'm terribly sorry and hope it can be resent. If there are shared unspecific concerns, I suppose I can look at different ways to argue section 3 / 3.1. Still assuming that this was intended to be identical in behaviour, I would hope the mismatch can be addressed in enterprise-pa-multihoming. Looking at, well, the title of that draft, it seems that it's trying to be complete in describing the specific application in multihomed enterprises. This may also explain the specific mismatch in behaviour; it's in fact identical as long as one only considers exit routing with non-overlapping source prefix restrictions. rtgwg-dst-src-routing argues a broader applicability of the idea and tries to be thorough in describing a routing system feature to build on. As such, I'd be very happy to see enterprise-pa-multihoming describing in detail how to apply this feature for its title. Assuming it is _not_ the case that the intention is for these to be identical, we're IMHO heading for a rather bad place. I'd rather not argue this without confirming we're indeed there. Cheers, -David P.S.: rtgwg-dst-src-routing already had a description on how to translate its routes into a form suitable for "policy routing" implementations. The version just posted adds a reference to https://hal.inria.fr/file/index/docid/947234/filename/source-sensitive-routing.pdf which argues the implementation specifics and correctness of this translation in its full mathematical gore ;) From nobody Wed Jul 19 23:53:45 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E5F81242F5 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=tessares-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qp8weZcdJKVB for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x235.google.com (mail-wm0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 28CB3124217 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x235.google.com with SMTP id w191so17771754wmw.1 for ; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tessares-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=to:cc:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-language; bh=3lYznN37G0ippBGCJASlXPCCUkLCZvaEZsx0XuboR7c=; b=X7kO7fHcimCSJ/5OXRdhfKCdRx9We0vnzCAEFUAHAw6y5hHP0DWpmVPqNcI4cZswRy ZLx91A1Ull7qJ8Ok2M/Eo2fdnhO5VY1d2p8TexTnZtW3IG3uTqy6K7JR6rtkpwB49bO8 N0UXn6EGSsfacxTOHAkF5/OZWleOepX1XpTbC2CvXnrZJ4ZzB+qfJm1Gst1FGFTdymjh irqxMtpBr1CYUnGzbiCQfNYd8q5nPdngU+ozI0H4vbLOYQVMmE2Dds3nCZj5fRSYIeDN Ftkq9z730lFXAR0/hROalOQD7yBgz3mH46/XFsr1JUMEW1oHir5XDJ7BkekOSZvfVy+5 h9mQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:cc:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-language; bh=3lYznN37G0ippBGCJASlXPCCUkLCZvaEZsx0XuboR7c=; b=sp2eAVc07Z5x1xLF/Gm1nUSJo5XSdxT6Zzow77hhW/t4fcGcGqInTQ3jGh/0gg1UJ5 JHyATKnvv72u157ecpPUo+rmw/TivvD5GPeMF5zX7gWU7Y0d0bOx+vYgj44Ip02W3sjz t6Hx0hhwKrLysKo+otorxLBM9yK4hi1/5EnUTS4pqfDXbXrs6YbKpRNQ8m41xG2J2j10 YvscyqgkaNr7mXymvW0VibByhf/E+qAHPGm7qnHY8nmhV4FtgrUSU5U+/9Z1GCjMX0Mh tW9p80YRG2t4FrCVlNahY3FwczF+XYeu6Tp2ORv6AkTNi3zJdNpGxKHVSWPEnidthXn4 AONw== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw113Bxi4QjU3HHTlxkO0q0j4Q2MY3pnkwHMjJcN1cn3SY3fQvJ4KI oRtfi+K/OoJZ0EyXn1LhaYZ1ppZ50lSrTWFLyYJsULC+RBCU0GCD5Sjtwo4pXXGyuA== X-Received: by 10.28.185.210 with SMTP id j201mr1501322wmf.52.1500533612607; Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mbpobo.local ([80.188.36.206]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h10sm1274528wme.30.2017.07.19.23.53.31 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 19 Jul 2017 23:53:32 -0700 (PDT) To: RTGWG , V6 Ops List From: Olivier Bonaventure Subject: Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:53:31 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.2.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format=flowed Content-Language: fr-classic Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 06:53:37 -0000 Hello, During v6ops and yesterday's plenary, John Brzozowski encouraged us to use our own technologies for the IETF network with NAT64. This argument is valid for those who teach computer networks and since RTGWG is working on enterprise IPv6 multihoming, you might be interested in a recent experiment we did with our students. When students learn networking, they should not learn the current state of affairs but be prepared for the future since they'll only graduate in a few years. Several years ago, when IPv6 deployment was burgeoning, I decided to remove IPv4 from my networking 101 open-source textbook ( http://cnp3book.info.ucl.ac.be ). Since then, our students only learn IPv6 and results are excellent. Once they've learned IPv6, they can quickly understand how IPv4 works. Hopefully they'll see sunset4 during their career. After networking 101, some of your students attend an advanced networking course. This course combines theory with practice and usually students do practice after theory to illustrate the theoratical concepts. This year, we decided to flip the course and start from a practical problem to see how groups of students can address this problem with an open mindset and based only on what they've learned from networking 101 and the information that they will find on the Internet. During their carreer, they will be forced to learn on the spot anyway and they should better start early to look at rfcs, internet drafts and open-source implementations. The project given to the students was very simple. One of the engineers responsible for our (IPv4 mainly :-() campus network explained the architecture and the basic openrational principles that they use. Olivier Tilmans prepared a virtual machine that mimics our compus network (basically six routers) and we attached a few virtual machines to act as servers and clients. The only constraint that we was that the campus network had two upstream providers each delegating a different prefix to the campus network. Then, the students had to : - define an IPv6 addressing plan for their network - select, install and configure a routing protocol and make sure that it was working correctly - install and configure dhcp servers/ra to distribute addresses - install and configure DNS servers and resolvers - install and configure Diffserv-like traffic control - install and configure ssh and http servers - install and configure firewall services to protect the network - think about a solution to monitor the network [the number of tasks was chosen based on the number of students in each group] All student teams had an operation network at the end of the project. Since we believe in automation and open-source, we required them to automate their network from day one and several groups have released their entire project in open-source. From a teaching viewpoint, entreprise IPv6 multihoming is a very nice problem. To encourage other educators (and maybe also network engineers willing to continue to learn) to experiment with IPv6 entreprise multihoming, we have released all the software developed to create this project in open-source. You can find all the details at : https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142 You only need a Linux virtual machine provided by Vagrant to reproduce the experiment. The barrier to experiment with IPv6 entreprise multihoming is very low. Selected students projects with reports and code are available from this repository as well https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/tree/master/student_projects I encourage you to have a look at the students' reports to see their final results: https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group1/report-group1.pdf https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group2/LINGI2142___Rapport_Groupe_2.pdf https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group3/report.pdf Comments and feedback are welcome although the IETF mailing lists may not be the best place for discussions on software or teaching projects... Olivier Tilmans and Olivier Bonaventure -- ------------------------------ DISCLAIMER. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. 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From nobody Thu Jul 20 00:15:29 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73557131CE4; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P1PuEbF9zkNK; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x236.google.com (mail-wr0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1B73B12EB2B; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x236.google.com with SMTP id k71so13378633wrc.2; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=user-agent:date:subject:from:to:message-id:thread-topic:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xBdyydK8L2NOQp5Jo0SIxG8n9Vw/b4ht3+eCVvNgAd4=; b=tY/2N6QEKSOIE5SDI2dz4rpqoK7y6/kmFczkYP0Q3xy2rgi9Stz0DXQvD4KNNwrhzJ vzMNxBvM1C1og74s0i2fej2asUQHKiue0TMI408NB9OajkMYiFqvowNa9ny+PKRXgrmB k2a4NHLl0//YfJmhsAzGx9Qt7cTmGF0KU8/Vby7Xsvg2W7JcgOLGNAJBgP3aiB98nHfv mmhNWQLC1HtL2O32E67Yz/Q+quNZeDRFsvkCKQnkqAAkN62rNTBb6QDDr71UUkyaDk1G NKwBfDWmMU8s6iUfMz7FuZqvJ4utWj4H9vqzrG109SLe1zR3z1z0MmLShliohWICmhAo 3EfA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:user-agent:date:subject:from:to:message-id :thread-topic:references:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=xBdyydK8L2NOQp5Jo0SIxG8n9Vw/b4ht3+eCVvNgAd4=; b=eTdHWh179f24G5QLrHTaQ+d2hHba1VzlRSvXGEatLwZwV0jY7Ku0ikRNvBESuSYOIX xayG02migD7EYRiBw2ysTI/lBZ/JeDarn1D0C/bItlzs1w6Lnbh1WJuTNHNY1TgGjLsp bfO7aShEcTrNuN8GTEqcz2TGJDpEzSkBWNOZ+L4l5D7k3dHH+sHzMuMpKFyZTRTGmM4u nqGC4tbw2IQzDHLQtlKMNarm42MzL3bIEBrrwE9jf1WQwJHwX2ac22Fynw2QunbTzUSw wZDDvdIha3Shok4XgTijzYkq7CuVp8F6OJDvIt4z1eRDAebFDwSRtBxlKLTGuPQxKdwj wxTw== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw111c8gY+p7lH1bkelc05wx7Qrczw3vfa7+7K3o7+RD+1doefQops nhp3YL3DD2hxIA== X-Received: by 10.223.168.110 with SMTP id l101mr2078535wrc.251.1500534923594; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.3.168] ([62.168.35.125]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r199sm1287238wmd.11.2017.07.20.00.13.26 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:15:22 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/f.24.0.170702 Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 09:12:18 +0200 Subject: Re: Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming From: Jeff Tantsura To: Olivier Bonaventure , RTGWG , V6 Ops List Message-ID: <6C482CA8-5E8A-47B6-A76E-D3A47B7F70B3@gmail.com> Thread-Topic: Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming References: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:15:27 -0000 Olivier, Thank you for sharing with RTGWG and looking forward to your future contributions! Cheers, Jeff -----Original Message----- From: rtgwg on behalf of Olivier Bonaventure Date: Thursday, July 20, 2017 at 08:54 To: RTGWG , V6 Ops List Subject: Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming Hello, During v6ops and yesterday's plenary, John Brzozowski encouraged us to use our own technologies for the IETF network with NAT64. This argument is valid for those who teach computer networks and since RTGWG is working on enterprise IPv6 multihoming, you might be interested in a recent experiment we did with our students. When students learn networking, they should not learn the current state of affairs but be prepared for the future since they'll only graduate in a few years. Several years ago, when IPv6 deployment was burgeoning, I decided to remove IPv4 from my networking 101 open-source textbook ( http://cnp3book.info.ucl.ac.be ). Since then, our students only learn IPv6 and results are excellent. Once they've learned IPv6, they can quickly understand how IPv4 works. Hopefully they'll see sunset4 during their career. After networking 101, some of your students attend an advanced networking course. This course combines theory with practice and usually students do practice after theory