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Visit Prestige Replicas today! http://johnwalkerblog.blogspot.com/ From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 7 10:54:20 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4D133A69ED; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 10:54:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B478F28C138 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 10:54:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.117 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.117 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, DNS_FROM_RFC_BOGUSMX=1.482] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gXu6gDbxU7sK for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 10:54:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from node05.dns-hosting.info (node05.dns-hosting.info [85.17.186.5]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97B43A6824 for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 10:54:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mit.xs4all.nl ([80.101.96.20] helo=[192.168.1.120]) by node05.dns-hosting.info with esmtpsa (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1KFutC-0003KK-Qk for simple@ietf.org; Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:52:40 +0200 Message-Id: <6B54736E-B492-4431-B579-B791AFAF2906@ag-projects.com> From: Adrian Georgescu To: simple@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 19:54:15 +0200 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 80.101.96.20 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: ag@ag-projects.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Tue, 21 Aug 2007 23:39:36 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on node05.dns-hosting.info) Subject: [Simple] How to Publish an icon/photo resource X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hello, A SIMPLE publisher would want to publish its own photo so that others can retrieve it in the context of presence notifications. The closest reference I could find for such scenario is the icon element in PIDF but a standard way to upload a picture to an URL I could not. A proprietary xcap application would probably work but maybe there is something already defined for this functionality. Is there an IETF document that explains how to upload the photo of a buddy? Regards, Adrian _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 7 15:39:05 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0C0928C31C; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:39:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A902D28C31C for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:39:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gtV7hNNkHgRq for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:39:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nylon.softarmor.com (nylon.softarmor.com [66.135.38.164]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84E2C28C31A for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 15:39:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.4] (65-65-155-30.dsl.bigbend.net [65.65.155.30] (may be forged)) (authenticated bits=0) by nylon.softarmor.com (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id m67Md8Rj025891 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 17:39:10 -0500 Message-Id: <738D7817-A840-46F1-973E-9DE5B6CAA994@softarmor.com> From: Dean Willis To: Simple WG Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 17:39:03 -0500 References: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Subject: [Simple] Fwd: [Sip] draft-polk-sip-location-get-00.txt submitted X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This may be of interest also to SIMPLE. Begin forwarded message: > From: "James M. Polk" > Date: July 7, 2008 1:39:14 PM CDT > To: > Subject: [Sip] draft-polk-sip-location-get-00.txt submitted > > This is a new ID creating the ability for a watcher to request, with > a subscription, the geolocation of a presentity. In keeping with > existing consensus in both the SIP and Geopriv WGs, a new Event > package is not to be created for this; but that the 'Presence' event > package is to be used when subscribing for another PA's location. > Without a new set of filters, subscribing to the presence of another > presentity would not yield its location, because nothing currently > exists specifying that location was sought. This document defines > these filters, and the surrounding semantics associated with this > 'get' function. > > This has been submitted into the SIP WG item because it extends SIP > Location Conveyance. Conveyance discusses dereferecing a > locationURI. The ability to request another PA's location is > identical to how a locationURI is dereferenced. If SIP is going to > be used to dereference a locationURI that was conveyed to it using > Location Conveyance - this document defines how this is accomplish. > There are both ECRIT and Geopriv documents that mandate this ability. > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-polk-sip-location-get-00.txt > "Session Initiation Protocol (SIP) Location Get Function", James > Polk, > 6-Jul-08, > > The abstract you included reads: > > This document defines how a watcher seeks the geographic location > information from presentity. SIP Location Conveyance defines how > location is sent from one entity to another unsolicited. This > document specifies how a watcher, i.e., a Location Target, requests > for specific geolocation state information of a presentity, in > addition to the details within the subscription such as the format > (geo or civic) returned and the frequency of updated location from > the presentity. \ _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From qujnlgyewc@glenncarter.com Mon Jul 7 21:42:05 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15AB43A68B4; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:42:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 3.888 X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.888 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RDNS_NONE=0.1, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IlJU7ez2lWjt; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:42:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxyrouter1.eatontownpolice.com (unknown [81.214.33.221]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 205BC3A6405; Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:41:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 64.127.111.2038 (l13.mypoints.com) (64.127.111.2038) by smtp160.mail.re6.girlday.com with SMTP; Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:42:04 -0800 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:42:04 -0800 (PDT) From: "maegan" Reply-to: "maegan" To: v6ops-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: it`s maegan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain hello, I am pretty russian girl, bored tonight. would you like to chat with me and see my pics? if so then email me at emaegan1@hugdr.info From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 09:39:06 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66D5B3A6A9E; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23E83A6A9E for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.976 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1GbPXv0e2GzE for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rv-out-0506.google.com (rv-out-0506.google.com [209.85.198.239]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6CF03A691A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by rv-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id b25so2443627rvf.49 for ; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 09:39:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender :to:subject:mime-version:content-type:x-google-sender-auth; bh=D1SZHhzjAj2yOlZLRaitghLp9o1uKhOwfzT7/cWfVq8=; b=vkRv/cWjiAWaA4rYCjmZOYrJsQjPR/7ye9DCh1U2nzrNCZdJ+Id8G+wo1kgwI71kzX e0VBNkXZS39KoMMT9PGJ7auOC1pWh7/3MMkatoznEXRlwy2aToRGQlVvdq4Wvj2LvwIZ Tv0i5Xd0TodDfcgXMa+qaEqvtSlPtEOVAUDYI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:mime-version:content-type :x-google-sender-auth; b=ncWMitl5RRrg3drmoGdRVIerNF+qaCylUqYW5DfhdM+WEzZg4l0DCysTCUv6IbKbXD zJMwuNtn9k7obNB/fkUQ2VRyNhh/AuefonetTiLqgY4jElE4Lt5JCAlMmkhEkmMdvya8 SKCUdRjP3NF8Ooc79c9guHK8evuAJ/ubIk2UU= Received: by 10.141.170.10 with SMTP id x10mr3326491rvo.105.1215535152166; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 09:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.140.173.3 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:39:12 -0700 From: "Derek MacDonald" To: "simple@ietf.org" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 655255118cb63089 Subject: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2060887833==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --===============2060887833== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_22934_33424549.1215535152155" ------=_Part_22934_33424549.1215535152155 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline This draft describes an extension to MSRP which allow efficient topology hiding. It defines a mechanism to have an MSRP URI which is a pointer to an IP address which is not itself contained in the MSRP messages. -Derek ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: IETF I-D Submission Tool Date: Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 3:12 PM Subject: New Version Notification for draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00 To: derek@counterpath.com Cc: hkaplan@acmepacket.com A new version of I-D, draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt has been successfuly submitted by Derek MacDonald and posted to the IETF repository. Filename: draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path Revision: 00 Title: Opaque MSRP Path Uri Creation_date: 2008-07-07 WG ID: Independent Submission Number_of_pages: 10 Abstract: The Message Session Relay Protocol(MSRP) does not allow efficient topology hiding, such that MSRP users can hide the IP Address of their systems. This limitation is due to the fact that MSRP Path headers contain physical IP addresses. This document describes a mechanism which adds a level of indirection to allow topology hiding. It defines the option tag msrp-opaque. The IETF Secretariat. ------=_Part_22934_33424549.1215535152155 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline This draft describes an extension to MSRP  which allow efficient topology hiding. It defines a mechanism to have an MSRP URI which is a pointer to an IP address which is not itself contained in the MSRP messages.

-Derek

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: IETF I-D Submission Tool <idsubmission@ietf.org>
Date: Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 3:12 PM
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00
To: derek@counterpath.com
Cc: hkaplan@acmepacket.com



A new version of I-D, draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt has been successfuly submitted by Derek MacDonald and posted to the IETF repository.

Filename:        draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path
Revision:        00
Title:           Opaque MSRP Path Uri
Creation_date:   2008-07-07
WG ID:           Independent Submission
Number_of_pages: 10

Abstract:
The Message Session Relay Protocol(MSRP) does not allow efficient
topology hiding, such that MSRP users can hide the IP Address of
their systems.  This limitation is due to the fact that MSRP Path
headers contain physical IP addresses.  This document describes a
mechanism which adds a level of indirection to allow topology hiding.
It defines the option tag msrp-opaque.



The IETF Secretariat.



