Subject: [Simple] RE: Guidelines for IM Sessions

From: "Peterson, Jon" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 03:05:27 -0600

On the first question, while I imagine "integration" would need to be
elaborated a bit, I think a general requirement along these lines is
appropriate for the SIMPLE WG - but I'm not immediately sure how it factors
in with the topic of this particular draft, which largely concerns
congestional control and the effects of intermediaries on the transport of
messages. A small amount of effort has been made in the draft to generalize
these problems to be applicable other IM efforts than SIMPLE - I don't think
that multimedia integration is necessarily an appropriate requirement for
all IM systems.

The second question is more complicated. There are no doubt a number of
potential congestion control issues that must be considered in a presence
system. Of especial interest in SIMPLE are matters concerning how well
networks using the SIP events mechanism will scale, for example how
frequently signaling traffic (like NOTIFYs) should go directly end-to-end
rather than through intermediaries, and so forth. The draft that Allison and
I wrote arose because a new model for IM (this chat/session model in
contrast to the paging model) had developed in the WG - a situation where
new protocols were being proposed, or existing protocols applied to new
architectures, and Allison felt that some guidelines were in order. For the
presence case, though, the properties of SIP as a signaling protocol (as it
would apply to the SIP events mechanism) with regards to congestion control
are comparatively well understood and have been worked into the charter from
the start of this WG. If any issues with the scalability of the SIP events
mechanism are uncovered in the exploration of the presence event package,
these issues would probably best be raised in the SIP WG. So in short, I see
no immediate need for a draft on the subject - but you are definitely
correct that we need to be mindful of the implications of congestion and
intermediaries to the presence work.

Jon Peterson
NeuStar, Inc.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roy, Radhika R, ALCTA [mailto:[email-masked]]
> Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 12:35 PM
> To: [email-masked]; [email-masked]
> Cc: simple
> Subject: I-D: Guidelines for IM Sessions
> 
> 
> Hi, Allison and Jon:
>  
> The draft for "Guidelines for IM and Presence
> <draft-mankin-im-session-guide-00.txt> is an excellent one. 
> It provides us
> clear pictures how the standards need to be developed and 
> what issues need
> to be addressed that are not usually apparent to many of us. 
>  
> I have two requests as follows:
>  
> 1. Can we include a statement in "Normative Guidelines" 
> section that IM
> sessions can also be integrated with audio and/or video 
> sessions (or similar
> statement), if needed?
>  
> 2. Can we expect a similar draft for "Presence" as well?
>  
> Best regards,
>  
> Radhika R. Roy
> [email-masked] <mailto:[email-masked]> 
> 
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---

From: "Roy, Radhika R, ALCTA" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 10:45:53 -0500

Hi, Jon:

I agree with you. I do not know whether I have been clear in explaining my
points.

Let me try again:

1. IM and Audio/Video Session Model in SIP

We have audio/video session model in SIP.

Now we have IM session model using SIP. (We know that the paging model is a
different one - a special case).

The implication is that there should be a conformity between audio/video and
IM session model while people will be using SIP. If this point is added in
the guideline, it would have been better.

2. Guidelines in Presence

There may be some issues related to scalability and others in Presence as
well. I am wondering whether any guidelines can also be provided in
Presence.

Radhika R. Roy
[email-masked]

-----Original Message-----
From: Peterson, Jon [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 4:05 AM
To: Roy, Radhika R, ALCTA; [email-masked]
Cc: simple
Subject: RE: Guidelines for IM Sessions

Jon Peterson
NeuStar, Inc.