to illustrate the theoratical concepts. This year, we decided to flip the course and start from a practical problem to see how groups of students can address this problem with an open mindset and based only on what they've learned from networking 101 and the information that they will find on the Internet. During their carreer, they will be forced to learn on the spot anyway and they should better start early to look at rfcs, internet drafts and open-source implementations. The project given to the students was very simple. One of the engineers responsible for our (IPv4 mainly :-() campus network explained the architecture and the basic openrational principles that they use. Olivier Tilmans prepared a virtual machine that mimics our compus network (basically six routers) and we attached a few virtual machines to act as servers and clients. The only constraint that we was that the campus network had two upstream providers each delegating a different prefix to the campus network. Then, the students had to : - define an IPv6 addressing plan for their network - select, install and configure a routing protocol and make sure that it was working correctly - install and configure dhcp servers/ra to distribute addresses - install and configure DNS servers and resolvers - install and configure Diffserv-like traffic control - install and configure ssh and http servers - install and configure firewall services to protect the network - think about a solution to monitor the network [the number of tasks was chosen based on the number of students in each group] All student teams had an operation network at the end of the project. Since we believe in automation and open-source, we required them to automate their network from day one and several groups have released their entire project in open-source. From a teaching viewpoint, entreprise IPv6 multihoming is a very nice problem. To encourage other educators (and maybe also network engineers willing to continue to learn) to experiment with IPv6 entreprise multihoming, we have released all the software developed to create this project in open-source. You can find all the details at : https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142 You only need a Linux virtual machine provided by Vagrant to reproduce the experiment. The barrier to experiment with IPv6 entreprise multihoming is very low. Selected students projects with reports and code are available from this repository as well https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/tree/master/student_projects I encourage you to have a look at the students' reports to see their final results: https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group1/report-group1.pdf https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group2/LINGI2142___Rapport_Groupe_2.pdf https://github.com/UCL-INGI/lingi2142/blob/master/student_projects/Group3/report.pdf Comments and feedback are welcome although the IETF mailing lists may not be the best place for discussions on software or teaching projects... Olivier Tilmans and Olivier Bonaventure -- ------------------------------ DISCLAIMER. This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. If you are not the intended recipient you are notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. _______________________________________________ rtgwg mailing list rtgwg@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg From nobody Thu Jul 20 00:41:41 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 268DB126CD6 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:41:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id a1hEfprbIrLk for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eidolon.nox.tf (eidolon.nox.tf [IPv6:2a07:2ec0:2185::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B62D7126557 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from equinox by eidolon.nox.tf with local (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1dY65U-001pDA-Rz; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 09:41:34 +0200 Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 09:41:32 +0200 From: David Lamparter To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: Anton Smirnov , Jen Linkova , Chris Bowers , Fred Baker Subject: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Message-ID: <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:41:40 -0000 Gah, forgot Cc:s, resending to list so replies will inherit Cc:s (please reply on this one to get the Cc:s) On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 07:29:13PM +0200, David Lamparter wrote: Hello again, rtgwg, Unfortunately (and possibly contradicting earlier statements I may have made to the opposite), the routing system behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01#section-3 is not compatible with the behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing and will result in loops in specific cases when mixing implementations. The failure scenario is illustrated by the following setup: Considering 2 connected routers A and B, A implementing dst-src-routing and B implementing enterprise-pa-multihoming. Have: - A advertise D=::/0, S=::/0 - B advertise D=2001:db8::/32, S=2001:db8::/32 - B advertise D=2001:db8:aaaa::/48, S=2001:db8:ffff::/48 B will build the following "scoped tables": - unscoped: ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8::/32 2001:db8::/32 local ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8:ffff::/48 2001:db8:aaaa::/48 local ::/0 via A Note that the last scope has no entry for 2001:db8::/32, since item 3. in the first list in section 3 of the draft only prescribes propagating unscoped entries to the scoped table. This leads to a packet with S=2001:db8:ffff::1, D=2001:db8::1 looping between the routers: - router B performs the lookup as: - longest matching scoped table is S=2001:db8:ffff::/48 - scoped table contains route to ::/0 pointing at A - router A performs the lookup as: - most specific destination match is 2001:db8::/32 - under this destination, route with S=2001:db8::/32 points to B => persistent loop. It is my understanding that this discrepancy in behaviour is accidental and the enterprise-pa-multihoming draft is attempting to describe the same behaviour in local wording. Assuming this is the case, I'm unsure how we've ended up in this situation. I've heard the rtgwg-dst-src-routing draft may be hard to understand. If there are specific concerns, I'd ask for them to be voiced so that I can address them. I've checked for such feedback and found none, if I lost any I'm terribly sorry and hope it can be resent. If there are shared unspecific concerns, I suppose I can look at different ways to argue section 3 / 3.1. Still assuming that this was intended to be identical in behaviour, I would hope the mismatch can be addressed in enterprise-pa-multihoming. Looking at, well, the title of that draft, it seems that it's trying to be complete in describing the specific application in multihomed enterprises. This may also explain the specific mismatch in behaviour; it's in fact identical as long as one only considers exit routing with non-overlapping source prefix restrictions. rtgwg-dst-src-routing argues a broader applicability of the idea and tries to be thorough in describing a routing system feature to build on. As such, I'd be very happy to see enterprise-pa-multihoming describing in detail how to apply this feature for its title. Assuming it is _not_ the case that the intention is for these to be identical, we're IMHO heading for a rather bad place. I'd rather not argue this without confirming we're indeed there. Cheers, -David P.S.: rtgwg-dst-src-routing already had a description on how to translate its routes into a form suitable for "policy routing" implementations. The version just posted adds a reference to https://hal.inria.fr/file/index/docid/947234/filename/source-sensitive-routing.pdf which argues the implementation specifics and correctness of this translation in its full mathematical gore ;) From nobody Thu Jul 20 00:45:50 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 014B41317BB for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:45:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 88hqxni4DU0l for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:45:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eidolon.nox.tf (eidolon.nox.tf [IPv6:2a07:2ec0:2185::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB341126557 for ; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 00:45:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from equinox by eidolon.nox.tf with local (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1dY69X-001pP2-Fc; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 09:45:43 +0200 Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 09:45:43 +0200 From: David Lamparter To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: Anton Smirnov , Jen Linkova , Chris Bowers , Fred Baker Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Message-ID: <20170720074543.GY773745@eidolon> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 07:45:48 -0000 ... I should step away from electronical devices, for some reason I'm missing Chris Bowers and Fred Baker again... From nobody Thu Jul 20 08:53:23 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78CF91252BA; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:53:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hhcHeIiSHimh; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E70E812EC46; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DRQ63388; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:53:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.38) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.301.0; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 16:53:14 +0100 Received: from SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.5.240]) by SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.4.153]) with mapi id 14.03.0301.000; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 08:53:11 -0700 From: Uma Chunduri To: RTGWG CC: "draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa@ietf.org" Subject: Regarding LFA's for Multi homed prefixes handling document Thread-Topic: Regarding LFA's for Multi homed prefixes handling document Thread-Index: AdMBbzG/M6m1uHYmQJGYNGPtBZQX9w== Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:53:10 +0000 Message-ID: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A3192C@SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.47.65.242] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A3192CSJCEML703CHMchi_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020203.5970D1EB.0160, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=169.254.5.240, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: 4bae3d5861ca30ce14ce34999510e602 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2017 15:53:19 -0000 --_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A3192CSJCEML703CHMchi_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear RTGWG & Chairs, https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-01 speci= fies a simplified and elaborate approach to compute LFAs for multi-homed pr= efixes. In this sense it thoroughly expands and updates Section 6.1 of RFC = 5286 (the base LFA specification). It also clarifies misc. topics (IGP_MAX_METRIC and MT handling) from RFC 5= 286. So based on the comments/discussions we had on this topic we intend update = the document to say it updates RFC 5286 and changed the intended status. Please let us know if you have any questions/concerns on this. Thanks in advance. -- Uma C. (on behalf of all co-authors) --_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A3192CSJCEML703CHMchi_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear RTGWG & Chairs,