------=_Part_22934_33424549.1215535152155-- --===============2060887833== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============2060887833==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 10:57:44 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A7A93A6ABC; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 10:57:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDF3B3A6ABC for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 10:57:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sellVvqFyLwo for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 10:57:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etmail.acmepacket.com (etmail.acmepacket.com [216.41.24.6]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0567A3A6ABB for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 10:57:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.acmepacket.com (216.41.24.7) by etmail.acmepacket.com (216.41.24.6) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.278.0; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:56:59 -0400 Received: from mail.acmepacket.com ([216.41.24.7]) by mail.acmepacket.com ([216.41.24.7]) with mapi; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:56:59 -0400 From: Hadriel Kaplan To: "simple@ietf.org" Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:57:42 -0400 Thread-Topic: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path Thread-Index: AcjhGQuKz0az/XLfTkuBtdZCIe2NlAACaV9g Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org A direct URL for the opaque-path draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt And to give some more context to this draft, it also addresses the problem discussed in Staffan Blau and Christer's msrp-acm draft, by removing the dependency on the path attribute address usage. To do this it uses the SDP c/m-lines for transport addressing instead, as msrp-acm and Remi's msrp-comedia draft do. Therefore there is a sort of Venn diagram of partial overlap for the problems that need to be solved and their solutions in all 3 of these drafts. -hadriel ________________________________________ From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Derek MacDonald Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 12:39 PM To: simple@ietf.org Subject: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path This draft describes an extension to MSRP which allow efficient topology hiding. It defines a mechanism to have an MSRP URI which is a pointer to an IP address which is not itself contained in the MSRP messages. -Derek ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: IETF I-D Submission Tool Date: Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 3:12 PM Subject: New Version Notification for draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00 To: derek@counterpath.com Cc: hkaplan@acmepacket.com A new version of I-D, draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt has been successfuly submitted by Derek MacDonald and posted to the IETF repository. Filename: draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path Revision: 00 Title: Opaque MSRP Path Uri Creation_date: 2008-07-07 WG ID: Independent Submission Number_of_pages: 10 Abstract: The Message Session Relay Protocol(MSRP) does not allow efficient topology hiding, such that MSRP users can hide the IP Address of their systems. This limitation is due to the fact that MSRP Path headers contain physical IP addresses. This document describes a mechanism which adds a level of indirection to allow topology hiding. It defines the option tag msrp-opaque. The IETF Secretariat. _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 20:10:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 358963A67FD; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:10:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41E1C3A67FD for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:10:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.274 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.274 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.275, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_74=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ltuGW2+s-0iW for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:10:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-2.cisco.com (rtp-iport-2.cisco.com [64.102.122.149]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFCFF3A67D6 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:10:08 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,329,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="13597683" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 09 Jul 2008 03:10:19 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-1.cisco.com (rtp-core-1.cisco.com [64.102.124.12]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m693AJxl026506; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:19 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m693AJ7O011262; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 03:10:19 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:18 -0400 Received: from [10.82.248.33] ([10.82.248.33]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:18 -0400 Message-ID: <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 23:10:24 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Michael Froman References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> In-Reply-To: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jul 2008 03:10:18.0499 (UTC) FILETIME=[50E7ED30:01C8E171] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=2700; t=1215573019; x=1216437019; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20 |To:=20Michael=20Froman=20; bh=G4S6ap53/twHRT2fysEZdcL3kYgPdC3uF7A8AmC7gLU=; b=eLJZ9lnRAV5sq9wy/EZ4HUJeB96dE1Ed/44U7QdAadfeIPl770iPELt3Qz 9aOa4/jClIpR/SIRyjJXQZesHZIMKy5xvy4f7Gdg9MGKnSTWEIGa7a4QL3Nm p99IKY4g5u; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org I am sorry it took so long to respond here. Thanks for your comments. Responses below: Michael Froman wrote: > Hello, > > I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. I > haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so please > excuse me if you've already discussed this. > > --- #1 concern --- > Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used to > construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode of > responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." The phrase > that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the initial state sent > by the presence agent MUST include an ACL document." This is a > current problem in 4662 when used with xcap, and it would be nice to > avoid creating a similar problem in this spec. I don't understand the problem. The presence server would just wait to send the NOTIFY until it had the state. > > > --- Other comments and concerns --- > Sec. 2. All the trust levels assume a whitelist auth model, what > about blacklists (especially in the Full Trust model)? Blacklists can work too; there is a blocked=true flag in a rule. So if you want to blacklist, you'd have something like this: sip:blacklist1@example.com sip:blacklist2@example.com > > Sec. 3.2.1 Trading inter-domain network traffic for higher server > load (and I'm guessing much higher) based on all the acl comparisons > and presence doc comparisons? There is an entire class of reverse > lookups (finding all ACLs that might have referenced 'W' or worse > finding all the RLSs that have 'W') that have the potential to be > expensive. Just making sure that's called out. OK, I'll mention. But this is exactly the tradeoff - CPU for messaging traffic. I don't think the increase in CPU load is that high however. > > > --- Nits --- > > Sec. 3.1.3 'R' is not defined - maybe "This represents the view that > the watcher is supposed to receive." --> "This rule ID, R, represents > the view that the watcher is supposed to receive." fixed. > > Sec. 3.1.3 All the bullets should start with the same verb tense ("If > R is null" , "If R is not null", "If R was not null"...) fixed. Thanks! -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 20:12:38 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A432F3A67D6; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:12:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 509D53A67D6 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:12:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.553 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.553 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.046, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gXcaSiy3KCHR for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:12:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com (rtp-iport-1.cisco.com [64.102.122.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 372763A6780 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:12:37 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,329,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="13589337" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 09 Jul 2008 03:12:47 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-1.cisco.com (rtp-core-1.cisco.com [64.102.124.12]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m693CloO027060; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:12:47 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m693Clah012957; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 03:12:47 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.38]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:12:47 -0400 Received: from [10.82.248.33] ([10.82.248.33]) by xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:12:47 -0400 Message-ID: <48742CB5.30901@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 23:12:53 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Salvatore Loreto References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <4832A1DB.7090000@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <4832A1DB.7090000@ericsson.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jul 2008 03:12:47.0262 (UTC) FILETIME=[A9935BE0:01C8E171] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=3224; t=1215573167; x=1216437167; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20 |To:=20Salvatore=20Loreto=20; bh=F1bG/WcEk+2UxCuXlCfHozjk6JozKVRe00D7xmCjZvo=; b=sb86WtRy2DWzKMRy1YkFHFjD92PjuF4GGvVYxhmELcnlxMb9ImenfqduCl 1bRm2xgAskNEUVzABvfGQLRjLIfHmcjz/W6ZrobU7hb/MCIvrDUhdhjlH+xo wpDNkB9AkE; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This is a good question. It deals with the case where the default behavior is to block, but there is a whitelist of users that have several different views. A default block rule cannot be provided unless ALL of the non-blocked users are listed, and since they have different views, that information must be conveyed to the RLS so it knows when to extend a new back-end subscription. Thanks, Jonathan R. Salvatore Loreto wrote: > Hi, > > I have finally read this draft, I like it. > I have a comment: > > Section 2 states that > "The ACL can also list users in the originating domain that are > authorized to subscribe > to that presentity, but who will end up receiving a different view" > > I really do not understand the pro of provide this possibility compared > with the scenario > where the ACL does not say anything about a particular watcher. > From my point of view is just a discloser of information that does not > provide any advance, > but maybe I am wrong. > > /Sal > > > Michael Froman wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. I >> haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so please >> excuse me if you've already discussed this. >> >> --- #1 concern --- >> Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used to >> construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode of >> responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." The >> phrase that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the initial >> state sent by the presence agent MUST include an ACL document." This >> is a current problem in 4662 when used with xcap, and it would be >> nice to avoid creating a similar problem in this spec. >> >> >> --- Other comments and concerns --- >> Sec. 2. All the trust levels assume a whitelist auth model, what >> about blacklists (especially in the Full Trust model)? >> >> Sec. 3.2.1 Trading inter-domain network traffic for higher server >> load (and I'm guessing much higher) based on all the acl comparisons >> and presence doc comparisons? There is an entire class of reverse >> lookups (finding all ACLs that might have referenced 'W' or worse >> finding all the RLSs that have 'W') that have the potential to be >> expensive. Just making sure that's called out. >> >> >> --- Nits --- >> >> Sec. 3.1.3 'R' is not defined - maybe "This represents the view that >> the watcher is supposed to receive." --> "This rule ID, R, represents >> the view that the watcher is supposed to receive." >> >> Sec. 3.1.3 All the bullets should start with the same verb tense ("If >> R is null" , "If R is not null", "If R was not null"...) >> >> -Michael. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Simple mailing list >> Simple@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple >> >> > > -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 20:15:42 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21FF53A67F3; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:15:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E09FF3A67F3 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:15:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.556 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.556 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.043, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0vkGDqh1Lu0M for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com (rtp-iport-1.cisco.com [64.102.122.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E9FA3A67D6 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 20:15:39 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,329,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="13589477" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 09 Jul 2008 03:15:49 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m693FnmO027843; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:15:49 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m693Fnij021183; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 03:15:49 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.38]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:15:49 -0400 Received: from [10.82.248.33] ([10.82.248.33]) by xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:15:49 -0400 Message-ID: <48742D6B.3010301@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 23:15:55 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adrian Georgescu References: <6B54736E-B492-4431-B579-B791AFAF2906@ag-projects.com> In-Reply-To: <6B54736E-B492-4431-B579-B791AFAF2906@ag-projects.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jul 2008 03:15:49.0485 (UTC) FILETIME=[163061D0:01C8E172] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=1103; t=1215573349; x=1216437349; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20How=20to=20Publish=20an=20ic on/photo=20resource |Sender:=20 |To:=20Adrian=20Georgescu=20; bh=NT9XxnKD//kuQCxo03qBLlRDelJlr/tSMxBzNzuEf4s=; b=U46Y/Cel83pSphi4O40CMvzfwNmso8RmpYqvnwdsSLhy0Vwp14KsuHtlEx lz+EoWxA0EZsd0DEuN7MAGowrcqaXDZSGXF5Bf2hIq1er6XXoUsFexVJmacP JtjQiBwBZA; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] How to Publish an icon/photo resource X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Plain old HTTP allows you to upload a file: PUT http://www.myfiles.com/joe/images/mypic.jpg -Jonathan R. Adrian Georgescu wrote: > Hello, > > A SIMPLE publisher would want to publish its own photo so that others > can retrieve it in the context of presence notifications. > > The closest reference I could find for such scenario is the icon element > in PIDF but a standard way to upload a picture to an URL I could not. A > proprietary xcap application would probably work but maybe there is > something already defined for this functionality. > > Is there an IETF document that explains how to upload the photo of a buddy? > > Regards, > Adrian > _______________________________________________ > Simple mailing list > Simple@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple > -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 8 21:56:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8393F3A684F; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:56:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 945EE3A684D for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:56:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IIGe-NmcOg3o for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:56:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 319493A67A1 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:56:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.6] (pool-71-164-170-246.dllstx.fios.verizon.net [71.164.170.246]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m694uI3C010415 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:56:19 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: From: Robert Sparks To: Jonathan Rosenberg In-Reply-To: <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:56:18 -0500 References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 71.164.170.246 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.1/7670/Tue Jul 8 22:00:35 2008 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Michael Froman , simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org On Jul 8, 2008, at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: > I am sorry it took so long to respond here. Thanks for your > comments. Responses below: > > Michael Froman wrote: >> Hello, >> I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. I >> haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so please >> excuse me if you've already discussed this. >> --- #1 concern --- >> Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used to >> construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode of >> responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." The >> phrase that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the initial >> state sent by the presence agent MUST include an ACL document." >> This is a current problem in 4662 when used with xcap, and it >> would be nice to avoid creating a similar problem in this spec. > > > I don't understand the problem. The presence server would just wait > to send the NOTIFY until it had the state. > 3265 immediate notifies. What do you send when its really time to kick that immediate NOTIFY out and the information you need for that ACL isn't there yet? Would it be OK just to send an empty NOTIFY and then push this stuff out, as you say, when the presence server gets the state? RjS _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 04:07:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 880993A6A84; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:07:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6F603A6A5E for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:07:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IlELhrXm06-b for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail119.messagelabs.com (mail119.messagelabs.com [216.82.245.51]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id EBDEE3A6A76 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:07:27 -0700 (PDT) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: KHBJ46@motorola.com X-Msg-Ref: server-11.tower-119.messagelabs.com!1215601654!25569549!1 X-StarScan-Version: 5.5.12.14.2; banners=-,-,- X-Originating-IP: [129.188.136.8] Received: (qmail 4099 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2008 11:07:34 -0000 Received: from motgate8.mot.com (HELO motgate8.mot.com) (129.188.136.8) by server-11.tower-119.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 9 Jul 2008 11:07:34 -0000 Received: from il06exr02.mot.com (il06exr02.mot.com [129.188.137.132]) by motgate8.mot.com (8.12.11/Motorola) with ESMTP id m69B7T6j019982 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:07:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from il06vts01.mot.com (il06vts01.mot.com [129.188.137.141]) by il06exr02.mot.com (8.13.1/Vontu) with SMTP id m69B7SHe007072 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 06:07:29 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ZMY16EXM70.ds.mot.com (zmy16exm70.ap.mot.com [10.179.4.29]) by il06exr02.mot.com (8.13.1/8.13.0) with ESMTP id m69B7R4U007063 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 06:07:28 -0500 (CDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 19:07:26 +0800 Message-ID: <7FAD6FCE52421841A11B441DEF3A88CA01A535E0@ZMY16EXM70.ds.mot.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Please Help!!! thread-index: Acjhs/hXKkSylcsJRYmnn58MW3oylg== From: "Deka Sanjeeb Kumar-KHBJ46" To: X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Cc: Michael Froman Subject: [Simple] Please Help!!! X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1044968688==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1044968688== Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B3.F848068D" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B3.F848068D Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, =20 Please help me for the following: =20 For Call Park and Pickup, which draft is compatible for Cisco and Avaya PBX servers? =20 Are they using best practices or any particular draft is supported for it. =20 If possible please send the name of the draft. =20 Thanks & Regards, Sanjeeb ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B3.F848068D Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi=20 All,
 
Please = help me for=20 the following:
 
For = Call Park and=20 Pickup, which draft is compatible for Cisco and Avaya PBX=20 servers?
 
Are = they using best=20 practices or any particular draft is supported for = it.
 
If = possible please=20 send the name of the draft.
 
Thanks = &=20 Regards,
Sanjeeb
------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B3.F848068D-- --===============1044968688== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============1044968688==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 04:41:50 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C364F3A6823; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:41:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610533A6823 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:41:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.298 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.298 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MANGLED_EXTNSN=2.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GeYYMHdsOJ6f for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:41:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-2.cisco.com (rtp-iport-2.cisco.com [64.102.122.149]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13E143A67FB for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 04:41:48 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,331,1212364800"; d="scan'208,217";a="13643236" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 09 Jul 2008 11:41:58 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m69BfwfQ017267; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 07:41:58 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m69BfwCL012963; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:41:58 GMT Received: from xmb-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.13]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 9 Jul 2008 07:41:58 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 07:41:57 -0400 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <7FAD6FCE52421841A11B441DEF3A88CA01A535E0@ZMY16EXM70.ds.mot.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Simple] Please Help!!! Thread-Index: Acjhs/hXKkSylcsJRYmnn58MW3oylgABLpFw From: "Sanjay Sinha (sanjsinh)" To: "Deka Sanjeeb Kumar-KHBJ46" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jul 2008 11:41:58.0720 (UTC) FILETIME=[CBA9E400:01C8E1B8] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=3821; t=1215603718; x=1216467718; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=sanjsinh@cisco.com; z=From:=20=22Sanjay=20Sinha=20(sanjsinh)=22=20 |Subject:=20RE=3A=20[Simple]=20Please=20Help!!! |Sender:=20 |To:=20=22Deka=20Sanjeeb=20Kumar-KHBJ46=22=20,=20; bh=kO9cxru9y3nVv5lvVs74q7+NwxIDN5NueK1cVkmrBzg=; b=JtFJBUrlWXfCO6HDG3V7v9Zm0fzWQ8ESyx0taAjVYaoxFvoXWV/lwsoiv2 Y8PVQhqDSNv6S3sXa/zK4BeV0Db94Xetu1mK0EC9vonX3Ch6/FfkBDNtpd00 6pe4KpW6jN; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=sanjsinh@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Cc: Michael Froman Subject: Re: [Simple] Please Help!!! X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1606463083==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1606463083== Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B8.CB542DD4" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B8.CB542DD4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This question belongs to Bliss. For call-park, you should look at this draft: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-procter-bliss-call-park-extens ion-01.txt ________________________________ From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Deka Sanjeeb Kumar-KHBJ46 Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 7:07 AM To: simple@ietf.org Cc: Michael Froman Subject: [Simple] Please Help!!! =09 =09 Hi All, =20 Please help me for the following: =20 For Call Park and Pickup, which draft is compatible for Cisco and Avaya PBX servers? =20 Are they using best practices or any particular draft is supported for it. =20 If possible please send the name of the draft. =20 Thanks & Regards, Sanjeeb ------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B8.CB542DD4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This question belongs to Bliss. For call-park, = you should=20 look at this draft: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-procter-blis= s-call-park-extension-01.txt

From: simple-bounces@ietf.org=20 [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Deka Sanjeeb=20 Kumar-KHBJ46
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 7:07 = AM
To:=20 simple@ietf.org
Cc: Michael Froman
Subject: = [Simple]=20 Please Help!!!

Hi=20 All,
 
Please help me for=20 the following:
 
For = Call Park and=20 Pickup, which draft is compatible for Cisco and Avaya PBX=20 servers?
 
Are = they using=20 best practices or any particular draft is supported for=20 it.
 
If = possible please=20 send the name of the draft.
 
