From ietf-secretariat@ietf.org Wed Nov 13 13:17:29 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5241121E80FF; Wed, 13 Nov 2013 13:17:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.621 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.621 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.021, BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P0iWNgBGNDpI; Wed, 13 Nov 2013 13:17:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8309B21E80C3; Wed, 13 Nov 2013 13:17:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: IETF Secretariat To: IETF Announcement List X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 4.83 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20131113211712.32373.55371.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2013 13:17:12 -0800 Cc: siesta@ietf.org, rgm@labs.htt-consult.com, turners@ieca.com Subject: [siesta] New Non-WG Mailing List: siesta -- SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Reply-To: ietf@ietf.org List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2013 21:17:29 -0000 A new IETF non-working group email list has been created. List address: SIESTA@ietf.org Archive: http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/siesta/ To subscribe: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta Purpose: The present end-to-end application security context is tightly cou= pled with the underlying communication context. This is problematic for at = least three reasons. First, it is not flexible: when the underlying communi= cation context changes, the application security context must change, too. = Second, in certain applications, the overhead associated with such coupling= is prohivitively expensive over constrained networks (such as sensor- or c= ellular networks). Third, and probably most important, an attack on the com= munication context immediately effects the application security. = This work aims at a solution to the above problems, with the objective of p= roviding security context for an application, which is fully decoupled from= the underlying communication methodology and is thus resilient to attacks = on the communication context. With that, the security context may need to h= ave basic understanding of the communication context to be efficient with d= atagram overhead and communication synchronization issues (such as sequence= window management), and so it is desirable that solution supports the "hoo= ks" into the underlying protocol. = For additional information, please contact the list administrators. From rgm@labs.htt-consult.com Thu Nov 14 08:03:03 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 019D011E8175 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:03:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4CHw3LOlt5pE for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:03:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [IPv6:2607:f4b8:3:0:218:71ff:fe83:66b9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F1A111E815B for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:02:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BDF362A6F for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 16:02:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S32xarSr3Qiv for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 11:02:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from lx120e2.htt-consult.com (unknown [216.1.225.2]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@labs.htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id F31FA62A62 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 11:02:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 10:02:47 -0600 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130625 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 16:03:03 -0000 test to see if list works From eburger@standardstrack.com Thu Nov 14 08:15:20 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13F1D11E8158 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:15:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.392 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.392 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.207, BAYES_40=-0.185, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EiJiTz9adbpC for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:15:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from biz104.inmotionhosting.com (biz104.inmotionhosting.com [173.247.247.235]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6262E11E8136 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:15:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from edge.argo.uwf.edu ([143.88.0.215]:49449 helo=[192.168.193.215]) by biz104.inmotionhosting.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VgzZW-0001TI-Cw for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:15:13 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.0 \(1822\)) From: Eric Burger In-Reply-To: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 10:15:04 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> To: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1822) X-OutGoing-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - biz104.inmotionhosting.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - standardstrack.com X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: biz104.inmotionhosting.com: authenticated_id: eburger+standardstrack.com/only user confirmed/virtual account not confirmed X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 16:15:20 -0000 Nobody here but us crickets. On Nov 14, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Robert Moskowitz = wrote: > test to see if list works >=20 > _______________________________________________ > siesta mailing list > siesta@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta From yrz@anche.no Thu Nov 14 08:16:53 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B047211E8141 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:16:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qqu5ifNiZFPy for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:16:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from diserzione.investici.org (diserzione.investici.org [IPv6:2a02:f48:2000:201::19]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94E3F11E8136 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 08:16:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from [82.221.99.153] (diserzione [82.221.99.153]) (Authenticated sender: yrz@autistici.org) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7E8DF18047B for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 16:16:49 +0000 (UTC) X-DKIM: OpenDKIM Filter v2.6.8 diserzione.investici.org 7E8DF18047B DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=anche.no; s=stigmate; t=1384445809; bh=dOIG/U2boFM9ZSa5DbgQEumnNYiODlRwBFNXm2VI3eA=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To; b=eZJnAYdHue3M5smF/OXI9PQgugoDJCds5keaXPpsgeLkIN8PFvuYO+C7VUCtkvJv/ G5LWdz02SFitzSwvvb0mNj8hahlLsNrAILKfw++vTGuqsjFPJERQPpQaJS+YGbUTVD t6IIId2T7f1GMAD5aZbkeGcSU0vXyoU2bC8JJFJY= Message-ID: <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:16:48 +0200 From: Pierpaolo Giacomin