 

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-= multihomed-prefix-lfa-01 specifies a simplified and elaborate approach = to compute LFAs for multi-homed prefixes. In this sense it thoroughly expands and updates Section 6.1 of RFC 5286 (t= he base LFA specification).

 

 

It also clarifies  misc. topics (IGP_MAX_METRIC= and MT handling) from RFC 5286.

 

So based on the comments/discussions we had on this = topic we intend update the document to say it  updates RFC 5286 and ch= anged the intended status.

 

Please let us know if you have any questions/concern= s on this.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

--

Uma C. (on behalf of all co-authors)

 

--_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A3192CSJCEML703CHMchi_-- From nobody Thu Jul 20 23:45:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A24B1250B8; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.449 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.449 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cOrqcr_7ssWa; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io0-x22b.google.com (mail-io0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BA973124D85; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id q2so19280201ioe.3; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:56 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=i5M99Pim2gKNvEvQ9mDprE/I4DLv9GykDVhdqX+qvug=; b=NXWhaMbgC1WajT3B87jUCQPRWTdkpc8yuNQ9ffiegu8JknJjB3svUaPtipa4oHo+ui iaYOiHw8UsxBzLTlQ5nsWfsOy0J3genpbM7v0priTkBc6awqvXcBk2vOkBi5UndG+cPi yuja6yl0RaGActBo1nalY/p7ChANShUs+m+gC11RUMHwjkzxEhkP/pRW0dUMKc4GkNfx qS2Y+gd5FmnQ84kKhQ91pv8hhi5RUFVW0sdiG45d3n7nJpz/M9T9BUmSmuJHsLE6jbF1 VREIXwEHZtwfljkFqlyDhC346c2wwJh3hHuEILPooG5zkWboZbx/1rcB2Y+dg9c+6ksV 7piQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=i5M99Pim2gKNvEvQ9mDprE/I4DLv9GykDVhdqX+qvug=; b=Gqz9vvUVilm91kdVtn0O/TbdJ+cjjzr4KYGDFpUMD11u6vEVJ7Vmq4NjCmvtXxyq0O kJUdSEFxdPxw7EtG6ZoogdvDVuXZ78uRxEkJSIf1LqaSHNivw9jEqqDWpNTC9k/cLllI HqqwDrzNYfUHdWzHoAadHrFGat2mNMclqMHaaIFydjJgT5AdZO/fvBILpGs/J6RA8pt1 9vE+Gf/NaWCQpPaY7SK88qToXpUZl4izdYQ/rket7ZhlUr2KDJOnAWIS1JAax13hxg+3 1uw7BzFKH10xh0vJkNR/bBOlCIHT9vBgDOQQcNoHd6wbIOIYpC4vDEkTkKMlFXcSX4nL DX2g== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw113I4ksWN+cdlUJjDnkHuhC4XpQlzhTHJAeENUU48khSIRiL0IDj MgfmeKeIZPGzCRMx8KE3v2nS7+PKl+TaAKs= X-Received: by 10.107.41.5 with SMTP id p5mr5765785iop.165.1500619496182; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.55.215 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jul 2017 23:44:35 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Jen Linkova Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 16:44:35 +1000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [v6ops] Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming To: Olivier Bonaventure Cc: RTGWG , V6 Ops List , Olivier Tilmans Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 06:44:58 -0000 Thanks a lot for sharing those results, Olivier! On Thu, Jul 20, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Olivier Bonaventure wrote: > Since then, our students only learn IPv6 > and results are excellent. Once they've learned IPv6, they can quickly > understand how IPv4 works. Hopefully they'll see sunset4 during their > career. Amen! -- SY, Jen Linkova aka Furry From nobody Fri Jul 21 07:43:23 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6747131E2F; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.698 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DENgDV71DY15; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi0-x22b.google.com (mail-oi0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 40A05131E2C; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi0-x22b.google.com with SMTP id q4so53552419oif.1; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=cUsJ2EtNsAuC6fRMiFkpWqKobTHYHbKdOaCsYX0FvCA=; b=s2ECSdcOSVyb0nnlZ3XZ5b7in5gAY8uNjpexHYF2RP0r6Al+q+CIRiNfWYNuC8rz79 UDtygLST8WAe8B2ZkQWUd2bU5BfImudWjlJfAUyios14JUUzjNE1CIKHfgs+Iv/SPwzN CMxWIGNVCaFd1CKt/IRWPU1Se/Xuu2kbz/AsNYOcuDzS99U+n64qS/rvUJTGXNh0iJDo b07dJU845oHvptDw0o+jkgbOuRFxYTVmLqDzVzUQdP5mOtzXsdPAc/VorpHMtCepduVk EJOG9xSzfE4AfSC21oME6KDPOS8KrXhHybvRYp2rDts3Hfhl+5AhP94fuRJ5r/jA/JM6 j2sA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=cUsJ2EtNsAuC6fRMiFkpWqKobTHYHbKdOaCsYX0FvCA=; b=Z6xsL9YITz6JezBnv6UzAJuFL6RNHo8y4/oEmWxwAyx5bVcTu53yV5zUodfdh0jpu0 7olOAorZz8DPVBJEcO+iPQNc2jLIo9VzVSnu/mkMbrnx0ixPHjq4IuqbI5KjyBqZ4Mmh XI4t/MM3t6rVjazzZzLZg1qYM0h9GNXyHKykIhHvJy+qIXhEcPr21BsxfHcfUiv9MV4A CmwEYwSacMgfFfu0UT35thNsMdEv3RjiJnYq5v2dyH4+l48VupnHQk+AUA0eftygfowX sRlC6i5lR3OKj8Im4Krrmw0cgjZTbrcXDV+OsF6rEHiDEo0ikvZ69fXJKyWdG4smFs/Z kc0w== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw110VyE8F38+3Bg76PTH2jbxm+mJ9AIecySgBfH+RpyWJr1ahtsuU a9jsFg/9YV2Wr4uImyVmX9rjnbMREw== X-Received: by 10.202.204.208 with SMTP id c199mr2201269oig.253.1500648193510; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.74.41.198 with HTTP; Fri, 21 Jul 2017 07:43:12 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Zied BOUZIRI Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 15:43:12 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [v6ops] Eating our own dog food : students solving IPv6 entreprise multihoming To: Jen Linkova Cc: Olivier Bonaventure , Olivier Tilmans , V6 Ops List , RTGWG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1135329c81d41c0554d4e2ed" Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2017 14:43:16 -0000 --001a1135329c81d41c0554d4e2ed Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks a lot for sharing this Best regards On Fri, Jul 21, 2017 at 7:44 AM, Jen Linkova wrote: > Thanks a lot for sharing those results, Olivier! > > On Thu, Jul 20, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Olivier Bonaventure > wrote: > > Since then, our students only learn IPv6 > > and results are excellent. Once they've learned IPv6, they can quickly > > understand how IPv4 works. Hopefully they'll see sunset4 during their > > career. > > Amen! > > -- > SY, Jen Linkova aka Furry > > _______________________________________________ > v6ops mailing list > v6ops@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops > --=20 *cordially*, *=D9=85=D8=B9 =D8=AA=D8=AD=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AA=D9=8A* *Zied BOUZIRI*=D8=8C *=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AF =D8=A8=D9=88=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8= =B1=D9=8A* ISET Charguia, Tunisie www.bouziri.tn --001a1135329c81d41c0554d4e2ed Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks a lot for sharing this
Best regards
=

