From nobody Mon Jul 29 13:59:05 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDE881200A4 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 13:58:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QvyRiwuscLCd for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 13:58:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lj1-x231.google.com (mail-lj1-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 66436120090 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 13:58:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x231.google.com with SMTP id i21so59956686ljj.3 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 13:58:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=1EoFQvazXzslyc73L+Ce7bt3a4TGCcPL3inrluKfP9A=; b=a1V3uMum61G/drTUgzaCbRCR1Hv+b3UJdyk8TC19z3w3zCdgh2YcIVjBRJ6tZ3XSB4 BhUKgh4iaDPpXsPLCVpmfWbAWxpjQobHbKOqAWkMEgecAvWaHiQSBgoUg7V5W4tqPuIV 2f/l3M0Asn9LIHQN6ikA8yEJ49UlcWArtjLH479i8EXRX0hAIJ2JTq6yGEcldJsFxtuu SjWYeEtICaGYpT5ivLzhBi8ub+aFlSQJA3vhHWnSg1nSfIqUgNEy9SKKCBf0FKXTXgTH NS2MMoOeT63doeilysnJv5kAGkUwCpqdgBxdjNGlRZ4cgVr1GUmIQ1bYsBPzWnq+DzJx Il5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=1EoFQvazXzslyc73L+Ce7bt3a4TGCcPL3inrluKfP9A=; b=K1O9rRn8XeuLB+UcHCDEiJwAmWnJU/W4I6LwRXiDLX3poQwIG0H07RMq7cuKuFlJJo TPwwaGUPQqj3DM6rH3fBdkPwJNxTikp7/H7JLCKcpiU9GcBZpNmR0elHbiJfq9PbYLhw JETxtW50xxEobgIO10cVY1wf5ijQoY5xg3xWYOsKWeVr44xs6MIoFG1kxOL4tqWC1y5m j72E5JR1pBCEyv65OG9j3z1c8W7IeMnrSE7LxkAEimWKyzoHZEwZVnmAsDr2QzuKJJv9 GuTGf+2G18UIpYqOirq1SD3TyLxxGLbyj41VJeubSVrguaZwfW9lId8rUg+Bkm+Xd8v2 vQoA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU/sz7ZvB+IygWMT3WS1o0cxFmAb8M7j0aIcFJUSfGQXE45felK 9Bv8NnuM9URE4LjYa3w9a4cQYqjjrRoaNM9fqHvJMA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxvULbZgMc/AvD1IrpTYnHx/Yxri7HPRoyiWsbfxEkUb/KKsIOFeX83Xi2phsn/VjoMdRB510Gkb9g7EUtP2AY= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9788:: with SMTP id y8mr58288270lji.41.1564433914281; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 13:58:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Victor Vasiliev Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 16:58:23 -0400 Message-ID: To: dispatch@ietf.org, IETF QUIC WG , HTTP Working Group , hybi@ietf.org, webtransport@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000bc9794058ed827c0" Archived-At: Subject: [Webtransport] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 20:58:41 -0000 --000000000000bc9794058ed827c0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hello everyone, Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone interested is invited to join our mailing list: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport Cheers, Victor. --000000000000bc9794058ed827c0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello everyone,

Judging from= the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a decent amount= of interest in the WebTransport work.=C2=A0 Everyone interested is invited= to join our mailing list:


Cheers,
<= div>=C2=A0 Victor.
--000000000000bc9794058ed827c0-- From nobody Mon Jul 29 14:33:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97FCF12006F for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:32:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id z8BRO437khZX for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:32:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lj1-x22d.google.com (mail-lj1-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BC575120072 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:32:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x22d.google.com with SMTP id h10so60027435ljg.0 for ; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:32:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=aIos4LByFU6Z0GxlSl4YOzuVFvSE8StZjEoHJusGg8Y=; b=Mh9rEVPhOhNAaATDVKtwK6Lo82WhgyZ5GCoJKxhz1tDdfhdxKX15i+7a4DYowfBgyU +cxyQ5PoPRDrXdOhzxixDHDdm/Ab58QrEnMMLyb6iIcmlTfEtlJBEcWjByIxVF0pi/Sh Ap13xhFtQZcwJefKsD0eNccbyyt2eqHX5CZKRSl96bO+EkmbpYvOaULMmU4PB2mLCkOp Vp2PQ7N5841QDF+U0xx85kPzS8keaW/Dr8b/wlBif8cYBtjxays0igYMBfX73QISWIG/ HzGT0fwj1Wo2gFtwHDK7fzdakmcmbXw8Up05TeeV2MFB7CuCHiI02+c49mdDJogaU7wc BTbg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=aIos4LByFU6Z0GxlSl4YOzuVFvSE8StZjEoHJusGg8Y=; b=g6Kihw3Z7qzUaBURYc3akdAn2zm5qCZnaadFyZ46LMJtPP/epdK2uPJuFN3wqLX77w vzPZCbihrxKUhwRgPMN1Oz5S1+gzIql/keGqpqPp9/EbMB7vfZ550gaKmMOwRaOcb4T3 iBJAKxEIxkmIPf/s/gJQxIuaAYc4eWvihMSzPqK7e0tR+LXK85unCY6OtnkTN2or7BfR H6cWZdWRan7ATIqna4ZnyzwwQoHNqJ239OPD8f7obORAeWYsOkYWBCV8FIkIaeEZC4Ey qPVxcXXkY1vE9pZ9y2ncDYw3iv7y/+yyn5vrzqcLPGO50szWv0+YXSsv+WwXo0/ZEHnB FlVw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUmyWah3rPkJUhXAJKqrMUN3/qmxBiutJ24dsopk7zIVlgf1tIh j9/1AIPM8TZXRkJK5bZraU3+yEcKDGRbK2EwKvwYEA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwIXjxuEVWuGyy3DfmjRX8yadSwJbNtTUFDxMCOnrCYLnxAgesgkF7SGCtx7mgFC9nQhpi9tknCiM1RPOE4ekw= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9a96:: with SMTP id p22mr58467783lji.57.1564435961630; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:32:41 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> From: Victor Vasiliev Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 17:32:30 -0400 Message-ID: To: Eliot Lear Cc: dispatch@ietf.org, IETF QUIC WG , HTTP Working Group , hybi@ietf.org, webtransport@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c49c62058ed8a126" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Webtransport] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 21:32:48 -0000 --000000000000c49c62058ed8a126 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Eliot, WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", currently described in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. Cheers, Victor. On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: > Hi Victor, > > Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, could > you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is supposed > to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or just > something else? > > Thanks, > > Eliot > > On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < > vasilvv=40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a > decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone interested is > invited to join our mailing list: > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport > > Cheers, > Victor. > > > --000000000000c49c62058ed8a126 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Eliot,