User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:10.0.12) Gecko/20130116 Icedove/10.0.12 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> In-Reply-To: <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 16:16:53 -0000 don't worry, it works :) On 11/14/2013 06:15 PM, Eric Burger wrote: > Nobody here but us crickets. > > On Nov 14, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > >> test to see if list works >> >> _______________________________________________ >> siesta mailing list >> siesta@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta > > _______________________________________________ > siesta mailing list > siesta@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta > From diego@tid.es Thu Nov 14 09:40:38 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74A5421E80B6 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:40:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.503 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.503 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.096, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9QpxNEHV8wAL for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:40:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from tidos.tid.es (tidos.tid.es [195.235.93.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AD7521F9A59 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:38:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from sbrightmailg01.hi.inet (sbrightmailg01.hi.inet [10.95.64.104]) by tid.hi.inet (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0MW9009XIL0T4Y@tid.hi.inet> for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:38:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from dequeue_removeroute (tid.hi.inet [10.95.64.10]) by sbrightmailg01.hi.inet (Symantec Messaging Gateway) with SMTP id 02.00.03197.DAA05825; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:38:53 +0100 (CET) Received: from correo.tid.es (mailhost.hi.inet [10.95.64.100]) by tid.hi.inet (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0MW9009XEL0T4Y@tid.hi.inet> for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:38:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from EX10-MB2-MAD.hi.inet ([169.254.2.212]) by EX10-HTCAS7-MAD.hi.inet ([::1]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:38:52 +0100 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 17:38:51 +0000 From: "Diego R. Lopez" In-reply-to: <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> X-Originating-IP: [10.95.64.115] To: Pierpaolo Giacomin Message-id: <7BF99A1A-7D81-47B2-874A-4DE7AA555EB5@tid.es> Content-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-language: en-US Content-transfer-encoding: base64 Accept-Language: en-US, es-ES Thread-topic: [siesta] test Thread-index: AQHO4VMFJl3NgPQKhEe2gniL20f1/5ok1fAAgAAAfACAABbfgA== X-AuditID: 0a5f4068-b7f3e8e000000c7d-b2-52850aad5e3e X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmplkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42Lhinfg0l3L1RpkcK5dwWLq/EPsDoweS5b8 ZApgjOKySUnNySxLLdK3S+DK6N97k6ngG1/F2UvbWBoYj/B1MXJySAiYSPyeuZAdwhaTuHBv PVsXIxeHkMABRokvbX+YQRJCAj8YJS5eNoVIzGSUmNvwnwUkwSKgKtHy4g2YzQZkP2r+DTZJ WEBK4kXjVzCbU0BD4vKVtWwQGxQk/px7DFYvAlR/5tlvRhCbWUBToun2RbB6XgFLiakdT5kh 4mYSt35fZYGIC0r8mHwPyOYAiqtLTJmSC1EiLtHcepMFwlaUmLaoAWwko4CsxLv581khVklL fNnzhA3CdpI48vwCE8Q5AhJL9pxnhrBFJV4+/scK8WM3o0TP7G9sExglZiE5YxaSM2YhnDEL yRmzkJyxgJF1FaNYcVJRZnpGSW5iZk66gaFeRqZeZl5qySZGSNRl7GBcvlPlEKMAB6MSD6/E 9uYgIdbEsuLK3EOMEhzMSiK8F5hag4R4UxIrq1KL8uOLSnNSiw8xMnFwSjUwute/qfp24EoN 04x3NpvYn+44/IErem5y+HE+sf3uaapKVc9zcqZ9uSEt+Frot3xk2LUnSl4pxpblhxfe/8V1 XL/y3uGLdkqmQm4rUxJMJh5J+uLyOJZlsWTy4aebHl771pO/Jv3W7eTmgnVHb5zMKmLmueQh aNThHxsq/XrH7seLv37M8pw4WYmlOCPRUIu5qDgRABI17LKYAgAA References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> Cc: "" Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 17:40:39 -0000 Q2hpcnAsIGNoaXJwLCBjaGlycC4uLg0KDQpPbiAxNCBOb3YgMjAxMywgYXQgMTc6MTYgLCBQaWVy cGFvbG8gR2lhY29taW4gd3JvdGU6DQoNCj4NCj4gZG9uJ3Qgd29ycnksIGl0IHdvcmtzIDopDQo+ DQo+IE9uIDExLzE0LzIwMTMgMDY6MTUgUE0sIEVyaWMgQnVyZ2VyIHdyb3RlOg0KPj4gTm9ib2R5 IGhlcmUgYnV0IHVzIGNyaWNrZXRzLg0KPj4NCj4+IE9uIE5vdiAxNCwgMjAxMywgYXQgMTA6MDIg QU0sIFJvYmVydCBNb3Nrb3dpdHo8cmdtQGxhYnMuaHR0LWNvbnN1bHQuY29tPiAgd3JvdGU6DQo+ Pg0KPj4+IHRlc3QgdG8gc2VlIGlmIGxpc3Qgd29ya3MNCj4+Pg0KPj4+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+Pj4gc2llc3RhIG1haWxpbmcgbGlz dA0KPj4+IHNpZXN0YUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPj4+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4v bGlzdGluZm8vc2llc3RhDQo+Pg0KPj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj4+IHNpZXN0YSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4+IHNpZXN0YUBpZXRmLm9y Zw0KPj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9zaWVzdGENCj4+DQo+ DQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IHNp ZXN0YSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gc2llc3RhQGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYu b3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vc2llc3RhDQoNCg0KLS0NCiJFc3RhIHZleiBubyBmYWxsYXJl bW9zLCBEb2N0b3IgSW5maWVybm8iDQoNCkRyIERpZWdvIFIuIExvcGV6DQpUZWxlZm9uaWNhIEkr RA0KaHR0cDovL3Blb3BsZS50aWQuZXMvZGllZ28ubG9wZXovDQoNCmUtbWFpbDogZGllZ29AdGlk LmVzDQpUZWw6ICAgICszNCA5MTMgMTI5IDA0MQ0KTW9iaWxlOiArMzQgNjgyIDA1MSAwOTENCi0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tDQoNCg0KX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCg0KRXN0ZSBtZW5zYWplIHNlIGRpcmlnZSBleGNsdXNpdmFt ZW50ZSBhIHN1IGRlc3RpbmF0YXJpby4gUHVlZGUgY29uc3VsdGFyIG51ZXN0cmEgcG9sw610aWNh IGRlIGVudsOtbyB5IHJlY2VwY2nDs24gZGUgY29ycmVvIGVsZWN0csOzbmljbyBlbiBlbCBlbmxh Y2Ugc2l0dWFkbyBtw6FzIGFiYWpvLg0KVGhpcyBtZXNzYWdlIGlzIGludGVuZGVkIGV4Y2x1c2l2 ZWx5IGZvciBpdHMgYWRkcmVzc2VlLiBXZSBvbmx5IHNlbmQgYW5kIHJlY2VpdmUgZW1haWwgb24g dGhlIGJhc2lzIG9mIHRoZSB0ZXJtcyBzZXQgb3V0IGF0Og0KaHR0cDovL3d3dy50aWQuZXMvRVMv UEFHSU5BUy9kaXNjbGFpbWVyLmFzcHgNCg== From alessandro@bassiconsulting.eu Thu Nov 14 09:49:15 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2E0921F9DAF for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:49:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.189 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.189 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, RCVD_ILLEGAL_IP=1.908] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xTzrR8+SFne1 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:49:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from m-r1.th.seeweb.it (m-r1.th.seeweb.it [5.144.164.170]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28AD521F9CF7 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 09:49:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from pc2.home (ANice-552-1-161-130.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr [86.203.36.130]) by m-r1.th.seeweb.it (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 56CED20356 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:49:09 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <52850D14.3070800@bassiconsulting.eu> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 18:49:08 +0100 From: Alessandro Bassi User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.8; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130801 Thunderbird/17.0.8 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> <7BF99A1A-7D81-47B2-874A-4DE7AA555EB5@tid.es> In-Reply-To: <7BF99A1A-7D81-47B2-874A-4DE7AA555EB5@tid.