On Fri, Jul 21, 2= 017 at 7:44 AM, Jen Linkova <furry13@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks a lot for sharing those results, Olivie= r!

On Thu, Jul 20, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Olivier Bonaventure
<olivier.bonaventure= @tessares.net> wrote:
>=C2=A0 Since then, our students only learn IPv6
> and results are excellent. Once they've learned IPv6, they can qui= ckly
> understand how IPv4 works. Hopefully they'll see sunset4 during th= eir
> career.

=C2=A0Amen!

--
SY, Jen Linkova aka Furry

_______________________________________________
v6ops mailing list
v6ops@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops



--
=
cordially, =D9=85=D8=B9 =D8=AA=D8=AD=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AA=D9=8A
Zied BOUZIRI=D8=8C =D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AF =D8=A8=D9=88=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=B1=D9= =8A
ISET Charguia, Tunisie
--001a1135329c81d41c0554d4e2ed-- From nobody Tue Jul 25 07:34:54 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietf.org Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C7A5131CD5; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:34:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.57.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <150099328637.26147.883922837159675493@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:34:46 -0700 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2017 14:34:47 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group WG of the IETF. Title : LFA selection for Multi-Homed Prefixes Authors : Pushpasis Sarkar Shraddha Hegde Chris Bowers Uma Chunduri Jeff Tantsura Bruno Decraene Hannes Gredler Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt Pages : 16 Date : 2017-07-25 Abstract: This document shares experience gained from implementing algorithms to determine Loop-Free Alternates for multi-homed prefixes. In particular, this document provides explicit inequalities that can be used to evaluate neighbors as a potential alternates for multi-homed prefixes. It also provides detailed criteria for evaluating potential alternates for external prefixes advertised by OSPF ASBRs. This documents updates and expands some of the "Routing Aspects" as specified in Section 6 of [RFC5286]. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Jul 25 07:59:02 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E6751317B1 for ; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:59:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dAXf7O35Sqgr for ; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:58:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4831C13188D for ; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:58:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO LHREML713-CAH.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id DLG95119; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 14:58:56 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.38) by LHREML713-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.36) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.301.0; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 15:58:05 +0100 Received: from SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.5.240]) by SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.4.153]) with mapi id 14.03.0301.000; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 07:58:03 -0700 From: Uma Chunduri To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" Subject: RE: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt Thread-Topic: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt Thread-Index: AQHTBVNHeBn6PDXetUSgX5zL9ERSYKJkobXg Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2017 14:58:03 +0000 Message-ID: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685401A36DC7@SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com> References: <150099328637.26147.883922837159675493@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <150099328637.26147.883922837159675493@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.212.247.217] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected X-Mirapoint-Virus-RAPID-Raw: score=unknown(0), refid=str=0001.0A020202.59775CB0.0205, ss=1, re=0.000, recu=0.000, reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0, ip=169.254.5.240, so=2013-06-18 04:22:30, dmn=2013-03-21 17:37:32 X-Mirapoint-Loop-Id: 10aabb1afe1bc90c1e4d74061b9bc0f6 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2017 14:59:00 -0000 Dear All, As indicated, https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtgwg/current/msg06254= .html this document has been refreshed. Please feel free to provide comments/suggestions. -- Uma C. -----Original Message----- From: rtgwg [mailto:rtgwg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-drafts@ie= tf.org Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 7:35 AM To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies. This draft is a work item of the Routing Area Working Group WG of the IETF. Title : LFA selection for Multi-Homed Prefixes Authors : Pushpasis Sarkar Shraddha Hegde Chris Bowers Uma Chunduri Jeff Tantsura Bruno Decraene Hannes Gredler Filename : draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02.txt Pages : 16 Date : 2017-07-25 Abstract: This document shares experience gained from implementing algorithms to determine Loop-Free Alternates for multi-homed prefixes. In particular, this document provides explicit inequalities that can be used to evaluate neighbors as a potential alternates for multi-homed prefixes. It also provides detailed criteria for evaluating potential alternates for external prefixes advertised by OSPF ASBRs. This documents updates and expands some of the "Routing Aspects" as specified in Section 6 of [RFC5286]. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lf= a-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-rtgwg-multihomed-prefix-lfa-= 02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ rtgwg mailing list rtgwg@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg From nobody Tue Jul 25 17:16:24 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21DD5132148 for ; Tue, 25 Jul 2017 17:16:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.523 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.523 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) 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Received: from host-37-32.sg.lan (unknown [172.23.37.32]) (Authenticated sender: boutier) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 58624EB2D0; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 15:05:08 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Matthieu Boutier In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 15:05:07 +0200 Cc: David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , Anton Smirnov Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.138]); Wed, 26 Jul 2017 15:05:14 +0200 (CEST) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 59789389.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 59789389.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 59789389.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 13:05:25 -0000 Hi, David, you're right, and as you remark, the draft says: 2.5: =C2=AB It is also useful to note that the prefixes assigned to the = site by different ISPs will not overlap. =C2=BB This hypothesis breaks your example. But, as you, I think that we = should not rely on such hypothesis: it seems error-prone. And I think that = some drafts (including yours) report use cases with overlapping prefixes. > Note that doing the source address lookup first maps directly to the > PA multi-homing use-case. Acee, I strongly disagree with that, and that's all the point of section 3 of draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming. We have routers A and = B advertising respectively (D=3D::/0, S=3D2001:db8:a::/48) and (D=3D2001:db8:a::/48, S=3D ::/0). This is exactly two routes. No more. = A dest-src table, like the one in the Linux kernel (IPv6 subtrees) will handle these routes correctly: Destination Source Nexthop -------------------------------------------------- ::/0 2001:db8:a::/48 X 2001:db8:a::/48 ::/0 Y Two routes are advertised, the routing table has two routes: everything = is clear. By the way, this is the simplest realistic scenario possible: 2001:db8:a::/48 +------+----=E2=80=A6---- R --- ISP | | H1 H2 So now, how to read this table? If you do source lookup first, *all* = your packets are going towards the Internet, even the one coming from the Internet=E2=80=A6 too bad. If you do destination lookup first, = everything is ok. Now, the purpose of section 3 of enterprise-pa-multihoming-01 is just = (in my understanding) to tell people how to configure their routers if they don't have native source-specific tables with destination-first = ordering. In that case, you have to deal with policy routing using multiple = routing tables with trafic engineering rules over it. The result is: Source Destination Nexthop --------------- ----------------------------- (unscoped) ::/0 2001:db8:a::/48 X Source Destination Nexthop --------------- ----------------------------- 2001:db8:a::/48 ::/0 Y 2001:db8:a::/48 X # section 3's = copy However, section 3's method only works with disjoint source prefixes. = We provided a general solution... =46rom a draft cited in this draft: [SS-ROUTING] Boutier, M. and J. Chroboczek, "Source-Specific Routing", August 2014. In Proc. IFIP Networking 2015. A slightly earlier version is available online from http://arxiv.org/ pdf/1403.0445. ... and an implementation.... https://github.com/boutier/babeld/blob/dev/disambiguation.c Section 3 should be more clear about its motivations, and might just be = a reference to David's draft. It's also unclear if it's the role of the administrator to configure routing or if it's the role of the routing protocol. Section 3 says =C2=AB The method described in this document = is intended to be easy to understand for network enterprise operators while at the same time being functionally correct =C2=BB. I believe that = presenting plain dst-src tables is much easier to understand. Anyway. Also, the first examples of the draft use SADR domains and "normal-routed" domain, sometimes with tunnels and so on... while saying that having such topology may not lead to have the best route. I think that the draft would be improved if it first present the clean solution which is: *all the network support dst-src routing*. This is what we really want for the long term. I think that all the discussion of 2.1 and 2.2 about what if all my routers don't implement SADR should be moved in an annex named "progressive deployment" (or something like = that). Matthieu From nobody Wed Jul 26 13:53:00 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15E19129B25 for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 13:52:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.523 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.523 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id h6un-V5M0Dha for ; Wed, 26 Jul 2017 13:52:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 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(acee)" To: Matthieu Boutier CC: David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , Anton Smirnov Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Thread-Topic: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Thread-Index: AQHTALSTB7SyiLHxWE2IPBWcbp9an6JlR1MAgAEZ7YCAAD+WAA== Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 20:52:53 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: 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David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" CC: Anton Smirnov , Jen Linkova , Fred Baker Subject: RE: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Thread-Topic: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing Thread-Index: AQHTALSR8NDhHeBsN0+K10gou7y3N6JcVcwAgApTD/A= Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 22:11:47 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> In-Reply-To: <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=cbowers@juniper.net; x-originating-ip: [66.129.239.12] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; MWHPR05MB2864; 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SCL:1; SRVR:MWHPR05MB2864; H:MWHPR05MB2829.namprd05.