Thanks &=20 Regards,
Sanjeeb
------_=_NextPart_001_01C8E1B8.CB542DD4-- --===============1606463083== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============1606463083==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 11:47:37 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F4B73A6837; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:47:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC91A3A696C for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:47:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xfBfw1k+HD2L for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dash.upc.es (dash.upc.es [147.83.2.50]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DFB93A6B40 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:47:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from entelserver.upc.edu (entelserver.upc.es [147.83.39.4]) by dash.upc.es (8.14.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m69Ilhtv029991 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 20:47:43 +0200 Received: from [147.83.47.151] (c5s102-151.upc.es [147.83.47.151]) by entelserver.upc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AF882CBCFE for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 21:47:22 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <487507EF.7080403@entel.upc.es> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:48:15 +0200 From: =?windows-1252?Q?Victoria_Beltr=E1n_Mart=EDnez?= User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: simple@ietf.org X-Mail-Scanned: Criba 2.0 + Clamd X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (dash.upc.es [147.83.2.50]); Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:47:43 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [Simple] ietf-simple-interdomain-scaling-analysis-04 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hello, I have some comments about this draft which I would like to discuss: 1- In page 10, the description of C14 variable could lead to confusion = saing =93(per each contact)=94 since a multipart boundary is also used for = the resource list. 2- In page 11, When S03 variable is calculated and dialog optimization = is applied, the multipart boundary of the resource list is missing. The = most correct is (C06*C04)*((S01*(C09+C11+C13+C14+C15+C14))+(S02*C10)) 3- In page 12, when the T07 variable is calculated and dialog = optimization is used, it is assumed that only a single presentity is = changed. But, In my opinion, considering presence changes in terminating = notifies does not make sense since the NOTIFY message is sent in = response to a terminating SUBSCRIBE. RFC 4662 makes no difference which = presentities have changed their state when the RLS sends a terminating = NOTIFY. This RFC only specifies that the terminating NOTIFY should be = full-state as well as the initial NOTIFY. So, I think that T07 variable = should be calculated by = (T03*C06*(C09+C14+C15))+(T03*C06*C04*(C11+C13+C14)) in the case of = dialog optimization. 4- The total number and bytes of messages in section 2.4 is calculated = assuming presence documents of 3000 bytes. However, the next section 2.5 = uses presence documents of 350 bytes. If the aim is to compare the case = No optimizations with the Dialog optimization case, the same document = size should be used. If we assume a size of 3000 bytes for Dialog = optimization, it generates more bytes than the No optimizations case does. Regards, Victoria _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 17:04:31 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E08AE3A6860; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 316C53A69A7 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.421 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.421 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.178, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sPCs2vo6GtRO for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-5.cisco.com (sj-iport-5.cisco.com [171.68.10.87]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B7073A67FE for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:30 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,333,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="36191574" Received: from sj-dkim-4.cisco.com ([171.71.179.196]) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 10 Jul 2008 00:04:43 +0000 Received: from sj-core-5.cisco.com (sj-core-5.cisco.com [171.71.177.238]) by sj-dkim-4.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6A04hLS032622 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:43 -0700 Received: from xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-231.cisco.com [128.107.191.100]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6A04hKq018635 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 00:04:43 GMT Received: from xfe-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com ([171.70.151.174]) by xbh-sjc-231.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:43 -0700 Received: from [128.107.102.253] ([128.107.102.253]) by xfe-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:04:43 -0700 Message-ID: <48755222.8040205@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:04:50 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Simple WG X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jul 2008 00:04:43.0020 (UTC) FILETIME=[8E0E6CC0:01C8E220] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=511; t=1215648283; x=1216512283; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim4002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20updated=20SIMPLE=20made=20simple |Sender:=20; bh=zOpdhhsLKABdvzLFpB3lHN8Slo/GkA/Lg4CLWnR8qYY=; b=OrsNtMyzuRciWkBhO6SuS7m8Idgp1VzzL9muuHcVO50iScVobD6jhPoN40 7tPPcO+SnBPmuEgcnOUpMWrzl6AuODRgZsfhs88+Z7sULfA0zZsjUuRmvdhp bIX/7qFayn; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-4; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim4002 verified; ); Subject: [Simple] updated SIMPLE made simple X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-simple-03.txt Changes: * updated references * added draft-ietf-sip-uri-list-subscribe to infrastructure - basically its an alternative to rfc4662 Thanks, Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 17:15:04 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91B3428C0E5; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:15:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@ietf.org Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id EAEC33A6885; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:15:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20080710001501.EAEC33A6885@core3.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 17:15:01 -0700 (PDT) Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: [Simple] I-D Action:draft-ietf-simple-simple-03.txt X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF. Title : SIMPLE made Simple: An Overview of the IETF Specifications for Instant Messaging and Presence using the Session Initiation Protocol (SIP) Author(s) : J. Rosenberg Filename : draft-ietf-simple-simple-03.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2008-07-09 The IETF has produced many specifications related to Presence and Instant Messaging with the Session Initiation Protocol (SIP). Collectively, these specifications are known as SIMPLE - SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions. This document serves as a guide to the SIMPLE suite of specifications. It breaks them up into categories and explains what each is for and how they relate to each other. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-simple-03.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-simple-simple-03.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-07-09170227.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --NextPart-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 9 23:40:06 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8A393A6962; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 23:40:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 760F83A6962 for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 23:40:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id frQi9pGH3deJ for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 23:40:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw3.ericsson.se (mailgw3.ericsson.se [193.180.251.60]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26B1C3A68AD for ; Wed, 9 Jul 2008 23:40:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw3.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 256A520B22; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:40:15 +0200 (CEST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3c-ab095bb00000193b-a5-4875aecea951 Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.123]) by mailgw3.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id F2493206FB; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:40:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.174]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:40:06 +0200 Received: from mail.lmf.ericsson.se ([131.160.11.50]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 10 Jul 2008 08:40:06 +0200 Received: from nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se [131.160.33.3]) by mail.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33F0C236E; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:40:06 +0300 (EEST) Received: from nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2C5C4DC75; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:40:05 +0300 (EEST) Received: from n68.nomadiclab.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54B144DB19; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:40:05 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <4875AEC5.6030100@ericsson.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:40:05 +0300 From: Salvatore Loreto User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jonathan Rosenberg References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <4832A1DB.7090000@ericsson.com> <48742CB5.30901@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48742CB5.30901@cisco.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jul 2008 06:40:06.0462 (UTC) FILETIME=[CA5465E0:01C8E257] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org thanks for the answer, now the scenario is more clear then when I read it in the draft. So the ACL will list that users (users in the originating domain that are authorized to subscribe to that presentity, but who will end up receiving a different view) only in the case where the default behavior is to *block*. However if the default behavior is *allow* it is useless list that user, isn't it? maybe it should be better explain clearer the scenario. Another question you also state "The ACL can also list watchers in the originating domain that are not authorized at all" I guess here you are talking of the watchers that are in someway explicitly listed as not authorized ( which is the difference with the ones that are blocked ?!?!) in the Presence Server, as the ones for whom the authorization is still pending. /Sal Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: > This is a good question. It deals with the case where the default > behavior is to block, but there is a whitelist of users that have > several different views. A default block rule cannot be provided > unless ALL of the non-blocked users are listed, and since they have > different views, that information must be conveyed to the RLS so it > knows when to extend a new back-end subscription. > > Thanks, > Jonathan R. > > Salvatore Loreto wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I have finally read this draft, I like it. >> I have a comment: >> >> Section 2 states that >> "The ACL can also list users in the originating domain that are >> authorized to subscribe >> to that presentity, but who will end up receiving a different view" >> >> I really do not understand the pro of provide this possibility >> compared with the scenario >> where the ACL does not say anything about a particular watcher. >> From my point of view is just a discloser of information that does >> not provide any advance, >> but maybe I am wrong. >> >> /Sal >> >> >> Michael Froman wrote: >>> Hello, >>> >>> I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. I >>> haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so please >>> excuse me if you've already discussed this. >>> >>> --- #1 concern --- >>> Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used to >>> construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode of >>> responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." The >>> phrase that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the initial >>> state sent by the presence agent MUST include an ACL document." >>> This is a current problem in 4662 when used with xcap, and it would >>> be nice to avoid creating a similar problem in this spec. >>> >>> >>> --- Other comments and concerns --- >>> Sec. 2. All the trust levels assume a whitelist auth model, what >>> about blacklists (especially in the Full Trust model)? >>> >>> Sec. 3.2.1 Trading inter-domain network traffic for higher server >>> load (and I'm guessing much higher) based on all the acl >>> comparisons and presence doc comparisons? There is an entire class >>> of reverse lookups (finding all ACLs that might have referenced 'W' >>> or worse finding all the RLSs that have 'W') that have the >>> potential to be expensive. Just making sure that's called out. >>> >>> >>> --- Nits --- >>> >>> Sec. 3.1.3 'R' is not defined - maybe "This represents the view >>> that the watcher is supposed to receive." --> "This rule ID, R, >>> represents the view that the watcher is supposed to receive." >>> >>> Sec. 3.1.3 All the bullets should start with the same verb tense >>> ("If R is null" , "If R is not null", "If R was not null"...) >>> >>> -Michael. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Simple mailing list >>> Simple@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple >>> >>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jul 10 11:25:04 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 864063A68B9; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75DBA3A68B9 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.433 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.433 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.166, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wNux6SH0e1G3 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sj-iport-6.cisco.com (sj-iport-6.cisco.com [171.71.176.117]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02F503A67A3 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:02 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,339,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="125070837" Received: from sj-dkim-1.cisco.com ([171.71.179.21]) by sj-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP; 10 Jul 2008 18:25:16 +0000 Received: from sj-core-5.cisco.com (sj-core-5.cisco.com [171.71.177.238]) by sj-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6AIPGfY018039; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:16 -0700 Received: from xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-sjc-211.cisco.com [171.70.151.144]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6AIPFFI019373; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 18:25:16 GMT Received: from xfe-sjc-212.amer.cisco.com ([171.70.151.187]) by xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:14 -0700 Received: from [128.107.103.52] ([128.107.103.52]) by xfe-sjc-212.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:25:13 -0700 Message-ID: <48765411.5050803@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 14:25:21 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Sparks References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jul 2008 18:25:13.0959 (UTC) FILETIME=[4B901F70:01C8E2BA] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=2046; t=1215714316; x=1216578316; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim1004; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20; bh=EHjGSo9gO4G5HeLWdXXM6+UoQQl0jXdCx2tXg3xDif4=; b=Sz/hpCS+gYmcgRL/igTziVLXUFr6d8lwVG8GWzwaZijM26exb+XKUV3kc+ j/KCANCbw9h0MAI6OwZh4dnm3RsJM3m0XvN/yfM+dKlDjJpKQ2gnV/lR7N/d ngifh0PvDCud6fksWk84uYh4zTMkMSsqnPfJyug+kHxE1KJxxWUqw=; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim1004 verified; ); Cc: Michael Froman , simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org inline: Robert Sparks wrote: > > On Jul 8, 2008, at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: > >> I am sorry it took so long to respond here. Thanks for your comments. >> Responses below: >> >> Michael Froman wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. I >>> haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so please >>> excuse me if you've already discussed this. >>> --- #1 concern --- >>> Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used to >>> construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode of >>> responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." The >>> phrase that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the initial >>> state sent by the presence agent MUST include an ACL document." >>> This is a current problem in 4662 when used with xcap, and it would >>> be nice to avoid creating a similar problem in this spec. >> >> >> I don't understand the problem. The presence server would just wait to >> send the NOTIFY until it had the state. >> > > 3265 immediate notifies. > > What do you send when its really time to kick that immediate NOTIFY out > and the information you need for that ACL isn't there yet? Is this a real problem? "Immediate" NOTIFY doesn't have a requirement around a specific time; it seems reasonable to wait for whatever backend DB operations are required before you send a NOTIFY. You need to do that anyway to figure out what presence document to send them. > > Would it be OK just to send an empty NOTIFY and then push this stuff > out, as you say, when the presence server gets the state? I do think its OK; but I still don't understand the problem. -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jul 10 11:30:21 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64A8F28C135; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:30:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 871403A6A75 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:30:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZS3eVWvls2-7 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:30:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA6E728C135 for ; Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:30:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.3.232] (vicuna-alt.estacado.net [75.53.54.121]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6AIUGRV050317 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:30:16 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: <2A11E205-477F-4F00-ACDF-F832281027E7@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks To: Jonathan Rosenberg In-Reply-To: <48765411.5050803@cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 13:30:16 -0500 References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> <48765411.5050803@cisco.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 75.53.54.121 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.1/7686/Thu Jul 10 10:27:03 2008 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Michael Froman , simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org On Jul 10, 2008, at 1:25 PM, Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: > inline: > > Robert Sparks wrote: >> On Jul 8, 2008, at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: >>> I am sorry it took so long to respond here. Thanks for your >>> comments. Responses below: >>> >>> Michael Froman wrote: >>>> Hello, >>>> I have a few comments about draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00. >>>> I haven't seen any of this on-list (maybe I've missed it) so >>>> please excuse me if you've already discussed this. >>>> --- #1 concern --- >>>> Sec. 4.2 What if (like in RLS using xcap) the information used >>>> to construct the ACL is not nearby? There appears to be no mode >>>> of responding with "I'm working on it and I'll let you know." >>>> The phrase that specifically concerns me is "Furthermore, the >>>> initial state sent by the presence agent MUST include an ACL >>>> document." This is a current problem in 4662 when used with >>>> xcap, and it would be nice to avoid creating a similar problem >>>> in this spec. >>> >>> >>> I don't understand the problem. The presence server would just >>> wait to send the NOTIFY until it had the state. >>> >> 3265 immediate notifies. >> What do you send when its really time to kick that immediate NOTIFY >> out and the information you need for that ACL isn't there yet? > > Is this a real problem? "Immediate" NOTIFY doesn't have a > requirement around a specific time; it seems reasonable to wait for > whatever backend DB operations are required before you send a > NOTIFY. You need to do that anyway to figure out what presence > document to send them. It really does have to be immediate - in the same sense that responses to Non-INVITE requests have to be immediate. There's a race. The subscriber will stop listening for NOTIFYs from other forks than the one that corresponds with the 200 OK very shortly after that 200 OK arrives. >> Would it be OK just to send an empty NOTIFY and then push this >> stuff out, as you say, when the presence server gets the state? > > I do think its OK; but I still don't understand the problem. > > > -Jonathan R. > > > -- > Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. > Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 > Cisco, Voice Technology Group > jdrosen@cisco.com > http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 > http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jul 11 08:50:17 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59D4328C20F; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:50:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59B3D28C20F for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:50:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qbrt73AxUcUy for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:50:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18E6B28C20C for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:50:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.3.232] (vicuna-alt.estacado.net [75.53.54.121]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6BFoUEA006521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:50:30 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:50:30 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 75.53.54.121 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.93.1, clamav-milter version 0.93.1 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [Simple] Agenda requests for SIMPLE at IETF72 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org So far I have requests from Christer, Derek, and Jonathan (2 MSRP related drafts, view sharing, and intradomain federation). What else do we need to talk about? RjS _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 06:33:54 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D08A73A6A5C; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:33:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4928528C142 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:33:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.557 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.557 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.042, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o+QmIpxqWvEp for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:33:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com (rtp-iport-1.cisco.com [64.102.122.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B248A3A68C9 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:33:15 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,359,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="14210149" Received: from rtp-dkim-2.cisco.com ([64.102.121.159]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Jul 2008 13:33:41 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-2.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6EDXfg8004451; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:33:41 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EDXe5U015235; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:33:41 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.38]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:33:40 -0400 Received: from [10.86.249.159] ([10.86.249.159]) by xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:33:40 -0400 Message-ID: <487B55BC.2000707@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:33:48 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Salvatore Loreto References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <4832A1DB.7090000@ericsson.com> <48742CB5.30901@cisco.com> <4875AEC5.6030100@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <4875AEC5.6030100@ericsson.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jul 2008 13:33:40.0531 (UTC) FILETIME=[3A51D830:01C8E5B6] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=1260; t=1216042421; x=1216906421; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim2001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20 |To:=20Salvatore=20Loreto=20; bh=BUSVQew8dmxUdCQ1Uo3sQPbfBJ9g+uEhiSZTgSKA9ZM=; b=ULtYG/0x6e080huQCjRsqfess//t4/znctDxAjGox95IF+ap3+9S7HrPmK 4nxw8IHqtU/+sBM/OwMLACvZbW1ldRDjMW7Lwi5ZadwhoPmXU8+hQ/pTQQzA i9tsHV2CRW; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-2; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim2001 verified; ); Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Salvatore Loreto wrote: > thanks for the answer, now the scenario is more clear then when I read > it in the draft. > So the ACL will list that users (users in the originating domain that > are authorized to subscribe to that presentity, > but who will end up receiving a different view) only in the case where > the default behavior is to *block*. > However if the default behavior is *allow* it is useless list that user, > isn't it? > maybe it should be better explain clearer the scenario. Yes, you are correct. I will mention this. I suspect the more common case is a default of 'block' of course. > > Another question you also state "The ACL can also list watchers in the > originating domain that are not authorized at all" > I guess here you are talking of the watchers that are in someway > explicitly listed as not authorized ( which is the difference with the > ones that are blocked ?!?!) blocked == not-authorized -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 06:38:44 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C13A3A691A; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:38:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1688B3A6939 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:38:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.559 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.559 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.040, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qGkJQvOaL2eW for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:38:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-2.cisco.com (rtp-iport-2.cisco.com [64.102.122.149]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1984C3A691A for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 06:38:42 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,359,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="14220344" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Jul 2008 13:39:07 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-1.cisco.com (rtp-core-1.cisco.com [64.102.124.12]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6EDd7j2030392; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:39:07 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EDd7Lk000425; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:39:07 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.38]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:39:07 -0400 Received: from [10.86.249.159] ([10.86.249.159]) by xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:39:06 -0400 Message-ID: <487B5702.5000302@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 09:39:14 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Salvatore Loreto References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <4832A1DB.7090000@ericsson.com> <48742CB5.30901@cisco.com> <4875AEC5.6030100@ericsson.com> <487B55BC.2000707@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <487B55BC.2000707@cisco.