WebTransport is roughly "= ;WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", currently described in=C2= =A0https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00=C2=A0= and=C2=A0https://wicg.git= hub.io/web-transport/.=C2=A0 It's not related to BCP 190 discussion= that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting.

Cheers,
=C2=A0 Victor.

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM= Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wr= ote:
Hi Victor,

Sorry if this= has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, could you provide t= wo or three sentences as to what the mailing list is supposed to cover?=C2= =A0 Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or just something = else?

Thanks,

Eliot
=

On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Vict= or Vasiliev <vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
<= br class=3D"gmail-m_-8947632560352852245Apple-interchange-newline">
Hello everyone,

Judging from th= e in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a decent amount of= interest in the WebTransport work.=C2=A0 Everyone interested is invited to= join our mailing list:


Cheers,
=C2=A0 Victor.

--000000000000c49c62058ed8a126-- From nobody Mon Jul 29 14:33:25 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A6E0120043; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:29:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UI0beln4imX4; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:29:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1BB2612006B; Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:29:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3594; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1564435742; x=1565645342; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc: to:references; bh=NO01rd8nvI8MgfjjqMPBao3ez9OekUlo4P9Gg6KJcoA=; b=AWLBL0JOFzIdn0MOe3HcRnfhJIFOMAvBWzfdnAKo9kwA527Z4kjMuvrM rq+1SkxzHxL6I8N2Zazw+3KbVD0VCC3DvICZab6z2wrVrx9teaxNuyRr3 WVrgNI4UAXNmUReBRUgD3JcUYxkJEsYzoDB05uuCH5KNqQKRncUv0+nyr U=; X-Files: signature.asc : 195 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0AFAAD0Yz9d/xbLJq0WBUsZAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQEBBwEBAQEBAYFTBAEBAQEBCwEBgwJRASASKow6YIosknyGBYF7Agc?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEJAwEBGAEKDAEBg3pGAoMPNAkOAQMBAQQBAQIBBm2FHgyFSgEBAQECAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BbAsFCwsEFC4nMAYTgyIBgXsPD4hPpUaFSIRqCgaBNAGBUIMhhwWBf4E4H4J?= =?us-ascii?q?MPoJhAQEChRyCJgSUeIdvjhAJghyCH4ENkGgbmA6iBoMLAgQGBQIVgVA4gVg?= =?us-ascii?q?zGggbFTsqAYJBPosJhUE9AzABjmMBAQ?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.64,324,1559520000"; d="asc'?scan'208,217";a="14839562" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA; 29 Jul 2019 21:28:59 +0000 Received: from ams3-vpn-dhcp114.cisco.com (ams3-vpn-dhcp114.cisco.com [10.61.64.114]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x6TLSwVK015940 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 29 Jul 2019 21:28:59 GMT From: Eliot Lear Message-Id: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_CBCF54D4-C02E-456E-9792-6851BF941040"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 23:28:57 +0200 In-Reply-To: Cc: dispatch@ietf.org, IETF QUIC WG , HTTP Working Group , hybi@ietf.org, webtransport@ietf.org To: Victor Vasiliev References: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 10.61.64.114, ams3-vpn-dhcp114.cisco.com X-Outbound-Node: aer-core-3.cisco.com Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 14:33:20 -0700 Subject: Re: [Webtransport] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2019 21:29:05 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_CBCF54D4-C02E-456E-9792-6851BF941040 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_9C2CC47E-110E-4838-ABF0-460CE1ACEE5A" --Apple-Mail=_9C2CC47E-110E-4838-ABF0-460CE1ACEE5A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Victor, Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, = could you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is = supposed to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic = or just something else? Thanks, Eliot > On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev = wrote: >=20 > Hello everyone, >=20 > Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to = be a decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone = interested is invited to join our mailing list: >=20 > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport = >=20 > Cheers, > Victor. --Apple-Mail=_9C2CC47E-110E-4838-ABF0-460CE1ACEE5A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Hi = Victor,

Sorry if = this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, could you = provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is supposed = to cover?  Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or = just something else?

Thanks,

Eliot

On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, = Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> = wrote:

Hello = everyone,

Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there = appears to be a decent amount of interest in the WebTransport = work.  Everyone interested is invited to join our mailing list:

  https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport

Cheers,
  Victor.