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: juniper.net does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Jul 2017 22:11:47.6846 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR05MB2864 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2017 22:11:52 -0000 David, It seems to me that the example that creates a routing loop depends on havi= ng two routes where=20 one non-default source prefix of one route contains the source prefix of th= e other route Specifically, S=3D2001:db8::/32 contains S=3D2001:db8:ffff::/48. I think that we can resolve the discrepancy between the two forwarding beha= vior descriptions if we=20 generalize rule #3 from section 3 of draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multiho= ming-01 to propagate routes from each less specific source-prefix-scoped forwarding table to the= more specific source-prefix-scoped forwarding tables contained in the less specific one. = This can be seen as generalizing the rule to propagate routes from the unscoped (S=3D::= /0) forwarding table to the scoped forwarding tables, since they are all contained in the S=3D::= /0 prefix. With this generalization, the forwarding table on B scoped for S=3D2001:db8= :ffff::/48 would inherit an extra route from=20 the forwarding table scoped for S=3D2001:db8::/32 which contains it. The r= esulting forwarding table=20 on B scoped for S=3D2001:db8:ffff::/48 would look as below. So there is no= routing loop. - scope S=3D2001:db8:ffff::/48 2001:db8:aaaa::/48 local 2001:db8::/32 local ::/0 via A Does this generalization of rule #3 resolve the discrepancy ? Thanks, Chris -----Original Message----- From: David Lamparter [mailto:equinox@diac24.net]=20 Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 2:42 AM To: rtgwg@ietf.org Cc: Anton Smirnov ; Jen Linkova ; Chris Bow= ers ; Fred Baker Subject: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and r= tgwg-dst-src-routing Gah, forgot Cc:s, resending to list so replies will inherit Cc:s (please re= ply on this one to get the Cc:s) On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 07:29:13PM +0200, David Lamparter wrote: Hello again, rtgwg, Unfortunately (and possibly contradicting earlier statements I may have mad= e to the opposite), the routing system behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming-01#s= ection-3 is not compatible with the behaviour described in https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-rtgwg-dst-src-routing and will result in loops in specific cases when mixing implementations. The failure scenario is illustrated by the following setup: Considering 2 connected routers A and B, A implementing dst-src-routing and= B implementing enterprise-pa-multihoming. Have: - A advertise D=3D::/0, S=3D::/0 - B advertise D=3D2001:db8::/32, S=3D2001:db8::/32 - B advertise D=3D2001:db8:aaaa::/48, S=3D2001:db8:ffff::/48 B will build the following "scoped tables": - unscoped: ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8::/32 2001:db8::/32 local ::/0 via A - scope 2001:db8:ffff::/48 2001:db8:aaaa::/48 local ::/0 via A Note that the last scope has no entry for 2001:db8::/32, since item 3. in the first list in section 3 of the draft only prescribes propagating uns= coped entries to the scoped table. This leads to a packet with S=3D2001:db8:ffff::1, D=3D2001:db8::1 looping b= etween the routers: - router B performs the lookup as: - longest matching scoped table is S=3D2001:db8:ffff::/48 - scoped table contains route to ::/0 pointing at A - router A performs the lookup as: - most specific destination match is 2001:db8::/32 - under this destination, route with S=3D2001:db8::/32 points to B =3D>= persistent loop. It is my understanding that this discrepancy in behaviour is accidental and= the enterprise-pa-multihoming draft is attempting to describe the same beh= aviour in local wording. Assuming this is the case, I'm unsure how we've ended up in this situation.= I've heard the rtgwg-dst-src-routing draft may be hard to understand. If= there are specific concerns, I'd ask for them to be voiced so that I can a= ddress them. I've checked for such feedback and found none, if I lost any = I'm terribly sorry and hope it can be resent. If there are shared unspecific concerns, I suppose I can look at different = ways to argue section 3 / 3.1. Still assuming that this was intended to be identical in behaviour, I would= hope the mismatch can be addressed in enterprise-pa-multihoming. Looking at, well, the title of that draft, it seems that it's trying to be = complete in describing the specific application in multihomed enterprises. = This may also explain the specific mismatch in behaviour; it's in fact ide= ntical as long as one only considers exit routing with non-overlapping sour= ce prefix restrictions. rtgwg-dst-src-routing argues a broader applicability of the idea and tries = to be thorough in describing a routing system feature to build on. As such, I'd be very happy to see enterprise-pa-multihoming describing in d= etail how to apply this feature for its title. Assuming it is _not_ the case that the intention is for these to be identic= al, we're IMHO heading for a rather bad place. I'd rather not argue this w= ithout confirming we're indeed there. Cheers, -David P.S.: rtgwg-dst-src-routing already had a description on how to translate i= ts routes into a form suitable for "policy routing" implementations. The version just posted adds a reference to https://hal.i= nria.fr/file/index/docid/947234/filename/source-sensitive-routing.pdf which argues the implementation specifics and correctness of this translati= on in its full mathematical gore ;) From nobody Thu Jul 27 02:07:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63DEA126BF3 for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 02:07:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bhCjcm-SUjJ6 for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 02:07:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 027C91200FC for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 02:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:1]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id v6R96uVK018377 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:56 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay2/56228) with ESMTP id v6R96uvK032503; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:56 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 095A9EB343; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:56 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id kBk9zcWArB_Z; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from host-37-32.sg.lan (unknown [172.23.37.32]) (Authenticated sender: boutier) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id ADE4FEB344; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:54 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Matthieu Boutier In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:54 +0200 Cc: David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , Anton Smirnov Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:56 +0200 (CEST) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.141]); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 11:06:56 +0200 (CEST) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 5979AD30.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-Miltered: at potemkin with ID 5979AD30.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 5979AD30.002 from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/null/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 5979AD30.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 5979AD30.002 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 5979AD30.000 on potemkin.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 09:07:04 -0000 > I believe the tables could be similarly collapsed giving source = address > higher precedence than destination address. Do you disagree? mmm, it seems I failed to explain something since that's not the = point=E2=80=A6 Did you agree that: 1. destination first give the correct behaviour as-is. 2. source first needs extra mechanism and route duplication. So we can do it, but we don't *want* so! I was pointing out that it's also what is behind this draft, even if not explicitly said. I'm probably missing something: why would you like "the FIB organization described in section 3"? Matthieu From nobody Thu Jul 27 07:55:46 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B44D131CAF; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 07:55:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.52 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.52 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, WEIRD_PORT=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9flvZmnJ7vVk; Thu, 27 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"rtg-ads@ietf.org" Subject: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Topic: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Index: AQHTBuhlO8jlpLakoECLslHbAbQDfw== Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 14:55:32 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/f.22.0.170515 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.117.15.4] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_AAA19B9732AA488E89D7106B30B30415ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 14:55:37 -0000 --_000_AAA19B9732AA488E89D7106B30B30415ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 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Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Matthieu Boutier In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 18:41:22 +0200 Cc: David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , Anton Smirnov , Jen Linkova Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <9BF40E52-63D7-4B04-815A-64F863241010@irif.fr> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> To: Chris Bowers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 18:41:24 +0200 (CEST) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.141]); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 18:41:24 +0200 (CEST) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 597A17B4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-Miltered: at potemkin with ID 597A17B3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597A17B4.001 from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/null/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597A17B3.001 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597A17B4.001 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597A17B3.001 on potemkin.