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 17:49:15 -0000 ack :) On 11/14/13 6:38 PM, Diego R. Lopez wrote: > Chirp, chirp, chirp... > > On 14 Nov 2013, at 17:16 , Pierpaolo Giacomin wrote: > >> don't worry, it works :) >> >> On 11/14/2013 06:15 PM, Eric Burger wrote: >>> Nobody here but us crickets. >>> >>> On Nov 14, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: >>> >>>> test to see if list works >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> siesta mailing list >>>> siesta@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta >>> _______________________________________________ >>> siesta mailing list >>> siesta@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> siesta mailing list >> siesta@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta > > -- > "Esta vez no fallaremos, Doctor Infierno" > > Dr Diego R. Lopez > Telefonica I+D > http://people.tid.es/diego.lopez/ > > e-mail: diego@tid.es > Tel: +34 913 129 041 > Mobile: +34 682 051 091 > ----------------------------------------- > > > ________________________________ > > Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario. Puede consultar nuestra política de envío y recepción de correo electrónico en el enlace situado más abajo. > This message is intended exclusively for its addressee. We only send and receive email on the basis of the terms set out at: > http://www.tid.es/ES/PAGINAS/disclaimer.aspx > _______________________________________________ > siesta mailing list > siesta@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta From tony@att.com Thu Nov 14 12:57:46 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B83AE11E810D for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 12:57:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.383 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.383 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.216, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UYWfBLRLfWgw for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 12:57:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from flpi406.enaf.ffdc.sbc.com (egssmtp03.att.com [144.160.128.152]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC4721E8096 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 12:57:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from dns.maillennium.att.com (maillennium.att.com [135.25.114.99]) by egssmtp03.att.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id rAEKvUD4001350 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 12:57:32 -0800 Received: from [135.70.25.43] (vpn-135-70-25-43.vpn.west.att.com[135.70.25.43]) by maillennium.att.com (mailgw1) with ESMTP id <20131114205729gw100j0c17e> (Authid: tony); Thu, 14 Nov 2013 20:57:30 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [135.70.25.43] Message-ID: <52853937.2000205@att.com> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 15:57:27 -0500 From: Tony Hansen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.1.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> <7BF99A1A-7D81-47B2-874A-4DE7AA555EB5@tid.es> <52850D14.3070800@bassiconsulting.eu> In-Reply-To: <52850D14.3070800@bassiconsulting.eu> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2013 20:57:47 -0000 Everyone can go back to sleep now On 11/14/2013 12:49 PM, Alessandro Bassi wrote: > ack :) > > On 11/14/13 6:38 PM, Diego R. Lopez wrote: >> Chirp, chirp, chirp... >> >> On 14 Nov 2013, at 17:16 , Pierpaolo Giacomin wrote: >> >>> don't worry, it works :) >>> >>> On 11/14/2013 06:15 PM, Eric Burger wrote: >>>> Nobody here but us crickets. >>>> >>>> On Nov 14, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Robert >>>> Moskowitz wrote: >>>> >>>>> test to see if list works From zhangdacheng@huawei.com Thu Nov 14 21:42:24 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CDEB11E80FA for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 21:42:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5az9IOHyTowp for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 21:42:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF85D21F9AE7 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2013 21:42:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml203-edg.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id AXX45756; Fri, 15 Nov 2013 05:42:17 +0000 (GMT) Received: from LHREML403-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.217) by lhreml203-edg.huawei.com (172.18.7.221) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Fri, 15 Nov 2013 05:41:53 +0000 Received: from NKGEML401-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.32) by lhreml403-hub.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.217) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Fri, 15 Nov 2013 05:42:14 +0000 Received: from NKGEML507-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.6.121]) by nkgeml401-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.32]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Fri, 15 Nov 2013 13:42:07 +0800 From: "Zhangdacheng (Dacheng)" To: Tony Hansen , "siesta@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [siesta] test Thread-Index: AQHO4VMEyUEpHceaQUqkGIL9bEEr1pokYJgAgAAAfACAABbsgIAAAuAAgAA0nYCAARiHgA== Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 05:42:06 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5284F427.80508@labs.htt-consult.com> <5B63FF0B-370D-4FCD-9D3B-8293490DA93C@standardstrack.com> <5284F770.9090005@anche.no> <7BF99A1A-7D81-47B2-874A-4DE7AA555EB5@tid.es> <52850D14.3070800@bassiconsulting.eu> <52853937.2000205@att.com> In-Reply-To: <52853937.2000205@att.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.98.139] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Subject: Re: [siesta] test X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 05:42:24 -0000 ^_^ The list works in China. > -----Original Message----- > From: siesta-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:siesta-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of > Tony Hansen > Sent: Friday, November 15, 2013 4:57 AM > To: siesta@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [siesta] test >=20 > Everyone can go back to sleep now >=20 > On 11/14/2013 12:49 PM, Alessandro Bassi wrote: > > ack :) > > > > On 11/14/13 6:38 PM, Diego R. Lopez wrote: > >> Chirp, chirp, chirp... > >> > >> On 14 Nov 2013, at 17:16 , Pierpaolo Giacomin wrote: > >> > >>> don't worry, it works :) > >>> > >>> On 11/14/2013 06:15 PM, Eric Burger wrote: > >>>> Nobody here but us crickets. > >>>> > >>>> On Nov 14, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Robert > >>>> Moskowitz wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> test to see if list works >=20 > _______________________________________________ > siesta mailing list > siesta@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta From rgm@labs.htt-consult.com Mon Nov 18 13:28:32 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D40D91AE0E1 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 13:28:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.526 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.526 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.525] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MpVOLi5c25uV for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 13:28:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [IPv6:2607:f4b8:3:0:218:71ff:fe83:66b9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45CD41AC7F1 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 13:28:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BCAD62A63 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 21:28:20 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ebost6TCvOIq for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 16:28:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from lx120e2.htt-consult.com (lx120e2.