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Tue, 30 Jul 2019 00:58:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.11.129] ([185.41.76.142]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id cb19sm11973317ejb.51.2019.07.30.00.58.12 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 30 Jul 2019 00:58:12 -0700 (PDT) To: webtransport@ietf.org References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> From: Lennart Grahl Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 09:58:11 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 07:58:18 -0000 Hi, I don't think what Victor said is really fitting (sorry). At least the W3C WebTransport API is a *framework* for all sorts of transports delivering streams or datagrams that may or may not be reliable/ordered on top of a transport that may or may not be reliable/ordered. So IMO, this mailing list or the perhaps upcoming IETF WG should not be limited to unreliable transports either. For example, it's very well possible to reuse RFC 6455 (WebSocket) and create a WebTransport-based API for it. Cheers Lennart On 30.07.19 05:53, Martin J. Dürst wrote: > I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may greatly benefit > from a better name (or acronym). > > Regards, Martin. > > P.S.: I already subscribed to the list. > > On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote: >> Hi Eliot, >> >> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", >> currently described in >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and >> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 >> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. >> >> Cheers, >> Victor. >> >> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: >> >>> Hi Victor, >>> >>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, could >>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is supposed >>> to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or just >>> something else? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Eliot >>> >>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < >>> vasilvv=40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: >>> >>> Hello everyone, >>> >>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a >>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone interested is >>> invited to join our mailing list: >>> >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Victor. >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> hybi mailing list >> hybi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >> > From nobody Tue Jul 30 13:47:13 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA4F12004D for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:47:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.737 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.737 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_OBFUSCATE_05_10=0.26, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0s51RE-VZsu1 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:47:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lj1-x22b.google.com (mail-lj1-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 02664120108 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:47:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x22b.google.com with SMTP id m8so29801243lji.7 for ; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:47:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=JV2etadZpzeKgmnG0+ZDeF3m/UpaN6rSDoI4KBSYJ9U=; b=JLevsi9fPFwEwvvkLqRH4LEAr/oRgv+13FXzm5dpiGeLpuHZGQflvcAZffdZ7+qCGv WJctwRLGHdkWPInidoRRMyClXxaTKSTbha+QUQGQZWWOTFGso/RUBYNi9EaXnc8D5n8H zZBvOOYOEzE3rbgwG+2xl9bhhWxy6OFoUBGcrxU23bUloVilpsrLQJiHakxsndiRWQRn 4YCiZ+5fs6K9swg2V7uZ4EY58rfqLY7sYSDMnhAQo8MsT29c64zhKS7HnF0zQlDDSIxv BTso1snTaxCSwe4kuyzX8r5SFULUBlL4J8RfkCFb50UZPEEEugJSroVNoCjMydrhHUgR 0P5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=JV2etadZpzeKgmnG0+ZDeF3m/UpaN6rSDoI4KBSYJ9U=; b=Ktu6l2Y1Q3nHvINm5iicITXed9EQuO4Rib2sFw1Ze3gsef8rsT/Ww4fo27BJ44APqY uUvp4R9tYcAiXnOKHzIpOskCeaZY46Y6dhmUaFLxFElpbiviudMrEvNPl7o1/D0L55xj 03tEZxShmgH9mESWP+WL0OYGqQrF2idglQ7KuKKf7+aYJxgy5E0+Uw/m4/6LwDyTHs/7 PEfkdlO/EJIEgGaohrbInVgGtN3URH8tJN3o5CIT3zXOkKC/gAfIMDFXg4WM7MspXEU6 VLDbUGUkodB1RyMm2wQzXvHMhtmoAOgougI0TC31v4/EgjyxQz5jHgNo4voafrTLvxjy adcw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAX6pxJA9cbwZl1vUu6iA/J9Ya5X/tOKliTqrHJua4tXIfejmFO5 XtVZiDmp/JnGH6myRN3jZF2GB/vT9JbsUr5cB+p8Gfoz X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwtr51lTNRxty/nZ/iTyQJVgE/3pSc0LqySMrKpSRsLmOQtQzEbhuWlgcF9LwE2wFGWxwiyOB0UvVleL7zes8c= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:4e12:: with SMTP id c18mr11922215ljb.211.1564519626337; Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:47:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Bernard Aboba Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 13:46:54 -0700 Message-ID: To: webtransport@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000926ff0058eec1c56" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Webtransport] Protocol work (was [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List) X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 20:47:12 -0000 --000000000000926ff0058eec1c56 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Lennart said: "W3C WebTransport API is a *framework* for all sorts of transports delivering streams or datagrams that may or may not be reliable/ordered on top of a transport that may or may not be reliable/ordered. So IMO, this mailing list or the perhaps upcoming IETF WG should not be limited to unreliable transports either. For example, it's very well possible to reuse RFC 6455 (WebSocket) and create a WebTransport-based API for it." [BA] As I understand it, the W3C Web Incubation Community Group (WICG) is handling the WebTransport API (see: https://github.com/WICG/web-transport ), so that the focus of the IETF would be on *new protocol development*. From that perspective, the following protocol documents seem potentially relevant: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-kinnear-httpbis-http2-transport (HTTP/2 Transport) https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-http3 (HTTP/3 Transport) https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-quic (QuicTransport) During the discussion in DISPATCH there were some comments suggesting focus on the HTTP/3 (and perhaps HTTP/2) protocol work. While that seems like a natural extension to RFCs 6445 and 8441, QuicTransport does reduce the roundtrips needed when it is known that the server (and intervening network) support QUIC. --000000000000926ff0058eec1c56 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Lennart said:=C2=A0