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 16:41:35 -0000 Hi, > Does this generalization of rule #3 resolve the discrepancy ? It's not enough, because if you have overlapping source prefix, you'll need to change the following. 1. If the source address of the packet matches one of the source prefixes, then look up the destination address of the packet in the corresponding source-prefix-scoped forwarding table to determine the next-hop for the packet. 2. If the source address of the packet does NOT match one of the source prefixes, then look up the destination address of the packet in unscoped forwarding table to determine the next-hop for the packet. Basically, you'll have to replace these two points by only one saying: "order your entries by prefix specificity (longest match first)". And=E2=80=A6 I have the feeling that the routing part is = overcomplicated. It should be as simple as: "put a SADR routing protocol on your network". And you're done. The draft discusses a lot about how to progressively deploy SADR in the network. This should be put in a "progressive deployment" section, = which would essentially say: - have a connected SADR backbone including the edge routers, - announce a default route from the backbone to attract packets. It's the role of the routing protocol to be backward compatible with the legacy (non-SADR) version. Also, about routing tables, section 3 clearly shows that if a packet matches two routes, it should follow the one with the most specific destination. All the section 3 is about what to do if we don't have native destination-first SADR tables but only policy routing. I believe it's the role of the routing protocol's implementation to deal with that (that's what we do since 2013). Then section 3 could probably just be a reference to David's draft, since it only concerns SADR/dst-src/source-specific/etc. routing protocol implementations. 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bHkganVzdCBiZSBhIHJlZmVyZW5jZSB0byBEYXZpZCdzIGRyYWZ0LCBzaW5jZSBpdCBvbmx5IGNv bmNlcm5zIFNBRFIvZHN0LXNyYy9zb3VyY2Utc3BlY2lmaWMvZXRjLiByb3V0aW5nIHByb3RvY29s IGltcGxlbWVudGF0aW9ucy4NCg0KTWF0dGhpZXUNCg0K From nobody Thu Jul 27 19:23:49 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5977131F03 for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bP6VYcJMcwmT for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi0-x231.google.com (mail-oi0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 34225131F0A for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi0-x231.google.com with SMTP id e124so162531016oig.2 for ; Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=YUBCixvxrM3p1SLrAFTquOmT5SDtKy4/CW68aklCXKA=; b=l8OYJiILIn1Wp4C5kN2iVqpXmkLcA5mbJ784P6jWkLhyGhENPvST3SC3fSlmWNmJ2L URCw3W40sXfqHwoWZpKq3ynO0JCpRG/KWc9iUfW6rnoppK3QjyNZXD2ZjM2FoTZIqRaX 8jNGJrz5HvI3sTrzEKCdF3o5gE1PIv5wE1Xzx1bCOhCvUECpvPtYPe2PFM6jiaSa+4b9 pVaKu4f+rsuQNjU43p/cDbsKrXLkHm6Je7qnAgHb5QOK0MdmQ3fbmWk6bPRbayLoO3KX 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([2600:8802:5600:1e::1004]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 82sm22560291oib.57.2017.07.27.19.23.43 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:44 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.0 \(3441.0.1\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Fred Baker In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2017 19:23:46 -0700 Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Anton Smirnov , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <670146D0-A26A-4AA5-AC6C-253B81271C12@gmail.com> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> To: Matthieu Boutier X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3441.0.1) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2017 02:23:48 -0000 > On Jul 27, 2017, at 2:06 AM, Matthieu Boutier wrote: >=20 > Did you agree that: >=20 > 1. destination first give the correct behaviour as-is. >=20 > 2. source first needs extra mechanism and route duplication. Actually, I don't. I can produce cases in which source first gives the = wrong route, and in which destination first gives the wrong route. The = only way I see to make doing either one first *always* gives the right = result is if a small set of routes is duplicated. The issue is when prefixes overlap. If you have sources S1 and S2, = destinations D1 and D2, D1 is a more specific of D2, and D1 is = advertised by S1 but not S2, and D2 is advertised by S2. If you are = looking from S1, you should find S1->D1, and if you are looking from S2, = you should find S2->D2. If you look destination first, and happen to be = looking from S2, I think you wind up trying to find S2->D1, which = doesn't exist. Every time I get my head into this space, I have to rethink it, and the = emails I wrote a few years back are unavailable to me now as I am no = longer at Cisco. I need to think the source version through again. But = you get the idea. I have pretty much convinced myself that you need to = duplicate S2->D2 as S2->D1 but with the next hop associated with S2->D2 = in order to make destination first work. There is a similar case = regarding source-first lookup. This is the reason I have suggested a PATRICIA algorithm or something = like it that looks up both addresses at the same time.= From nobody Fri Jul 28 05:43:15 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF67F131F7F for ; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 05:43:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VCfbP2kfWA26 for ; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 05:43:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2616A12778D for ; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 05:43:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:1]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id v6SCh30a008671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:03 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay2/56228) with ESMTP id v6SCh2eh008556; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:02 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79F21EB342; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:02 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id e5cRUEkoja4t; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:01 +0200 (CEST) Received: from host-37-32.sg.lan (unknown [172.23.37.32]) (Authenticated sender: boutier) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 35DA1EB2CC; Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:00 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Matthieu Boutier In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:42:59 +0200 Cc: David Lamparter , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , Anton Smirnov , Jen Linkova Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <489E14E1-04F2-45A4-A85D-A0B132740BE0@irif.fr> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <20170720074132.GW773745@eidolon> <9BF40E52-63D7-4B04-815A-64F863241010@irif.fr> To: Chris Bowers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]); Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:03 +0200 (CEST) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.141]); Fri, 28 Jul 2017 14:43:03 +0200 (CEST) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 597B3157.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-Miltered: at potemkin with ID 597B3156.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597B3157.000 from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/null/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597B3156.001 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597B3157.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597B3156.001 on potemkin.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2017 12:43:14 -0000 Thank's Chris, it makes things much more clear. > With [=E2=80=A6], I think we are in agreement that the forwarding = behavior described > in rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming Is identical to that described in > rtgwg-dst-src-routing. I think so. :-) > Assuming that the forwarding behaviors are identical, we can now ask = the > question: Is it useful to have two different representations of the = same > forwarding behavior? I think it is. >=20 > It is not the case that "All the section 3 is about what to do if we = don't > have native destination-first SADR tables but only policy routing." = If the > two representations produce the same forwarding behavior, then one = should be > free to implement using either representation. >=20 > I think that enterprise network operators are going to have a very = difficult > time understanding destination-first SADR forwarding tables. Instead, > operators are very familiar with simple destination-based forwarding = tables. > I think that operators will find it much easier to understand and = troubleshoot > when this forwarding behavior is represented using a set of > source-prefix-scoped destination-based forwarding tables. I completely missed this discussion while reading the draft. I = understand that people may want to have different representations. Perhaps the draft = should speak about both representations, since routes are advertised as pairs = (D,S), and it's likely that routing protocols will keep this simple = representation. Perhaps having something like the following(?): 3. Forwarding tables representations 3.1. Source Address Dependant Forwarding tables -> this is just a dump of the announces 3.2. Source-Prefix-Scoped Forwarding Tables -> using "Generating Source-Prefix-Scoped Forwarding Tables v2" 3.3. Examples > When routing protocols are working properly, it shouldn't matter. But = when > packets are not going where the network operator wants them to, they = are going > to want to be able to troubleshoot this by looking at the forwarding = tables. Now I see the point. Thanks, Matthieu From nobody Sat Jul 29 01:47:03 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F46E132047 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 01:47:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KAWogRCYhtV9 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 01:47:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CC7C3120227 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 01:47:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:1]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/75695) with ESMTP id v6T8kt5O002048 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:55 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay2/75695) with ESMTP id v6T8ktee004212; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:55 +0200 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DA7BEB2D0; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:55 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id az1LgDzfhpJw; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:54 +0200 (CEST) Received: from mac-matthieu.lan (AAubervilliers-652-1-222-176.