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.155]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@labs.htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 52E5162A5B for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2013 16:28:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <528A8669.5030904@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2013 16:28:09 -0500 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130625 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [siesta] Welcome, problem, and my approach X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2013 21:28:33 -0000 I want to welcome you all to the SIESTA list. I hope to get that siesta in when we finish this little project. Since I can use my naps these days, this means I got to focus for a bit to get the job done. I ask you to give me a hand here so we can get this done and get down to other business. Like that nap. Please feel free to break this longesh post into pieces for your response(s). I wanted to get it all out at once... Now that the standard IETF irreverence is out of the way, here is the problem statement that a few friends here have helped me work out: PROBLEM STATEMENT The present end-to-end application security context is tightly coupled with the underlying communication context. This is problematic for at least three reasons. 1) Not flexible: when the underlying communication context changes, the application security context must change, too. 2) Overhead associated with such coupling is prohibitively expensive over constrained networks (such as sensor or cellular networks). 3) Probably most important: an attack on the communication context immediately effects the application security. I might add that because of 3, an attack that results in system restart, which restarts all communication context, also results in the need to restart security context. GOALS This work aims at a solution to the above problems, with the objective of providing security context and security message format(s) for an application, 1) which is fully decoupled from the underlying communication methodology and is thus resilient to attacks on the communication context. 2) With that, the security context may need to have basic understanding of the communication context to be efficient with datagram overhead and communication synchronization issues (such as sequence window management), and so it is desirable that solution supports the "hooks" into the underlying protocol DIGRESSION I have been in many sidebars comparing my concerns with tools we currently have created within the IETF. I contend that many of these tools fate share with the transport. TLS is strongly tied into the fate of the TCP state. Others are point solutions that, say IEEE 11073, cannot pick up and implement within 11073.20601. Finally, why here? IETF is about networking and a session layer (i.e. messaging) technology seems to be out of scope. To that I have two answers. IETF has many session protocols, starting with this one called SMTP. Here is where the security knowledgeable people congregate. Here is where we can do the job right and provide a tool for other organizations to run with. So now on to what I have seen as a way to accomplish this. MAILING LIST WORK ITEMS Define an envelope that will provide security protection for any message. As you will see, conflicting environments has led me to define 3 formats, and I see a forth lurking around the corner. Define how existing Key Management Protocols (e.g. IKE and HIP) will create the necessary security state and keys. And in fact, what is needed in terms of Security Associations at the session level and where does a Security Policy Database live in this context. I will add that it is up to the KMPs to create security context that will protect from MITM and other attacks, and to provide support for multi-player applications (e..g over multicast communications) as well as the more common two-party communications. Define the session security machine that will live within a proper security boundry where the well defined session security state machine lives, accessed by a well defined API. With all the North-bound and South-bound software interface models I have seen of late, one might see this as a set of east and west bound interfaces with the KMP machine on one side and the communicating application on the other. OTHER DISSCUSION POINTS I have been asked about exposed, but authenticated message header formats. For example a communicating application over HTTP. I see this as a research issue as to whether the Additional Authenticated Data approach can be applied, resulting in some more formats. Though what little I understand of HTTP, I don't see this working for HTTP imbedded applications. Rather only their messages can be protect in this model. What about mid-box awareness and exposed, but authenticated type information? First the Session Security Envelope (SSE, there I have named what I have been working on) format will be negotiated by the KMP just like they do for cipher suites and the like. So the participating communicating application know which format is used and thus how to process it. Any type information in a control byte(s) is for the benefit of outsiders. Since there is no protocol processing here, what for? I don't see it. I was given the case of extensiblity that ESP faced wrt WRAP. But with the 'ability' to define a new format and negotiate it within the KMP, I see this as a better approach than guessing what is needed for future extensibility. But I am open to being convinced. The state machine/SSE service is a critical component in that it has to be complete, and secure. So do I have all the states, and can we well define the information passed between the communicating application and the SSE service and the SSE service and the KMP service. So moving on. ENVELOPE FORMATS and CIPHERSUITES I have defined 3 SSE formats that vary based on the Envelope Length and the Sequence number sizes: SPI (32 bits, to be consistant with existing KMPs) Envelope Length (12 or 32 bits; 12 for constrained use) Sequence number (20, 32, or 64 bits; note: this is the explicit size, the implicit size is 64 or 128 bits.) Cryptotext (n bytes) ICV (8 or 16 bytes) The defined cipher suites are: AES with CCM, CMAC, GCM, or GMAC with either 8 or 16 byte ICV. I can see the free-for-all that has occured in general with KMPs of