"W3C WebTransport API is a *framework* for all sort= s of transports delivering strea= ms or datagrams that may or may not be reliable/ordered on top of a transport that may or may not be relia= ble/ordered. So IMO, this mailin= g list or the perhaps upcoming IETF WG should not be limited to unreliable transports either. For example, = it's very well possible to=C2=A0reuse RFC 6455 (WebSocket) and create a= WebTransport-based API for it.= "

[BA] As I understand it, the W= 3C Web Incubation Community Group (WICG) is handling the WebTransport API (= see: https://githu= b.com/WICG/web-transport=C2=A0), s= o that the focus of the IETF would be on new protocol development. <= /span>From that perspective, the follo= wing protocol documents seem potentially relevant:

During the discussion i= n DISPATCH there were some comments suggesting focus on the HTTP/3 (and per= haps HTTP/2) protocol work. While that seems like a natural extension to RF= Cs 6445 and 8441, QuicTransport does reduce the roundtrips needed when it i= s known that the server (and intervening network) support QUIC.=C2=A0
=


=C2=A0
=C2=A0

--000000000000926ff0058eec1c56-- From nobody Wed Jul 31 09:40:59 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C98B8120018; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 06:49:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.701 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.701 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=mnot.net header.b=i3zd1sWl; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=cNAB4Rjp Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GJH_n8JaZc07; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 06:49:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from new3-smtp.messagingengine.com (new3-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A9B6212004F; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 06:49:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailnew.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0AEC1FBD; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 09:49:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 31 Jul 2019 09:49:33 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mnot.net; h= content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; s=fm3; bh=e 8oLACul+KAOHEyqSm9hMXQsbf2RFaP03ZEIw6sH2XM=; b=i3zd1sWlv3rGPLP28 ufnhQ5jCN5Rbydrjkr0EWGvkfxTE8oPDyTF3OdiXNOtKYzsqPQ9frH1ay2waEjG6 QalK0vKHLYJBPLJHRpXKN+l80JPCG21HGOI27MkC+pPEqLsXDQyKlnGCsm+5BJqC XZzac4gaaOcWcQumRo+b+XlagKyhm0TB3WF3QyZPkNY4JZ+HpRpOp2w0BCVtD3sJ iq5yiKI4EThXqWb9EDisnM2AFX4iKsvFkKdVqkx/iMM+QAwa8cGkutNFQ2jiIIEv ugiFF5pecGoDPm5OIIHEm5F4ZqV6X118KMfB/yP5RSzXx03DJt0IWR6nhiPWem2J n9LTg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=e8oLACul+KAOHEyqSm9hMXQsbf2RFaP03ZEIw6sH2 XM=; b=cNAB4RjpYbB7CM7hyBNHme9Lh8nzvfxcnelkiH8ulE8c558pfA7KdZdcI bkKOdyRsEUD8AYL2k6NmpEOEcr/uFOsmsuXATpWY98Hw26M0SJgImki396vrrQoW KQRAmGLRDsp6btDNyCtXXPD3IPSgEt0PUpqTfBqD0he389M/WgGJyZj9zzRQiZGt bS57596KDz+c9VBZOLBVnZbMfDwJiY/jVmVin8FTgv4Xj1t1fshBFCy11HqkeCOV Zj+0kQEnxPRBnSnr57/rFoWW20feDbeGnuhgGsYRcaF1ACVSYcbOmvdeamYidGmR xCXF+0oc6/gV1A8m6vuj99DQTA5cw== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduvddrleehgdeijecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenog fuuhhsphgvtghtffhomhgrihhnucdlgeelmdenucfjughrpegtggfuhfgjfffgkfhfvffo sehtqhhmtdhhtdejnecuhfhrohhmpeforghrkhcupfhothhtihhnghhhrghmuceomhhnoh htsehmnhhothdrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpehgihhthhhusgdrihhopdhivghtfhdr ohhrghdpmhhnohhtrdhnvghtnecukfhppedvudeirddvuddrudelfedrjeeknecurfgrrh grmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmnhhothesmhhnohhtrdhnvghtnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfu ihiivgeptd X-ME-Proxy: Received: from [10.20.2.23] (unknown [216.21.193.78]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id A909B80060; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 09:49:31 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) From: Mark Nottingham In-Reply-To: <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 09:49:30 -0400 Cc: Victor Vasiliev , Eliot Lear , "dispatch@ietf.org" , "webtransport@ietf.org" , "hybi@ietf.org" , HTTP Working Group , IETF QUIC WG Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <433A2B37-704A-419B-B56F-F7B697E35741@mnot.net> References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> To: =?utf-8?B?Ik1hcnRpbiBKLiBEw7xyc3Qi?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 09:40:57 -0700 Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [dispatch] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:49:39 -0000 +1.=20 Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with = other things, it's worth the pain. > On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst = wrote: >=20 > I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may greatly benefit=20= > from a better name (or acronym). >=20 > Regards, Martin. >=20 > P.S.: I already subscribed to the list. >=20 > On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote: >> Hi Eliot, >>=20 >> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", >> currently described in >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and >> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 >> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. >>=20 >> Cheers, >> Victor. >>=20 >> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: >>=20 >>> Hi Victor, >>>=20 >>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, = could >>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is = supposed >>> to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or = just >>> something else? >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>>=20 >>> Eliot >>>=20 >>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < >>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: >>>=20 >>> Hello everyone, >>>=20 >>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to = be a >>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone = interested is >>> invited to join our mailing list: >>>=20 >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport >>>=20 >>> Cheers, >>> Victor. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> hybi mailing list >> hybi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >>=20 >=20 > --=20 > Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst > Department of Intelligent Information Technology > College of Science and Engineering > Aoyama Gakuin University > Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara > 252-5258 Japan > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch -- Mark Nottingham https://www.mnot.net/ From nobody Wed Jul 31 13:38:08 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B8A3120091 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:37:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iJ2z-Kpph2Dp for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:37:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ua1-x929.google.com (mail-ua1-x929.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::929]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E131C120018 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:37:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ua1-x929.google.com with SMTP id 8so27512945uaz.11 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:37:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=OBfJJvtpDjldJZKsRY7KC6mQrlqiw6TYVcoW+ucL8sQ=; b=tj+IfxYCpuv7HiKg13DhktVrOFrp0SBG26SKxHw6GX4LscP6jsaJV1NLXWYfmdcIDW eE21LrqGAdp9LEITVO5JQ8SsTQTvuLfAmKJ/OVwOEF434ByRBXuAg1RnJ9tFZYswpoRu lC6yTH3tgBY5lwtezWwq9qj2b/9DTxCoLA5dsCLbuA5mAOHxrvrGP09/85zflBS55sPn YxGHnqIyfPK/Ofk1LsGL5inI/JVyr80EEHse5Ir9LmR8zXn6+dpUaT6pzHHXnqbJmZAh 4pbvAaPlDdvNHR55NJO1o7P5nIh6+Qmgnx3xZM5Rynbp/Dehzr9QSQlmdod1VhSRB6b3 lPJA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=OBfJJvtpDjldJZKsRY7KC6mQrlqiw6TYVcoW+ucL8sQ=; b=fpvEOYSXTaJ6nfJsGg/oqkw6F9C9m7bV+eSzmYvGBe80D5JDxTPxX9BegdDM/HAF44 fYoMyyefxLCNl8hJ4pIvoQd2Uni60qdLgGX79vLPMSJ9mtqmP8mgPMxgdQYfjbbE5/k9 2A46Y1RtTmdlZnTq2IVqX/Ns4xa4RrufSnwLcmWt5OpH4K2RBLSuMa3HMiCdWG7cextd DsdKhIvShiph1M5DtD4zM96SPfDCryUcudmrGRNNkdQLU6j6jdrwdnQ4mp73w1oSZDq6 tbpWuY8bOKsZlwGMnNvPBMHunB7PMALmzzVhZTazJDapLHH1rU9XsEaWewdMSGZd24BM ji3g== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVJ5uVus4Irpy9lgA7tZzE6Ck48Zm9OC36nasfzx6oDn7oFLQEC 0dD1FNmmJCaNYI412J2Zrg+af5vKuwbNYYC4ErPOTA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw4qktjqrBXHoFActWkHUWbtFpeF2n/jVNh/oPcnhJWiRSEtct9f+k1y9jEC4cBEh9iV3eapu7y+MYGnAq6VUU= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:30c7:: with SMTP id c7mr17309878uam.143.1564605437577; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:37:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> <433A2B37-704A-419B-B56F-F7B697E35741@mnot.net> In-Reply-To: <433A2B37-704A-419B-B56F-F7B697E35741@mnot.net> From: Peter Thatcher Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:36:41 -0700 Message-ID: To: Mark Nottingham Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Martin_J=2E_D=C3=BCrst?= , Victor Vasiliev , "hybi@ietf.org" , Eliot Lear , "webtransport@ietf.org" , "dispatch@ietf.org" , HTTP Working Group , IETF QUIC WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000005284d9058f001741" Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:38:06 -0700 Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [dispatch] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 20:37:22 -0000 --0000000000005284d9058f001741 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What's wrong with "WebTransport"? It seems like a good name to me. With what is it confusable? On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham wrote: > +1. > > Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with other > things, it's worth the pain. > > > > On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst > wrote: > > > > I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may greatly benefit > > from a better name (or acronym). > > > > Regards, Martin. > > > > P.S.: I already subscribed to the list. > > > > On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote: > >> Hi Eliot, > >> > >> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", > >> currently described in > >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and > >> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 > >> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Victor. > >> > >> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Victor, > >>> > >>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, > could > >>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is > supposed > >>> to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or ju= st > >>> something else? > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> Eliot > >>> > >>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < > >>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hello everyone, > >>> > >>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to > be a > >>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone > interested is > >>> invited to join our mailing list: > >>> > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport > >>> > >>> Cheers, > >>> Victor. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> hybi mailing list > >> hybi@ietf.org > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi > >> > > > > -- > > Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst > > Department of Intelligent Information Technology > > College of Science and Engineering > > Aoyama Gakuin University > > Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara > > 252-5258 Japan > > _______________________________________________ > > dispatch mailing list > > dispatch@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > > -- > Mark Nottingham https://www.mnot.net/ > > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > --0000000000005284d9058f001741 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
What's wrong with "WebTransport"?=C2=A0= It seems like a good name to me.=C2=A0 With what is it confusable?

On= Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net> wrote:
+1.

Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with oth= er things, it's worth the pain.