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jul 2008 13:39:07.0008 (UTC) FILETIME=[FCEA4800:01C8E5B6] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=1494; t=1216042747; x=1216906747; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20 |To:=20Salvatore=20Loreto=20; bh=hZte9GWM5BVWRZOSCG6rUzP8bMM72/d1GfFFhht2U54=; b=FZFavBHiZk7mlGz/NUaPrWBWmh9TIo/mJLzoqv/I28VV8hfJ1PJNEdTdR3 uhSH3sS87/KWQcIgXgyTDKy0u4uXmJsvY1CWy3NbDZ4zSvc2cHoDWfCUoWVT jgqEqsJ+Fr; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org a correction here: Jonathan Rosenberg wrote: > > > Salvatore Loreto wrote: >> thanks for the answer, now the scenario is more clear then when I read >> it in the draft. >> So the ACL will list that users (users in the originating domain that >> are authorized to subscribe to that presentity, >> but who will end up receiving a different view) only in the case where >> the default behavior is to *block*. >> However if the default behavior is *allow* it is useless list that >> user, isn't it? >> maybe it should be better explain clearer the scenario. > > Yes, you are correct. I will mention this. I suspect the more common > case is a default of 'block' of course. Actually this is wrong. The ACL is really specifying views for watchers. When there is a default, it means, "this is the default view". So, if there are users that are allowed but are not going to get the default view, they need to be enumerated as well. So, the rule is correct as stated in the document: if a default view is included, you HAVE to include an enumeration of all other views that users might receive. This is true regardless of whether the default view is blocked or not. -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 07:00:03 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D369228C182; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:00:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@ietf.org Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id B2D7E3A69E9; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:00:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20080714140001.B2D7E3A69E9@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:00:01 -0700 (PDT) Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: [Simple] I-D Action:draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF. Title : Optimizing Federated Presence with View Sharing Author(s) : J. Rosenberg, et al. Filename : draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt Pages : 30 Date : 2008-07-14 Presence federation refers to the exchange of presence information between systems. One of the primary challenges in presence federation is scale. With a large number of watchers in one domain obtaining presence for many presentities in another, the amount of notification traffic is large. This document describes an extension to the Session Initiation Protocol (SIP) event framework, called view sharing. View sharing can substantially reduce the amount of traffic, but requires a certain level of trust between domains. View sharing allows the amount of presence traffic between domains to achieve the theoretical lower bound on information exchange in any presence system. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-07-14065234.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --NextPart-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 07:04:05 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B6C73A6A29; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:04:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F2573A69D1 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:04:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.561 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B+m6amJcHELX for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:04:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com (rtp-iport-1.cisco.com [64.102.122.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F3B33A6A29 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:04:03 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,359,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="14214947" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Jul 2008 14:04:28 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6EE4SIV015586 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:04:28 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EE4SXG001432 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 14:04:28 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:04:28 -0400 Received: from [10.86.249.159] ([10.86.249.159]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:04:28 -0400 Message-ID: <487B5CF4.2010200@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:04:36 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Simple WG X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jul 2008 14:04:28.0143 (UTC) FILETIME=[87950FF0:01C8E5BA] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=889; t=1216044268; x=1216908268; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20updated=20view=20sharing=20spec |Sender:=20 |To:=20Simple=20WG=20; bh=me5/cSk2gCS4JqoJ1g+vMBXEOTjH3MC4stXVMWy2c/I=; b=PqV5rEEXe2GFwXTxPhyiO2fw3eNoCgCofvwxRVplaQOMm7OlheGseIXTxO Hae9s5ZD5chxITIMRGOYrH3cCbzuijR5OqYaGwod8dfei4fZkS+GWs0MLz4f PVM87qiVGv; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Subject: [Simple] updated view sharing spec X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org I've submitted an update to the view sharing spec: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt Changes: * mention that the mechanism trades off messaging traffic for increased CPU load in the watching domain * added solution to open issue: how to identify two subscriptions as coming from different RLS in watching domain? Solution is to use instance parameter in Contact header field, which is now required to be used by RLS. * minor nit fixes based on comments No open issues at this point and I think the doc is ready for WGLC. -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 07:10:10 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24ED63A6A46; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:10:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D60033A6AA7 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:10:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.563 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.563 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.036, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Hf-+-v3dKfz1 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:10:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-2.cisco.com (rtp-iport-2.cisco.com [64.102.122.149]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EABB28C2D1 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 07:08:33 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,359,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="14224992" Received: from rtp-dkim-2.cisco.com ([64.102.121.159]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Jul 2008 14:08:56 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-2.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6EE8uiV028179; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:08:56 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EE8uY4003568; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 14:08:56 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:08:56 -0400 Received: from [10.86.249.159] ([10.86.249.159]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:08:56 -0400 Message-ID: <487B5DFF.3040408@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:09:03 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Robert Sparks References: <822C0A32-4BA8-422B-8FE0-5C3F5D6F739B@estacado.net> <48742C20.2080302@cisco.com> <48765411.5050803@cisco.com> <2A11E205-477F-4F00-ACDF-F832281027E7@nostrum.com> In-Reply-To: <2A11E205-477F-4F00-ACDF-F832281027E7@nostrum.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jul 2008 14:08:56.0078 (UTC) FILETIME=[2748B2E0:01C8E5BB] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=1313; t=1216044536; x=1216908536; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim2001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Simple]=20comments=20on=20draft-ietf-s imple-view-sharing-00 |Sender:=20 |To:=20Robert=20Sparks=20; bh=FZ2ws7cb1hFMUlO2SSzfYq85vWNMortBOYB64QvIoZ8=; b=maWLMho+ufHWXsxsgPuYZ26yHN0W6HdO2GrLF+iRgdwtmSXQPAgxFyn7m4 9Wb2Wqp12/gtvUA4YFAv7GPthUegiUUg/H4nqx8gp6cGT45i9mS4meOwPfEk dgOYeUIGax; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-2; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim2001 verified; ); Cc: Michael Froman , simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] comments on draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-00 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Robert Sparks wrote: > >> Is this a real problem? "Immediate" NOTIFY doesn't have a requirement >> around a specific time; it seems reasonable to wait for whatever >> backend DB operations are required before you send a NOTIFY. You need >> to do that anyway to figure out what presence document to send them. > > It really does have to be immediate - in the same sense that responses > to Non-INVITE requests have to be immediate. > There's a race. > > The subscriber will stop listening for NOTIFYs from other forks than the > one that corresponds with the 200 OK very shortly after that 200 OK > arrives. Well, in the case of presence at least there isn't going to be forking; RFC3856 forbids multiple dialogs from being created from forked branches. Particularly in the case of federation I wouldn't expect to see this happen even if it were allowed. Thinking about other event packages though, I actually couldn't find a value for this timer in RFC 3265. Is one defined? -Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 13:47:09 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98E7428C334; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:47:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 237FD3A6A0F for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:47:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cE1Jct-IeX5j for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:47:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A6183A6A7D for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:46:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.3.232] (vicuna-alt.estacado.net [75.53.54.121]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6EKlHhh068566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:47:18 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: <71733B0E-9834-40B8-BBC7-5729A619CB3F@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:47:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 75.53.54.121 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.3/7709/Mon Jul 14 11:16:52 2008 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [Simple] strawman IETF72 agenda for SIMPLE X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org So here's a strawman agenda for the hour we have. Please bash it into the right shape. 5 Administrivia chairs 15 Intradomain Federation Jonathan 10 View Sharing Jonathan 10 MSRP Alternate Connection Model Christer 10 Opaque MSRP URI Derek 10 Group Presence Henning Its very full - if anything runs over, the topics at the end won't get covered, so be sure to comment on order of importance to you. Note that what's _not_ here is any time for Chat. If you disagree, let me know why. (IMDN isn't there either, but I _think_ we can handle any remaining discussion on it on list) And, of course, tell me what else I've missed. RjS _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 17:00:04 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 822E43A6AA1; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:00:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@ietf.org Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 0652D3A67AC; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:00:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20080715000002.0652D3A67AC@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Cc: simple@ietf.org Subject: [Simple] I-D Action:draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions Working Group of the IETF. Title : Models for Intra-Domain Presence and Instant Messaging (IM) Federation Author(s) : J. Rosenberg, et al. Filename : draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt Pages : 44 Date : 2008-07-14 Presence and Instant Messaging (IM) federation involves the sharing of presence information and exchange of IM across multiple systems. Most often, presence and IM federation is assumed to be between different organizations, such as between two enterprises or between and enterprise and a service provider. However, federation can occur within a single organization or domain. This can be the result of a multi-vendor network, or a consequence of a large organization that requires partitioning. This document examines different use cases and models for intra-domain presence and IM federation. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-07-14165047.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --NextPart-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Mon Jul 14 17:04:44 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E683C28C389; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:04:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6443928C349 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:04:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.568 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.568 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.031, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JYAr82aJCcNi for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:04:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rtp-iport-1.cisco.com (rtp-iport-1.cisco.com [64.102.122.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 447023A6C6D for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:01:36 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.30,361,1212364800"; d="scan'208";a="14304129" Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 15 Jul 2008 00:02:02 +0000 Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6F022Th004205 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:02:02 -0400 Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6F022n6001581 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 00:02:02 GMT Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:02:02 -0400 Received: from [10.86.248.220] ([10.86.248.220]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:02:01 -0400 Message-ID: <487BE901.1000105@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:02:09 -0400 From: Jonathan Rosenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Simple WG X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Jul 2008 00:02:01.0867 (UTC) FILETIME=[02112DB0:01C8E60E] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=1168; t=1216080122; x=1216944122; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jdrosen@cisco.com; z=From:=20Jonathan=20Rosenberg=20 |Subject:=20Updated=20intra-domain=20federation=20draft |Sender:=20 |To:=20Simple=20WG=20; bh=QPQXv5x0dY41agT6MVqmGmEgPcAB5MbuNqtMk1rc3eM=; b=ZdUEAUnlgzLeW349ALMoXbuYjP+BTuga1/ms/m3eSGjY1JZEabj23p16+Q nUnoPwWQcfEivJDn/ohgqNVTYd9pwV63UZ3OdzBfMSUMKT2ZSVYdWItdnFAh WjS792NZ60; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jdrosen@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Subject: [Simple] Updated intra-domain federation draft X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org I've just submitted an update to the intra-domain federation spec: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt Some major updates: * added IM, which introduced an IM-specific consideration called 'conversation consistency' - seeing a consistent view of IM conversations both past and present. Introducing IM also changed the definition of unioned federation; ownership of registration state in multiple places is now the key property for defining IM unioned federation * added additional considerations in the exclusive model for routing - in particular database change notifications * removed open issue around subdomaining as a fourth model - really no need to add. * added another model for policy in unioned federation - usage of a centralized PDP plus many minor fixes. Thanks, Jonathan R. -- Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D. 499 Thornall St. Cisco Fellow Edison, NJ 08837 Cisco, Voice Technology Group jdrosen@cisco.com http://www.jdrosen.net PHONE: (408) 902-3084 http://www.cisco.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 15 06:40:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC6A83A6A4F; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B62783A686A for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dGhiu+5pfMx6 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fk-out-0910.google.com (fk-out-0910.google.com [209.85.128.190]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E60A03A67D2 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by fk-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 18so3177792fkq.5 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:reply-to :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Dii5sEaR7NrjqN4euuwjP3Myrv8fp6ElD+chf7/CR8M=; b=pgPkbv7DTJAoRKQbkK5QvPe8xxduJdklPSHzv42dVeAC3yTZAp1hZ/I7mAb4quovRp MrJ20XatVpWYEdOtpCEtctQk4ClNtPd9oy/CI3AtQRcWc3NVcqRG8Sd0Z6hI95aWUyQS AOex26EidmNVqshPel6hln69/9oBZFE/55bDE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=JXeaQZA4LZ5z98Ox5ZW3JxZ168DTZobTKTFvcLdBOTrplfafZxdGzOfCo7eKGzmXy7 ieINP+SIoatAoJ7I7mBbLHUybEpBcFKFoQZ6/yaYPGvVfW4vOdB/JJBb7lQXBPlZplSj E9q6bhbCgLCROG5P2YIak4RhEwEM4k1aEcy5g= Received: by 10.187.203.4 with SMTP id f4mr2472933faq.1.1216129231709; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?192.168.1.3? ( [86.121.128.69]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 39sm309556hui.60.2008.07.15.06.40.29 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 15 Jul 2008 06:40:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <487CA8CD.3050208@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 16:40:29 +0300 From: Daniel-Constantin Mierla User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (X11/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: simple@ietf.org Subject: [Simple] SIP/SIMPLE-XMPP Developer Workshop 2008 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: miconda@gmail.com List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hello, for those interested in SIP/SIMPLE - XMPP interoperability, there is going to be a workshop in Paris for developers in the first week of September. Detailed description of the event follows. Best regards, Daniel SIMPLE-XMPP Developer Workshop 2008 SIP/SIMPLE and XMPP share a lot of concepts but they are different in many aspects. Being nowadays the leading open protocols for voice, video, instant messaging and presence, the interconnection between them creates an unified communication environment for users in both sides. The workshop aims to bring together people with large expertise in both protocols, interested in development, testing and deployment of SIP/SIMPLE-XMPP solutions. With a permanent focus on innovation, the participants cover open source projects to private enterprises. You can join the event for free. Date: September 2-5, 2008 Place: INRIA, Paris, France Main organizers: - Philippe Sultan, INRIA - contributor to the XMPP/Jingle support in Asterisk, member of XMPP Standards Foundation - Olle E. Johansson, Edvina - main SIP developer of Asterisk - Daniel-Constantin Mierla, Asipto - co-founder Openser, developer of XMPP/Jabber gateway Goal: - kick up simple-xmpp interoperability Agenda guidelines: - identify common issues of simple-xmpp interoperability - define best-practice solutions and workarounds of delicate issues - coding sessions in existing applications such as Asterisk, Openser, Jabberd, Freeswitch, eJabberd, libraries, client applications, etc. - testing sessions - reports about past experiences and results of the workshop Target participants: - developers of simple-xmpp products - people interested in testing simple-xmpp products - people interested in building simple-xmpp communication environments Cost: - free registration (everybody pays for its traveling and accommodation) Registration: - via e-mail at simple-xmpp@asipto.com - please write the motivation to participate and add bullets into agenda if you like to approach new subjects. The organizers reserve the right to select a group of people that will contribute most as this is mainly a workshop to approach issues, test interoperability and design new solutions. - updates about the event are posted at: http://www.asipto.com/index.php/simple-xmpp-developer-workshop-2008/ Size: - up to 20 people As of Jul 15, 2008, participating companies are: - INRIA - http://www.inria.fr - SIP-XMPP interoperability in Asterisk (http://www.asterisk.org) - Edvina - http://www.edvina.net - SIP-XMPP interoperability in Asterisk (http://www.asterisk.org) - AG Projects - http://www.ag-projects.com - MSRP-XMPP Interoperability (http://www.msrprelay.org) - Asipto - http://www.asipto.com - SIP-XMPP interoperability in Openser (http://www.openser.org) General discussions about sip-xmpp can be conducted via mailing list: sip-xmpp [at] xmpp.org http://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/sip-xmpp -- Daniel-Constantin Mierla http://www.asipto.com _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 15 16:02:59 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 072103A698E; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 16:02:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7A593A685C for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 16:02:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.149 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.149 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MSGID_MULTIPLE_AT=1.449] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E-ntOa0dpJao for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 16:02:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tpamail2.verizon.com (tpamail2.verizon.com [192.76.82.136]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFC7A3A698E for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 16:02:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpftw3.verizon.com (smtpftw3.verizon.com [138.83.140.92]) by tpamail2.verizon.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m6FN3NYo024978 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ftwintrmemf2.verizon.com (ftwintrmemf2.verizon.com [138.83.131.184]) by smtpftw3.verizon.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m6FN3N0B025448 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ftwintrmemf2.verizon.com (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by ftwintrmemf2.verizon.com (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 5AD39528002 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:23 -0400 (EDT) X-AuditID: 8a5383b8-a2ebabb000000647-38-487d2cbbc160 Received: from smtptpa.verizon.com (unknown [138.83.66.45]) by ftwintrmemf2.verizon.com (EMF) with ESMTP id 2A7EF4E4002 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from madrid ([106.12.2.67]) by smtptpa.verizon.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m6FN3JfJ018371 for ; Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Piotr Boni" To: Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:03:13 -0400 Message-ID: <005701c8e6ce$f5ad35c0$e107a140$@boni@verizon.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 thread-index: AcjmzvUmNz/AhSN0QKeKcfdxD+dejw== Content-Language: en-us X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Subject: Re: [Simple] New Version Notification for draft-singh-simple-membership-01 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1845978681==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============1845978681== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0058_01C8E6AD.6E9B95C0" Content-Language: en-us This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C8E6AD.6E9B95C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, We have submitted a new Internet-draft: Membership Event Package Authors: Vishal Singh, Henning Schulzrinne, Piotr Boni The draft is available at: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-singh-simple-membership-01.txt Please find the abstract below: This document defines a new event membership package that allows to track changes in membership in groups. Groups can represent entities contained within a physical space, such as a room or vehicle, or a logical group of entities, such as a call center team. Each member of a group can support a different set of event packages. Your comments are appreciated Best Piotr Piotr Boni Verizon Network & Technology 117 West Street Waltham, MA 02451 phone: 781-466-2903 cell phone: 781-789-4819 e-mail: piotr.boni@verizon.com -----Original Message----- From: IETF I-D Submission Tool [mailto:idsubmission@ietf.org] Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:51 PM To: piotr.boni@core.verizon.com Cc: vs2140@cs.columbia.edu; hgs+simple@cs.columbia.edu Subject: New Version Notification for draft-singh-simple-membership-01 A new version of I-D, draft-singh-simple-membership-01.txt has been successfuly submitted by Piotr Boni and posted to the IETF repository. Filename: draft-singh-simple-membership Revision: 01 Title: Membership Event Package Creation_date: 2008-07-14 WG ID: Independent Submission Number_of_pages: 15 Abstract: This document defines a new event membership package that allows to track changes in membership in groups. Groups can represent entities contained within a physical space, such as a room or vehicle, or a logical group of entities, such as a call center team. Each member of a group can support a different set of event packages. The IETF Secretariat. ------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C8E6AD.6E9B95C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

