Subject: [Rucus] Any particular reason there was no RUCUS BOF scheduled for Dublin?

From: Dan York <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 11:10:29 -0400

I noticed there is no RUCUS BOF scheduled in Dublin.  I realize there  
are incredible time pressures on the RAI agenda and there are  
challenges getting slots for all groups... was a timeslot for RUCUS  
requested but then denied?  Or was one not requested?

Dan

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From: Hannes Tschofenig <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:14:46 +0300

We had a BOF already. The BOF was successful in the sense that folks in 
the room wanted todo.

Unfortunately, the discussions about the charter so far did not lead to 
anything. I am sue that's going to be fixed.

---

From: Dan York <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 14:25:29 -0400

Hannes,

On Jul 28, 2008, at 11:14 AM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote:

> We had a BOF already. The BOF was successful in the sense that folks  
> in the room wanted todo.

Okay, point taken. Back at IETF 71 we had a BOF to discuss forming an  
Exploratory Group.   Now at IETF 72, it would be logical to have a  
meeting of either the BOF (again) or the Exploratory Group (EG).  
Neither is on the agenda.

> Unfortunately, the discussions about the charter so far did not lead  
> to anything. I am sue that's going to be fixed.

So to summarize... between IETF 71 and now there was no closure on the  
charter and therefore no meeting could be held at IETF 72.

Thanks,
Dan

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From: Hannes Tschofenig <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 21:29:48 +0300

Hi Dan,

> Neither is on the agenda.

It does not make sense to organize a BOF again since the other BOF was 
already successful.

You cannot request a meeting slot if you don't have a group yet. Some of 
us are planning to meet during the meeting. Are you here in Dublin?

> charter and therefore no meeting could be held at IETF 72.
Yep. You have seen the discussions on the list. Very little feedback 
from various people. It seems that many folks are busy with something 
else. Those who have discussed something didn't advance things -- I 
would even argue that they went backwards.

Ciao
Hannes

---

From: Dan York <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:23:33 -0400

Hannes,

On Jul 28, 2008, at 2:29 PM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote:
>> Okay, point taken. Back at IETF 71 we had a BOF to discuss forming  
>> an Exploratory Group.   Now at IETF 72, it would be logical to have  
>> a meeting of either the BOF (again) or the Exploratory Group (EG).  
> It does not make sense to organize a BOF again since the other BOF  
> was already successful.

Well... was the other BOF in fact successful?  Given that no further  
work has taken place?  The RTPSEC "BOF" met for what... 3 IETF meetings?

It doesn't matter, really... the point is that there is no formal  
RUCUS meeting happening at IETF 72.

> You cannot request a meeting slot if you don't have a group yet.  
> Some of us are planning to meet during the meeting. Are you here in  
> Dublin?

I am unfortunately NOT in Dublin but am listening in to streaming  
audio and participating in Jabber chat rooms. (It was when I was  
planning my listening for the week that it dawned on me that there was  
no RUCUS session scheduled.)

>> So to summarize... between IETF 71 and now there was no closure on  
>> the charter and therefore no meeting could be held at IETF 72.
> from various people. It seems that many folks are busy with  
> something else. Those who have discussed something didn't advance  
> things -- I would even argue that they went backwards.

And I am as guilty of that as everyone else as the past few months  
have been insanely busy for me on a variety of work and personal fronts.

It would seem that we need to regroup on-list (and in person for those  
of you there) and put the pieces together so that we can meet at IETF  
73 and move the progress of this group along.

Regards,
Dan

---

From: Hannes Tschofenig <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:35:49 +0300

Hi Dan,

Dan York wrote:
> Well... was the other BOF in fact successful?

Yes. The folks in the room thought that we should do some work in the 
discussed areas.

> Given that no further work has taken place?  The RTPSEC "BOF" met for 
> what... 3 IETF meetings?
I have to check but I believe that there was only one BOF and the rest 
where some discussions attached to other sessions.

> RUCUS meeting happening at IETF 72.
Yep.

>
>> You cannot request a meeting slot if you don't have a group yet. Some 
>> of us are planning to meet during the meeting. Are you here in Dublin?
>
Correct.

> 73 and move the progress of this group along.
We are doing this while we chat.

Ciao
Hannes

---

From: Juergen Quittek <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:23:01 +0200

Dan,

> 73 and move the progress of this group along.

I thin this is the important point.

Yes, there can be more than one BoF for establishing a WG or EG.
However, as Hannes explained already, there is no need for another BoF.
We just need all to work on a charter.

There has been one proposal from Jan, see

    http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rucus/current/msg00261.html
and http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rucus/current/msg00279.html

This may be a starting point for a charter discussion. Alternatively,
everybody is highly welcome to come up with their own charter proposal.

Thanks,

    Juergen