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr [83.112.109.176]) (Authenticated sender: boutier) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A18BDEB2FC; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:50 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Matthieu Boutier In-Reply-To: <670146D0-A26A-4AA5-AC6C-253B81271C12@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:49 +0200 Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Anton Smirnov , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <1DA4E10A-A73E-4B1D-B527-6825EA47AEFF@irif.fr> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <670146D0-A26A-4AA5-AC6C-253B81271C12@gmail.com> To: Fred Baker X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]); Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:55 +0200 (CEST) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.141]); Sat, 29 Jul 2017 10:46:55 +0200 (CEST) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 597C4B7F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-Miltered: at potemkin with ID 597C4B7F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597C4B7F.000 from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/null/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 597C4B7F.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597C4B7F.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 597C4B7F.000 on potemkin.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2017 08:47:03 -0000 > Actually, I don't. I can produce cases in which source first gives the = wrong route, and in which destination first gives the wrong route. Interesting! (but I'm lost with the example below) > The only way I see to make doing either one first *always* gives the = right result is if a small set of routes is duplicated. Did you mean: it any cases, the administrator himself will have to duplicate routes to achieve its goals? > The issue is when prefixes overlap. If you have sources S1 and S2, = destinations D1 and D2, D1 is a more specific of D2, and D1 is = advertised by S1 but not S2, and D2 is advertised by S2. If you are = looking from S1, you should find S1->D1, and if you are looking from S2, = you should find S2->D2. If you look destination first, and happen to be = looking from S2, I think you wind up trying to find S2->D1, which = doesn't exist. I'm lost somewhere. I'm unable to draw this example, being confused = with "who announces what?". For example, when you say "D1 is advertised by = S1 but not S2", does that mean that S1 wants to announce a route for the destination D1 and for all sources except S2? or S1 announces (D1, S1) but not (D1, S2) ? The first solution would give: (D1, =C2=ACS2) ---. <-- =20 S1 |---------- ---' :/ > This is the reason I have suggested a PATRICIA algorithm or something = like it that looks up both addresses at the same time. I should have missed the reference. Could you please resend? I guess = you first complete tables and then do the lookup, right? Thanks, Matthieu From nobody Sat Jul 29 16:31:05 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B89512942F for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id na_RmGoCFUN4 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi0-x244.google.com (mail-oi0-x244.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::244]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 20EFD127601 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi0-x244.google.com with SMTP id s21so15869001oie.5 for ; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=A9Q9v26TCupK7xFPJEIBfO9YcdgCoZ0JNQqw9VPQKjw=; b=ZfXgxgK5IjrAKycDwDicJEMI+lrRFqnrr6uvxpvDmKQZuBn8vumNPIlkufldamhwXO vD1y6DW2I0Ay75WoCNeHKFXiFeVmNrgISbsAnniuqiuYC+u94bKTsU5PaAVDsHTDu8bN fITOBtbcv47U334VBzwOH6RIeDk4HUpK8m8lz370gybjW6sjJeB67O8/gV172hRQTI0T QaAsmXyvnZzRsozKrO5FZZR+Wo/j/mT/0I2FBnS9BwuZlopUiGyVvIEwXtLf5HX/vSLx jpoBkgXxkjt17ewrvq57YM9Q5oNmoRDTzt+ddqdJmTASnxCK4QahpqvhYgI7PEkf98+T hCdw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=A9Q9v26TCupK7xFPJEIBfO9YcdgCoZ0JNQqw9VPQKjw=; b=SFdxvodPPN+fzR3A4Keypuq0iHzGoqDc5ZG0F7C8w5xBQB9D5A4Tt5Mr8HauqPZ76F UFlUV9zxFS6BGvh7pbl+hWtqqC1n7/3biLHaNPzCH1dXxmlq5rPzRfEpkye48Ek0XjZG CBKhSi7J7GTR8lCexa11VErfuwK2rL6mZ0Y9vD4scr1sSFGIVh6sLrRhy83uoIdL4c2f rEKIrtXND/hGAQkyKEy5FCcYF3uwe6I8p9ciCJTXlXpSy5TDTLai7UJk1GgiFtiaI69z cj80NERhugWcvd3Xgsw7/6l+4lVtMUCqNbjMOONoZQQSrI61n740KuvGhbNZhapr0v55 hwxQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw110sNGgLRyDql8p8hKKIeyJWSrq9u5J3kLnd8XQXnDeKmHvGXa8p phiFli9WsIOJ/w== X-Received: by 10.202.166.196 with SMTP id t65mr13149336oij.63.1501371061587; Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2600:8802:5600:1e::13a4? ([2600:8802:5600:1e::13a4]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g3sm22457959oif.21.2017.07.29.16.30.59 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:31:00 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.0 \(3441.0.1\)) Subject: Re: Persistent loops when mixing rtgwg-enterprise-pa-multihoming and rtgwg-dst-src-routing From: Fred Baker In-Reply-To: <1DA4E10A-A73E-4B1D-B527-6825EA47AEFF@irif.fr> Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2017 16:30:59 -0700 Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Anton Smirnov , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <22C01357-92DA-43CE-A2E4-5AE2D3A68DAD@gmail.com> References: <20170719172913.GU773745@eidolon> <670146D0-A26A-4AA5-AC6C-253B81271C12@gmail.com> <1DA4E10A-A73E-4B1D-B527-6825EA47AEFF@irif.fr> To: Matthieu Boutier X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3441.0.1) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2017 23:31:03 -0000 > On Jul 29, 2017, at 1:46 AM, Matthieu Boutier wrote: >=20 >> Actually, I don't. I can produce cases in which source first gives = the wrong route, and in which destination first gives the wrong route. >=20 > Interesting! (but I'm lost with the example below) >=20 >> The only way I see to make doing either one first *always* gives the = right result is if a small set of routes is duplicated. >=20 > Did you mean: it any cases, the administrator himself will have to > duplicate routes to achieve its goals? If I had meant that I would have said it. I think the set of such FIB = routes would be detected and programmed by the software that writes the = FIB. Let me work through the example for the rest of your email.= From nobody Mon Jul 31 10:01:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57EAD1326B5; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:01:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xVH-8GycAgzo; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:01:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-8.cisco.com (alln-iport-8.cisco.com [173.37.142.95]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BA1281326B2; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:01:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2301; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1501520503; x=1502730103; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:mime-version; bh=8AEn5fw0RN1RUgf3/o7FQ59P4f5RaZ9KiXtBYFQmmCM=; b=O5kOA9v/7/0nyNTvjrNyCWRmuRysEhOLtjCmdwQXHePCzyjzM/tM0OQT g+WiTaRXYiw9T2HXzaecfGq/44JyJ0RZxGdLEAikucjCJMUP6vvEM690L Yc5seJCXEZYH+T+MFWf131zG5954qQfAXg8iELUx1p1tcIuoOMUlboLOv o=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0DdAQDAYX9Z/4cNJK1bGgEBAQECAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QgBAQEBg1pkgRSODY95gUmQfoUvghIshRsChAY/GAECAQEBAQEBAWsohRkGbgs?= =?us-ascii?q?QAgEIBAEfGwcyFBECBAENBYc9gg5kELBci0QBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEYBYMog02CDAuCcYg3gjEFl2GIDgKUJYIMhVKKX5VxAR84gQp3FUkSAYcGdoo?= =?us-ascii?q?vAQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.41,304,1498521600"; d="scan'208,217";a="464177793" Received: from alln-core-2.cisco.com ([173.36.13.135]) by alln-iport-8.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 31 Jul 2017 17:01:43 +0000 Received: from XCH-RCD-004.cisco.com (xch-rcd-004.cisco.com [173.37.102.14]) by alln-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6VH1gkw016654 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:01:43 GMT Received: from xch-aln-002.cisco.com (173.36.7.12) by XCH-RCD-004.cisco.com (173.37.102.14) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1210.3; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:01:42 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-002.cisco.com ([173.36.7.12]) by XCH-ALN-002.cisco.com ([173.36.7.12]) with mapi id 15.00.1210.000; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:01:42 -0500 From: "Alvaro Retana (aretana)" To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "routing-discussion@ietf.org" CC: "rtg-ads@ietf.org" Subject: Re: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Topic: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Index: AQHTBuhlO8jlpLakoECLslHbAbQDf6JuL4wl Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:01:42 +0000 Message-ID: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2589921382D241B28097F0BDE5FF59E7ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:01:45 -0000 --_000_2589921382D241B28097F0BDE5FF59E7ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! I have received several private responses to this effort, all from people w= illing to contribute. :-) To make the discussion easier, I have asked for the creation of a new maili= ng list which is available now! Please subscribe and start the discussion! https://www.ietf.org/mailman/admin/dcrouting Thanks! Alvaro. Thumb-typed and autocorrected.. On Jul 27, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) > wrote: I will be setting up a mailing list in the next couple of days so that we c= an focus the discussion there. --_000_2589921382D241B28097F0BDE5FF59E7ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi!