All,

We have submitted a new Internet-draft:

Membership Event Package

Authors: Vishal Singh, Henning Schulzrinne, Piotr Boni

 

The draft is available at:

 

http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sing= h-simple-membership-01.txt

 

Please find the abstract below:

 

This document defines a new event membership package that allows to track = changes in membership in groups.  Groups can represent entities contained = within a physical space, such as a room or vehicle, or a logical group of = entities, such as a call center team.  Each member of a group can support a = different set of event packages.

 

Your comments are appreciated

 

Best

Piotr

 

Piotr Boni

Verizon Network & Technology

117 West Street

Waltham, MA 02451

phone: 781-466-2903

cell phone: 781-789-4819

e-mail: piotr.boni@verizon.com

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: IETF I-D Submission Tool [mailto:idsubmission@ietf.org]
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:51 PM
To: piotr.boni@core.verizon.com
Cc: vs2140@cs.columbia.edu; hgs+simple@cs.columbia.edu
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-singh-simple-membership-01 =

 

 

A new version of I-D, draft-singh-simple-membership-01.txt has been successfuly submitted by = Piotr Boni and posted to the IETF repository.

 

Filename:   = draft-singh-simple-membership

Revision:   01

Title:       &nbs= p;   =20 Membership Event Package

Creation_date:    = 2008-07-14

WG = ID:           =20 Independent Submission

Number_of_pages: 15

 

Abstract:

This document defines a new event membership = package that allows to

track changes in membership in groups.  = Groups can represent entities

contained within a physical space, such as a = room or vehicle, or a

logical group of entities, such as a call center team.  Each member

of a group can support a different set of event = packages.

  =             &= nbsp;           &n= bsp;           &nb= sp;           &nbs= p;            = ;            =        

 

 

The IETF Secretariat.

 

------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C8E6AD.6E9B95C0-- --===============1845978681== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============1845978681==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jul 17 06:48:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A25163A6968; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 06:48:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BAB53A6968 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 06:48:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.274 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.274 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.025, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0Mow2iW4+GmB for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 06:48:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (mailgw4.ericsson.se [193.180.251.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078A83A68A8 for ; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 06:48:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id A4F562141A; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 15:48:06 +0200 (CEST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-ab192bb000004ec0-cb-487f4d96938b Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.123]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 7D736204E1; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 15:48:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.174]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 15:48:06 +0200 Received: from mail.lmf.ericsson.se ([131.160.11.50]) by esealmw126.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 17 Jul 2008 15:48:06 +0200 Received: from nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se [131.160.33.3]) by mail.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05B6F2462; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:48:05 +0300 (EEST) Received: from nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id B52CC4DC75; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:48:05 +0300 (EEST) Received: from n68.nomadiclab.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by nomadiclab.lmf.ericsson.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68E714DB19; Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:48:05 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <487F4D95.8020901@ericsson.com> Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:48:05 +0300 From: Salvatore Loreto User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Hadriel Kaplan References: In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jul 2008 13:48:06.0199 (UTC) FILETIME=[BD898C70:01C8E813] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Cc: "simple@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hi, I have just finished the read the draft and I have a doubt in my mind. It is not clear to me how using the SDP c/m-lines for transport addressing is still possible to MSRP allows multiple session to share the same TCP connection. maybe I am missing something. /sal Hadriel Kaplan wrote: > A direct URL for the opaque-path draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt > > And to give some more context to this draft, it also addresses the problem discussed in Staffan Blau and Christer's msrp-acm draft, by removing the dependency on the path attribute address usage. To do this it uses the SDP c/m-lines for transport addressing instead, as msrp-acm and Remi's msrp-comedia draft do. Therefore there is a sort of Venn diagram of partial overlap for the problems that need to be solved and their solutions in all 3 of these drafts. > > -hadriel > > ________________________________________ > From: simple-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:simple-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Derek MacDonald > Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 12:39 PM > To: simple@ietf.org > Subject: [Simple] draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path > > This draft describes an extension to MSRP which allow efficient topology hiding. It defines a mechanism to have an MSRP URI which is a pointer to an IP address which is not itself contained in the MSRP messages. > > -Derek > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > Date: Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 3:12 PM > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00 > To: derek@counterpath.com > Cc: hkaplan@acmepacket.com > > > > A new version of I-D, draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt has been successfuly submitted by Derek MacDonald and posted to the IETF repository. > > Filename: draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path > Revision: 00 > Title: Opaque MSRP Path Uri > Creation_date: 2008-07-07 > WG ID: Independent Submission > Number_of_pages: 10 > > Abstract: > The Message Session Relay Protocol(MSRP) does not allow efficient > topology hiding, such that MSRP users can hide the IP Address of > their systems. This limitation is due to the fact that MSRP Path > headers contain physical IP addresses. This document describes a > mechanism which adds a level of indirection to allow topology hiding. > It defines the option tag msrp-opaque. > > > > The IETF Secretariat. > > > _______________________________________________ > Simple mailing list > Simple@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple > > _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jul 18 13:07:13 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9196C28C299; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:07:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C17A28C289 for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:07:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.001, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZDra4jL5oJX1 for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:07:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from estacado.net (estacado-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:266::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A404728C27D for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:07:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.3.232] (dn3-232.estacado.net [172.16.3.232]) (authenticated bits=0) by estacado.net (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6IK7fDm080521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:07:41 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@estacado.net) Message-Id: <0812673D-2121-431B-83DF-1472D4411384@estacado.net> From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:07:41 -0500 References: <12BA6CCB-D50F-4E13-AB63-6334BC41E9CD@nostrum.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Subject: [Simple] Fwd: Items of cross group interest X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1617863523==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --===============1617863523== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-35--266223242 --Apple-Mail-35--266223242 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ARGH. Missed a crosspost target. Begin forwarded message: > From: Robert Sparks > Date: July 18, 2008 3:07:03 PM CDT > To: GEOPRIV > Cc: SIP IETF , sipping LIST > Subject: Items of cross group interest > Reply-To: GEOPRIV > > This message is heavily crossposted. It is set to reply-to geopriv. > If you manually reply-to, please reply there. > > There are some questions about how to best provide location for some > applications. To date, the answer from GEOPRIV has been to use > Presence as defined by SIMPLE and extended by GEOPRIV. (We've spent > time arguing that in GEOPRIV more than once). > > There are some new proposals, perhaps with new information, that > push at that answer again, and in some cases, if they move forward, > its not clear what the best venue to vet them in is. But we have to > start somewhere, and the plan at the moment is to have a framing > discussion in GEOPRIV. > > Please review the following drafts, comment on the GEOPRIV list if > you have an opinion, and plan to attend this section of the GEOPRIV > meeting if you have an interest in how the conversation turns out. > > ------ > Location events/filters > draft-ietf-geopriv-loc-filters-02.txt > draft-winterbottom-sip-location-package-00.txt > draft-polk-sip-location-get-00.txt --Apple-Mail-35--266223242 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ARGH. Missed a crosspost = target.