defining for every cipher that MAY be used by someone. Afterall, should we really trust AES and is it really the best (forget that it is built into MOST sensor hardware these days). And NIST may actually approve a stream cipher... There is a lurking fourth format to work with Dave McGrew's new AERO cipher or any other similar cipher for highly constrained communication channels. This is for future work. Unless there is already a recognized cipher of this sort. KMP NEGOTIATION I invision the KMPs negotiating SSE in a single parameter that has two values: format and cipher suite. The combined values into a single parameter is to save on message length for constrained environments. Again I am open on this point. The KMP authors will address this. What are the 'selectors' for the Security Policy Database (SPD). Does the SPD 'live' in the KMP or SSE service, or in the Communicating Application? I think the SA(s) are in the SSE service. What else is need here? SSE SERVICE/STATE MACHINE The states I have defined are: Start – call the KMP with the session identities and get the SPIs, key hierarchies, and ciphersuite Key refresh – on seq # consumption, call the KMP for fresh keys Secure – secure the message Reveal – decrypt and/or authenticate the message Teardown – tear down the security context State machine needs to handle responder Security setup and state loss recovery (e.g. after reboot) Some method is needed to connect a start or rekey with new SPIs to the SSE application that will use it. This could be internal to the KMP or KMP run over the eventual application port before any messages. SECURITY SURVIVABILITY This is important, but needs to be expressed carefully. Knocking over a server has to become uninteresting in a security sense. Time to restart or battery cost to restart are concerns. How best to achieve this? How to recommend best practice (eg how to use an HSM). Can hot standby work? Can security state be replicated across a group of servers? Securely? How tightly does seq# updates need to occur? Or is some form of multicast better? Definitely some intersting work here. THE PLAN Put together a writing team. I have a couple volunteers for writing an SSE draft. I will be contacting them tomorrow. If you are interested in helping with the writing, let me know. Also there needs to be specific KMP drafts and authors are needed for them. And of course discussion here is always welcomed and SHOULD help focus on what to include, or not, in the documents. Well this is a start. Thank you for joining. From eburger@standardstrack.com Thu Nov 28 03:37:46 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A6071AE02A for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 03:37:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.578 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.578 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QgYG79lG4X-l for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 03:37:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from biz104.inmotionhosting.com (biz104.inmotionhosting.com [74.124.215.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B49B1ADF5B for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 03:37:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ip68-100-74-215.dc.dc.cox.net ([68.100.74.215]:57751 helo=[192.168.15.104]) by biz104.inmotionhosting.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1Vlzui-0007wm-4Q for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 03:37:44 -0800 From: Eric Burger Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_57A24FF1-F852-4AF6-B664-88F058868A87"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.0 \(1822\)) Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 06:37:39 -0500 References: <528A8669.5030904@labs.htt-consult.com> To: siesta@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <528A8669.5030904@labs.htt-consult.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1822) X-OutGoing-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - biz104.inmotionhosting.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - standardstrack.com X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: biz104.inmotionhosting.com: authenticated_id: eburger+standardstrack.com/only user confirmed/virtual account not confirmed X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: Re: [siesta] Welcome, problem, and my approach X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 11:37:46 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_57A24FF1-F852-4AF6-B664-88F058868A87 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Seems like siesta is taking a siesta. --Apple-Mail=_57A24FF1-F852-4AF6-B664-88F058868A87 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - http://gpgtools.org iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJSlysEAAoJEDY/T2tCIPW3YvkP/3acCNpW2u5WhAlcq13qf6Kh 801jn4hhGstAJ/vBxYSTXO8t+NgzPw4oMDwZ/EktVURIjWjGB2Nu36csOkzDBoFV LufhMP78S7xircEBD05RqkjobtUncURs+MQ12BzEDH4Ewms5D06xQ4gnR10VlURa jZUxg8lz8ZRvsyL7+hcml6zrSUX2+iZn8mF/eimJrygzovoOnCVSJauYC5EL/Jrd YVqR8nypFfpviREFzN4/9olqVIOJTmQF8x78f6l+KRvm5W+NJYN7dMHvrsdjuTgK hoP1+7lRlJJ6nxWPBR7k++cu4W4zit9bse5yiNgCvGvvtGg3B3wvDl2lQxJg18xD 10Ffd6tan7PDjFRnNm7PsDWI5WWeR6XlFDuWq6oFm43YVhr19PHxRUuvYblis12Q JOOvtpa3qZGmK8CxbMNrN+DmiZjZDel6jVcaGFEpXm1BE6qGyJuAKgdcwdlKWVcy dU/piCMhW0bCC5PFYnMsinIPMjHou9ObhsUaBDSJjgD4+borFQpbp6QMWarcPx6C TRXZ7KfrskC0koiaa6EKSbzuucyT5L3wSA0E6lU42ZuSZD5uvG8KRIQV0vAQpowk mog/GOD1oxwVwdPDoG8mzXXodhvWrPiSgiZevM+b1NF3/pkTX2UIuX9WhVRZkWzy I8W0Dh7VkZfFG0dwTALc =q+IC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_57A24FF1-F852-4AF6-B664-88F058868A87-- From rgm@labs.htt-consult.com Thu Nov 28 04:38:00 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EFD71AE0B0 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 04:38:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mQMg6ls-aont for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 04:37:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [IPv6:2607:f4b8:3:0:218:71ff:fe83:66b9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF44B1AD698 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 04:37:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E20B62A60; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 12:37:56 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 81l-bmgU4PBM; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:37:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from lx120e2.htt-consult.com (lx120e2.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.155]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@labs.htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id E589062A7A; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:37:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <52973918.9040706@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:37:44 -0500 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130625 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eric Burger References: <528A8669.5030904@labs.htt-consult.