> On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> = wrote:
>
> I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may g= reatly benefit
> from a better name (or acronym).
>
> Regards,=C2=A0 =C2=A0Martin.
>
> P.S.: I already subscribed to the list.
>
> On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote:
>> Hi Eliot,
>>
>> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable trans= port",
>> currently described in
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/d= raft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and
>> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/.=C2=A0 It= 9;s not related to BCP 190
>> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting.<= br> >>
>> Cheers,
>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Victor,
>>>
>>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the= room, could
>>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list= is supposed
>>> to cover?=C2=A0 Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more g= eneric or just
>>> something else?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Eliot
>>>
>>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev <
>>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appe= ars to be a
>>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work.=C2=A0 Ever= yone interested is
>>> invited to join our mailing list:
>>>
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/webtransport
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> hybi mailing list
>> hybi@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >>
>
> --
> Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst
> Department of Intelligent Information Technology
> College of Science and Engineering
> Aoyama Gakuin University
> Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara
> 252-5258 Japan
> _______________________________________________
> dispatch mailing list
> dispatch@ietf.o= rg
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch

--
Mark Nottingham=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.mnot.net/

_______________________________________________
dispatch mailing list
dispatch@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch
--0000000000005284d9058f001741-- From nobody Wed Jul 31 13:44:38 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 786B2120077; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.997 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.997 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AJXB6XEZEDYg; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ed1-x52f.google.com (mail-ed1-x52f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::52f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2D8FD12006D; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ed1-x52f.google.com with SMTP id w13so67041581eds.4; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=FxSAM7wLdAS/gJet0b4tWn6fxwojHIvcQE2QPXrOJEM=; b=J+aXrmT62/IZFASlRRHSl4b21+aDPeBuznIdb/Baf3lM9cIb8ZIV7sCv0p+06+1FjZ Cj8ZrPk/9P/SGInYCszglVxqr0pYUHK5jTvvZYYfI0uOQihuK/GI6KX++BBnsdEOJI5H HI+Be/Mj8ag28X1fr378md6sLR0bG1nIFanxXdWyEfqCKqjEv+i399xZDLmLhw7dgb2X eRU359Mdit48nEiUdMu/shvaVlOedWeIC6PKBdOHNg9cLH04BHgJ1oUPFy9qoU2XAhCa fB1qy4JcQby6/sGioaVmg6AVZdjN3z9oWA5+HrExNwPLEkjEAmLCBgLXE3OABpKG+DTv ZebA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=FxSAM7wLdAS/gJet0b4tWn6fxwojHIvcQE2QPXrOJEM=; b=l4gzvwW1i2r53+VwbinkXO1DJvLOtYRxt06SqWzeGWhJxP8fjWaobMTjfT6sEUqAGN +1iYstqd9h1ZMEGge+msUxZYdOu1xC1W+IFHiFV+mATSh13GA+YH+tYrjquhDvYhbumO Yijav/obBYBLmHbhAICT9PvJp/QMYotC+5Xe7uKTJIfknEYX024uqzwQv/d5DOdrTpM0 V2vpSNLmuBrqcMoL7Rn2VaOaa+HifV+XpUBSz+bVfSX3pnu74YHumBAt2EI8RbhMY8Hw RWAZGO8+pYoW0BmgZbjP1/o6V8qr+mypdPAmcAAfXFxScPzhIHUN7GtZaGPSChY798SN kt2A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXRGayXm7+o3yiIdf054sSgzsw01DKeUF9WeV/xWvTr/MI9J1Rm zF5lfA6eQ4flH7OQNV0n+/q4cUtj0lzeK7eDG+w= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzcvpEklhlFOPeJpAh4NY16tny7FK5h0HLBwafjPmZFcYlPXUeBoQSLMfIaFVF8HDx2HnkjZg5fCcw+bz9m+kM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:4882:: with SMTP id v2mr35756468ejq.100.1564605824661; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:43 -0700 From: =?UTF-8?Q?Mikkel_Fahn=C3=B8e_J=C3=B8rgensen?= In-Reply-To: References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> <433A2B37-704A-419B-B56F-F7B697E35741@mnot.net> X-Mailer: Airmail (420) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:43:43 -0700 Message-ID: To: Peter Thatcher , Mark Nottingham Cc: "webtransport@ietf.org" , IETF QUIC WG , Victor Vasiliev , HTTP Working Group , =?UTF-8?Q?Martin_J=2E_D=C3=BCrst?= , "dispatch@ietf.org" , "hybi@ietf.org" , Eliot Lear Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000647f5f058f002e28" Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:44:37 -0700 Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [dispatch] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 20:43:50 -0000 --000000000000647f5f058f002e28 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Same as for WebAssembly and WebSocket when not used with a browser with HTTP. For example MQTT over WebSocket to penetrate firewalls has very little to do with Web. On 31 July 2019 at 22.37.39, Peter Thatcher ( pthatcher=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org) wrote: What's wrong with "WebTransport"? It seems like a good name to me. With what is it confusable? On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham wrote: > +1. > > Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with other > things, it's worth the pain. > > > > On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst > wrote: > > > > I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may greatly benefit > > from a better name (or acronym). > > > > Regards, Martin. > > > > P.S.: I already subscribed to the list. > > > > On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote: > >> Hi Eliot, > >> > >> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", > >> currently described in > >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and > >> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 > >> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Victor. > >> > >> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Victor, > >>> > >>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, > could > >>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is > supposed > >>> to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or ju= st > >>> something else? > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> Eliot > >>> > >>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < > >>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hello everyone, > >>> > >>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to > be a > >>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone > interested is > >>> invited to join our mailing list: > >>> > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport > >>> > >>> Cheers, > >>> Victor. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> hybi mailing list > >> hybi@ietf.org > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi > >> > > > > -- > > Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst > > Department of Intelligent Information Technology > > College of Science and Engineering > > Aoyama Gakuin University > > Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara > > 252-5258 Japan > > _______________________________________________ > > dispatch mailing list > > dispatch@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > > -- > Mark Nottingham https://www.mnot.net/ > > _______________________________________________ > dispatch mailing list > dispatch@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch > --000000000000647f5f058f002e28 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable = Same as for WebAssem= bly and WebSocket when not used with a browser with HTTP.