Begin forwarded message:

From: = Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com>
Date: = July 18, 2008 3:07:03 PM CDT
To: GEOPRIV = <geopriv@ietf.org>
Cc: SIP IETF = <sip@ietf.org>, sipping LIST = <sipping@ietf.org>
Subject: = Items of cross group interest
Reply-To: = GEOPRIV <geopriv@ietf.org>

This message = is heavily crossposted. It is set to reply-to geopriv.
If you = manually reply-to, please reply there.

There are some questions = about how to best provide location for some applications. To date, the = answer from GEOPRIV has been to use Presence as defined by SIMPLE and = extended by GEOPRIV. (We've spent time arguing that in GEOPRIV more than = once).

There are some new proposals, perhaps with new = information, that push at that answer again, and in some cases, if they = move forward, its not clear what the best venue to vet them in is. But = we have to start somewhere, and the plan at the moment is to have a = framing discussion in GEOPRIV.

Please review the following = drafts, comment on the GEOPRIV list if you have an opinion, and plan to = attend this section of the GEOPRIV meeting if you have an interest in = how the conversation turns out.

------
Location = events/filters
=           draft-ietf-geo= priv-loc-filters-02.txt
=           draft-winterbo= ttom-sip-location-package-00.txt
=           draft-polk-sip= -location-get-00.txt

= --Apple-Mail-35--266223242-- --===============1617863523== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============1617863523==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Fri Jul 18 13:15:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 642C228C2A6; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:15:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9D6728C2A6 for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:15:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nL8elSFhQdcD for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:15:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from estacado.net (estacado-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:266::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8660228C28D for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:15:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.3.232] (dn3-232.estacado.net [172.16.3.232]) (authenticated bits=0) by estacado.net (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6IKFqLX081541 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:15:52 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@estacado.net) Message-Id: <5BDB35B8-7F38-41D4-93F5-E9F23E6C350C@estacado.net> From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:15:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Subject: [Simple] Updated agenda for SIMPLE at IETF72 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org There has been no bashing (did I miss any?). Here's the same agenda with drafts added. ------ Agenda: SIMPLE at IETF72 5m Administrivia chairs 15m Intradomain Federation Jonathan draft-ietf-simple-intradomain-federation-01.txt 10m View Sharing Jonathan draft-ietf-simple-view-sharing-01.txt 10m MSRP Alternate Connection Model Christer draft-blau-simple-msrp-acm-00.txt (be careful, there was a previously, similarly named -00 - you want to read _this_ one) 10m Opaque MSRP URI Derek draft-macdonald-simple-msrp-opaque-path-00.txt 10m Group Presence Henning draft-singh-simple-membership-01.txt _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Tue Jul 22 11:07:01 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C28ED3A6991; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:07:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E5EE3A693E for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:07:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.632 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.632 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.018, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9WfRjL7FAVx5 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from estacado.net (dsl001-129-069.dfw1.dsl.speakeasy.net [72.1.129.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BAAB3A6929 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dn3-233.estacado.net (dn3-233.estacado.net [172.16.3.233]) (authenticated bits=0) by estacado.net (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6MI6OC3083839 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:06:24 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from bcampen@estacado.net) Message-Id: From: Byron Campen To: simple@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v928.1) Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 13:06:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.928.1) Cc: Adam Roach Subject: [Simple] Bug in RFC 4826: resource-lists schema doesn't require anchor attribute X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0341127248==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --===============0341127248== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-6-72099574; micalg=sha1; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature" --Apple-Mail-6-72099574 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-5-72093395 --Apple-Mail-5-72093395 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The resource-lists schema in RFC 4826 does not match the normative text wrt whether the "anchor" attribute is required in elements. The normative text reads: " The element has a single mandatory attribute, "anchor", which specifies the external list by means of an absolute HTTP URI. " The schema reads: " " I looked in the rfc errata, but did see this mentioned. Should I go ahead and file a new erratum? Best regards, Byron Campen --Apple-Mail-5-72093395 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The resource-lists schema in RFC 4826 does not match = the normative text wrt whether the "anchor" attribute is required in = <external> elements. 

The normative text reads: 

"
   The <external> element has = a single
   mandatory = attribute, "anchor", which specifies the external list = by
   means of an = absolute HTTP URI.
"

The schema = reads:

"
    <xs:complexType = name=3D"externalType">
     = <xs:sequence>
      = <xs:element name=3D"display-name" = type=3D"display-nameType"
       = minOccurs=3D"0"/>
      <xs:any = namespace=3D"##other" processContents=3D"lax" = minOccurs=3D"0"
       = maxOccurs=3D"unbounded"/>
     = </xs:sequence>
     = <xs:attribute name=3D"anchor" type=3D"xs:anyURI"/>
     <xs:anyAttribute namespace=3D"##other" = processContents=3D"lax"/>
    = </xs:complexType>
"

= I looked in the rfc errata, but did see this = mentioned. Should I go ahead and file a new = erratum?