I have received several private responses to= this effort, all from people willing to contribute. :-)

To make the discussion easier, I have asked = for the creation of a new mailing list which is available now!  Please= subscribe and start the discussion!


Thanks!

Alvaro.

Thumb-typed and autocorrected..

On Jul 27, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) <aretana@cisco.com> wrote:

I will be setting up a mailing list in the next couple of days so that= we can focus the discussion there.
--_000_2589921382D241B28097F0BDE5FF59E7ciscocom_-- From nobody Mon Jul 31 10:04:46 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF9481326C0; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:04:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP 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Jul 2017 12:04:34 -0500 From: "Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)" To: "Alvaro Retana (aretana)" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "routing-discussion@ietf.org" CC: "rtg-ads@ietf.org" Subject: Re: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Topic: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Index: AQHTBuhlO8jlpLakoECLslHbAbQDf6JuL4wlgAARjgA= Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:04:34 +0000 Message-ID: <55F72140-34D2-4B96-9F93-29784DF2B8B6@cisco.com> References: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/f.22.0.170515 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.82.170.201] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_55F7214034D24B969F9329784DF2B8B6ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list 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[149.20.66.228]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 92sm2628361wrr.58.2017.07.31.10.05.05 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:05:06 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.0 \(3441.0.1\)) Subject: Re: Routing in the DC - Next Steps From: Fred Baker In-Reply-To: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:05:02 -0700 Cc: "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "routing-discussion@ietf.org" , "rtg-ads@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> To: "Alvaro Retana (aretana)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3441.0.1) Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:05:20 -0000 > On Jul 31, 2017, at 10:01 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) = wrote: >=20 > Hi! >=20 > I have received several private responses to this effort, all from = people willing to contribute. :-) >=20 > To make the discussion easier, I have asked for the creation of a new = mailing list which is available now! Please subscribe and start the = discussion! >=20 > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/admin/dcrouting Did you mean https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcrouting? :-) > Thanks! >=20 > Alvaro. >=20 > Thumb-typed and autocorrected.. >=20 > On Jul 27, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) = wrote: >=20 >> I will be setting up a mailing list in the next couple of days so = that we can focus the discussion there. > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg From nobody Mon Jul 31 10:06:02 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtgwg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DC2F129B40; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:05:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.521 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.521 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qSPNW1Tst955; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-3.cisco.com (alln-iport-3.cisco.com [173.37.142.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 73C3C1326C4; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 10:05:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3042; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1501520748; x=1502730348; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:mime-version; bh=omstOCAhkMkdYZRBGqRdmpeM4BqGNdqRaVsypK59MU4=; b=DQ7ag6rvzpKuPdSQfcgT719QZtaT6o5PJRoLMJrBg4UcN8lquvy5C8dD EsWCFXtHYBinaeZ/lUR8v1A0UZlBAtVSr1TZM31/z2L2jpDzNNflMNMBF vZ39PQlGMWNKBX1S9K/EABwK7VMN2nA6TFmQkaPTUnrIi49yNZJtqXxil Y=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0DfAQAdY39Z/4QNJK1bGgEBAQECAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QgBAQEBg1pkgRSODY95gUmQfoUvghIhAQqETE8ChAY/GAECAQEBAQEBAWsohRk?= =?us-ascii?q?CAQMBAWwLEAIBCAQgGwcnCxQRAgQBDQWHPYIOZBCwWotEAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBA?= =?us-ascii?q?QEBAQEBAQEBGAWDKINNggwLgnGIN4IxBZdhiA4ClCUMggCFUopflXEBHziBCnc?= =?us-ascii?q?VSRIBhwZ2ii8BAQE?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.41,304,1498521600"; d="scan'208,217";a="463673413" Received: from alln-core-10.cisco.com ([173.36.13.132]) by alln-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 31 Jul 2017 17:05:47 +0000 Received: from XCH-RCD-004.cisco.com (xch-rcd-004.cisco.com [173.37.102.14]) by alln-core-10.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id v6VH5lMj010361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:05:47 GMT Received: from xch-aln-002.cisco.com (173.36.7.12) by XCH-RCD-004.cisco.com (173.37.102.14) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1210.3; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:05:46 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-002.cisco.com ([173.36.7.12]) by XCH-ALN-002.cisco.com ([173.36.7.12]) with mapi id 15.00.1210.000; Mon, 31 Jul 2017 12:05:47 -0500 From: "Alvaro Retana (aretana)" To: "rtgwg@ietf.org" , "routing-discussion@ietf.org" CC: "rtg-ads@ietf.org" Subject: Re: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Topic: Routing in the DC - Next Steps Thread-Index: AQHTBuhlO8jlpLakoECLslHbAbQDf6JuL4wlgAABJO8= Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:05:46 +0000 Message-ID: References: , <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <25899213-82D2-41B2-8097-F0BDE5FF59E7@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_EE0FA0E4149747A69D51F9D0621C5F43ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: X-BeenThere: rtgwg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Routing Area Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2017 17:05:56 -0000 --_000_EE0FA0E4149747A69D51F9D0621C5F43ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sorry, here's the right link: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcrout= ing Thumb-typed and autocorrected.. On Jul 31, 2017, at 12:01 PM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) > wrote: Hi! I have received several private responses to this effort, all from people w= illing to contribute. :-) To make the discussion easier, I have asked for the creation of a new maili= ng list which is available now! Please subscribe and start the discussion! https://www.ietf.org/mailman/admin/dcrouting Thanks! Alvaro. Thumb-typed and autocorrected.. On Jul 27, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) > wrote: I will be setting up a mailing list in the next couple of days so that we c= an focus the discussion there. --_000_EE0FA0E4149747A69D51F9D0621C5F43ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sorry, here's the right link:  https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcrouting


Thumb-typed and autocorrected..
Hi!

I have received several private responses to= this effort, all from people willing to contribute. :-)

To make the discussion easier, I have asked = for the creation of a new mailing list which is available now!  Please= subscribe and start the discussion!


Thanks!

Alvaro.

Thumb-typed and autocorrected..

On Jul 27, 2017, at 9:55 AM, Alvaro Retana (aretana) <aretana@cisco.com> wrote:

I will be setting up a mailing list in the next couple of days so that= we can focus the discussion there.
--_000_EE0FA0E4149747A69D51F9D0621C5F43ciscocom_--