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: siesta@ietf.org Subject: Re: [siesta] Welcome, problem, and my approach X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 12:38:00 -0000 On 11/28/2013 06:37 AM, Eric Burger wrote: > Seems like siesta is taking a siesta. Actually not. I now have a team of writers: Pierpaolo Giacomin Igor Faynberg Hui-Lan Lu Sue Hares We have decided on two documents, or perhaps three: An architecture document that will be more Siesta like. Usages cases. This is more a throw-away document, as is typical to show why this effort is being done. SSE (Session Security Envelope) document. We have the beginning of an outline for each, a git server to share the writing from, and initial writing assignments. Over the next week, we will see what we can put together. More on this Monday. It is over the river and through the woods for this Grandpa (and of course Grandma) to see the grandkids (well 4 of the grandsons) in Baltimore. Their parents are just extras :) From rgm@labs.htt-consult.com Thu Nov 28 05:03:22 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A3661ADF50 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 05:03:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id C6IKhrUsVK-b for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 05:03:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [IPv6:2607:f4b8:3:0:218:71ff:fe83:66b9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63DE71ACCF0 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 05:03:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B9762A70 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 13:03:17 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lkp13k+RzZ5W for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 08:03:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from lx120e2.htt-consult.com (lx120e2.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.155]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@labs.htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 909E862A63 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 08:03:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <52973F0B.6080900@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 08:03:07 -0500 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130625 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: siesta@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [siesta] Eastbound - Westbound X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 13:03:22 -0000 I *think* I have coined a new terminology that I have clearly stolen from others that talk about a southbound and northbound set of interfaces (e.g. Openflow). A Siesta-like process, like my SSE, sits in user space next to a communicating application, performing the necessary session level security functions. This SSE process MUST follow all the current Best Practices on maintaining a proper security boundary. But SSE does not do the key management; next to it is a KMP also sitting in user space. So to the east of SSE is the communicting application that is using its security services. To the west of SSE is a KMP which actually manages the security state for SSE. So unless someone else can point me to somewhere else where East/West bound interfaces and APIs are named as such... Or is the app to the west and KMP to the east? Sheesh, I got to finish packing and get on the road already!! ;)' From diego@tid.es Thu Nov 28 07:20:34 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A53E1AE155 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:20:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.202 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.202 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1RXG4hiHoPON for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:20:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from tidos.tid.es (tidos.tid.es [195.235.93.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E75731AE169 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 07:20:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from sbrightmailg01.hi.inet (sbrightmailg01.hi.inet [10.95.64.104]) by tid.hi.inet (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0MWZ0084BBY561@tid.hi.inet> for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 16:20:29 +0100 (MET) Received: from dequeue_removeroute (tid.hi.inet [10.95.64.10]) by sbrightmailg01.hi.inet (Symantec Messaging Gateway) with SMTP id AF.73.03314.D3F57925; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 16:20:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from correo.tid.es (mailhost.hi.inet [10.95.64.100]) by tid.hi.inet (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0MWZ00846BY561@tid.hi.inet> for siesta@ietf.org; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 16:20:29 +0100 (MET) Received: from EX10-MB1-MAD.hi.inet ([169.254.1.96]) by EX10-HTCAS5-MAD.hi.inet ([::1]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 16:20:28 +0100 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 15:20:28 +0000 From: "Diego R. Lopez" In-reply-to: <52973F0B.6080900@labs.htt-consult.com> X-Originating-IP: [10.95.64.115] To: Robert Moskowitz Message-id: <79062E4D-BE01-4E6C-AFA5-063B8D9C66E9@tid.es> Content-id: <3282FE0D1DDDBE4EB8B2B3F48ACCF8F5@hi.inet> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-language: en-US Content-transfer-encoding: base64 Accept-Language: en-US, es-ES Thread-topic: [siesta] Eastbound - Westbound Thread-index: AQHO7Do5E7ShrewgbEqfsspVXkTZWpo6sYWA X-AuditID: 0a5f4068-b7fe58e000000cf2-57-52975f3d3b7e X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmpkkeLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42Lhinfg0rWNnx5ksKVd3WLq/EPsDoweS5b8 ZApgjOKySUnNySxLLdK3S+DKuLnuClPBG7GKjru8DYwLxLoYOTgkBEwknm2L7GLkBDLFJC7c W8/WxcjFISRwgFFi96ZjLBDOD0aJrv8/mSCcaYwST84/ZQFpYRFQlbh4/jE7iM0GZD9q/g1m CwtoS9xseMkKYnMCbfh4fzkLxAoFiT/nHoPZIgL6ErsfT2cDsZkFNCWabl8E6+UVsJRY+3IZ E8h1zAJmEnPviEKEBSV+TL7HAhFWl5gyJReiU1yiufUmC4StKDFtUQMjiM0oICvxbv58VohN OhLXfv9ig7CNJM7c+MsIcY2AxJI955khbFGJl4//gdULCRhLtE6YxDqBUWIWwhGzkBwxC+GI WUiOmIXkiAWMrKsYxYqTijLTM0pyEzNz0g0M9TIy9TLzUks2MUKiLWMH4/KdKocYBTgYlXh4 L5hPCxJiTSwrrsw9xCjBwawkwmsROj1IiDclsbIqtSg/vqg0J7X4ECMTB6dUA2Pl5I8ylrEp JtwqvIWMTge109OnyplpVz+7HHpJfco815+GTZ8Ueq40J++7cOnGX+HnfX+27+qcc/b2++Wd E9aK3jy9katIZYmilaSL/8rz0YX7Jv0VnbjFo9iruGr2Kw+Nt+8NTmRsLUtXe3XZrY3lx7+D BzRMS6f8PD+fd+V8fRVd5qkZ89iUWIozEg21mIuKEwHFXoX+lAIAAA== References: <52973F0B.6080900@labs.htt-consult.com> Cc: "" Subject: Re: [siesta] Eastbound - Westbound X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 15:20:34 -0000 SGksDQoNCkkgdGVuZCB0byBpbWFnaW5lIHRoZSBLTVAgdG8gdGhlIFdlc3QgYW5kIHRoZSBhcHBs aWNhdGlvbiB0byB0aGUgRWFzdCwganVzdCBiZWNhdXNlIG9mIHRoZSBsZWZ0LXRvLXJpZ2h0IG9y ZGVyIGZvciB0aGUgZWxlbWVudHMgaW4gYSBub3JtYWwgZXhjaGFuZ2UuDQoNCkFuZCBJIGhhdmUg ZW1wbG95ZWQgdGhpcyBzaW1pbGFyIGlkZWEgb2YgdGhlICJFYXN0L1dlc3QtYm91bmQiIGludGVy ZmFjZSB3aGVuIHRhbGtpbmcgYWJvdXQgU0ROIGNvbnRyb2xsZXIgaW50ZXJjb25uZWN0aW9uIChh Y3R1YWxseSwgSSBhbHdheXMgdXNlZCAiRWFzdGJvdW5kIiBiZWNhdXNlIG9mIHRoZSBhYm92ZSBp ZGVhIG9uIG9yZGVyKQ0KDQpCZSBnb29kZSwNCg0KT24gMjggTm92IDIwMTMsIGF0IDE0OjAzICwg Um9iZXJ0IE1vc2tvd2l0eiB3cm90ZToNCg0KPiBJICp0aGluayogSSBoYXZlIGNvaW5lZCBhIG5l dyB0ZXJtaW5vbG9neSB0aGF0IEkgaGF2ZSBjbGVhcmx5IHN0b2xlbiBmcm9tIG90aGVycyB0aGF0 IHRhbGsgYWJvdXQgYSBzb3V0aGJvdW5kIGFuZCBub3J0aGJvdW5kIHNldCBvZiBpbnRlcmZhY2Vz