From pierre.levis@orange-ftgroup.com Thu Apr 2 07:57:35 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4CB43A697B; Thu, 2 Apr 2009 07:57:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.048 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.048 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.201, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7tKWuZsqJdrK; Thu, 2 Apr 2009 07:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [195.101.245.16]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6372B3A686A; Thu, 2 Apr 2009 07:57:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ftrdmel1.rd.francetelecom.fr ([10.192.128.40]) by ftrdsmtp2.rd.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 2 Apr 2009 16:58:36 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 16:58:33 +0200 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <986DCE2E44129444B6435ABE8C9E424D02F7E95D@SGSINSMBS02.ad4.ad.alcatel.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [shara] Follow up on Layer2-Aware NAT (draft-miles-behave-l2nat-00) Thread-Index: AcmgdlhcsqF9XOaRSFmUv5LfTG7d5QAAEU/wA2dPQ2AASTlpgAEaJr3w References: <986DCE2E44129444B6435ABE8C9E424D02D5CE0A@SGSINSMBS02.ad4.ad.alcatel.com> <986DCE2E44129444B6435ABE8C9E424D02F7E95D@SGSINSMBS02.ad4.ad.alcatel.com> From: To: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Apr 2009 14:58:36.0302 (UTC) FILETIME=[7FDD4AE0:01C9B3A3] Subject: Re: [shara] Follow up on Layer2-Aware NAT (draft-miles-behave-l2nat-00) X-BeenThere: shara@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Sharing of an IPv4 Address discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2009 14:57:35 -0000 Hi David, I'm not very convinced on the interest to modelize a PRR as a NAPT = function that would not do any translation. For me it makes the PRR appear as a kind of degenerated NAT, when one of = its main value is to get rid of a CGN function. That said, I agree there is an interest to consider solutions that = integrate both PRR and CGN functions. Pierre -----Message d'origine----- De : MILES DAVID [mailto:David.Miles@alcatel-lucent.com.au]=20 Envoy=E9 : samedi 28 mars 2009 01:27 =C0 : LEVIS Pierre RD-CORE-CAE; behave@ietf.org; shara@ietf.org Objet : RE: [shara] Follow up on Layer2-Aware NAT = (draft-miles-behave-l2nat-00) Pierre, Thanks for the support. The presentation of draft-nishitani-cgn-01 outlined a good way forward - here the Network Model was separated from the core NAT Function. I think a L2-Aware NAT best belongs in a core document like this. In this way L2-Aware NAT could make up an optional component of the core NAT Function (in the way it describes a Virtual NAT [tables] facility). On top of this a variety of network models could be created and documented - these could even come from other working groups (such as Softwires).I believe a core NAT function (regardless of whether we describe IPv4 or IPv6) fits well in BEHAVE.=20 Applying the mechanisms in L2-Aware NAT to PRR makes a lot of sense as well - I'm wondering if port-range solutions could be described (perhaps poorly) as similar to a NAPT mapping function (outside-ip/port to inside-ip/port) however in the case of PRR, the pairs are the same/common - in effect a address/port translation does not occur. What do you think of attempting to describe the PRR function like this? If agreeable I would like to invite the authors of PRR/A+P and CGN drafts to work within the bounds of a new draft that describes a core NAT function (without drawing reference to size or scale) - introducing elements of core NAT function (CGN/LSN) virtual NAPT tables (L2-Aware NAT), and mappings tables where translation is not applied (PRR). Best Regards, -David -----Original Message----- From: shara-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:shara-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of pierre.levis@orange-ftgroup.com Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:17 AM To: behave@ietf.org; shara@ietf.org Subject: [shara] Follow up on Layer2-Aware NAT (draft-miles-behave-l2nat-00) The comment I had on the mike during behave session 2: This kind of work is very valuable, it is worth not only for CGN but also for Port Ranges solutions and for all IPv4 shortage solutions.=20 As we presented it in the shara BoF all solutions basically: 1) Put a dedicated function in an ISP Box (CGN, PRR, whatever) 2) Use some sort of transport mechanism (tunneling, layer 2, whatever) between customers and ISPBox,=20 3) Are confronted with the same issues: how to force a route from customers to ISPBox, how to route back from ISPBox to relevant customer, how to identify the customer.=20 This would advocate for seeing all work related to IPv4 shared addresses host in the same place, under the same ombrella. =20 Regards Pierre _______________________________________________ shara mailing list shara@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/shara From teemu.savolainen@nokia.com Mon Apr 6 02:51:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20D603A6C1A; Mon, 6 Apr 2009 02:51:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.666 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.666 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.133, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_RAND_LETTRS4=0.799] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ubakXnLQpz93; Mon, 6 Apr 2009 02:51:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mgw-mx06.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [192.100.122.233]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FCEE3A6BB4; Mon, 6 Apr 2009 02:50:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh106.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.138.213]) by mgw-mx06.nokia.com (Switch-3.2.6/Switch-3.2.6) with ESMTP id n369pYbD021634; Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:51:50 +0300 Received: from vaebh104.NOE.Nokia.com ([10.160.244.30]) by esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:51:49 +0300 Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.8]) by vaebh104.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 6 Apr 2009 12:51:31 +0300 Received: from NOK-EUMSG-01.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.86]) by nok-am1mhub-04.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.8]) with mapi; Mon, 6 Apr 2009 11:51:31 +0200 From: To: , Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2009 11:50:55 +0200 Thread-Topic: About UPnP IGD:2 and AddAnyPortmapping() Thread-Index: Acm2nS37z1upCJWIQUKkT5Xf8mehGg== Message-ID: <18034D4D7FE9AE48BF19AB1B0EF2729F27F29675A3@NOK-EUMSG-01.mgdnok.nokia.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_18034D4D7FE9AE48BF19AB1B0EF2729F27F29675A3NOKEUMSG01mgd_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Apr 2009 09:51:31.0691 (UTC) FILETIME=[4397C3B0:01C9B69D] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [shara] About UPnP IGD:2 and AddAnyPortmapping() X-BeenThere: shara@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Sharing of an IPv4 Address discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:51:01 -0000 --_000_18034D4D7FE9AE48BF19AB1B0EF2729F27F29675A3NOKEUMSG01mgd_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, There have been comments regarding UPnP IGD:2 during IETF meetings, mailing= list, and in some I-Ds. Please check out this presentation http://www.upnp.org/resources/documents/= UPnPIGD2vsIGD1d10032009.pdf "UPnP Gateway committee: IGD:2 improvements ov= er IGD:1". Best regards, Teemu --_000_18034D4D7FE9AE48BF19AB1B0EF2729F27F29675A3NOKEUMSG01mgd_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
 