For example MQTT over WebSocket to pen= etrate firewalls has very little to do with Web.

On 31 July 2019 at 22.37.39, Peter Thatcher (pthatcher=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.or= g) wrote:

<= div>
What's wrong with "WebTransport"?=C2=A0 It seems like a = good name to me.=C2=A0 With what is it confusable?

On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net> = wrote:
+1.

Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with other things, it's worth the pain.


> On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> = wrote:
>
> I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may g= reatly benefit
> from a better name (or acronym).
>
> Regards,=C2=A0 =C2=A0Martin.
>
> P.S.: I already subscribed to the list.
>
> On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote:
>> Hi Eliot,
>>
>> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport",
>> currently described in
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/d= raft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and
>> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/.=C2=A0 It= 9;s not related to BCP 190
>> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Victor,
>>>
>>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, could
>>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is supposed
>>> to cover?=C2=A0 Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or just
>>> something else?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Eliot
>>>
>>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev <
>>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be a
>>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work.=C2=A0 Everyone interested is
>>> invited to join our mailing list:
>>>
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/webtransport
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> hybi mailing list
>> hybi@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >>
>
> --
> Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst
> Department of Intelligent Information Technology
> College of Science and Engineering
> Aoyama Gakuin University
> Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara
> 252-5258 Japan
> _______________________________________________
> dispatch mailing list
> dispatch@ietf.o= rg
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch

--
Mark Nottingham=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.mnot.net/

_______________________________________________
dispatch mailing list
dispatch@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch
=
--000000000000647f5f058f002e28-- From nobody Wed Jul 31 13:52:28 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 328041200A4; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:50:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VofQe1auPP6h; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from warmcat.com (warmcat.com [46.105.127.147]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F7D012006D; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 21:50:23 +0100 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To: hybi@ietf.org, Victor Vasiliev , dispatch@ietf.org, IETF QUIC WG , HTTP Working Group , webtransport@ietf.org From: Andy Green Message-ID: Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 13:52:26 -0700 Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 20:50:37 -0000 On July 29, 2019 9:58:23 PM GMT+01:00, Victor Vasiliev wrote: >Hello everyone, > >Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to be >a Could you find a moment in your busy schedule to respond to what I wrote o= n this list before making your own new and exciting list, esp wrt this shou= ld find a way to target h2? -Andy >decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work=2E Everyone >interested is >invited to join our mailing list: > > https://www=2Eietf=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/webtransport > >Cheers, > Victor=2E From nobody Wed Jul 31 14:04:03 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: webtransport@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82BFB12006D for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 14:04:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=adligo-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SZdxD2C80-51 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 14:03:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qk1-x72a.google.com (mail-qk1-x72a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::72a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5ED6A120018 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 14:03:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-qk1-x72a.google.com with SMTP id d79so50224983qke.11 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 14:03:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=adligo-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=RDY/WadoNLiAO571SHvmtOQSDvES4MdqUj5uo0+vg/4=; b=seXBbsExiUaounQUpjn1jW72LsFOIX/R2XLg5Cjmad6/BBek01H06EpHNstIIGyPMX +anMHMT9duYJQPNSqN7l7u+zC/zfWdgNI1y06MkLNkQSSYh2ftJQJDRdS3Leg/bXwWt8 xBs8klgwjF+oL0jJgQKUhLUIwC3+851TB42U0HRWjYoUynNHlWnqMNnp9yNG+r3NZ4o3 vnO/b6hKeoW0X8U1llkaJfBUXZQgPpIaExEdLLE03FAQ5vG2fuHCzeo4FcpHTOxoiFXG ry0jIqjfNyKelrtFUOycNH7cwTbgW+m91oJQHfuD+i5bB+WTZal5Y7uP19ZMgqpaOT78 tV5Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=RDY/WadoNLiAO571SHvmtOQSDvES4MdqUj5uo0+vg/4=; b=aLqiTJ1ax15cmgVlMWtM0KVSGj1ltvg0bO53ZvvDr68Hbf8iDKXVTukABdnkFO6h+l f2pO5jw2soct4nmSLWxl10VMgCOoWIMYWE2leXrc2nVI4A4omgPCnoC6s9qOa3PMbmRR 8Ru0JnEBNkRPa8tKMbg3lFS3UDgjtJakYhxQrNYCuoFn/5vvXaPdkEWOzQNy44kibaPm Mo364mUWIZk9dlPIVqKJxXzW5gyL/HKu80v61bbb6FvJVC6xsd69FPUTslx3vcTGv10c 2Yjl0B2syea9XWRNDrqDgPkXGCtS0TeHakyQ4rCIlmNtv7y5WvgO7Yyog+WTa9uet0Wh Q43A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUlYcod+meSPQcmX5hjaTk5p3BFVa87RqWvXY/Sj2U3LScqjkzY cGg6Jb/MMnOp0VSf4z3XaWVAvk1rIiOovNAEm2FTpe0X X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw+5Y24qXqvHUl+xctUZ4iYlyGJyhe/l7Y/zX1yEKbMolK1KvDZ5SirThIJKFBisCvMuECcnnsVD7uuFuieTGE= X-Received: by 2002:ae9:c00f:: with SMTP id u15mr79995388qkk.426.1564607036203; Wed, 31 Jul 2019 14:03:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <85E74088-6D84-47CB-97CC-C637167959B0@cisco.com> <4f6894c1-b6ea-46c6-d662-9b2e2f4daf02@it.aoyama.ac.jp> <433A2B37-704A-419B-B56F-F7B697E35741@mnot.net> In-Reply-To: From: Scott Morgan Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 16:03:45 -0500 Message-ID: To: webtransport@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009b388b058f00767f" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Webtransport] [dispatch] [hybi] WebTransport Mailing List X-BeenThere: webtransport@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2019 21:04:01 -0000 --0000000000009b388b058f00767f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well my suggestion is if you don't like the name suggest one at least ;) I'll throw out some suggestions 'BigSocket' , 'WideSocket' or 'LightningSocket', although I'm not emotionally attached to any of them. On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 3:41 PM Peter Thatcher wrote= : > What's wrong with "WebTransport"? It seems like a good name to me. With > what is it confusable? > > On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham wrote: > >> +1. >> >> Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with othe= r >> things, it's worth the pain. >> >> >> > On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst >> wrote: >> > >> > I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may greatly benefit >> > from a better name (or acronym). >> > >> > Regards, Martin. >> > >> > P.S.: I already subscribed to the list. >> > >> > On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote: >> >> Hi Eliot, >> >> >> >> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable transport", >> >> currently described in >> >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and >> >> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/. It's not related to BCP 190 >> >> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting. >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Victor. >> >> >> >> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear wrote: >> >> >> >>> Hi Victor, >> >>> >> >>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the room, >> could >> >>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list is >> supposed >> >>> to cover? Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more generic or >> just >> >>> something else? >> >>> >> >>> Thanks, >> >>> >> >>> Eliot >> >>> >> >>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev < >> >>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Hello everyone, >> >>> >> >>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appears to >> be a >> >>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work. Everyone >> interested is >> >>> invited to join our mailing list: >> >>> >> >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/webtransport >> >>> >> >>> Cheers, >> >>> Victor. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> hybi mailing list >> >> hybi@ietf.org >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >> >> >> > >> > -- >> > Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst >> > Department of Intelligent Information Technology >> > College of Science and Engineering >> > Aoyama Gakuin University >> > Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara >> > 252-5258 Japan >> > _______________________________________________ >> > dispatch mailing list >> > dispatch@ietf.org >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >> >> -- >> Mark Nottingham https://www.mnot.net/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dispatch mailing list >> dispatch@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch >> > --=20 Regards, Scott Morgan President & CEO Adligo Inc http://www.adligo.com https://www.linkedin.com/in/scott-morgan-21739415 A+ Better Business Bureau Rating https://github.com/adligo By Appointment Only: 1-866-968-1893 Ex 101 scott@adligo.com skype:adligo1?call Send Me Files Securely: *https://www.sendthisfile.com/f.jsp?id=3DewOnyeFQM18IDRf7MMIdolfI * --0000000000009b388b058f00767f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Well my suggestion is if you don't li= ke the name suggest one at least ;)