Best regards,
Byron = Campen

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charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============0341127248==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 23 12:20:51 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E375F3A6AFE; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:20:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 210F23A6AFA for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:20:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lttLp+7WsZHv for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:20:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com (wr-out-0506.google.com [64.233.184.225]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71C9A3A6AF6 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 37so1870229wra.17 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:21:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :content-disposition; bh=38XNF8DcI+9yCsWcNIGCOpm8Q23ssNruOh2jK8T9910=; b=gM0UZiZFaO2z8zFdish42pmi4uQp2pGikWbRq1A6kcbId531wxdRzfD7R8IWxkolND KEO0fu7CG3FuXKX+l5Pg/h90IM9sq0iZAzqQDjxuKGpV4QhN0GQCGLXqzXM2GYIkJLqz osI3ZcpjyvOlppzpMxo7rYsOq9PdQ7mYlzx2s= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=HL6aNDnpCRWkJLVIpVGz0dSpUV8GXnrEAJThySn1g5xiYKLRyIuj1wDNZVmUHGXVGA b3nke4ZnTj9ITHe6zli2WuN/rHHGdV4dQeeyaBVWcmjDCRZ0HXyQw/Xw2PZhdcQDUiCy Ms0SmlImDPisG8SRH+1Kg/4fvsDpU27C0+kNY= Received: by 10.90.29.13 with SMTP id c13mr183878agc.34.1216840887569; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.115.13 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <455d6c10807231221m3ba93ca5j5def7e5ca80fcbcf@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 15:21:27 -0400 From: "Eric Tremblay" To: mikko.lonnfors@nokia.com, krisztian.kiss@nokia.com, simple@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Simple] draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hi Mikko & Krisztian, In section 3.2.14: I wonder if representing winfo support in the element as a single element makes sense. Just putting under a element does not mean that an application supports watcher-info for all events enumerated there. I think that winfo should somehow apply to an other event. Without an existing grammar to represent recursive template support (or limitations of such support), I would suggest representing a single level of support and then applications could assume that if presence.winfo is supported, then presence.winfo.winfo should also be supported. A bug already exists to track this issue: http://bugs.sipit.net/show_bug.cgi?id=711 I suggest two options: 1) Allowing an optional element under the other event types (, , , , , , , , , , ) to indicate that winfo is supported for that specific event type. 2) Allowing an optional "template" attribute to the event types which could contain a comma separated list of templates supported for this event type. How do we then represent the fact that a device only supports conference.winfo but not conference? Maybe an additional attribute could do the trick... Best Regards, EricT _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 23 18:59:28 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A7223A69DB; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:59:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 162F63A69DB for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:59:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KSJEaNOqixu5 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:59:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mgw-mx09.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [192.100.105.134]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 103953A6901 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:59:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh106.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.138.213]) by mgw-mx09.nokia.com (Switch-3.2.6/Switch-3.2.6) with ESMTP id m6O1xRqN012256; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 21:00:04 -0500 Received: from daebh101.NOE.Nokia.com ([10.241.35.111]) by esebh106.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 24 Jul 2008 04:59:28 +0300 Received: from daebe103.NOE.Nokia.com ([10.241.35.24]) by daebh101.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 23 Jul 2008 20:59:26 -0500 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 20:59:24 -0500 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <455d6c10807231221m3ba93ca5j5def7e5ca80fcbcf@mail.gmail.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment Thread-Index: Acjs+VT2T9V/OL2eTIe+gX+7afGlMAAJwykA References: <455d6c10807231221m3ba93ca5j5def7e5ca80fcbcf@mail.gmail.com> From: To: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Jul 2008 01:59:26.0202 (UTC) FILETIME=[E68925A0:01C8ED30] X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: Re: [Simple] draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hi Eric, I see your point. However, I read the bug report which says: "Adam Roach: Truth is, once you implement a template, the implementation technically can support applying it to anything (unless you're a really bad programmer). Adam Roach: The only thing that might prevent it from working is a decision -- either by the programmer or by the administrator -- that certain combinations are dangerous or silly. Adam Roach: Ergo, it's a policy decision." ...so the question comes to my mind: is presence the right tool to advertize what kind of policy restrictions are implemented at the UA when applying a template package? Or, should we just leave this policy exchange to the actual subscription transaction, i.e. let the UA advertize support for template package and if a UA policy disallows certain combinations with other event packages or recursive template support, that will be discovered during subscription time (rejecting unallowed events with 489/403 as described in the bug report). As explained in section 1.2 and 4, "This extension is only aimed for presentities to give watchers hints about the presentity's preferences, willingness and capabilities to communicate before watchers initiate a communication with the presentity.", so it is not meant to replace capability negotiation procedures with SIP. What is your view on this option? Cheers, Krisztian P.S. there's another major problem to change the draft at this point of time: it is currently in RFC editor's queue waiting for a final confirmation from the ADs and then the RFC is out... >-----Original Message----- >From: ext Eric Tremblay [mailto:eric.m.tremblay@gmail.com] >Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 12:21 PM >To: Lonnfors Mikko (Nokia-D-MSW/Helsinki); Kiss Krisztian >(Nokia-OCTO/MtView); simple@ietf.org >Subject: draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment > >Hi Mikko & Krisztian, > >In section 3.2.14: >I wonder if representing winfo support in the >element as a single element makes sense. Just putting > under a element does not mean that an >application supports watcher-info for all events enumerated there. > >I think that winfo should somehow apply to an other event. >Without an existing grammar to represent recursive template >support (or limitations of such support), I would suggest >representing a single level of support and then applications >could assume that if presence.winfo is supported, then >presence.winfo.winfo should also be supported. A bug already >exists to track this issue: >http://bugs.sipit.net/show_bug.cgi?id=711 > >I suggest two options: > >1) Allowing an optional element under the other event >types (, , , , >, , , , >, , >) to indicate that winfo is supported for >that specific event type. > >2) Allowing an optional "template" attribute to the event >types which could contain a comma separated list of templates >supported for this event type. > >How do we then represent the fact that a device only supports >conference.winfo but not conference? Maybe an additional >attribute could do the trick... > >Best Regards, > >EricT > _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jul 24 07:00:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0821F3A6A0A; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B4E3A6A0A for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_36=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GEKDLkBi7HDu for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com (wr-out-0506.google.com [64.233.184.231]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ED9F3A67B5 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 37so2420022wra.17 for ; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=hz/RJQRrNz116+pXWQmmFvN4rl30A3/kaNq7sDcdgpM=; b=pqqyhnadKDgPIq2JHHAec7sj3TmUqJmFWMb+rWdUIr8ua/weKx3n1yHuc31eeINQXG MVUFOvjOoALq705jN988m9MyUm5oYxKHkca/lm0pTGVv6b8jA36TV8WvTbjbpTBeQqnC m22bEO1DnRa+Pxqs/HjCGWHjasDOZh4OG9Fjo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=dU1AFBN6i/uUWkfU4ObTIgJ09fMy4Y++DCmpXo/uiXRdbp8FAIKiaCRIafIP0PmOG0 2XXg1XX1OyZUe1pHvl5aObwwDtxuzYX4Pqin8RF58rLYYfsDcerud3m+8+1CiIk8nboa hB+XnJ4YffUunvNDxJvlyiTKF2GJPTTLVCGgM= Received: by 10.90.86.9 with SMTP id j9mr425873agb.11.1216908057878; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.115.13 with HTTP; Thu, 24 Jul 2008 07:00:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <455d6c10807240700m2bbc0566p57de3e7dae23c1c3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 10:00:57 -0400 From: "Eric Tremblay" To: krisztian.kiss@nokia.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline References: <455d6c10807231221m3ba93ca5j5def7e5ca80fcbcf@mail.gmail.com> Cc: mikko.lonnfors@nokia.com, simple@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Simple] draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hi Krisztian, Good point, I did not read the bug report like this, but this makes more sense to me now. So this should apply to Allow-Event and the sip.events UA caps. I see that there are some implementations that do place presence.winfo (or even presence.winfo.winfo) into their Allow-Event and I would assume they would do the same in sip.events. However, when mapping this to PIDF UA Caps, they would have to include the element if any of their supported events include winfo, without specifying for which event it is supported. It is then up to the recipient of this information to find out if winfo is supported for a specific event using the standard SIP mechanism. Thanks for the clarification. I agree it was quite late to change the spec, but we at least have some justifications logged into the mailing list now :) Best Regards, EricT On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 9:59 PM, wrote: > Hi Eric, > > I see your point. However, I read the bug report which says: > > "Adam Roach: Truth is, once you implement a template, the implementation > technically can support applying it to anything (unless you're a really > bad > programmer). > Adam Roach: The only thing that might prevent it from working is a > decision -- > either by the programmer or by the administrator -- that certain > combinations > are dangerous or silly. > Adam Roach: Ergo, it's a policy decision." > > ...so the question comes to my mind: is presence the right tool to > advertize what kind of policy restrictions are implemented at the UA > when applying a template package? Or, should we just leave this policy > exchange to the actual subscription transaction, i.e. let the UA > advertize support for template package and if a UA policy > disallows certain combinations with other event packages or recursive > template support, that will be discovered during subscription time > (rejecting unallowed events with 489/403 as described in the bug > report). > As explained in section 1.2 and 4, "This extension is only aimed for > presentities to give watchers hints about the presentity's preferences, > willingness and capabilities to communicate before watchers initiate a > communication with the presentity.", so it is not meant to replace > capability negotiation procedures with SIP. What is your view on this > option? > > Cheers, > Krisztian > > P.S. there's another major problem to change the draft at this point of > time: it is currently in RFC editor's queue waiting for a final > confirmation from the ADs and then the RFC is out... > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: ext Eric Tremblay [mailto:eric.m.tremblay@gmail.com] >>Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 12:21 PM >>To: Lonnfors Mikko (Nokia-D-MSW/Helsinki); Kiss Krisztian >>(Nokia-OCTO/MtView); simple@ietf.org >>Subject: draft-ietf-simple-prescaps-ext-10 comment >> >>Hi Mikko & Krisztian, >> >>In section 3.2.14: >>I wonder if representing winfo support in the >>element as a single element makes sense. Just putting >> under a element does not mean that an >>application supports watcher-info for all events enumerated there. >> >>I think that winfo should somehow apply to an other event. >>Without an existing grammar to represent recursive template >>support (or limitations of such support), I would suggest >>representing a single level of support and then applications >>could assume that if presence.winfo is supported, then >>presence.winfo.winfo should also be supported. A bug already >>exists to track this issue: >>http://bugs.sipit.net/show_bug.cgi?id=711 >> >>I suggest two options: >> >>1) Allowing an optional element under the other event >>types (, , , , >>, , , , >>, , >>) to indicate that winfo is supported for >>that specific event type. >> >>2) Allowing an optional "template" attribute to the event >>types which could contain a comma separated list of templates >>supported for this event type. >> >>How do we then represent the fact that a device only supports >>conference.winfo but not conference? Maybe an additional >>attribute could do the trick... >> >>Best Regards, >> >>EricT >> > _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 30 04:51:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1916328C1A0; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 04:51:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6482628C198 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.376 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.376 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_72=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZSWxyIX7ee3r for ; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.170]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9936D3A682F for ; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so3302874wfd.31 for ; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:reply-to :sender:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:x-google-sender-auth; bh=5eVOFzszTQoQjW8zo6ZsyI3VNhg5TtahzcrIP4FzQhg=; b=GCs9TyNf6KCtUE4nn5TSz4EAE4gkmMYz2j43VL2XaCyW1jTcw3sF8ot3tFlHHS1WTb BADpn1CraYgnOMBcW7JnRXRjTrJYZgo0ewSo4PbXCS/AnBnmcFlx+gxxU7Wqtxy/F05/ iVLqWPg4mgx0NONMOObboTlIoWAyE+dgSOVfc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:sender:to:subject:mime-version :content-type:x-google-sender-auth; b=xXd8MQMheEiajLhExKCp+SmArAVpRzcoNlomZQWfpnemFlz9muJLejLY4DtQmuqPhm cKgXK761RGyHgolvG9VINt/O3+hxe78mfocO0Hl1sF01UChe1UBwJioHt/mK49M/WZRk Zt4qajFpfAJ4MtEOsgATNajnkFZZaTQ09O1lc= Received: by 10.142.43.7 with SMTP id q7mr970671wfq.11.1217089294355; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.254.18 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <229d210e0807260921lf1644a4q8298151038dbba52@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 17:21:34 +0100 From: "Joao Antunes" To: simple@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Google-Sender-Auth: da3e3329b143190e X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 04:51:19 -0700 Subject: [Simple] [SIMPLE - WG] [MSRP and MSRP relays rfc 4975 and 4976] - Small questions about these protocols. X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: joao.antunes@tagus.ist.utl.pt List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0248793097==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --===============0248793097== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_5081_8001205.1217089294349" ------=_Part_5081_8001205.1217089294349 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Hi! I have some small questions about those protocols, which i don't seem to find an answer in the RFCs, i apologize beforehand if I overlooked something, and please, if i did overlooked point me to the rfc chapter or even just the rfc if you would be so kind. Going right to it: "When an endpoint that sent a SEND request receives a failure REPORT indicating that a particular byte range was not received, it MUST treat the session as failed. If it wishes to recover, it MUST first re-negotiate the URIs at the signaling level then resend that range of bytes of the message on the resulting new session." - How does the message receiver knows that the SEND has failed in the case that the REPORT was sent by a relay? - How does the message receiver (the receiver of the SEND request) knows when to discard the message?Is it assumed that if anything goes wrong the sender will try to resume the sending of a message? Thanks in advance, Jo=E3o Antunes ------=_Part_5081_8001205.1217089294349 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Hi!

I have some small questions about those protoco= ls, which i don't seem to find an answer in the RFCs, i apologize befor= ehand if I overlooked something, and please, if i did overlooked point me t= o the rfc chapter or even just the rfc if you would be so kind.

Going right to it:


"When an endpoint th= at sent a SEND request receives a failure REPORT
indicating that a pa= rticular byte range was not received, it MUST
treat the session as failed. If it wishes to recover, it MUST first
= re-negotiate the URIs at the signaling level then resend that range
= of bytes of the message on the resulting new session."
 - How does the message receiver knows that the SEND has failed in the case = that the REPORT was sent by a relay?
- How does the message receiver (t= he receiver of the SEND request) knows when to discard the message?Is it as= sumed that if anything goes wrong the sender will try to resume the sending= of a message?

Thanks in advance,
Jo=E3o Antunes
------=_Part_5081_8001205.1217089294349-- --===============0248793097== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============0248793097==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 30 08:02:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF2B23A6C11; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68F653A6A13 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.159 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.159 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.441, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LOOZ-Joqh9AK for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from yx-out-2324.google.com (yx-out-2324.google.com [74.125.44.29]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B47153A6C0D for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by yx-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 8so15016yxg.49 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :content-disposition; bh=etT7JsuaYXL619SSIer6PJEEzYhLu4fILGERqP310fA=; b=ZLexXZ0HiFr/D1omMtxKdbpq6xJqoQh4Bly26NzxyVWa5zpvwFyis6mtark6Dvz8Tp UGTbWCP0v3eYHocJvVb2HCXE18a1IIp730I3i5/RSTzgU8xle9T5OdPyuZSdy3AdQlQe /SiLWeotsNUf7Pehcb2o+CYw+SNJlDTFz9oho= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=LLud5D5bsoiXag0qXQHfm9d3JIrD/qL9Lxj8xv3TzZtOaIsN0sPdgo8efVIcA/H8pW O6eNqlzKJKUgEcfWXe2To4JyjYz5tFlKz3oBKgGvlbtgv8NulY9SaWY7/Qo7SD9v+Whp rfkcrTJKSCk5zG5ycA8uKRzONkmf8a6Z2kLag= Received: by 10.142.223.20 with SMTP id v20mr2729654wfg.336.1217430134837; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.200.19 with HTTP; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:02:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4f6069290807300802m4e515c84qe2eb0872a00e425b@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 11:02:14 -0400 From: "Vishal Singh" To: simple@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Simple] CFP for IMSAA-2008, Deadline -August 15th, 2008. X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Hi All, Sorry about posting this CFP on this list. Since, it is related to IMS, I thought some of folks on this list may be interested in this conference. Please find more details about the conference at the following link:- http://www.iiitb.ac.in/imsaa2008/index.html Regards, Vishal _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 30 08:15:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 062BD3A6AC0; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:15:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B866B28C27B for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:15:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zgnsv7WMjivG for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:15:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brinza.cc.columbia.edu (brinza.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.29.8]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A27F528C368 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:14:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dhcp-130-129-19-238.meeting.ietf.org ([130.129.19.238]) (user=hgs10 mech=PLAIN bits=0) by brinza.cc.columbia.edu (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6UFEhZZ007596 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 11:14:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: From: Henning Schulzrinne To: simple@ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 11:14:43 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) X-No-Spam-Score: Local X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.63 on 128.59.29.8 Subject: [Simple] Group membership draft X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org This dropped off the tail end of the agenda, but here's the slide presentation: http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~hgs/papers/2008/IETF72-simple.ppt Comments are much appreciated. Henning (on behalf of the authors) _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Wed Jul 30 19:04:57 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08D863A6BF2; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:04:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEB613A6A3B for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:04:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RatSrcRgfQUE for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etmail.acmepacket.com (etmail.acmepacket.com [216.41.24.6]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5F7528C152 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:04:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.acmepacket.com (216.41.24.7) by etmail.acmepacket.com (216.41.24.6) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.291.1; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:03:37 -0400 Received: from mail.acmepacket.com ([216.41.24.7]) by mail.acmepacket.com ([216.41.24.7]) with mapi; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:03:37 -0400 From: Hadriel Kaplan To: "simple@ietf.org" , Cullen Jennings Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:06:42 -0400 Thread-Topic: MSRP Opaque URI Thread-Index: AcjyshNdWNCO8S3nSXWaFrg649rnQA== Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Simple] MSRP Opaque URI X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Howdy, During the presentation of the opaque-uri draft, one of the comments made was that "you need an SBC to do this draft anonymization thing". The answer I said was "no", but I don't think I explained it very well, so I'll try again here: The opaque draft anonymizes the MSRP URI. It does not anonymize the IP layer itself used for the MSRP connection. To do that you need something in the middle that changes the IP. That can be an SBC, TURN server, or MSRP B2BUA. (The draft does not support it being a "MSRP Relay" as defined) A comment was then made that if you're using a TURN server you don't need to anonymize the MSRP URI because it will be the IP of the TURN anyway. That is true, afaict. But that doesn't mean you need an SBC for this draft. It just means that if you're using a TURN server it's superfluous to anonymize the MSRP URI. In other words, there's a Venn diagram with 4 circles of "relays" available: TURN, SBC, MSRP-b2bua, MSRP-Relay. This draft provides anonymization covering 3 of those - all except MSRP-Relay. It is true that you don't need this draft to just cover the one TURN circle, but that doesn't mean you need to be in the SBC circle to use this draft. Clear as mud? :) My point about the draft was *my* motivation for it (and perhaps Derek's) is to make MSRP work through SBCs, but the motivation for a UA would be to get anonymization. If you think we should re-write it to make it clear that the advantage is it will work through SBC's, that's fine with me. -hadriel _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple From simple-bounces@ietf.org Thu Jul 31 09:48:50 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4C0028C1DE; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:48:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 826CE3A6CF6 for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:48:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.54 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.54 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.060, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SltGCAfWPQlv for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:48:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (nostrum-pt.tunnel.tserv2.fmt.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FE013A6CEC for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:48:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [130.129.21.16] ([130.129.21.16]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m6VGmxlo012884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 11:49:01 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: <27ABC798-1842-4D8A-A3DD-9285C0901E52@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:48:58 +0100 References: <488A4A11.7030205@joelhalpern.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 130.129.21.16 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.3/7899/Thu Jul 31 10:40:41 2008 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [Simple] Fwd: Second Nomcom 2008-9 Call for Volunteers? X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0692759203==" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org --===============0692759203== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-105-845053797 --Apple-Mail-105-845053797 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Begin forwarded message: > From: "Joel M. Halpern" > Date: July 25, 2008 10:48:01 PM IST > To: ietf-announce@ietf.org > Subject: Second Nomcom 2008-9 Call for Volunteers? > > Second call for volunteers! > I am pleased to report that there are 38 volunteers whose > qualifications have been confirmed by the secretariat. (I have > mailed confirmation to all the volunteers. If you have volunteered > before 5:30 pm On Friday the 25th of July, 2008, and have not > received a confirmation from me, please resubmit.) > However, We need more volunteers. > Please! > Yes, you have until August 18th, 2008 as stated below (with the year > corrected from the typo in the initial announcement). But it is > better for all concerned if you can volunteer early. Please do so. > The full details are included below. Please use the listedSecond > format, as that helps me and the secretariat do our jobs better. > > Once the final list of volunteers has been confirmed by the > secretariat after the 18th of August, I will publish: > The schedule for the next phase > The list of candidate committee members and their stated affiliations > The exact random seeds for the RFC 3797 selection process, with at > least one week between the list publication and the random selection > (for objections or concerns from the community, as specified in RFC > 3777.) > > Thank you, > and I hope to hear from you soon as a volunteer, > Joel M. Halpern > > > Once again, the IETF nominating process has begun, and the community > (and I) need your help. The IETF Nominating Committee appoints > folks to > fill the open slots on the IAOC, the IAB, and the IESG. The people > who > do that are 10 folks selected randomly from the pool of volunteers. > To make this work well for the community, we need people to volunteer. > Lots of people. Please! > > Volunteers must have attended 3 of the past 5 IETF meetings. As > defined > by RFC 3777, that is 3 of the past 5 meetings as of the time this > announcement goes out to start the solicitation. If you qualify, and > are > willing to forgo appointment to any of the positions for which the > nominating committee is responsible, please volunteer. Details on the > nominating process can be found in RFC 3777. > > Below is the list of people and posts whose terms end with the March > 2009 IETF meeting, and whose positions therefore the nominating > committee is responsible for: > > IAOC: > Jonne Soininen > > IAB: > Loa Andersson > Barry Leiba > Kurtis Lindqvist > Danny McPherson > Dave Thaler > Lixia Zhang > > IESG: > IETF and IESG Chair: Russ Housley > Applications Area (app): Chris Newman > Internet Area (int): Mark Townsley > Operations and Management Area (ops): Ronald Bonica > Real-time Applications and Infrastructure Area (rai): > Jon Peterson > Routing Area (rtg): David Ward > Security Area (sec): Tim Polk > Transport Area (tsv): Lars Eggert > > Before volunteering, please think about whether you want to be > considered for one of the above positions instead. If you are willing > to volunteer, please send email before 5:00 pm EDT (2100 UTC/GMT) > August > 18, 2008 (otherwise, please read on) > > Please send email to me using the following skeleton: > > To: jmh@joelhalpern.com > Subject: Nomcom 2008-9 Volunteer > Body: > > // As you enter in the IETF Registration Form, > // First/Given name followed by Last/Family Name > > // typically what goes in the Company field > // in the IETF Registration Form > [] > // > // For confirmation if selected > > Please expect an email response from me within 1-2 days stating > whether you are qualified or not. If you don't receive anything, > please > re-send your email with the tag (duplicate) in the subject line. > During the IETF meeting in Dublin, responses will be somewhat slower, > due to both my activities at the meeting and the secretariat's many > activities in support of the meeting. I will try to send out at > least > a prompt confirmation that your email volunteering has been received. > > > Not convinced yet? Please consider that nomcom members play an > important role in shaping the leadership of the IETF. If you are a > people person, you will enjoy meeting many of the active > contributors to > the IETF. If you prefer instead to read a lot of email, well, we have > that too. Being a nomcom member is also an important > responsibility: it > requires adherence to confidentiality rules and some time commitment > from the members. The term of this nomcom will begin in early > September > this year. We will be talking with folks at the Minneapolis IETF (if > you are there. It is not mandatory that all nomcom members come to > the > meeting.) I hope to wrap up our primary selection work by mid- > December, > and we must complete our selection work by mid-January. > > We will be collecting requirements from the community, as well as > talking to candidates and to community members about candidates. > There will be weekly conference calls to ensure progress. > > > Nomcom members are selected following a publicly verifiable random > selection method specified in RFC 3797. > > For the nomcom to work as it should, the pool from which the > volunteers > are chosen should be as large as possible. The more people who > volunteer, the better chance we have of choosing a random yet > representative cross section of the IETF population. > > Ensuring the leadership of the IETF is fair and balanced and comprised > of those who can lead the IETF in the right direction is an important > responsibility that rests on the IETF participants at large. > Volunteering for the nomcom is a good way of contributing in that > direction. So please volunteer! > > > I will be publishing a more thorough and precise target timetable, as > well as details of the randomness seeds to be used for the RFC 3797 > selection process within the next few days. > > > Thank you, and I hope to hear from you, > Joel M. Halpern > jmh@joelhalpern.com > nomcom-chair@ietf.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > IETF-Announce mailing list > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce > > _______________________________________________ > IETF-Announce mailing list > IETF-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce --Apple-Mail-105-845053797 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Begin = forwarded message:

From: = "Joel M. Halpern" <jmh@joelhalpern.com>
<= div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; = margin-left: 0px; ">Date: = July 25, 2008 10:48:01 PM IST
To: ietf-announce@ietf.org
Subject: Second Nomcom 2008-9 Call for = Volunteers?
jmh@joelhalpern.com
Subject: = Nomcom 2008-9 Volunteer
Body:

<Your Full Name>  // As = you enter in the IETF Registration Form,
=             &n= bsp;    // First/Given name followed by Last/Family = Name
<Current Primary Affiliation>
=             &n= bsp;    // typically what goes in the Company = field
=             &n= bsp;    //  in the IETF Registration = Form
[<all email addresses used to Register for the past 5 IETF = meetings>]
<Preferred email address>  //
<Telephone = number>         // For = confirmation if selected

Please expect an email response from me = within 1-2 days stating
whether you are qualified or not.  If = you don't receive anything, please
re-send your email with the tag = (duplicate) in the subject line.
During the IETF meeting in Dublin, = responses will be somewhat slower,
due to both my activities at the = meeting and the secretariat's many
activities in support of the = meeting.   I will try to send out at least
a prompt = confirmation that your email volunteering has been = received.


Not convinced yet?  Please consider that = nomcom members play an
important role in shaping the leadership of = the IETF.  If you are a
people person, you will enjoy meeting = many of the active contributors to
the IETF.  If you prefer = instead to read a lot of email, well, we have
that too.  Being a = nomcom member is also an important responsibility: it
requires = adherence to confidentiality rules and some time commitment
from the = members.  The term of this nomcom will begin in early = September
this year.  We will be talking with folks at the = Minneapolis IETF (if
you are there.  It is not mandatory that = all nomcom members come to the
meeting.)  I hope to wrap up our = primary selection work by mid-December,
and we must complete our = selection work by mid-January.

We will be collecting requirements = from the community, as well as
talking to candidates and to community = members about candidates.
There will be weekly conference calls to = ensure progress.


Nomcom members are selected following a = publicly verifiable random
selection method specified in RFC = 3797.

For the nomcom to work as it should, the pool from which = the volunteers
are chosen should be as large as possible. The more = people who
volunteer, the better chance we have of choosing a random = yet
representative cross section of the IETF = population.

Ensuring the leadership of the IETF is fair and = balanced and comprised
of those who can lead the IETF in the right = direction is an important
responsibility that rests on the IETF = participants at large.
Volunteering for the nomcom is a good way of = contributing in that
direction.  So please = volunteer!


I will be publishing a more thorough and precise = target timetable, as
well as details of the randomness seeds to be = used for the RFC 3797
selection process within the next few = days.


Thank you, and I hope to hear from you,
Joel M. = Halpern
jmh@joelhalpern.com
nomcom-chai= r@ietf.org




____________________________________________= ___
IETF-Announce mailing = list
IETF-Announce@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ie= tf-announce

_______________________________________________
IETF= -Announce mailing = list
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= --Apple-Mail-105-845053797-- --===============0692759203== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple --===============0692759203==-- From simple-bounces@ietf.org Fri Aug 1 01:43:24 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: simple-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-simple-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE0ED3A6AB4; Fri, 1 Aug 2008 01:43:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: simple@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 810893A6AB4 for ; Fri, 1 Aug 2008 01:43:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.557 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.557 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.043, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jsdzSzXSIauE for ; Fri, 1 Aug 2008 01:43:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nostrum.com (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:1f03:267::2]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0906C3A6A7C for ; Fri, 1 Aug 2008 01:43:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [172.16.8.99] ([130.129.65.134]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m718hWsR005052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 1 Aug 2008 03:43:34 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from rjsparks@nostrum.com) Message-Id: <214E4A33-F805-4EF6-984A-66B6BF40C1A8@nostrum.com> From: Robert Sparks To: simple mailing list Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 09:43:25 +0100 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Received-SPF: pass (nostrum.com: 130.129.65.134 is authenticated by a trusted mechanism) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.3/7907/Fri Aug 1 01:59:59 2008 on shaman.nostrum.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [Simple] draft minutes for SIMPLE at IETF72 X-BeenThere: simple@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: SIP for Instant Messaging and Presence Leveraging Extensions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: simple-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: simple-bounces@ietf.org Please review and provide any corrections and comments as soon as you can. Thanks! RjS ======================= Minutes - SIMPLE - IETF72 Summary: The interdomain-federation draft is ready for WGLC, which will likely occur in late August or September. The view-sharing draft is getting close to ready and needs detailed review. The chairs will be recruiting reviewers. There was quite a bit of discussion around supporting a comedia connection establishment model for MSRP and how it impacts the use of MSRP relays. There is strong interest in taking on supporting comedia connections as a WG effort. There is not yet consensus to adopt a particular document as a starting point. Additional list discussion (including further discussion of the opaque path proposal) is expected. The MSRP discussions overran the agenda time for group presence. Please review Henning's presentation and provide comments to the list. Raw Notes follow: ---------------------------------------------------- Notes on SIMPLE at IETF 72 reported by Dean Willis Chaired by Robert Sparks and Hisham Khartabil Note Well presented Agenda accepted as presented Chairs present status and administrivia updates. Topic: Interdomain Federation led by Jonathan Rosenberg slides presented Changes since last version reviewed. Result: Plan on WGLC late August or September. Please review before then. Topic: View Sharing led by Jonathan Rosenberg slides presented Pre-WGLC reviewers asked to volunteer. Topic: Alternative COnnection Model for MSRP led by Christer Holmberg slides presented Noted that correct draft here is draft-blau-simple-msrp-acm-00 Noted that this draft is not an alternate solution, but if adopted it replaces draft-denis-simple-msrp-comedia. Issue: C and M line usage Noted that WG went over this many times and decided they could not use C and M lines due to relays. So this usage is contradictory with use of MSRP relay; so if a relay is used (for the many things relays might be used for) this approach will preclude use of relays. Question: Is it time to deprecate MSRP relays? Noted that at least one developer has received RFP requests for relays within the last year. Question: Is there any real reason to not have two ways to relay MSRP? Question: B2BUAs have the fundamental flaw of modifying messages without consent of endpoints. Is it reasonable to make this our only architecture? Question: Is it possible to use comedia without using the c and m lines? If it is, then we could easily use both relay approaches. Noted by another vendor that all current requests are for B2BUA or comedia relays, and not MSRP relays. Noted that in the SIP world, many users are busily removing B2BUAs for scaling. Should we be putting b2BUAs into MSRP? Response that MSRP relays have exactly the same scaling issue, and we'd be better off figuring out how to crosss NATs at the transport layer. Noted by chairs: We haven't seen much uptake on relays, but this doesn't seem to be a fault of the protocol. It would not seem reasonable to deprecate the MSRP relay function at this time. Noted that the model proposed in this draft requires a relay-model decision at call setup time. This may result in non-interoperable clients. This might require negotiation of comedia based on pre-knowledge of relay behavior. Question: What has changed since the arguments that led us to develop MSRP relays? JDR thinks that the initial model of shared TCP connections between relays/carriers/enterprises has not developed, so people care less about it. We should not be afraid to learn from industry experience. Noted that we really don't have very much deployment experience with this protocol. Noted that the need for relays has diminished with the increased TCP capacity of modern OS. Noted that MSRP relays may make pushback on congestion more difficult than TCP. Suggested that perhaps we should have just used SIP to set up an XMPP session. Issue: detailed ICE text. Proposed that document not discuss in detail Poll: Should WG take on effort of negotiating comedia? Strong response yes. Poll: Is this draft a good starting point for the discussion? Response mixed. Topic: Opaque Path led by Hadriel Kaplan slides presented Issue: MSRP Relay Scaling Noted that the MSRP relay has other functions that may be hard with a comedia relay. Suggested that these might be doable on a non-transparent signaled relay. Issue: Proposed Solution Noted that connection sharing may not be important to nodes using the proposed solutions. Privacy was discussed, with the potential impacts on anonymity noted. Noted that we may not be able to support all the uses of MSRP relays. Poll: Who read this draft? (few). Who understands? (fewer). Question: This means we don't need a relay and it won't work with one. Anonymization requires a B2BUA and a TURN server (and the turn server alone could have provided anon with current arch). One argument for this approach is more efficient processing of messages. Is that enough to justify adding an SBC for anonymization? Conclusion: We do have group interest in comedia and will further discuss on the list. Noteed that last presentation was dropped from the agenda. _______________________________________________ Simple mailing list Simple@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/simple