There have been comments regarding UPnP IGD:2 during IETF meetings, ma= iling list, and in some I-Ds.
 
Please check out this presentation htt= p://www.upnp.org/resources/documents/UPnPIGD2vsIGD1d10032009.pdf=   "UPnP Gateway committee: IGD:2 improvements over IGD:1".
 
Best regards,
 
        Teemu
 
 --_000_18034D4D7FE9AE48BF19AB1B0EF2729F27F29675A3NOKEUMSG01mgd_-- From bernard_aboba@hotmail.com Sun Apr 12 16:11:17 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: shara@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 626C53A6C3F for ; Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:11:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.957 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.957 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.959, BAYES_50=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id s8XUUInwDWrD for ; Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:11:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.94]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91D8E3A6BAF for ; Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:11:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from BLU137-W16 ([65.55.116.73]) by blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:12:26 -0700 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_d0b8d616-fe42-433e-92f2-2568b2c4b211_" X-Originating-IP: [67.40.176.105] From: Bernard Aboba To: Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2009 16:12:26 -0700 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Apr 2009 23:12:26.0853 (UTC) FILETIME=[252E1150:01C9BBC4] Subject: [shara] Minutes? X-BeenThere: shara@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Sharing of an IPv4 Address discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2009 23:11:17 -0000 --_d0b8d616-fe42-433e-92f2-2568b2c4b211_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Can anyone who took minutes of the SHARA BOF at IETF 74 please forward them= to Marcelo and I? --_d0b8d616-fe42-433e-92f2-2568b2c4b211_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Can anyone who took minutes of the SHARA BOF at IETF 74 please forward them= to Marcelo and I?
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