I'l= l throw out some suggestions 'BigSocket' , 'WideSocket' or = 'LightningSocket', although I'm not emotionally attached to any= of them.


On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 3:41 PM Peter Thatcher <= ;pthatcher@google.com> wrote= :
What's wrong with "WebTransport"?=C2=A0 It seems like= a good name to me.=C2=A0 With what is it confusable?

On Wed, Jul 31, = 2019 at 6:50 AM Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net> wrote:
+1.

Naming things is hard, but when they're generic and confusable with oth= er things, it's worth the pain.


> On 29 Jul 2019, at 11:53 pm, Martin J. D=C3=BCrst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> = wrote:
>
> I think Eliot's question shows that "WebTransport" may g= reatly benefit
> from a better name (or acronym).
>
> Regards,=C2=A0 =C2=A0Martin.
>
> P.S.: I already subscribed to the list.
>
> On 2019/07/30 06:32, Victor Vasiliev wrote:
>> Hi Eliot,
>>
>> WebTransport is roughly "WebSockets, but for unreliable trans= port",
>> currently described in
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/d= raft-vvv-webtransport-overview-00 and
>> https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/.=C2=A0 It= 9;s not related to BCP 190
>> discussion that happened at the other portion of ARTAREA meeting.<= br> >>
>> Cheers,
>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 5:29 PM Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Victor,
>>>
>>> Sorry if this has been covered, but for those of us out of the= room, could
>>> you provide two or three sentences as to what the mailing list= is supposed
>>> to cover?=C2=A0 Is this more BCP 190 stuff or something more g= eneric or just
>>> something else?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Eliot
>>>
>>> On 29 Jul 2019, at 22:58, Victor Vasiliev <
>>> vasilvv=3D40google.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> Judging from the in-person discussions in Montreal, there appe= ars to be a
>>> decent amount of interest in the WebTransport work.=C2=A0 Ever= yone interested is
>>> invited to join our mailing list:
>>>
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/webtransport
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Victor.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> hybi mailing list
>> hybi@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi >>
>
> --
> Prof. Dr.sc. Martin J. D=C3=BCrst
> Department of Intelligent Information Technology
> College of Science and Engineering
> Aoyama Gakuin University
> Fuchinobe 5-1-10, Chuo-ku, Sagamihara
> 252-5258 Japan
> _______________________________________________
> dispatch mailing list
> dispatch@ietf.o= rg
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch

--
Mark Nottingham=C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.mnot.net/

_______________________________________________
dispatch mailing list
dispatch@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dispatch


--
=
Regards,
Scott Morgan
President & CEO
Adligo Inc
A+ Better Business Bureau Rating
By Appointment Only:=C2=A0
1-866-968-1893 Ex 101
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