IChlLmcuIE9wZW5mbG93KS4NCj4NCj4gQSBTaWVzdGEtbGlrZSBwcm9jZXNzLCBsaWtlIG15IFNT RSwgc2l0cyBpbiB1c2VyIHNwYWNlIG5leHQgdG8gYSBjb21tdW5pY2F0aW5nIGFwcGxpY2F0aW9u LCBwZXJmb3JtaW5nIHRoZSBuZWNlc3Nhcnkgc2Vzc2lvbiBsZXZlbCBzZWN1cml0eSBmdW5jdGlv bnMuICBUaGlzIFNTRSBwcm9jZXNzIE1VU1QgZm9sbG93IGFsbCB0aGUgY3VycmVudCBCZXN0IFBy YWN0aWNlcyBvbiBtYWludGFpbmluZyBhIHByb3BlciBzZWN1cml0eSBib3VuZGFyeS4gIEJ1dCBT U0UgZG9lcyBub3QgZG8gdGhlIGtleSBtYW5hZ2VtZW50OyBuZXh0IHRvIGl0IGlzIGEgS01QIGFs c28gc2l0dGluZyBpbiB1c2VyIHNwYWNlLg0KPg0KPiBTbyB0byB0aGUgZWFzdCBvZiBTU0UgaXMg dGhlIGNvbW11bmljdGluZyBhcHBsaWNhdGlvbiB0aGF0IGlzIHVzaW5nIGl0cyBzZWN1cml0eSBz ZXJ2aWNlcy4gIFRvIHRoZSB3ZXN0IG9mIFNTRSBpcyBhIEtNUCB3aGljaCBhY3R1YWxseSBtYW5h Z2VzIHRoZSBzZWN1cml0eSBzdGF0ZSBmb3IgU1NFLg0KPg0KPiBTbyB1bmxlc3Mgc29tZW9uZSBl bHNlIGNhbiBwb2ludCBtZSB0byBzb21ld2hlcmUgZWxzZSB3aGVyZSBFYXN0L1dlc3QgYm91bmQg aW50ZXJmYWNlcyBhbmQgQVBJcyBhcmUgbmFtZWQgYXMgc3VjaC4uLg0KPg0KPiBPciBpcyB0aGUg YXBwIHRvIHRoZSB3ZXN0IGFuZCBLTVAgdG8gdGhlIGVhc3Q/DQo+DQo+IFNoZWVzaCwgSSBnb3Qg dG8gZmluaXNoIHBhY2tpbmcgYW5kIGdldCBvbiB0aGUgcm9hZCBhbHJlYWR5ISEgIDspJw0KPg0K Pg0KPiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBz aWVzdGEgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IHNpZXN0YUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRm Lm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL3NpZXN0YQ0KDQoNCi0tDQoiRXN0YSB2ZXogbm8gZmFsbGFy ZW1vcywgRG9jdG9yIEluZmllcm5vIg0KDQpEciBEaWVnbyBSLiBMb3Bleg0KVGVsZWZvbmljYSBJ K0QNCmh0dHA6Ly9wZW9wbGUudGlkLmVzL2RpZWdvLmxvcGV6Lw0KDQplLW1haWw6IGRpZWdvQHRp ZC5lcw0KVGVsOiAgICArMzQgOTEzIDEyOSAwNDENCk1vYmlsZTogKzM0IDY4MiAwNTEgMDkxDQot LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLQ0KDQoNCl9fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQoNCkVzdGUgbWVuc2FqZSBzZSBkaXJpZ2UgZXhjbHVzaXZh bWVudGUgYSBzdSBkZXN0aW5hdGFyaW8uIFB1ZWRlIGNvbnN1bHRhciBudWVzdHJhIHBvbMOtdGlj YSBkZSBlbnbDrW8geSByZWNlcGNpw7NuIGRlIGNvcnJlbyBlbGVjdHLDs25pY28gZW4gZWwgZW5s YWNlIHNpdHVhZG8gbcOhcyBhYmFqby4NClRoaXMgbWVzc2FnZSBpcyBpbnRlbmRlZCBleGNsdXNp dmVseSBmb3IgaXRzIGFkZHJlc3NlZS4gV2Ugb25seSBzZW5kIGFuZCByZWNlaXZlIGVtYWlsIG9u IHRoZSBiYXNpcyBvZiB0aGUgdGVybXMgc2V0IG91dCBhdDoNCmh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGlkLmVzL0VT L1BBR0lOQVMvZGlzY2xhaW1lci5hc3B4DQo= From rgm@labs.htt-consult.com Fri Nov 29 06:59:27 2013 Return-Path: X-Original-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: siesta@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A92F11AD8CD for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 06:59:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CV5rfXVhrsuM for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 06:59:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [IPv6:2607:f4b8:3:0:218:71ff:fe83:66b9]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98B7C1AD6BF for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 06:59:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EBE062A7B; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 14:59:21 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OspFpKcGU9xr; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 09:59:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from lx120e2.htt-consult.com (106.sub-70-208-161.myvzw.com [70.208.161.106]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@labs.htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 1972C62A62; Fri, 29 Nov 2013 09:59:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5298ABB8.4000404@labs.htt-consult.com> Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 09:59:04 -0500 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130625 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Diego R. Lopez" References: <52973F0B.6080900@labs.htt-consult.com> <79062E4D-BE01-4E6C-AFA5-063B8D9C66E9@tid.es> In-Reply-To: <79062E4D-BE01-4E6C-AFA5-063B8D9C66E9@tid.es> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------050408090505040100000407" Cc: "" Subject: Re: [siesta] Eastbound - Westbound X-BeenThere: siesta@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "SessIon layEr SecuriTy Approach discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 14:59:27 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050408090505040100000407 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 11/28/2013 10:20 AM, Diego R. Lopez wrote: > Hi, > > I tend to imagine the KMP to the West and the application to the East, just because of the left-to-right order for the elements in a normal exchange. Kind of what I thought as well. Great minds think alike! > And I have employed this similar idea of the "East/West-bound" interface when talking about SDN controller interconnection (actually, I always used "Eastbound" because of the above idea on order) Sigh. Thought it would be obvious. East/West that is. But that means the 'coin' is out there so others will understand what we are refering to. > Be goode, Got 4 grandsons (6 yrs, 3 yrs, 2 yrs, 6 mos) here to enjoy and two sets of parents to take care of the messy diapers! > > On 28 Nov 2013, at 14:03 , Robert Moskowitz wrote: > >> I *think* I have coined a new terminology that I have clearly stolen from others that talk about a southbound and northbound set of interfaces (e.g. Openflow). >> >> A Siesta-like process, like my SSE, sits in user space next to a communicating application, performing the necessary session level security functions. This SSE process MUST follow all the current Best Practices on maintaining a proper security boundary. But SSE does not do the key management; next to it is a KMP also sitting in user space. >> >> So to the east of SSE is the communicting application that is using its security services. To the west of SSE is a KMP which actually manages the security state for SSE. >> >> So unless someone else can point me to somewhere else where East/West bound interfaces and APIs are named as such... >> >> Or is the app to the west and KMP to the east? >> >> Sheesh, I got to finish packing and get on the road already!! ;)' >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> siesta mailing list >> siesta@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta > > -- > "Esta vez no fallaremos, Doctor Infierno" > > Dr Diego R. Lopez > Telefonica I+D > http://people.tid.es/diego.lopez/ > > e-mail: diego@tid.es > Tel: +34 913 129 041 > Mobile: +34 682 051 091 > ----------------------------------------- > > > ________________________________ > > Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario. Puede consultar nuestra política de envío y recepción de correo electrónico en el enlace situado más abajo. > This message is intended exclusively for its addressee. We only send and receive email on the basis of the terms set out at: > http://www.tid.es/ES/PAGINAS/disclaimer.aspx > _______________________________________________ > siesta mailing list > siesta@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta -- Standard Robert Moskowitz Senior Technical Advisor Security & Standards Verizon Business Systems C:248-928-6233 F:248-968-2824 E:robert.moskowitz@verizon.com There's no limit to what can be accomplished if it doesn't matter who gets the credit --------------050408090505040100000407 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
On 11/28/2013 10:20 AM, Diego R. Lopez wrote:
Hi,

I tend to imagine the KMP to the West and the application to the East, just because of the left-to-right order for the elements in a normal exchange.

Kind of what I thought as well.  Great minds think alike!

And I have employed this similar idea of the "East/West-bound" interface when talking about SDN controller interconnection (actually, I always used "Eastbound" because of the above idea on order)

Sigh.  Thought it would be obvious.  East/West that is.  But that means the 'coin' is out there so others will understand what we are refering to.

Be goode,

Got 4 grandsons (6 yrs, 3 yrs, 2 yrs, 6 mos) here to enjoy and two sets of parents to take care of the messy diapers!


On 28 Nov 2013, at 14:03 , Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I *think* I have coined a new terminology that I have clearly stolen from others that talk about a southbound and northbound set of interfaces (e.g. Openflow).

A Siesta-like process, like my SSE, sits in user space next to a communicating application, performing the necessary session level security functions.  This SSE process MUST follow all the current Best Practices on maintaining a proper security boundary.  But SSE does not do the key management; next to it is a KMP also sitting in user space.

So to the east of SSE is the communicting application that is using its security services.  To the west of SSE is a KMP which actually manages the security state for SSE.

So unless someone else can point me to somewhere else where East/West bound interfaces and APIs are named as such...

Or is the app to the west and KMP to the east?

Sheesh, I got to finish packing and get on the road already!!  ;)'


_______________________________________________
siesta mailing list
siesta@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta


--
"Esta vez no fallaremos, Doctor Infierno"

Dr Diego R. Lopez
Telefonica I+D
http://people.tid.es/diego.lopez/

e-mail: diego@tid.es
Tel:    +34 913 129 041
Mobile: +34 682 051 091
-----------------------------------------


________________________________

Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario. Puede consultar nuestra política de envío y recepción de correo electrónico en el enlace situado más abajo.
This message is intended exclusively for its addressee. We only send and receive email on the basis of the terms set out at:
http://www.tid.es/ES/PAGINAS/disclaimer.aspx
_______________________________________________
siesta mailing list
siesta@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/siesta

--
Standard Robert Moskowitz
Senior Technical Advisor
Security & Standards
Verizon Business Systems
C:      248-928-6233
F:      248-968-2824
E:      robert.moskowitz@verizon.com

There's no limit to what can be accomplished if it doesn't matter who gets the credit
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